Ken313 - you have mentioned a few times your church involvement (choir, pastor, etc.) so I'd like to ask you a little bit about your faith and your wife's faith. If it offends you, please tell me and I'll not "go there" anymore.

I am very curious about other aspects of your marriage also.

So let's just list a few questions that you may want to answer in order to give us more background on your situation on which to base some suggestions and/or advice.

1. Do you believe that you are a born again Christian?

2. What is the Pastor's stance on your wife's actions?

3. Are you and your wife members of the local church you attend?

4. What is your wife's relationship with Christ, if any?

5. What was the reason that your wife divorced her first husband?

6. What is it about you or your behavior that your wife's friends and co-workers think is "bad enough" that she should divorce you?

7. Though it may sound "dumb," why do you want to remain married to your wife and her lazy, lay-about, messy, children?

8. Knowing your wife for some 6 years before getting married you must have know a lot about what she was like and what the children were like, so why did you decide that she was "marriage material" in general and why did you think that she was "your lifetime mate" in specific?

God bless.

P.S. You may be "controlling and manipulative," but I'm not hearing that in your posting so far. What I "hear" is a very selfish, self-centered, wife who likes the "Things" that you provide her and her children but who also wants to remain "single" in her mind and NOT your wife and helpmeet.

In short, she wants her "cake and to eat it too" just like virtually all Wayward Spouses. So these accusations of being "controlling and manipulative" are just her attempts to rationalize and justify her gross sin and to shift the "blame" for her behavior to you. That is something that you should be aware of, not let bother you when you hear it, and should be yet another warning sign that she is very much into "self" and "justifying an affair or affair-like behavior."

no problem, no offense,

1. I do beleive in god/christ... born again I don't know... Sometimes i have doubts (like thomas) Sometimes I feel near him, sometime I feel alone and later realize he was carrying me. and sometimes I feel the spirt move within me... born again you tell me it isn't a term I Assoicate with well...
How ever with the latest trails, I have become active in church again and the messeage has been coming through very loud and clear... so you tell me..

2. He isn't happy, he had recommend we get counseling, he is concerned and has lifted up W and I in prayer many times.

3. members no but we have been attending pretty reguraly since the tribulations have been on going...

4. I am methiodist, she is more pentacostal, and has been "filled with the spirt" does that answer your question?

5. He was a control freak and abusive as i understand it... also a minister who had an A, and later broke up another marrage and is with that Woman...

6. Ok this takes some back ground... I caught my former (not current) W in an affair, it was girls night out... I drove up to suprise her, and caught her in the parking lot doing it (skirt around waist him between legs etc) that was extreamly trumatic for me emotionally... My therpiost says she believes when i discovered W flirting online this trigger first a withdrawl by me then when it didn't stop it proceeded to a hyper-viglalence (sp) condition... she says that is common from post trumatic stress.... that triggered w fear of a controling hubby... causing a visious spirl...more she pulled away harder i held on...

7 they are kids not bad kids just kids... I am ex military and as such like everything in its place... not a neat nick but like things shipshape so to speak... I have also bounded with the little beggers... I love W deeply and I love Ws childern as my own... I have had the best 6 years of my life with her. When it worked i was content and at peace hope that makes sense...

8 I have had the best 6 years of my life with her. When it works i was content and at peace hope that makes sense...


concerning the ps... i could be, and she could be... I am not wise enough to know these things at the moment, i am trying as best i can to understand and do what i can for me to lead her back to me... time will tell i guess..

Who knows why she is distant? You might want to drop any relationship talk, but tell her that you are really going to miss her and the kids.

we talked a lot today about the days to come.. I liestened alot, I am convinced this is going to be a long seige not a quick battle.

she said she would give a D if i asked for one. just fill out the papers and she would sign them, I said the D word isn't in my vocabulary, she said if I meet another let her know, I said my heart is already spoken for and isn't open for bussiness... she talks in terms of when school gets out and what school s the kids do next fall... I sat and listened and tried to breath.

We made love, we held each other for a long time... she talked about feeling old and about so much pain in her life and being numb and confusion i almost lost it. when steped into the shower i did loose it...when she walked out i simply shattered.

I will be asking my BIL and Big Sis to be on stand-by for when she leaves, to give me the stregnth to face the seperation and the move out. I will try to keep it togeather the next few days but it will very hard, this is going to really hurt...

For those out there who pray, say one for me and us... I am pretty sure when she stps out the door i will break into shatter into pieces.

anyone ever feel like they were dead meet and have the M work out?

Some of the most hopeless are the ones that turn around the quickest. But your situation seems very optimistic to me. Usually the WW won't have anything to do with the husband.

i think she is playing me to buy time to get her act togeather and leave for good...

she told toxic sis i broke down today and was crowing she is moving...

Well, they are often cold and heartless. Let's just see what happens if she moves.

Does she have a job outside the home, and good credit?

not good credit yes 2 jobs
she broke down the bunk beds today... is to move her stuff tommrow to storage and move out next monday day after anaversary...

dad giving her appt deposit and co-signing... i think she is telling me wat i want to hear until she is gone and when gone will be long gone...

thanks for hanging in here with me the others it seem deserted me...

feeling really vulnarble right now I thank you for the support!

also what percent of W that sepeate ever come home?

Dad made a big mistake by co-signing. He will regret that.

Stay in Plan A. You are still very early in this. And most do come back to the marriage.

Does your wife have lots of past problems, and problems in her family of origin?

Yes.

and Yes.

Hang in there.

more intresting details...

W admitted her GF's dosn't like me and I can only visit when she isn't there... Also W admitted the roommate's les GF hates my W and is jelious of the time W spends with friend, now they will be roommates... Keeps getting better....

Also W admitted when i broke down it made her very uncomfortable and she didn''t know what to do...(she just hugged me...)

when i left for work today didn't say i love you after kissing her goodbye, (she did, i pretended not to hear it...) when i called on the way to work (normal thing) she said ILU first and i relied in kind...

More advice please and i would love some help making a decent plan A... I am still reacting more then acting...

Her mom was abusive, her Ex H was a control freak and abusive so i am told... But for sure controling....


Her family is disfuntional, always some drama going on... would make a great book... brother/dad drink pretty heavly, sis a addict in recovery, other sis is unstable (married and had/having PA with W future Roomate), drinks alot also, take all kinds of pills perscribed, but she DR shops I am told...

The sis in recovery is probaly second most healthy after W...

you tell me...her family always tried to split us and maybe they finally are succeding...

Remember Ken, the M and it's recovery is between you and her. The love we have for someone and the choices we make are our own. In the end, neither of you should make any decision that you don't make yourself. She will make her own decisions on things, and her friends & family are certainly going to try to influence that. You have to play that game to, and influence her by your deeds and some of the things you say.

I have said things to my wife in hopes of pushing away advice she may be receiving that is simply not "right". If someone tells her she needs to do what makes her happy, I agree. If someone tells her that too much has happened, and it can't be fixed, I disagree.

Bottom line is: Even though your actions and words seem to have little or no influence on this situation, they STILL do. However small, you'll take it.

On the note of hope and separation:
You made love to your wife recently. She told you she loved you. You have more than hope.

Sure, there is hope for the separated. If separation can be avoided, I strongly recommend anyone discussing it or considering NOT to do it. There's a bit of out of sight and out of mind that will occur. As a married couple, it can't last long as you will need to learn to live together again.

yesterday she said...

"I see your making changes..." "I see your trying hard and catching yourself when you make mistakes" ... "the house is calmer and more relaxed, I feel less presure" stuff like that

That's a good sign, you are receiving positive feedback for your changes. Thank her for that, you are doing the best you can one day at a time.

You haven't changed. You are changing. You don't tell her that either, you just do it.

Be like Nike. Just do it. Words without action are bull*hit.

and she is still leaving... also seem real cold when talking about me when she thinks i am not aware...

agreeded about the game being the biggest problem in my view... and a harder nut to crack... I don't know how to overcome this one...

Ideas?

that is the quandry, she has seemed to be more engaging and we have resumed being intamate (3 out of the past 4 days) she sent me an e-mail today with an ILU and heart on it... Hasn't done that in some time...

Then again she is still trying to move... I can't make sense of it...