I have decided not to talk to him any more. I don't know if I should tell him or not sincehe doesn't know how I feel. Should I just make a clean break. Also I will tell my husband tonight. I am actually in the process of sending my H an email about the WAW syndrome and a another Q I got off this board that sounds so simialr to what I am feeling except the man is younger not older. I am having issues with telling my H about the OM simply because the OM other talking to me and asking me out to lunch has done nothing to take things any further and I don't want to cause any problems with him. I am lost and I don't know what to do. Please help.

MB

To me, it sounds like you're starting down that path of justifying the avoidance of practicing Openness and Honesty with your H. Believe me, near the end of that path the A patiently awaits.

You need to let your H know what is going on. Who knows - his reaction may help to break this "fix" you're getting from the OM.

Mary,

You keep asking the same questions over and over. You ask for help and what to do.

1. Stop talking to OM period. Don't tell him how you feel. Just stop and if he calls you just tell him that you feel uncomfortable talking with him anymore. Leave it at that.

here is your quote:
"I am having issues with telling my H about the OM simply because the OM other talking to me and asking me out to lunch has done nothing to take things any further and I don't want to cause any problems with him."

Mary, a single man asked you to lunch and has told you how attractive you are. Does this seem normal or ok with you? You may be too close to see it so I will tell you - NO.

Tell you H all you can.

"Mr. Mary, we need to talk. I have been feeling neglected by you and I feel like my love for you is slipping away. I don't want that to happen, I want us to be in love and stay in love, but I need your help with this. Here are some of my needs X X X X X and I need you to be the one to fill them.

Now I love you very much, but lately I have found myself looking at other men. You know the CS guy, he and I get along real well and I don't want it to end up going too far one day. I need your help to work thru this with me.

I also know that I have not always been the best to meet your needs also. I will work on that along with your help.

I want to grow old with you, the father of my four kids, and I want to look back at our life and have no regrets."


something like that

best wishes

Thank you very much and that's exactly what I had done I just wrote him an email and told him what you just wrote almost to a T. I also gave him examples of other's letters so he could see how I am feeling from my POV. It's funny really but I have told him before that I was starting to like attention from others and it got his attention for a little while then he went right back to being inattentive.

I don't know what has changed this time but I think something is different with him and he may now realize how close he came to losing me. I will not C the OM anymore nor talk to him when he C me. I know it is for the best. Pray for us. We need it.

Do you think I am going about this the right way? If not I am all ears. I think an A is the most selfish thing for anyone to do yet I can't judge because I see how easily it can happen after years of neglect. Go figure.

MB

Thanks again

Mary,

You need to tell your H everything that you've told us on this board. You need to be completely open and honest with him. A marriage where each spouse keeps secrets from the other is doomed to failure. Your H will be upset at first, but the damage will be far less than if you keep secrets from him. Let him know the depths of your unhappiness. If he continues to fail to meet your needs, then divorce him. However, it is immoral to engage in this type of behavior while you are married.

My WW's affair started off the exact same way. She even told me that OM had feelings for her, but that she just wanted him as a friend, and she should be able to hang out with whoever she wanted. Well, guess what. She knew that it bothered me to hang out with him, so she hung out with him one weekend behind my back, got drunk, and started fooling around with him. She was ADDICTED to the attention he gave her. When she kept refusing his advances, he pulled back some of the attention. Well, that drove her crazy because she was addicted to that attention, so she sold her soul (fooled around with him) to get him to continue to shower her with attention. I finally got her to end it with OM, but extreme damage has been done to our M that still isn't fixed. She still isn't over him and continues to call him every once in a while to get her fix, which kills me inside. Why don't you read my story to see how much pain your behavior can cause?

This is the path you are going down. It is much easier to stop smoking if you've only have smoked 4 cigarettes a day for the past 2 months. It is much harder to stop smoking when you've been smoking a pack a day for the past 10 years. Tell the OM that his behavior towards you is inappropriate for someone who is married, and you want to have no further contact from this day on. Anything sugarcoated will just be an invitation for him to try again a little later. Tell your H, change your phone number, and delete all his info. Don't sell your dignity to get your fix from the OM. Get yourself and your H into MC today. Yeah, it may suck to get him in there, but having an affair with someone else to get your WH to work on things is degrading to yourself and immoral. Do you want your parents and friends to know about this? Then stop it, now!

Hi,

i have two comments. one about your husband, and one about you:

"He said that if he went out and got them that he would be doing it not because he wanted to but because I wanted him to. "

he's an idiot <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> "because you want him to", should be a plenty fine reason for him to go do it.
it's usually the other way around, where the wife complains "you're not doing it because you 'want' to do it, you're only doing it because I told you to". That is REAAAALLY annoying and frustrating to a husband; you should feel good about yourself that you are not doing that behaviour.


Now about you:
" All I want to know is if my huband finds me attractive and interesting and when I try and look nice for him he ask me am I going to wear that instead of saying I look nice."

Umm.. you're trying to validate yourself, instead of "looking nice for him". If you wanted to look nice for HIM... you should be wearing things that HE thinks look nice on you. Instead, you want him to tell you that the things you think look nice, look nice to him.
If that's what you want, then start training him to lie to you. (doesnt sound like a good idea to me, though)
If, on the other hand, you actually do want to look nice to him, then why not try involving him more in your wardrobe choices, and choosing to wear what looks nice [i]to him[/b]? (and maybe asking him more about what he likes, before buying new outfits?)

Hey Jim I will be happy to read your story and learn from you experience. Also I know how hurt he would be if I did something like this because I have been cheated on and I know how devestated I was. I think it's why I have never acted on my feelings before with someone other than my husband. I love him to much to want to do that to him. It's the reason I have been telling him all alone about the feelings I was having. I don't think it really made a difference until he saw that I was interested in someone who was interested in me.

Techie you are a wise man. I really like what you said. It's why I love getting others perspective. I would have never thought about it that way without you help. I really appreciate a good eyeopener. Also thanks for your kind words. Yes I agree sometimes he can do silly things but then we all can. I don't think that he doesn't like the clothes that I wear he just doesn't want me to waer the clothes I think I look nice in outside of the house, because he doesn't want anyone else looking at me. He wants me to look good but not to good. How crazy is that. Do you think I am silly for wanting his validation instead of validating myself? Thank you all so much. MB

I dont think it's crazy at all. in fact, i think it's very sensible. It shows that he cares about you, and is protective of you; also shows that he is worried that your attentions could be turned by another man getting interested in you by the way you dress.
Which... you have posted about... is exactly true, eh? you are vulnerable to the attentions of other men right now.

(and even if you werent.. in some ways, it is disrespectful of your husband, to dress in a way that elicits flirtations from other men, if that's what you are saying)

I dont think you are "silly". i think you are relatively normal in wanting your own tastes validated. Just remember that getting your own tastes in clothes, doesnt help your relationship any. Showing that you value his opinion of you, and showing effort to look good for HIM, does.

In contrast, dressing in an "attractive" way, that isnt attractive to him, is actively bad for your relationship; It says two things to him:

1. I don't care what you think about me.
2. I want to attract men OTHER than YOU.

I understand what you are saying but don't you think if he was doing what I needed as far meeting my EN that he would not have to worry about anyone else. His focus is on the wrong thing.

If his focus was on giving me what I need instead of the way I dress. (BTW I think I dress the way I do to get from others what I am not getting from him.) He wouldn't care one way or another. Would you agree with that? This is just my opinion.

We have been going back and forth with this for years. I ask him to affrim me and he tells me that if he does things he wants it to because he wants to not because I told him. I know he loves me, but I still need my needs met and I will work on meeting his better as well. How can I get this across to him without coming off as nagging?

in a word: "no".

Anyone is vulnerable to an affair. The best way to not have one, is to avoid putting yourself in a situation where you are available for one. Dressing a certain way, makes affairs come looking for you.

absolutely true!!
I'm no expert on the "getting this across to him" bit, but in MB terms, that would be termed making a "thoughtful request". you might want to read up more on it <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Ok Techie, I hear you and last night I talked to H and he said that he would like me to stop wearing clothes that are too revealing. I will honor that request but you have to understand and so does he that no matter what I wear because I am attractive men still flirt.

I remember one day after my H and I had a conversation about my clothes being to revealing I wore a jogging suit to the store and 3 guys tried to talk to me while I had all the kids with me.

Also I talked to him last night about the email I sent him and my EN and it didn't go to well. He seems to be stuck in victim mode. No matter what I say or do he always seems to turn it into a personal attack. I told him that I can tell he has been being more attentive and I really appreciate his effort but if he really want to make it work that the only thing I really want him to do is to be more affectionate, praise me more and read to the 2 oldest kids. Then I ask him if he thought that this was reasonible and he said yes but he wants me to be understanding some days he may be tired and not feel like reading to the girls and I suggested that he could do it every other day. I told I know how he feels because sometimes I don't feel like reading to them either.

After this I asked him to make love to me because I wanted to feel close to him and he said why don't you think about the guy you thought about cheating with and mastuerbate to that. I feel so lost. I am trying to do the right thing but he makes it so hard. I want to be able to talk to him like I use to when he would be so understanding and not judgemental.

I want him to understand that I am not cheating but telling him my feelings because I don't want to cheat or I don't want our relationship to end. I want us to work on what is wrong. He swears that I just pick and pick even things are going good just because. I told him that I have been asking him for years to do the above mentioned things and the reason I keep complaining is because he is not doing them not because things are going good and I am trying to find a way to ruin it. Even though we are going to counseling I don't know what to do. I feel so sad. I want to make this work and I know he does to but for some reason I can't seem to make him understand what I want from him. No matter how much I have asked him even when he tries to do the things I ask of him he still doesn't do what I keep telling him I need. Please can anyone help me?!!!

Your husband was obviously hurt by your emotionaly infidelity. It is going to take some time for him to heal from it. He needs to trust that you and OM are truly over and that you aren't going to call him up again (or get involved with someone else) when things start getting bad again. You obviously want to sweep this under the rug and blame your recent behavior on his lack of attention towards you. You need to suck it up for a while, keep meeting his ENs and avoid LBs. Trust me, he is hurting right now WAY more than you are. Dr. Harley always says that the WS will NEVER understand the pain they put the BS through. However, don't dwell on that, just try and understand why he acts the way he does. It will take some time to get over what happened, but you can if you put in the work to reconnect. Trust me, if I can put the hard work into saving my M after my W cheated on me, then you can.

Some things that you can do to diffuse the situation. If he says, "why don't you think about the guy you thought about cheating with and masterbate to that?" you should calmly say, "I was stupid and wrong to get caught up w/ OM, but I realize now that I only want you." Make him feel secure. But not answering what he said, he may have thought that you rather would have sex with OM. Let him know that he is the only one you want. Also, you don't have to ask him to make love to you. You can instigate. I know all that it would take would be my WW to start kissing me and put her hand down my pants. I couldn't say no!

That's on the money, I agree with that. We are telling you what we would do in your situation KNOWING WHAT WE KNOW NOW, and we're telling you that because we would carry out that action entirely based on love for our spouses.

If my wife told me the things we are asking you to do, it would have stopped a world of pain for both of us. You are trying to protect your marriage and being very courageous with your posts - follow the advice here, it is genuine and tested by experience.

Best wishes for the success of your marriage, it means something.

I agree with you all. I don't feel I did anything wrong with the OM because when I realized I liked talking to him way more than I should I went looking for help. Hence coming to the MB. I have not spoken with the OM anymore. I would understand why my H would be upset if once I realized how much I liked talking to the OM and kept doing it and disconnected from him emotoinally. That's not what I have done the whole time this has been going on I have been trying to talk to my husband and asking him to give me what I need. I know no solid foundation can be built on lies and it's another reason why I have not tried to run off in the sunset. I know no matter where I go and whatever person I am with I will have problems.

Thank you all so much for your help I really appreciate your help, concern, and kind words. I have since been with my husband told him when I was attracted to another M because I knew it was only because I wasn't getting something I needed at home and everytime I do he starts doing more of the things I asked of him but then over time would stop again. I am a very insightful person and I will do all I can to save my marriage but when I ask my husband to give me the things I need and he totally disregard them I feel just like I did when I was growing up and asking my parents to tell me they love me and that I am pretty. It really hurts. Also when he starts giving me what I need I only have eyes for him. What else can I do?

What is LB? Thanks MB

This is the problem that your BH has. You DID do something wrong with the OM (now on a scale of 1-10 on infidelity it was on the lower end, but it was still wrong and still hurt your BH). You shouldn't have been talking to him enough by yourself to start liking him in the first place.


How do you know that he didn't think you were disconnecting from him emotionally? Asking your husband to meet your needs or else you will keep talking to OM is emotional blackmail. If you want to recover, you need to stop rationalizing your behavior. Yes, your BH has contributed to the state of your M, but that in no way excuses bringing in a third party. That will only hurt your M. Stop focusing on what your WH is not doing for you, and start focusing on what you aren't doing for him. If you start focusing on his ENs chances are he'll be more willing to work at meeting your ENs. The key to improving your M is improving yourself, not the other person.



Like I said before, emotional blackmail will never get your BH to sustain meeting your ENs. If anything, he will build up resentment and will be less willing to meet your ENs once the threat of the OM is gone. To build a lasting, satisfying M, you need to work to meet his ENs first. If you have done all this work and still are unhappy with him, let him know the depths of your unhappiness and what you want from him (not all men can read minds), and if that fails to get him to act, you can tell him you want a divorce (that usually gets their attention). Under no circumstances is it acceptable to bask in the attention of OM. Do you understand? You need to do the legwork if you are unhappy with your M.


LB can either mean love buster or love bank. You need to read up more on Dr. Harley's basic concept if you don't know that. Read all his Q&A columns and articles as well. He may very well have the answer to your problem right here on this website. Use all the info as a tool to improve your M.

Dear MB,

You are not YET a wayward woman, but your thinking will surely take you there if you don't alter it.

If you cheat on your H, it will NOT be b/c he hasn't met your needs, but b/c you chose to try to fix something that is wrong inside yourself by going through another person.



That statement is alarming.

You have a loving H who cares for you and your FOUR children, he doesn't have an addiction, nor does he abuse you or your children, and yet....you are actually considering "throwing in the towel" b/c he doesn't tell you you're pretty often enough?

Ummmm, does that sound like a woman who is counting her blessings to you?



What does your attractiveness have to do w/ this?

Do you think if you weren't attractive you wouldn't want your H to desire you?

Or do you believe b/c you are, that you are entitled to be admired, and if he won't do it to your satisfaction you'll find someone else who will?

You call your H overprotective.

But, from my perspective, he's got reason to want try to protect his family.

His wife dresses to attract other men, flirts in front of his face, and tells him if he stops being attentive to her again, 'like is his usual pattern, she might do the unthinkable!'

Sounds to me like he has reason to be afraid his wife is about to destroy his family.


~ Marsh

Ok Jim, let me start with you. When you say I should not have talk to the guy enough to know I like him. I didn't have much of a choice. We had our home built and he was coming to fix things that were not right with the house, as far a drywall issues, heater, etc. It's not just him I talk to. Anyone that comes over to the house I hold a conversation with. The furniture movers, the movers so forth and so on. So it's not like I was looking to do anything other small talk. Also I can see how you or my husband would think I was trying blackmail him emotionally. I however was doing just what Dr H suggested you do and being honest with him. I didn't say hey look honey if you don't do abc I will go to xyz to get it. I simply told him that I am startting to like attention from others because he was being distant. I don't know how else I could have handled it. Also I have been working on meeting more of his needs as well. I was not just waiting until started meeting mine to do the same for him. I never basked in the OM attention. When I realzied I was attracted to him like I said before I came to the MB looking for help.

Ok now Marsh you turn not once did I say I was considering throwing in the towel because my husband does not tell me I am pretty often enough. I asked the question because if he is not willing to try and meet my emotional needs once he finds out what they are should I stay just because of the kids. No he does not abuse me or my kids and he is a good man but should I stay if I am not happy because I have kids for him, if so what does that teach my kids? Also Jim told me I need to become more familiar with Dr H theroies it seems I am not the only one did you not notice that Admiration is an EN and it is one of my top needs. I said the man is very critical and he goes on and on about what I do wrong who wants to hear that all the time? Would you?

Also when I dress in a way that he feels is revealing I do it when we go out together not when I am by myself. As far as flirting goes because I did it while he was present to it was harmless. It's not like I was trying to get in the man's pants while my H was siting right there or not there for that matter. I never once told my H if he stops being attentive that I would turn to other men for it. You must be projecting. If I offended anyone I apologize but I am not a vain, selfish B**** who is so shallow I would put my family in jepoardy because I am not getting what I want. I have been trying to work on myself and my marriage fo quite sometime.

Thank you for you help it is much appreciated. By the way I do count my blessing and I am very grateful for all that I have but because I am grateful should I be willing to settle for anything other than extraordinary?

Also excuse me if I don't want to repeat my parents mistakes. They have a long unhappy & unfulfilling marriage they have both cheated on one another and they don't talk to each other. So forgive me for wanting better for me and my kids.

One last thing if can someone answer this? If someone top EN is admiration and all they get is critizied how do you think they would feel? This is my situation. I hope I answered all of your questions. If not I will be more than willing to. Thanks again
BFN MB

(Bye For Now)

MB,

If you came here looking for help on how you can change your H, you've come to the wrong place.

YOU can make changes and improve yourself, but you can't change your H.

Are you open to learning that some of your beliefs may be harming yourself, your H, your M, and your family?




How about like this...

"DH, I am beginning to worry that I am enjoying the attention of other men more than is healthy for our M. And I want to tell you about this, so you can help me enforce a protective boundary around our marriage."?



Yes, I think staying for your children and b/c of the vows you took when you got married (for better or worse) are perfectly excellent reasons to stay in a marriage.

And I think you would do well to learn how to meet your own emotional needs.


You will teach your children that keeping promises and living from one's standards is more important than acting from one's feelings.

Also you own your unhappiness. Your DH doesn't make you unhappy...YOU do.

Isn't THAT wonderful news? It means that if YOU can make yourself unhappy, then it means YOU can make yourself happy too.

Cool huh?



Why would you think I was unfamilar w/ the EN of admiration?

B/c I don't believe that not getting that EN met by your H is enough of a reason to have an A or "throw in the towel" to your M?



Can you site some examples of what he says to you that is critical so I can better understand?



You said you dress the way you do in order to attract the attention of other men.

How does dressing "revealing" show respect for yourself, your H, or your marriage?


Was it "harmless"?

Did your flirting make your H feel safe? Loved? Respected?



How does holding this belief strengthen your marriage?

How does it conflict w/ the belief that if your "H stops being attentive then you would turn to other men for it."?


Why would you need to be excused for this? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />



How sad!

Then you know how adultery brings nothing but pain and misery to a marriage.



Why would you want to be forgiven for THAT? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

~ Marsh

Ok Marsh, I have to say I do know that in your vows it's says to love honor and cherish as well good times and bad. So if I don't feel like he cherishes and honors me should I stay only because of the children. They can tell when their parents are unhappy. I don't want them to think that being married means you are not suppose to be happy. When I asked about thowing in the towel if I tell him what I need to feel fulfilled in our marriage and he is not willing to do it I will not settle for that I am sorry. I should be able to get what I need from my husband in my marriage. I agree with you when you said that I should be able to meet my own needs I am learning to do that. It's why I am in counseling . Yes I do want to learn what it takes to make my M work that's why I am here instead running into someone else's arms. I do know how much destruction cheating can cause that's why I have never and will never do that to him or anyone else for that matter.

Also how many women want to look sexy when they go out on a date with there man. I have always dressed that way when we go out since we have been together. It's not like it's just something I just started.

Also I didn't see my flirting as harmful because he never told me it bothered him. Also When we do things together and he sees someone that he thinks is pretty and he says so but he does not do that for me.

You asked for an example of how he critizes well last week I locked myself out of the house because my baby was crying and my son was running around the garage and didn't want to get in the car. I knew I was forgetting something I couldn't think of what it was until after I locked the door to the house and tried to start the car. I called him to ask if he put the key in the garage like he said he was going to and he said " How can you lock yourself out the house. It was 24 degrees out that day and it was cold as he** in the garage and he is fussing at me like I wanted to be locked out in the cold with two screaming kids. All I wanted was a little empathy and support not to be made to feel worse because I couldn't focus with all that was going on. Also if he says I want you to cook more often. I do and he never says anything until I go two nights without cooking then he says you going out for food again?

I hardly get any acknowledgement for doing the things he ask me to but if I forget something or I don't do something he ask of me I can never live it down. How fair is that? I told him before I knew he was having a hard time acknowledgeing my efforts and I told him if it was that hard for him to do that's fine I could do without but if he wasn't going to tell me what I was doing right don't tell me what I am doing wrong.

I know I am here looking for help so I won't become a WW do you mind if I ask why are you here?

Ok Techie where are you 2day?

Mary,

You may have covered this, but do you two go to MC together.