First off, my wife and I have ben married 10 years now. About 5 years ago I had a two year affair. I regret it and wish I never did it. I love my wife. It has been 3 years since it ended and I have been faithul since (except I did some emailing and chatting online NOT TO HER and not anymore). We were in counseling since we first got together...its been a hard marriage, no kids. About 3 months ago, my wife said she wants a divorce because I have not shown her that I love her enough. Basically, in regular cycles, she goes crazy with anger, she is paranoid and obsessed about my affair and causes a complete marital disruption causing us to start all over again. The problem is that I want to forget the affair and move forward in our marriage...and it hurts that she acts like she loves me, trusts me then regularly "rakes me over the coals" again. I know she is hurt, I am hurt too...I hurt myself and everyone who knew me. My wife and I have only had sex about twice in the last 3 years. Last night I asked if she could wear some lingere' and she refused...reacted negatively only remebering my affair. She had a nightmare about me and OW last night. We had a huge fight and today and I told her she must return to counseling with me or individually if she is to get over the affair, work on forgiving me, and moving forward in the marriage. For both of our sake, I need her to get involved in helping to heal this marriage, or else this marriage is only a torture for both of us and it should end. We have lived like this too long. HELP ME PLEASE <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Have you answered all of her questions openly and honestly about your affair? Have you opened up your life so you are an open book to her? Do you account for all your time to her? Have you done the neccesary things to rebuild trust?


What is this about?

Thanks Melody,
I have answered all questions open and honestly about the affair, opened my life as an open book to her, and I do account for all my time. I honestly don't know if I have done eveything I need to do to rebuild trust...where do I start? She refused counseling or any outside help.

About the email/online stuff...I responded to personal ads and emailed/chatted with women....those were huge errors on my part, I admit. But that has stopped.

First you must understand that your wife had something very precious to her, STOLEN. You promised before God and everyone who was at your wedding that you gave her, with the marriage certificate, title to your heart and body. And she gave the same to you. TRUST was a huge part of that ceremony. You breached that trust and you stole from her. You took what was no longer yours to give away and gave it to another. You stole not only your body, but part of her heart and all of her trust. She is working through her feelings of betrayal and her anger. But if it did end 3 years ago as it seems you say it did, she should have worked through more of her feelings about it.

If I were you, I would get another book that I will not name so as to not be a commercial for it. PM me for the title, if you would like. But the technique I will paraphrase to you is an active listening technique that has helped us tremendously. Give her a token and while she has the token, she has the right to speak about anything, and you cannot argue, defend, fight or do anything but actively listen to her statements. You then have the responsibility to say what YOU HEARD her say and she can say yes that's it or she can say it another way so that you get it. But she has to pick only one issue and chunk it small enough that you can paraphrase it back. Then you switch the token.
It does slow things down, but usually the issue gets taken care of once and then it is done. Or it only gets brought up a few (usually two or three) more times. Being finally heard and listened to instead of your spouse saying 'I got it, I got it' was healing for both of us.

If you have accepted Christ as Savior then I would suggest you also go on a water only fast for 3 days to a week and do a great deal of praying, confess any other sin load you are carrying and cry out to God during this time. He will help you.

I hope this helps and I will be praying for you.

This is more adultery added to the mix. They weren't "errors;" it was adultery. Does she know all about this and when did it stop?

F, I would have to say that, FOR ME, a continuation of adultery after the discovery of one affair would be a deal breaker. If I were her, I would also choose to move on. Sometimes the resentment created from multiple affairs is just too much for many people. It sounds to me like she realizes she just has too much resentment to overcome this, which is understandable.

From Dr Harley's article Coping with Infidelity: Part 4 Overcoming Resentment:


Quote:
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In fact, when a couple goes through a recovery after an affair, and then experience another affair, the resentment is often more intense and more persistent after the second recovery. With multiple affairs and recoveries, resentment is almost impossible to overcome. But then, in those cases I usually feel that the emotional reaction of resentment is not irrational at all. Emotions are telling the person that it's not a good idea to continue the relationship, and I would agree.

When did this happen, and when did it finally stop? Was it stopped by you on your own, or did you end it after you were caught?

What actual steps did the two of you take to recover your marriage after your affair? How did you go about fixing the problems that caused and resulted from your affair? Rebuild trust?

Have you read up on the information on this site? (Love bank, emotional needs, etc...).

Yes Melody, in a strange way, I agree with you. If the situation were reversed I believe I would have left her. The problem is that she says wants to stay married(or does she?) She has plenty of reason to divorce me, plenty. Maybe her anger is rational, but being verbally abusive and harrassing me about it is not rational. She is responsible for expressing herself, even anger, in a safe way. And if she is unable to cooperatively "work through" our troubled marriage WITH ME, then you are right...maybe she cannot forgive, maybe I am the one who needs to release HER, even though I want to love her she remains unloveable. It seems like she is torturing me, and maybe I deserve it, but it is not healthy for either of us to be verbally abused. Thanks for your honest response...I will give it serious consideration.

If you want to do right by your wife and show her you really care about her ... make it easy for her to get the divorce if she so chooses.
But there is a catch to that... at the same time you are telling her that you will be kind to her through this process... let her know that you will make the following changes should she be willing to give you one last chance...

You will sign a post nuptual agreement giving her every asset from the marriage in the event of another infidelity on your part.
You will be an open book and there will be no secrets in your life.
You will participate in counseiling and marriage improvement efforts with her in an effort to help repair what you have broken.
You will cease and desist all contact of a personal nature with ALL women since you have shown yourself to be untrustworthy.
You will work with her on developing a list of things that will make her able to rebuild her trust in you.
You will never put yourself in a questionable situation ever again.
You will never have any contact with any of the ow ever.
You will take full responsibility for every single one of your infidelities. And there were several as ML pointed out.

Make her these promises... and see if you are lucky enough that she gives you the gift of another chance... and if she does... be worthy of it and NEVER make her regret what you she has done.

I don't understand. In your first post you said: "About 3 months ago, my wife said she wants a divorce ..."


See, the verbal abuse you are getting is a result of a continued RAPING of your wife. Rape victims sometimes do get verbally abusive when they are repeatedly raped.

It just sounds to me like she cannot get over the resentment and has made a decision to move on. And maybe that is the best thing?

As far as her being verbally abusive... I am not sure what that means... many people like to cry abuse when none has taken place... when they are merely being held accountable for their actions. Heck... it used to happen on this site all the time when you would disagree with someone the would scream DJ (disrespectful judgement). So, nobody should have to tolerate verbal abuse... but there is a consequence to what you have done and I am not sure that forgiveness is possible... that is up to your wife. As far as you though... and I am a man....your comments asking her to wear lingerie were ridiculous considering you have only had sex 2 times in 3 years. Obviously that was not the request that you should have made. Asking for that would be nice when you are engaging in a healthy sexual relationship... the manner in which you did it shows a level of insensitivity on your part.
Good Luck.

MEDC

And when did you quit your internet adultery? Does she know and how did she find out?

But she never does move on, that is the problem. Don't you see? We have had a problemed marriage from the beginning, she had an emotional affair before my affair, the asked ME for a divorce when I found out (looking back maybe i should have even when she pleaded with me to stay married) So I also struggle with "being raped" as you put it. This is not as unequal as you are putting it...she had infidelity long before I ever started, in fact, I would have never done it if she had not been unfaithful to me. Thats how it all started! I would give her a divorce if she told me that she honestly cannot get over it. But please don't portray her as the soul victim here, she had done plenty of damage before I ever did and she knows it.

See, here is the thing. Only *ONE* affair ended "3 years ago." There have been SUBSEQUENT affairs from which she is expected to recover.

So, of course she will be "paranoid" and "obsessive." When living with someone who has a track record of serial cheating, paranoia is very rational response. Anger and resentment is very normal.

I am not surprised you "struggle" with this because they are just "errors" to you, but Dr. Harley likens it to a RAPE. And as you can see, she does too.


Oh, I see I am talking to a wayward here. So she is to blame for your serial cheating? GOOD GRIEF. Yours is a wayward mentality, F, so I can understand her inability to trust you. You don't even take responsibility for your affairs, much less feel remorse, so she SHOULD be very paranoid. She would be CRAZY to trust you.


Well, since you are the victim here and she CAUSED your affairs, then I can't think of a better reason to give her that divorce she wants! Sounds like she wants to move on and I can't say I blame her.

FFN,

Listen pointing fingers will get you guys no where fast.

Now people are trying to help you here but you are not answering their questions.

When, where and for how long were your internet affairs.
When did they end? When did your W find out. How did she find out.

Whe discovering another betrayal, like your W did it is normal to waffle a little on wanting to stay or wanting to go.

Next if she had an A then you had an A don't blame your A on her.

You made that choice. The wrong Choice as well.

If you want to save your M go get a good MC, and a good IC for each of you.

Then decide since there are no kids in the mix if you guys want to do the work to get through this.

I think if you are going to get help here everyone needs more background to everything you are saying.

fathfulnow,

Where the two of you involved with other people when you met?

Hi Melody-The internet stuff I was doing ended like 6 months ago. But like you said, it seems like she will never forgive and maybe I should just believe that, and that being married to her will only hurt her even if I want to love her and be a good husband now. Maybe I should just give up and file for divorce. Maybe she doesn't have the strength or wherewithall to do it herself and i can do the one right thing for both of us and just end it.

You can defend her rationality if you want, but what good does it do for her to destroy any trust we have worked on for the last 3 months by harrasing me and threatening me now for something that is already over? There is a way to communicate without angry outbursts...have you read Dr Harley's books?

Plank-
No i was not invloved with another when we met, i was very monogamous, until she betrayed me and asked me for a divorce...which broke my heart. I don't know if she had anyone when we met.

That's funny. Asking Mel if she read Dr. Harley's books. Sorry, I just got a chuckle out of that. She's actually one of our "pros" on here, FFN.

Listen, you've only been trying to be a good H for the past 3 months. That is nothing. If you want to give up now, then you do still have the mentality of a wayward. I'm sorry, but I call it like I see it. My H & I are just now considering ourselves recovered & we're 3 years into this.

Let me say something that might be able to sink in a bit -- your W is definitely going to have trust issues. Angry outbursts? She is entitled to them at this point. Notice I say AT THIS POINT. She is dealing w/a slew of emotions right now & doesn't know how to handle them all. You have got to give her some time.

When she LB's you, what do you do? What do you say? When your W triggers, what do you do for her? There are many things YOU can do right now to plug along the recovery. What you have right now isn't a recovery. It's a war zone. And that's b/c all the raw emotions are right here at the surface right now. You cannot expect her to find out about these things & just "get over it". It doesn't work that way.

FF, what trust has she destroyed? There is no trust, you destroyed that by having multiple affairs for 3+years. That is the problem.

I am not defending her, I am trying to help you understand that having multiple affairs spanning YEARS tends to make folks angry and resentful. Try and think about someone other than yourself for a change. Do you not realize the ****** you have put this woman through for years? That does not seem to even be on your radar. Your only concern is that she is angry at you. Well, GEE. NO DUH!

Who wouldn't be?

If you want to save your marriage, why not start by accepting a little bit of responsibility for what you have done instead of whining that your victim is reacting in anger? You, no doubt, KEEP HER enraged with your thoughtless, selfish, unaccountable attitude.

I seriously doubt she is as worried with her communication style as you are and you are hardly in a position to demand she act in a way that suits you. SHE SHOULD BE DAMN ANGRY! She is more worried about her resentment and anger. You should understand why she is angry since you caused it and be more accommodating if you want her to stay around.