I have been lurking on this great site for a month or so now, since my DDay of 2/11. WH and I have been married for 15 years, together 17. Two children. I discovered he had been having an EA for about 4 weeks with a colleauge in another city to which he must travel for work a few times/year. They do not work for the same company, but are in the same industry and as such met initially over the phone. The first in-person meeting resulted in a quick heating up of phone conversations, emails & texting of their undying love for the other. I read many of these emails and they are forever burned in my mind. My husband confronted me on the morning of 2/11 with the classic WS talk, "i've been unhappy for many years, don't love you anymore, i've met someone I can really talk to," etc etc etc. Admittedly, our marriage had not been good for sometime, and I occasionally did think to myself that if one of us didn't acknowledge what was going on and start fixing things, some day I would find out my husband was having an affair. Bingo. His disclosure of his affair that morning resulted in many angry things being said to one another, but ultimately we both acknowledged that we had been treating the other badly, that we both shared blame in the pathetic state of our marriage, and WS agreed to end his A and give our marriage another try. I do know who the OW is, though I have never seen her, she is 10 yrs younger than me and unmarried. I could contact her if I wish, but I have not. WS and I have been going to counseling and are getting along better than we have in years. Of course, I have gone through incredible anguish over his deceit and betrayal, which I still cannot understand. As an explanation, he offers that he was in such pain from my neglect for so many years and somehow or another he turned into a monster unrecognizable even to himself, and can't believe he almost lost everything that was important in his life. I am trying very hard to believe him, but I do not yet have the confidence that he won't sometime again turn into that "monster," with the 'former' OW, or a new one.

My husband now has 2 upcoming trips to the city where the OW lives. They will have to talk on the phone a bit prior to each trip, and they will see each other, in a large group, while he is there. He is likely to spend one night in that city during each trip. I just learned of these trips today. I have not said anything yet to my husband of my panic at these upcoming trips, and am not sure what, if anything I should say. The thing is this: I have been quite successful in my detective work and am able to monitor most of my husband's communications, which he does not know. I have discovered a 'secret' email account he has, through which there have been a small number of exchanges btwn him and the OW. Both appear to have been initiated by the OW, and in both instances, my WH responded in a friendly, very brief, but not romantic manner. The emails were very different than the ones they were exchanging just a month ago. Neither his nor her emails contained any "i love yous" nor were they signed "love." They were mostly related to their line of work, though clearly more friendly than an 'official business' email would have been. As a matter of fact, in the last exchange my WH's last email to the OW seemed to me to be a bit of a blow-off, she clearly wanted to keep the exchange going, and he rather bluntly said he had to run to a conference call. That ended it. I admit I was very disappointed to see that the OW clearly was not harboring any anger at my husband for ending their A to work on our marriage. I had truly hoped she had cussed him out and told him to go to he**.
I have not confronted my WH with my knowledge of this continued contact with the OW because I feel it is my ace in the hole -- if I tell him about it, I lose my edge. I can now monitor his email account over the next couple of weeks to see if they start making plans to see each other during the trips, and, G*d forbid, if after the trips are over, if the love-dovey emails start up again. I pray with all my might that that does not happen. I guess what I'm wondering here is, do you think I should make sure my WH knows how uncomfortable I am with this upcoming trip? I am torn sometimes between honest communication, and being too much of a nag, i.e, continuing to beat him over the head with his infidelity. I'm afraid of chasing him back into the arms of the OW, especially since he will soon be alone, in the same city where she lives. I almost feel like, in Plan A fashion, that this is when I really need to crank up the meeting of his ENs, so when he does see her again, he thinks to himself, "what on earth was I thinking before???" He does now professes undying love for me, that I am the woman of his dreams, right here under his nose, and he can't believe he forgot that. But I am still afraid he is weak......

Any advice would be appreciated!!

Thanks everyone -- you're all so inspirational!

Once there has been an affair, there needs to be no contact ever again for life. This whole thing of staying in contact, talking (even if about business), and him seeing her so far away from home is very bad for your marriage.

We see former wayward spouses here all the time that have just a tiny bit of contact, and continue the affair.

I have read much on this site about NC, and the absolutes involved in it. Unfortunately, the only way to achieve full NC in our situation is for my husband to leave not only his job, but his field. It is a somewhat specialized field. Without going into too much detail, I worked almost as hard as my husband did to get him this job he has now, it is his, and our, "dream job." We went through many years of paying dues, both of us, to get to this point. I am not ready to throw all that away for a 4 week email & telephone EA that is giving good indications that it is over or ending, at least I'm not willing to yet. At least this woman does not live in our state, and the opportunity of seeing her will probably only arise a few times each year. I have considered telling my husband that, unless he wants to leave his job, that from this point forward I demand that he either take very very early morning flights to this city to avoid overnight trips, or I come along. However, that would entail my needing to take time off from my job, finding someone to watch our kids if we are both travelling, etc. and I also simply just don't want to feel like I need to watch over him like a child. (Though apparently I do <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />) I feel that if my husband proves himself to be sincere about ending his relationship with the OW, which I feel I can be almost 100% certain about by my being able to, unbeknownst to him, monitor any email exchanges he has with her, that I will feel much better about our chances for the future. Of course, on the other hand, I don't plan on ever telling him I know of his email account, or that I have also figured out his password to his office laptop computer,where I continue to monitor his activity and whether or not he visits or has created any other email accounts through with to contact the OW. I confess it may seem a bit odd to say we are getting along great, when at the same time I am doing constant spying on him, but I feel it is justified. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Well, that's your choice. But the odds are HUGE that the affair will either continue or rekindle at some later date. I know that there's no way I would take the risk of my wife resuming contact with OM in any way. Please take the time to read through so many of the threads here where affairs were re-started even years after NC was put in place, simply because of resumed contact.

You really need to give some serious thought on what's more important to you...your marriage and the risks that seeing the OW is going to create, or the position that your H is now in due to all the hard work and 'paying dues'. Again, it's all up to you.


As far as the spying being 'justified'...of course it is. He's proven to you that he's NOT trustworthy...it's going to take a long time for him to regain that title, and only after a lot of hard work on his part PROVING to you that he IS trustworthy. Don't feel bad about that.

I have read many such stories on this site, unfortunately. The NC issue is the one that I have been struggling with since this whole sorry 'affair' started. I guess I will continue to struggle with it for some time to come, because I am just not ready to make that decision yet. Perhaps it is naivety, perhaps it is hoping that my husband can redeem himself in my eyes and prove to me that he means what he says. I am certain most folks here would say I am being in a fool, but I am hoping that even though they may not be in agreement at this time with my strategy, that they can still offer me support and advice. One question has eaten away at me, though, as I read so many stories here on MB, and it is a question that came to mind because I also frequent another message board for parents of children with a medical condition that one of my children has, and it is this: On the other board, many of the members seek to calm the fears of new parents coming to the board by telling them to always remember that the people posting the most on the board are those whose children are most profoundly affected by the condition, which has many varying degrees of severity. That for every horror story they read on the board, there is a child with the same condition living a happy life, with minimal or no complications, and the parents of those children don't have the same need for the support, and hence do not visit the site or post on it. Basically, all types of experience with the condition are not equally represented - it is heavily slanted to those having the most difficulty, since they require so much more emotional support. It is a very important point to make, and I have not yet seen anything similar to that on this board. Might it be possible that those couples who have experienced an A that successfully repair their marriages,and are able to leave the pain behind, do not come to this site and post in the numbers that folks who are still in pain, who continue to experience betrayal by their spouse, do? Food for thought....

Sure - go with that.

LOL.

Really though, most people who stay here do have recovered marriages and also really want to give something back to people in the deepest despair of their lives.

Dr Harley is also adamant about NC for life and if you understood the first thing about affairs (hint: get "His Needs, Her Needs" and "Surviving an Affair") you might understand it too.

If he continues contact with OW, hie "dream job" will be your nightmare and you can add your marriage t the "cost" of obtaining that job.

Is that clear enough for you?

Hopeful,

Is there any way you can go with him on his conferences? It might take some maneuvering, but it would be well worth the peace of mind. I did something similar and had to really juggle the kids (4 in 4 different schools); it was the best move I could have made.

Thanks everyone for your responses. I really appreciate them. WH and I had a good talk last night, and since one trip will be on a Friday, I will be going along, and we will stay an extra night just for fun. On the other trip, WH has agreed to take a very early a.m. flight for the event to avoid an overnight stay. As for the OW being at these events, she has recently been promoted (her email to my husband that I saw was mostly bragging about this, in fact) that will put her in a position where she & my husband will no longer have any need to communicate for professional reasons. There is a good chance this will happen before these 2 trips, she is currently transitioning to the new position. I think for the moment I am OK with how we have handled this situation, and it appears as though shortly it will be possible for us to have a NC situation w/o my WH leaving his job.


PS: And bigkahuna, though I appreciate your taking the time to reply, your tone could be a bit less condescending. Having now had first-hand experience with an affair, being in counseling with my husband and by myself, and the stack of books on my nightstand, I do think I might know at least "the first thing about affairs." I've seen a few of your other posts, and people might be a bit more receptive to what you have to say if it wasn't imparted with such ridicule.

HopefulBS-

Since you've read a lot of posts around here, hopefully you'll have noted that I try to be pretty understanding of most folks who come here. With that said, I actually agree with BigK's response...and even his tone wasn't far off. And BigK and I NEVER agree...LOL!

It sounds to me like you're looking for any 'reason' you can to justify not taking action on the NC front...and your response talking about that other forum just clinches that. I'd say that the majority of the 'long time posters' here are actually the ones who recovered their marriages. I don't know that I count as 'one of the veterans'...I tend to disagree with people a lot around here on various things...but I too am in a recovered marriage.

The advice your given is based off of a couple of things...the MB principles (which many here have used to save their marriages), the poster's own personal experience in their own lives, and often the long time spent on these threads have shown many of us just how similar and constant the infidelity issue really is. It's the same story, over and over and over. And truthfully, the way to recovery is normally just the same...but everyone comes here convinced that their situation is 'unique'. That the methods that people recommend don't apply to them.

It sounds like good news and a decent set of compromises on how to deal with the business trips...good call.

But how are you going to handle this on a long term basis? Having the two of them work in any kind of proximity is going to remain a risk forever. There is a great reason why the Harley's insist on NC...FOREVER.

So, you have decided to chance renewal of affair by

working at the same job.

I understand we don't always live in a perfect world. I do agree that it is important for you to go with your husband to out of town meetings. It will serve two purposes. You can use the spare time to fill the required 15 hours of recreational time with him, and avoid the two possibly picking up where they left off.


My advice would be to keep the lines of communication open. Ask your fws how he is going to protect himself and you from re-kindling his EA, and or keep from having another.


Having access to his e-mails is a wonderful way to monitor his actions. I agree, don't reveal your source.

Wishing you the best,

k.d.'s heartbreak

Thanks, Owl. You're right, I guess I am trying to justify my strategy on the NC front because, though I wholeheartedly agree that the behavior of people involved in affairs is remarkably similar(it's truly amazing, isn't it?), I do in fact think that each of our situations IS unique, and that we each have to apply the MB principles, including achieving NC, in a way that best fits our own situation. I do think that my WH and I have hit upon a good compromise for my WH's upcoming business trips, and once the OW completes the transition to her new position over the next month, they will no longer have any need for contact. They do not work for the same company, but are only in the same field. Without going into too much detail, her new position is drastically different than her current one, and will eliminate any need whatsoever for my husband and her to communicate or ever be in the same place again for business reasons. I don't think it's necessary for me to ask my husband to give up his job simply because it requires him to travel to the city where the OW lives a few times a year if there is no longer any need for them to have any contact for business reasons. I think it will be easier for us, in our situation, to achieve NC than it has been for the many situations I've read on this site where NC has been achieved even though the OW lives in the same city as the FWS. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> And as I mentioned before, my detective work has given me some excellent 'tools' for monitoring whether or not my WH continues contact the OW. As it stands now, their last contact, initiated by the OW, was almost 3 weeks ago. To be honest with you, my long-term concerns are not so much my WH continuing his A with this particular OW, but my WH starting up with a new OW on some business trip somewhere down the line. To his credit, he has been showing huge amounts of remorse, self-loathing, etc., which I believe is sincere, but it will be, as everyone here knows, a long time before my trust in him can be restored. In the meantime, we are both working very hard on meeting each other's ENs, and it has made a huge difference in our relationship. We have been 'dating' again and making together time a priority for the first time ever since our kids came along. (We were one of those couples where everything was about the kids, and we went out alone, I kid you not, maybe twice a year, and have only spent the night away, alone, without the kids, once in 12 years <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />.) We already have another night away at a local, romantic hotel, scheduled for later this month.

Thanks again, everyone. This site has been a great comfort to me.