BIT, BIT, BIT. Listen, pardner. You sound like you're not really on board with finding an attorney. Let me put it bluntly. Stop being an idiot. Your WW has told you she's going to divorce you. BELIEVE HER! The longer you delay, the better chance she and her slime ball lawyer will have to put something before the court that you'll have to spend much time and money combating. Darn it, your children must be protected even if you care little for yourself.

I presume you’ll fight for custody. It sounds like you’re the primary caregiver and IF you’re journaling all the things she’s doing that are not in the children’s best interests, you stand a good chance even here in Texas. Your WW is lying when she says she would not have to pay you child support (or her lawyer is lying to her). The court will act in the best interests of the children, period. BTW, Texas is a no-fault state but when the time comes to divide property, assign child support, spousal support, etc., adultery is one of the things that can be considered by the court. In your case, without a job or means of support, you can probably get the other side (if things work out to the worst possible conclusion) to pay for your attorney.

Are you journaling all these things? If not, it’s time to begin establishing a record for the court to have available for review.

Have you read Pepperband’s “Carrot and Stick of Plan A?” If not, please look at it as soon as you can. It’s a good reminder that you do not have to accept such things as being locked out of your bedroom when she is the wayward one. Establish your boundaries, pardner. Deliberate humiliation in the home and/or in front of the children is not acceptable. Here’s a link to Pepper’s thread.

[color:"red"]Pepperband’s The Carrot And Stick Of Plan A[/color]

BIT, I think the best advice you can be given at this point is to prepare for the worst and work for the best. Just because you retain an attorney doesn’t mean any petition for divorce will ever be filed, and if filed, it’s no assurance one will ever be finalize. Right now, you MUST protect your children by getting legal advice. Please don’t procrastinate any longer. You do NOT need your WW out of town in order to make some phone calls so please don’t delay any longer.

Hang in there, pardner. The ride’s going to get awfully bumpy for a while but you’ll come out of this whole and sane, no matter how tilted the universe looks right now.

Longhorn-

Thanks for the 2x4. I was never not on board, but sometimes I need some whoop-a$$ to wake me up. 10-4, G-Buddy.

I consulted w/atty today, and we will be covertly discussing my options. She is leaning towards LS, to protect my children and I. We will be prepared when WW drops the D-bomb.

This is still very confusing for me. I do not want the D, but if WW proceeds, I will have my a$$ covered.

It is funny to read the new and continuing correspondence that WW is having with her future dates. She is LaLa land thinking we will be good friends after "her D." I am still going to Plan A, but my code is usually expect the worst, any than other than that is a bonus.

All MB Boarders: Keep the invaluable advice coming my way. It is very theraputic to have people that actually care to help me. The fact that you are all strangers willing to help really gives me hope about the overall state of humanity in general. Not what I have been used to, believe me.

BIT

To Marsh and Anyone else who can Advise-

I know you said the D talk from the WW is fog talk, but I know by her past behavior, that WW is serious. And she is reiterating it in every email conversation she has with her new dates. She must wait until June to file, and that will be one year in present state. That does not bother me. And thanks to Marsh, Longhorn and others, I have the wheels rolling to protect myself and kids.

What is confusing me is that my Atty. is suggesting I file for LS, will doing this eliminate Plan A and instantly start Plan B? Another twist is a large 1-week family vacation is planned for early April, and I don't want to spoil that for my children. This seems aggressive to me, because WW has already discussed taking care of our living expenses when she moves out. But I don't believe a thing that lying w**** WW says anymore. I am torn between waiting until vac is over, or do nothing until she files. Any advice?

Less than a week and WW will be moved out. I am happily approaching that day. WW has been around here physically the majority of the past 2 weeks, but not emotionally, but once again she hasn't been for the last 4 months. I am so tired of her constant emails and texts, while we are all here in the house. That stupid "fog happy" look on her face all the while she is doing this just makes me want to barf. I am more than ready for her to go. I have been Plan A-ing my [censored] off, and it is quite a degrading feeling knowing that the unappreciation from WW continues.

I had talked to a friend about my sitch, and it was mentioned to me to be prepared for a crying breakdown by WW a few weeks after she moves out. Will this this happen, and what strategy should I use to combat this?

BIT

I would file the LSA personally and protect you and the children from WW (not wife, WW!!!) and that's who is calling the shots in her twisted brain right now. It's a piece of paper, that's it. Should she "get it" and have an epiphany of some sorts then great. She sounds as if she is having a mid life crisis and NEEDS, DESERVES, IS ENTITLED to whatever and whomever she wants without the distraction of a M and kids. Protect yourself and the children from her whacked out ways at this point.

h&p-

I think your description is dead on! It pretty much was always about her, and now with WW's "new single life" it is even more so.

It just amazes me that someone who is thinking so unclearly can function in other aspects of life(work, A, etc.)

I am feeling less and less for her everyday, and desparately want her to hurt as bad as my children and I do. Karma will pevail, but waiting for that is the
hardest part.

Don't be amazed by this....Waywards have a way of "compartmentalizing" everything in their lives and this makes it easier for them live in fantasy land and carry on an affair.

When is your appointment with your attorney.

PS by the way you cannot believe anything they tell you.....(i.e. WW - "I will support you and kids financially", don't believe it!)

[When is your appointment with your attorney.

[/quote]

It is next Thurs. I am waiting on some$$ from taxes to be deposited for retainer. If $$ arrives, I can call to move it to Tues.


It is funny, because I never doubted or had reason to not believe WW before the A. Now I don't believe one thing she says. And she knows it. But I just Plan A, and frequently catch her in lies. It is quite humorous. It least I have one thing I can laugh at.

BIT

Finally time to update-

WW started packing today, and with each sealed into a box, a smile would come over me.(Big inside, not visible outside) I am stll Plan A-ing, but I have come to the realization that I don't want WW or W back. I know it is the alien, not W, but I can't stand the constant texting and emailing while the kids and I are in the same room. What a disrespectful display. I don't believe I will be able to get the thought of wh*ring around with the OM for 4 months and that fact that she already lining up more dates and she hasn't even left home yet. I say good riddance. I haven't felt this relaxed in 6 weeks.

I'm also getting tired of doing Plan A, it is fruitless and degrading to me. I was told by WW that I had no dignity or self respect for being nice to her and wanting work this out. I wish I could tell her what I really thought of her, but I don't want to give her any ammo for the D.

Would it be more advantageous to beat her to the punch by filing before her? I will also discuss this with my atty.


BIT

Hi BIT:

I just wanted to put her quote up there. She is the one that has no dignity or self respect.

I asked you a while back to get a lawyer and protect yourself. In my opinion take action and make her feel some consequences for her actions.

Some day your WW will probably regret her decision. That day is no where near. She has lost all respect for you just like my wife did for me. I personaly do not believe in being a dormat to a woman because they lose respect for you. I was a doormat for years and she walked all over me.

That was my fault, never again. In my case when I became strong my XW became more attractive to me? Go figure?? When I was doing everything to give her what she wanted and gave her attention she ran away from me. When I put my foot down and said enough goodbye she came running to me but it was too late for me.

You are a SAHD if I remember correctly. Start giving her consequences for her actions. You can always stop it later if she realizes what she is doing and you still want her back but please protect yourself and your children.

What are you going to do if she cuts off your funding? Be prepared and be strong. I honestly think your wife resents you for being a SAHD. I could be wrong but I believe it to be true. I think in her comments that you have no dignity or self respect kind of hints at this. Again, I could be wrong but who knows.

Again, if you file it can be stopped but I would protect myself. Be strong and in your case I would suggest you show her another side to you. Be strong and not a wimp in her eyes. Just my opinion.

On another note it always amazes me that women just love to say "A good man is hard to find". I see women that throw away a lot of good men. The problem is the new guy after a while is never any better than the one they got rid of.

BT,

I am glad that Longhorn and IhadEnough posted to you. I was getting afraid that you were not Manning up enough to deal with your sitch. I see that you have improved a lot in that area.

File ASAP because your WW has shown a complete lack of disrespect for you and your family and it is time to let her know that she is dealing with a MAN, not a wimp, as she has come to perceive you. Filing first is also the best way to protect yourself and your children from the carnage that will ensue because of your WW’s A(s).

For your future relationship(s), whether with your WW or not, and your future well-being, it is important to understand what went wrong, so as not to repeat the same mistakes in the future. With the caveat that people can be very unpredictable no matter what preventive measures one put in place, I believe that your M failed partially because you have been betaised.

Well, this must explain why I found that article utterly ridiculous.

~ Marsh

Marsh-

I see some sense in that article, but right now I can plug just about anything into my sitch and think it applies.

Last night I made a comment to WW about putting the cell away and stop texting and checking messages from her dates. I told her her that it was "disgusting." She didn't say anything, and did it.

WW continued packing today. When she hit a stopping point, I told her I would help her move it to her apt.(Plan A, I hope, or doormat?) My thinking is the sooner WW leaves, the better. I am just doing my part to expedite that process. She is again showing signs of mixed feelings about leaving as the moment is nearly here. I on the other hand am waiting with anticipation. It won't be very different for the kids and I because she was gone alot anyway. More recently away alot more.

As WW was preparing to go sleep at her new apt. she somewhat tearily WW told me she wasn't lining up dates, she was talking to a female work friend. I know this to be false, because she left the room and gave yes, no and uh-huh answers. I was born at night, but not last night. Plus I have read the large volume of email from the future dates. She still thinks I am am so gullible. I now know everything out of her mouth is a lie.

I made no comment, except for "I just want you to be happy." "If this will make you happy, so be it."



BIT

Blind, I have removed the article as most will not get it and many will deny its truths. I hope you get the point.



No surprise there!

Excellent strategy. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Reverse babble really confuses the WS and that's a good thing. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Telling a WS to be happy makes it almost impossible for them to smile because the BS' unhappiness is what satisfies their selfish WS cravings. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

L.

You've talked about meeting her ENs. What are those needs and can you tell us a little bit about how you're meeting them?

At some point soon, you need to tell her in a calm, not pitiful voice, that you want this marriage to work and you believe it can. Tell you understand you weren't meeting her needs, but you now understand that and are working hard to meet those needs.

Make sure when your attorney files for a legal separation, that he asks for appropriate child support and money to support the household.

Then tell her that you don't want her go, you want her stay home and build a happy marriage. But if she stays, because you don't want to lose your love for her, she won't be allowed to talk to, text message, e-mail or otherwise contact her OMs out of respect for you and the children. You'd like to work on the marriage, but if she wants to go, you will do nothing to stop her, but you will do nothing to help her either. Tell her I know I said I would help, but I've thought about and will not take part in anything that is helping you to destroy this family. And that includes NOT taking things from the family home.

She'll be on her own now and must understand that consequences come with her choices.

These will show both the way home and how you still love her, but you WILL not be doormat, even in Plan A.

Good Luck,

shellybird

Good for you! Well done!



Usually it is recommended that you don't help them leave.

THEY want to leave, then they need to do the work.

I'm a bit confused about what kind of advice to give you.

Do you want to try to save the M or are you done?

You sound very strong. Most BS are very depressed. You seem to be taking this pretty well.

~ Marsh

I was wondering if you would tell me who wrote that article.

~ Marsh

Here's an artcle that you might be able to apply to your sitch that is respectful to both sexes. (I already quoted a part of it to you.)

James Dobson wrote it...

"Only those who have been rejected by a beloved spouse can fully comprehend the tidal wave of pain that crashes into one's life when a relationship ends. Nothing else matters. There are no consoling thoughts. The future is without interest or hope. Emotions swing wildly from despair to acceptance and back again. Nothing in human experience can compare with the agony of knowing that the person to whom you pledged eternal devotion has betrayed your trust and is now involved in sexual intimacies with a "stranger". . . a competitor . . . a more beautiful or handsome playmate. Death itself would be easier to tolerate than being tossed aside like an old shoe.

If one word must be selected to describe the entire experience, it would be something equivalent to panic. Just as a drowning person exhausts himself or herself in a desperate attempt to grasp anything that floats, a rejected partner typically tries to grab and hold the one who is leaving. This panic then leads to appeasement, which destroys what is left of the marriage.

Let's look for a moment at the other half of the relationship—focusing on the individual who wants out of the marriage. What secrets lie deep within the mind of the woman who has an affair with her boss, or the man who chases the office flirt? Surprising to some, the desire for sex is not the primary motivator in such situations. Something much more basic is operating below the surface.

Long before any decision is made to "fool around" or walk out on a partner, a fundamental change has begun to occur in the relationship. Many books on this subject lay the blame on the failure to communicate, but I disagree. The inability to talk to one another is a symptom of a deeper problem, but it is not the cause itself. The critical element is the way a husband or wife begins to devalue the other and their lives together. It is a subtle thing at first, often occurring without either partner being aware of the slippage. But as time passes, one individual begins to feel trapped in a relationship with someone he or she no longer respects.

Now we begin to see why groveling, crying and pleading by a panic-stricken partner tend to drive the claustrophobic partner even farther away. The more he or she struggles to gain a measure of freedom (or even secure a little breathing room), the more desperately the rejected spouse attempts to hang on.

Perhaps it is now apparent where the present line of reasoning is leading us. If there is hope for dying marriages, and I certainly believe there is, then it is likely to be found in the reconstruction of respect between warring husbands and wives. That requires the vulnerable spouse to open the cage door and let the trapped partner out! All the techniques of containment must end immediately, including manipulative grief, anger, guilt and appeasement. Begging, pleading, crying, hand-wringing and playing the role of the doormat are equally destructive. There may be a time and place for strong feelings to be expressed, and there may be an occasion for quiet tolerance. But these responses must not be used as persuasive devices to hold the drifting partner against his or her will.

To the reader who is desperately in need of this advice, please pay close attention at this point: I'm sure you would not have dreamed of using these coercive methods to convince your husband or wife to marry you during your dating days. You had to lure, attract, charm and encourage him or her. This subtle game of courtship had to take place one delicate step at a time. Obviously, it would not have been successful if you had wept violently and hung on the neck of your lover saying, "I think I'll die if you don't marry me! My entire life amounts to nothing without you. Please! Oh, please, don't turn me down," etc.

Coercing and manipulating a potential marriage partner is like high-pressure tactics by a used car salesman. What do you think he would accomplish by telling a potential customer through his tears, "Oh, please, buy this car! I need the money so badly and I've only had two sales so far this week. If you turn me down, I think I'll go straight out and kill myself!"

This is a ridiculous analogy, of course, but there is applicability to it. When one has fallen in love with an eligible partner, he attempts to "sell himself" to the other. But like the salesman, he must not deprive the buyer of free choice in the matter. Instead, he must convince the customer that the purchase is in his own interest. If a person would not buy an automobile to ease the pain of a salesman, how much more unlikely is he to devote his entire being to someone he doesn't love, simply for benevolent reasons? None of us is that unselfish. Ideally, we are permitted by God to select only one person in the course of a lifetime, and few are willing to squander that one shot on someone we merely pity! In fact, it is very difficult to love another person romantically and pity him or her at the same time.

If begging and pleading are ineffective methods of attracting a member of the opposite sex during the dating days, why do victims of bad marriages use the same groveling techniques to hold a drifting spouse? They only increase the depth of disrespect by the one who is escaping. Instead, they should convey their own version of the following message when the time is right: "John [or Diane], I've been through some very tough moments since you decided to leave, as you know. My love for you is so profound that I just couldn't face the possibility of life without you. To a person like me, who expected to marry only once and to remain committed for life, it is a severe shock to see our relationship begin to unravel. Nevertheless, I have done some intense soul-searching, and I now realize that I have been attempting to hold you against your will. That simply can't be done. As I reflect on our courtship and early years together, I'm reminded that you married me of your own free choice. I did not blackmail you or twist your arm or offer you a bribe. It was a decision you made without pressure from me. Now you say you want out of the marriage, and obviously, I have to let you go. I'm aware that I can no more force you to stay today than I could have made you marry me in 1989 [or whenever]. You are free to go. If you never call me again, then I will accept your decision. I admit that this entire experience has been painful, but I'm going to make it. The Lord has been with me thus far and He'll go with me in the future. You and I had some wonderful times together, John. You were my first real love and I'll never forget the memories that we shared. I will pray for you and trust that God will guide you in the years ahead."

Slowly, unbelievably, the trapped spouse witnesses the cage door vibrate just a bit, and then start to rise. He can't believe it. This person to whom he has felt bound hand and foot for years has now set him free! It isn't necessary to fight off her advances—her grasping hands—any more.

"But there must be a catch," he thinks. "It's too good to be true. Talk is cheap. This is just another trick to win me back. In a week or two she'll be crying on the phone again, begging me to come home. She's really weak, you know, and she'll crack under pressure."

It is my strongest recommendation that you, the rejected person, prove your partner wrong in this expectation. Let him marvel at your self-control in coming weeks. Only the passage of time will convince him that you are serious—that he is actually free. He may even test you during this period by expressions of great hostility or insult, or by flirtation with others. But one thing is certain: He will be watching for signs of weakness or strength. The vestiges of respect hang in the balance.

If the more vulnerable spouse passes the initial test and convinces the partner that his freedom is secure, some interesting changes begin to occur in their relationship. Please understand that every situation is unique and I am merely describing typical reactions, but these developments are extremely common in families I have seen. Most of the exceptions represent variations on the same theme. Three distinct consequences can be anticipated when a previously "grabby" lover begins to let go of the cool spouse:

The trapped partner no longer feels it necessary to fight off the other, and their relationship improves. It is not that the love affair is rekindled, necessarily, but the strain between the two partners is often eased.

As the cool spouse begins to feel free again, the question he has been asking himself changes. After wondering for weeks or months, "How can I get out of this mess?" he now asks, "Do I really want to go?" Just knowing that he can have his way often makes him less anxious to achieve it. Sometimes it turns him around 180 degrees and brings him back home!

The third change occurs not in the mind of the cool spouse but in the mind of the vulnerable one. Incredibly, he or she feels better—somehow more in control of the situation. There is no greater agony than journeying through a vale of tears, waiting in vain for the phone to ring or for a miracle to occur. Instead, the person has begun to respect himself or herself and to receive small evidences of respect in return. Even though it is difficult to let go once and for all, there are ample rewards for doing so. One of those advantages involves the feeling that he or she has a plan—a program—a definite course of action to follow. That is infinitely more comfortable than experiencing the utter despair of powerlessness that the victim felt before. And little by little, the healing process begins.

This recommendation is consistent with the Apostle Paul's writings in 1 Corinthians 7:15: "But if the unbeliever leaves, let him do so. A believing man or woman is not bound in such circumstances. God has called us to live in peace" (NIV). Paul is not authorizing the rejected spouse to initiate a divorce in these instances. He is, rather, instructing a man or woman to release the marital partner when he or she is determined to depart. The advice I have offered today is an expression of that scripture.

Well, that represents my attempt to summarize a basic theme of Love Must Be Tough, which is 212 pages in length. I hope it will be helpful to those who have been struggling to keep a troubled marriage alive. In a broader sense, the principles I have described are not only relevant to husbands and wives in a time of crisis; they are applicable to healthier marriages, too. Indeed, I wish they could be taught to every engaged or newlywed couple in the morning of their lives together. There would be fewer bitter divorces if young husbands and wives knew how to draw their drifting partners toward them, rather than relentlessly driving them away. Respect, you see, is not only vital to rebuilding broken marriages, but to preserving healthy relationships day by day.

Now isn't that just like an author to promise the moon to his readers? All writers have this tendency to overestimate the significance of their views. Books being published today offer everything from 30 more years of life for men or ageless skin for women. Unfortunately, these authors rarely deliver on their promises; they remind me of "Professor Miraculous" in the Old West who sold his Elixir of Life from the back of his covered wagon and then left town ... fast.

Hoping not to fall into the same "cure-all" trap, let me tell you candidly how I feel about the various concepts described in Love Must Be Tough—only one of which is addressed in this letter. Genuine insights into human behavior are not everyday occurrences—at least not for me. Indeed, if one stumbles onto two or three fundamental principles in the course of a lifetime, he or she has done well. The concepts I expressed in this book focus on one of my allotted few. Do they always preserve dysfunctional marriages? Of course not. No one can make that promise. But even in cases where the spark of love has died, the principle of self-respect in the face of rejection holds true. The alternative is usually despair."

Marsh-

The reason I helped WW move was I want her out of the house as soon as humanly possible. I can't stand the sight of her anymore. I hate what she is doing to our kids. I will recover, but my kids will be affected for a long time. I've have come to the realization that I don't want her back. I had many chances over the years to have A's, and had enough integrity, fortitude and commitment to the sanctity of marriage to not do it.

Hearing WW lie to my face the last 2 months, and continue to do so when I knew the real truth, is one of the reasons. I think the final clincher is that I don't want to ever touch her knowing she is having unprotected sex will all of her new "soulmates." More like "holemates." I believe in karma, good and bad, and I know paybacks are a b!tch. What goes around comes around baby!

To answer your question Marsh, finally, the marriage is DONE. I read a recent email to OW, saying that WW was tired of supporting me. What a 2-faced b!tch. Always praising me in front of others to build herself up, then losing all respect for me because of her support. i wanted to work, but WW like the fact I took care of everything and was at her beck and call. I feel bad for the next fool that falls for her lies. I should have listened to my friends 10 years ago who told me to rid myself of that problem. Live and learn, I guess.

I can't wait to meet with my atty. this week and start the ball rolling. I am having a good time telling all my neighbors about what she has done, too. I can hold my head high, while she will slink around everytime she comes for the kids. I've got your doormat right here. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I appreciate all the help, and will update as much as possible.

BIT

This woman is resentful that you were at home with the childen taking care of them, and your household and yet blasts you to others. At the same time she wouldn't have lasted two weeks doing what you are doing. She is the classic "I don't have a clue why I am here in this world and just want to experience one good feeling after another (for my ego boost)." No real life for Mrs Hi and Mighty, only la la land will suit her.

You stay strong, protect those children, take over 1/2 of the property, get child support and alimony (spousal support). Don't feel sorry for her azz one minute she obviously doesn't for you.