Ok, I still do have the password to his email, the man I left two years ago and I check it now and then just out of curiosity. Actually it helps prove over and over again what type of person he really is. I realize there's two sides to every story, but the story he's telling - it's so far off it's rediculous. Of course he's looking for sympathy from his friends and the real story wouldn't work.

My story:

the man was fired twice from executive bank jobs in a five year marriage (and two more times while we were dating), was just as rude at work as at home obviously. He moved for another job while I was pregnant, I was trying to hold on to my small business plus have a baby. (ok I'd moved out, moved back and got pregnant so this was unplanned and I wasn't the happiest pregnant person as my husband was still behaving like a pig although I was puking every day from the baby that I couldn't see straight). I moved right after the baby, there was stress, my dad was dying of cancer, and my husband sat in the basement every night drinking, wouldn't help with the baby, called it "my job." My resentment grew and grew. There were the usual verbal arguments, his arrogance, and during arguments he pushed and shoved.

The final incident I left with the baby back to the town I used to live three hours away. I slept on a matress on the floor, had a beanbag chair and plastic silverware. I didn't take anything from the house, bought new clothes even just so I didn't have to go back. I continued to fly monthly to see my father who was dying of cancer. My boy's dad came once in an eight month period to see his son before moving to another state (when he was offered the job I told him to go, that I didnt' want him here since he didn't see his son - I did NOT ever say I'd move there, ever). I continually asked him to see his boy, even brought him to him a few times and on weekends - but he called it babysitting "my son" and refused more then a day so I quit doing that. I served him with divorce papers then backed out but I did tie up the money legally from the house that sold, saying the money couldn't be used until an agreement was made. I could have taken some money then and I didn't. Since I moved, expanded my business, have been trying to get my life together, going to church, taking breaks, you name it... but working my tail off. Everything in my rental house is stuff I bought after leaving him, I took no furniture, nothing. I did let him sell my car and took the truck when I left, that's it finanacially. He refused to send child support, until after I filed the divorce, said I did nothing and didn't deserve a dime.

My life has been hard and filled with struggles, stress and exhaustion from being a single mom. We lived in a big house, had a lifestyle, friends say I should go after the money, and I should have by now, that I've enabled him. I've taken the high road, I haven't dated, haven't even gone out at night once in two years, I've worked my taiil off raising my son and I'm always told he's the best mannered, sweetest boy. This winter I hit some depression, knowing that likely I need to finish up this divorce and get on with my life. Besides I deserve some of the money from the marrriage as I paid a lot of our expenses for the house and bought a lot of furniture and things I never too. I also think more child support would be fair since he sees his son once a month if that. He said lately he was offered a job here, but coudln't take it as it wasn't enough money unless I moved in with him and split the bills - not true, of course he can afford life with an 80k per year job - a shrink told me he'd do this just to make himself feel good, like he tried...

I just can't believe this email I read today - there was another one like this to a different friend a few months ago. I need to DIVORCE THIS MAN. TODAY.

His story:
Here's the email I just read that he wrote to some old girlfriend from the 80s:

It's been years, hasn't it?...
'm sticking with banking, although I'm not sure why I'm still in (sm town). I've been here almost 2 years and it's a good job, but the town is dying a slow death. I was married with a baby son and living in (town we lived), had a big job and a big house, constantly stressed out, and got the chance to chuck it all for the boonies. Actually, she encouraged me and said she'd move here when the house sold. But when it sold she got the dough and I got served with divorce papers. Well of course it's a much longer and better story than that, worth about a bottle of wine or 2. So now I travel to (state) twice a month to visit my boy Soren. He is the light of my life and such a good kid and we get along fabulously. I need to figure out how to spend more time with him. I guess I can move back to Colorado, and I am looking for a job there, or hope that I can get him for summers. This would be a great place for him to grow up, and that was my thinking all along, but now it's all changed. I trade cars every 6 months cuz of the miles I put on driving to (state). I am still paying for a 3 year old Silverado Z-71 so Soren will be in something safe since his mother (name) (yeah, I had to marry one sooner or later) (just to find out what it was like) (ha!) is not a good driver. Hey, I love your website and you have a very cool business. I hope to hear back from you soon, please use this email and not my work one. Take care and it was GREAT to hear from you after all these years. J

And here's HER response:
Hi John,

Cool pic! Congratulations on your son! Too fun, an heir to carry on the (last) name! Man have you got your work cut out for you now!
My daughter is a Freshman at St Ben's...
At three years old you have a long way to go! Was (me) a lot younger then
you? How do I sign up for that program? Marry a man, take his money, and go on to the next guy! I never figured that out. I've been divorced for 17 years! Sad but true! How do I get this gravy train option! Do I need to be stupid? Why can't smart people get married? Men always pick
the "needy" girls. Get ****** in the end! Heaven forbid you pick a smart
woman. Pick the needy girl. Then wonder why your [censored] is hung out to dry! To crazy, must be a man thing, pick the crazy ******, To choose a normal mate would be asking to much! I don't get it! I really don't.
Ok Goodnight! Need to go to bed! J

Horsey, you should know better than to read your ex's email to an old girlfriend.

I'm sure it's irritating to be painted as 2-dimensional money-thirsty ex-wife. But, it's just a smear job. You know the facts.

Let it go, and get the divorce done. You've made it on your own. Soon, you'll have more and more free time. You do not want the good things you've earned spoiled by your STBX popping up again.

Meanwhile, forget his password. Do not check his email account. It's not worth the irritation.

Haha! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Oh, horsey, I know it's frustrating to read his lies, but really, what did you expect he would say?

"I lost my job 5 times in 5 years because I was irresponsible at work. I messed up my marriage and during one of our reconciliation attempts I got my wife pregnant. My son is now three but I barely see him because I moved out of state and abandoned him and all I really want to do is sit in the basement and drink."

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" /> Don't be silly! He wouldn't be able to attract anymore slutballs if he actually took personal responsibility! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

A smear job? Why? I have been through absolute and complete ****** here and that's what he's telling his friends. I should have taken money, and I didn't. I took the high road, didn't date, stayed at home every weekend with my boy. Could have cleaned him out with an attorney I hired and fired because I didn't feel right about it... to be painted as a money hungry ******.

Actually my mom once once said seeing his email has been helpful as I've seen the way he really is. This man is "good" obviously if he can get fired bank job after bank job and still become president over and over again. He's a big talker and I'm sure whatever stories he tells, they are quite convincing - I wouldn't have married him otherwise. It was my mom who said while dating him that he's a talker with and actions don't follow his big talk.

I just called and got the name of a good counseler here in town. It's obvious that I need some help getting through this. Of course in the back of my head I've thought of reconciling, maybe I need to keep reading stuff like this here and there, it's so hurtful and unbelievable. He's so arrogant, is he hurting too and this is his way of handling it or what? Of course what she emailed back was worse, shows how insane his old friend is whoever the heck she is... all his friends were drinkers like him.

I need OUT of this.

Faithful wife - you are right, he's looking for a slutball... and that she emailed back all angry and rediculous probably turned him on to his next victim. Likely he'll go see her to buy a car this weekend - I gather that's her business, rather then come to see his own son don't you think? Oh my gosh.

You know what, he did this when I dated him. Made comments about his ex being a blue collar you know what, made it sound like she sat on her butt and did nothing... I saw him as a successful banker at the time, he was quite dynamic. And said all of the right things. Other then my mom, always right, said I was next because everything was someone else's fault. And guess what, here I am and he's blaming his life on me! To other women. Why would I expect the man to be respectful especially since to my face he's still saying he wants to reconcile and move here, and within the same week he's emailing old girlfriends. He was offered a job 45 minutes from his son, but he can't take the job because he "can't afford" to live on his own... if he moved here he'd have to be responsible to his son, he wouldn't be able to just show up whenever he wanted to flashing in and out buying toys and feeling good about himself. And worse he'd help me out on some weekends by watching him and he'd never stoop to that. I just can't believe this.... why are mothers always right. That I'd be next?

Horsey, I don’t know why he smeared you, expect to avoid taking responsibility.

However, it is NOT good for you to read his email. First of all, it’s unethical. Second, it keeps you attached and connected to him. And third, it hurts you to read what he’s written.

You know he’s a jerk. We know he’s a jerk. Get rid of him. You don’t need him.

As for mother’s being right…. My grandmother was so right about my X.

He wrote the same thing to a guy friend, so it's not just about getting the next bimbo. How can he be asking me to come with his family on a vacation, go on and on about moving here, saying he wants to reconcile then trash me like this to his friends? Ok, I'll admit I trashed him this weekend, I met an old friend who was here skiing but actuallyl it was a situation where I finally emailed him saying I was embarrassed we were separated and I couldn't go to Germany this year for our reunion of friends from college. He said I should stop hiding this, and I did for a long time, just didn't tell anyone. So I confessed the "truth" but I believe my truth is the correct story. Really this has been awful, this man has bashed me criticized me, treated me horribly and my German friend is right - if I don't get this divorce over with I'll be in limbo for years. I've already been in limbo for two years since I left him and it's allowing him to be irresponsible, just showing up whenever he wants. It's not fair to me and it's arrogant. I dont' see a way to divorce him with a mediator or on our own in a friendly way but heck - if he's telling all his so called friends that I cleaned him out anad took the money from the house I might as well take at least what I deserve. I've been too nice to him, everyone says it, the nice days should have been over so long ago. In his email he talks of wanting his boy during the summers, I could have faught so that wouldn't happen too - so he shows up, gets all his pictures, tries to prove what a wonderful father he is at least to the courts after having seen his son ever 3-4 months for 1-1/2 years... this man is sick, you are right he's a jerk. We all know he's a jerk. I need to get rid of him but we have a child together so I'll never really have the man out of my life. I need closure though and to just admit once and for all that this is over, the man's a fake, a liar and a drunk. He can be whatever he wants to be to his friends, I know the truth and so do many others he's trashed before.

Get a good attorney and divorce his [censored]. Get your share of assets, and more child support. Then he can tell his friends YOU cleaned him out and at least it will be TRUE.

i'm with believer on this one.

oh, and stop reading his emails. it is not doing you any good, it is getting you worked up, and too focussed on him.

half the time i don't even read emails my ex sends me because they are usually rude and degrading. if i wanted that i would have stayed married to him. i know mine is a liar and so is yours. my ex has smeared me many times over i am sure and completely rewritten history to suit his needs. not much i can do about it. his friends were not my friends anyway so let them think what they want.

i got everything i was entitled to and every penny of child support my kids were entitled to. it pisses him off royally and i don't care. i may not have been perfect in our marriage, but as soon as he decided to stick his manhood into every woman in town, i earned every penny of everything i have gotten. he deserved nothing less than for me to get what my children and i deserved under state law.

get what you are entitled to and don't look back.

mlhb

Yes, AFTER I clean him out this will be TRUE. I have been so NICE to the man, all family and friends think he shouldn't have even had rights to my boy, he hurt me physically, barely saw him when he was here then left the state... this has gone on too LONG and it's absurd. I just can't believe all of his sweet talking this past year about getting back together - of course he's been a pig either way. A counselor told me it's easy just watch what he says and what he does, it's two different things and it is. I know I need to quit reading his email but it makes it so black and white - what he's saying to me vs. what he's doing and telling others. I am so sick of him. I keep trying to get healthy, exercise, eat right and then this will consume me all over again. Of course I wish it were different, reality really sucks in this case - I feel like such a fool wrapping up almost a decade of my life with this man. Leaving and not divorcing him the past two years. I wish friends and family weren't right. Perhaps I wanted to prove everyone wrong. I don't know.

Yes he's a LIAR, he proved to be untrustworthy our first year of marriage. He's good, very good. One shrink called him the expert manipulator of all times - he's always been able to get better jobs and another wife or girlfriend. He's now 50 it's not as easy for him, but he's still at it - obviously looking for the next woman while lying to me, his family, his friends, everyone. I can't even believe the tone of his email - about how he had to marry a "my name' just to see what it was like. I have the same name of the girl he was emailing. He's been married twice before me, and lived with another woman two - so you could say I'm number four. And that he makes a comment like this confirms my always right mother that this is serial with him. And he doesn't care. Only about himself.

How did you get everything you were entitled to, every penny of child support. I need to stay in this MODE I'm in today to get through this. But there has to be an ENOUGH IS ENOUGH IS ENOUGH point, and today is a good day for it. I worked out tonight, felt better and realize it's time to work out harder to get through this - exercise and nutrition seems to really help with the blues. Yes I earned every penny of what I'll get from him too - he says I deserve nothing, he makes it look like to his friends I was a mooch - I run my own business, I paid my way in this marriage and never asked him for a dime, in fact I supported him twice when he was fired from jobs, once while I was pregnant and the next with a baby for goodness sake - while he was buying new suv's and thinking he could just drag me along to the next town and state.

I wish I could get what I want and not look back. A counselor once said this isn't the kind of guy that goes away - and it was in his email - wanting summers with my boy and he'll likely get them won't he? He'll manipulate through my boy if he can't through me. He'll buy toys and gifts and show up like he does so my boy will go on and on. There will be a day my boy will want to move to be with him as I'll have to discipline and deal with reality while they go fishing. I don't think there's a way to not look back with a three year old boy involved. But I can keep a distance, stop letting him through my door, never talk to him on the phone, hand it directly to my boy, and YES, QUIT READING HIS EMAIL - ok, after I see what he emailed this bimbo from ****** back (how dare the snot nose bit#h make the comments about me that she did not evening knowing more then she did from this email).

The same day he was emailing her by the way, he was emailing me about going on a trip to reconcile... GRrrrrrrr.... Does he think I'm a complete idiot or what?

Ok, so I HAD TO CHECK his email again...

The POOR guy, he goes on to explain to this "friend" who emailed back again that she was sorry for what she wrote as she was drunk last night when she emailed him... THAT he was a CO-DEPENDENT and did EVERYTHING for me so that I was irresponsible in our marriage and DID NOTHING. He says he DID pick a NEEDY one (oh my gosh - when I met him I make 80k per year, had traveled the world, dated and was tall, skinny and cute - needy?). He then says to her that he had thought the rewards of picking such a needy person outweighed the risks. But after our son was born what little we had in common was not enough to handle the stress (YES HE"S right about this part although he didn't mention that the stress included him being fired from two jobs while I was pregnant and had a baby). He then goes on to say I was the smarter one and totally not in need of what he had to offer.

He then claims that I only wanted a child and not a husband but that he and my family pressured me into marriage (actually I told him I'd dump him after three years of conveniently dating if we didn't marry, and my mom begged me not to marry him, friends too, they all knew it was wrong). And then he says at the first chance I got, I got out of it (REALLY, after 8 counselors, reading every marriage book, crying, leaving him once, getting beat up, smashed around in fights, I finally left him)... Then he claims that he owes this chick some explanation since she made him "feel so bad" but this still isn't half of it (can you even imagine the other half?).

Oh then of course he goes on to stroke her ego (read her email above to see signs of her character)... telling her that he's surprised she didn't get married after 17 years of being divorced as she's oh so loving, caring and sharing, a person who deserves the best (although prone to mood swings but as he recalls her highs are worth the lows). He adds that all he wanted was a partner (really, a partner - I wasn't "allowed" to even park my car in the garage, we never shared a bank account, he made all of the decisions and completely took over, even if I tried to cook or do anything I was wrong). And then of course he BRAGS about his position as a bank president, saying he's also an owner (what did they give him 1% if that to massage his ego in this little town). And he says he works hard most of the time (really, I remember a man fired the last time when I had a baby because he showed up to work an hour late, didn't work and I found the letter from his boss about how he didn't return calls and lost their big accounts, was given warnings and was still an arrogant lazy pig at work).

And then of course the "wisdom" of how he's getting happier and is learning more about himself (another really here, as all he does is drink $300 a month in booze), whines, mopes about how unhappy he is, sits alone in his rental house and blames his life on me, happy? Of course then he asks her to call him to commiserate.

HER REPLY to this email: How the message wasn't made to make him feel bad, that she just can't believed he picked a "NEEDY" one, saying she KNOWS men like him (the NICE guys) who have been SH#T on by women, who put up with "all of this... then she adds a FU#K and how all she wants is a partner in life (of course my ex knows she's a bimbo from her language and chose to build her up telling her what wonderful character she had knowing he might get a night or two out of her don't you think?). She brags that she's not a big brain damage person (like me - and what does that mean, she's drunk and shallow?). She claims to be frustrated in life because she doesn't have the hidden agendas of WOMEN LIKE ME. Then she claims she's no trophy wife (at 50 who is) but she gives good head (REALLY, right there in the email from this woman of character).

And then our FRIEND goes on to say that she's with some guy whos a complete loser in life, was in bed when she was up emailing my husband the other night - his situation isn't good, he's 54, has four kids who live at home - throws in the F word to describe the kids and that he's FU#KED, the boys are waste cases, gamble and smoke pot so he needs to kick them out of the house. So (HINT TO HIM) she's waiting for the bomb to drop, and oh she can't wait to chat with him more (and what, give him HEAD)?

I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE IT, I CAN'T... of course married to him I realized all of his old friends were mostly alcoholics, losers and pot heads. But here is the REALITY right in my face of a woman he obviously slept with either during one of his marriages or inbetween. My friend once said he DOES THIS because he doesn't really fit into the world of banking and people of character although he pretends so he has TWO LIVES (yes there was another one when we were married the first year, a bimbo I found from his cell messages, he'd call her when he was going to ball games on weekends with "the boys" and was likely seeing her the three years we dated and during our marriage). He's good, the ultimate manipulator as one shrink once told me. I don't think those banks that hire him have a clue, then they slowly figure it out and he gets fired - he's been through 8 jobs actually in the 8-9 years I've known him. It's narrccissm at it's best? Always creating lies, being a fake, weaving his way into positions yet having no character to keep them - OR ME. The truth is the man didn't have character, I should have dumped him the first year i married him when I found the other chick, the porn on his computer, was with him as he flirted with women at public events right in front of me... he was a big talker, went to the shrinks with me, said what he had to say to keep me by a string in this crappy marriage. Look at what he's doing to this stupid woman? I'm sure she half believes it - it's what she wants to believe - that some rich banker who's been screwed in life will finally she that a middle aged drunken woman is his "partner" for life... will bail her out, she'll dump the idiot. REALLY people live like this.

I was raised in a nice Christian family, I think this man targeted me because I was naive, not stupid - but yes he's right I was smart, smart enough to make enough money to leave him (my money, not by cleaning him out) although I should have done what he says I did - LEFT AT THE VERY FIRST OPPORTUNITY, which would have been before month six of this insane marriage when I found the married but looking dot com on his computer (married women who do married men secretly when they travel - something to this day I can't believe goes on or went on). What I can't believe is after marriage number three, or four if you count his live in - that this woman pities him, and feels sorry that he's been trashed by another woman. Really hes's been a "victim" his entire adult life then. NOPE he didn't include the details of me calling the police after being bashed for the last time, or being fired from every job he's had in a decade, or the fact that he sits around drinking all the time, or that he's abusive and rude, and disrespectful - and that the reason he's getting nothing in return from women is because they all give up as nothing they could do would be good enough for him, and he trashes every move they make.

Hey if I were her I just might want to "come to all of her conclusions" about this man who's about to sweep her off of her feet - and get some good head, he might even stick around as they can be true codependents together for the rest of their middle and old age... gosh.

Eeeeew. Translation:
His: I'm a victim, she's a bloodsucker but I'm a saint of a father.
Hers: She's a bloodsucker, but I'm strong, independent, my daughter is out of the house and it's time for us to pick up where we left off. Too bad you didn't pick me the first time.

Me: ***hurl****

HURL... you are right. That is the interpretation - she is saying too bad you didn't pick me the first time (I can't believe what she's saying and he's lonely so he'll go running to her arms, or well, you know what).

Scary thought here: would my boy spend summers with HER saying the F word in every sentence and playing mommy?

How can I prevent THAT? I work so hard to find him good daycare, keep the tv off, especially the violent shows, and everyone has told me I have the best behaved sweetest boy at daycares and church, etc. I left his dad when he was 8 months old so he wouldn't remember the fighting we did, and yes some of it was really bad.

Just so that he can be around THIS and maybe with my boy.

Oh my gosh.

Project for the week - see if the divorce is still on file at the court house, find an attorney, clean him out, protect my little boy.

Agree with GG. Stop reading his e-mail. It's keeping you from detaching and healing.

HL

horsey,

When are YOU going to quit playing the victim here? Seriously, you left the man. You don't like him apparently. Yet, in several years you have not divorced him, but rather tied up money he could use and YOU could use. Why?

You complain about him NOT seeing his son, but then you worry that he might see his son. You complain about lack of child support but you won't divorce him and get child support mandated.

What the heck are YOU thinking? I could care less what your H is thinking, and I am not sure why YOU care. You have said absolutely nothing positive about this man since you came here. If I am to beleive all you have said, you were nuts to marry him. So quit moaning about him, and focus on your life, and that means taking care of your son, which means finishing the divorce so that you have more resources to take care of your son.

The man YOU left is not your problem or worry now is he? He should not be.

Please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

It's called codependence isn't it? I think he drank so much he became an alcoholic and a friend recovering from that disease told me I was waiting around with the hope he'd change and quit drinking which is half true. I blame the alcohol but it's more then that. So according to him I became codependent, and then he turns and say he was codependent with me, supporting me. Obviously it was disfunctional and what he told this chick is true, that we didn't have enough in common - we never did. I shouldn't have married him but of course there were the good times, mostly trips as I love to travel. But the day to day life was mostly miserable and filled with tears. I was upset all the time and couldn't function with a control freak. Yes I keep crying victim and it's pathetic. A shrink warned me if I didn't leave him it'd get into all of this victim stuff, he predicted it all. I should have left the first six months of marrying him when that shrink said what he did. I just wanted to be right, I wanted to prove everyone wrong. I wanted to fix this. I never thought I'd get a divorce. I still keep hanging on thinking there will be some miracle. Truth is he is a fairly good father, what he's telling her, my boy and him get along well. I worry that he doesn't see him enough, I worry that he'll see him too much only because of this woman and all of her f words, I can't imagine my boy being in a situation like that during the summers. Today I got the name of a good attorney that my babysitter used in a custody battle. Tomorrow I'll make the call. Promise. Thanks for listening to my broken record.

Horsey2- remember when I told you that your X2B is a Narcissist?

That is what they do, they do smear campaigns. Don't be surprised.
Consider reading the following discussion board on Divorcing a Narcissist