So here is the long and short of it...

I've been living with a girl for 7 years, we had an abortion 7 years ago. We never dealt with it and as a consequence our feelings of self-loathing, hurt and betrayal went ignored.

I didn't love her anymore, I even broke up with her but we kept living togeth and having sex sometimes. She just kept hanging on waiting for the day that I would love her. Eventually, out of guilt and a desire for her to be happy, I asked her to be my girlfriend again. Later, since she said she would leave is I didn't marry her, I asked her to marry me.

We do love each other on some level, but I convinced myself that "love" and being "in love" were childish fantasies and that I had out grown them. I abandoned these ideas in favor of "compatibility" and her qualities that I thought would make a good mother.

Well, she gave me a "free pass" for a bachelor party a week before the wedding. I found a young girl who is everything that I ever wanted but never had. I found out that those feelings I didn't have anymore were not just fantasies, but realities that had been covered up by lies, pain, denial and hurt.

I told my fiance about the other woman. She didn't care about the physical intimacy, but the emotional relationship that had developed between the girl and I. She claims that she gave me a free pass for physical relations, not emotional ones. However, had it not been for this other woman, I never would have known what we were missing...

Two days before the wedding, I had a second party thrown by people who were out of town for the first one. I wasn't given a pass. I got blitzed (I rarely, if ever drink, but I chose to be irresponsible) and the other woman and I messed around again...

I told my fiance and she was devistated.

We got married on Sunday (three days ago) anyway...

Now I am learning what marriage is and I know that I wasn't ready. This is not the right relationship for me.

We are going to go to counseling.

We are going to resolve the issue of the abortion.

We know that there is a type of love that I do not have for her but she has for me.

We know that I have those feelings for someone else...

We don't know anything else at all...

We have been under a cloud of hurt, pain and fear for so long that we couldn't see clearly - she wanted something so badly that she chose to believe that we had something we didn't - that ate me up on the inside and I couldn't even tell myself the truth because I didn't want to cause any more pain or upheaval...

I didn't know what I was missing until it was almost too late... She still wants this, but she shouldn't - she shouldn't want me if I can't feel the same way for her right?

Maybe I can feel the same way for her after we resolve everything, but what if I don't or can't?

Any thoughts, suggestions or advice is appreciated...

Hello Greg,

Welcome to Marriage Builders.

I don't mean to offend you but,you sound very immature.How old are you? What I mean is you don't seem to have many healthy relationship skills so far based on what you said.

You spend 7 years of your life with the girlfriend (GF) and she has an abortion,which I'm sorry about.That is sad. But you don't really commit after that,you're half in,half out of the relationship,having sex periodically.You let other's,namely your GF,dictate where your life goes and out of guilt get back together,then under poor circumstances and reasoning you get married all the while knowing deep down it wasn't the right decision.And now you are even more sure it wasn't right yet you took vows.

What is this "free pass" business? You find another young girl( just how young is she??) and start a new relationship there which now is interfering with your marriage.Why you ever decided to do that,I will not really understand.Marriage is not to be taken lightly.And your wife doesn't seem to care either about your behavior and perhaps her boundaries are lax.

Well,it's a mess you are in no doubt.In my opinion,you can do one of two things.Really try to make this marriage work.Counseling is good but be sure it's with a PRO marriage counselor,not one that thinks it's ok to move on simply if you're not "happy".The other option is divorce and cut your "losses" so to speak.You have no kids right now which is good since that would only complicate matters even more.

If you read the concepts here about love and emotional needs,etc,it is quite possible that you and your wife could learn how to fall in love and stay in love through Dr.Harley's principles.But it's work and you have to have a plan.One thing you need to be sure of though is that the "other woman" (OW) is out of the picture.She cannot be a part of your life if you want any chance at all of having a good marriage ok? A marriage is not a threesome and you will NOT be able to have any romantic,love type feelings for your wife if the OW is around interferring.

It's all up to you.This might be a good chance for you to see what's it's really like to work on a real marriage.If it still ends then you can at least say you tried your best so when the time comes again one day that marriage is considered,you hopefully will be a bit more educated and experienced in what to expect and what to do.

Lastly,keep in mind that the "in love" feelings aren't designed to last,not the way they are in the beginning.That is a crucial mistake people make when they are married and things get tough.Love transitions over time.So when the love feeling changes,people may think something is wrong or they need to go be with someone else and find that feeling again.That's one reason I think relationships break up so much and divorce rates remain so high.You can't just keep "upgrading" every time things aren't super happy.Marriage isn't about that.It's about love,care,respect,committment and many other things.Not just the high of the infatuation stage.If that's all people care about then they will be going through partners every few years.It's those couples who understand all these things that are the ones that last for years and have silver and gold wedding anniversaries.

Anyway,good luck to you with what you decide.I know it's a difficult situation.

"I don't mean to offend you but,you sound very immature.How old are you? What I mean is you don't seem to have many healthy relationship skills so far based on what you said."

Late 20s.

My emotional growth was stunted as a child due to family situations. I am aware that I have poor relationship skills. I am working on these things as well.

"You spend 7 years of your life with the girlfriend (GF) and she has an abortion,which I'm sorry about.That is sad. But you don't really commit after that,you're half in,half out of the relationship,having sex periodically.You let other's,namely your GF,dictate where your life goes and out of guilt get back together,then under poor circumstances and reasoning you get married all the while knowing deep down it wasn't the right decision.And now you are even more sure it wasn't right yet you took vows."

You make an excellent point. My locus of control was entirely external. I know that is wrong and THIS is one of the primary issues to be corrected in the near future. I place a higher priority on control over my own life than I do "saving" any relationship.

"What is this "free pass" business?"

Quite simply, my GF gave me permission to do whatever I chose with whomever I chose on the night of the aforementioned party.

"You find another young girl( just how young is she??)"

Early 20s

"and start a new relationship there which now is interfering with your marriage.Why you ever decided to do that,I will not really understand."

It was, and is, primarily a friendship. It grew into much, much more than that when, without any physical intimacy, we experienced a sensation that can only compare to the best orgasm that one has ever had multiplied by 1000. It makes no sense to me but it was an emotional and nearly spiritual bliss that we both experienced at the same time while doing nothing more than sitting and holding one another with no sexual touching, kissing or anything of the sort...

I can't explain this sensation, but I would gladly sacrifice any and all physical intimacy with this OW just to spend 5 more minutes with her. These feelings have become that strong...

"Marriage is not to be taken lightly.And your wife doesn't seem to care either about your behavior and perhaps her boundaries are lax."

We come from a rather different perspective than most people. We are primarily concerned with one anothers personal and spiritual growth rather than our own feelings. If other relationships are best, then neither of us will stand in the others way...

"Well,it's a mess you are in no doubt.In my opinion,you can do one of two things.Really try to make this marriage work.Counseling is good but be sure it's with a PRO marriage counselor,not one that thinks it's ok to move on simply if you're not "happy"."

Neither of us desires to see this type of counselor since we have no desire to make this work if it is not in the best interests of our personal growth.

"The other option is divorce and cut your "losses" so to speak.You have no kids right now which is good since that would only complicate matters even more."

Since we never signed any legal paperwork, there is no divorce to be had should we choose to cut our losses...

"If you read the concepts here about love and emotional needs,etc,it is quite possible that you and your wife could learn how to fall in love and stay in love through Dr.Harley's principles."

Understood. I am having a hard time seeing why I would want to fall in love with her since the main reason that I continued this realtionship was out of fear, pain and guilt.

"But it's work and you have to have a plan.One thing you need to be sure of though is that the "other woman" (OW) is out of the picture.She cannot be a part of your life if you want any chance at all of having a good marriage ok? A marriage is not a threesome and you will NOT be able to have any romantic,love type feelings for your wife if the OW is around interferring."

Oddly, I seem to have more feelings of gratitude and love toward her after spending time talking with the OW... Any idea why this may be?

"It's all up to you.This might be a good chance for you to see what's it's really like to work on a real marriage."

This is where I get confused... Is a "real marriage" based upon years of deceit and false emotion? Does a "real marriage" mean that you tell yourself and your partner that you have feelings that you do not? If so, I really do not think that I am a "real marriage" type of person...

"If it still ends then you can at least say you tried your best so when the time comes again one day that marriage is considered,you hopefully will be a bit more educated and experienced in what to expect and what to do."

I do want to learn all that I can from this, thank you for your perspective. This helps.

"Lastly,keep in mind that the "in love" feelings aren't designed to last,not the way they are in the beginning.That is a crucial mistake people make when they are married and things get tough."

I think that I understand this, but I doubt that they should have been replaced by "this person disgusts me" and "I don't feel toward them the love that they express to me feelings". Or am I just seriously wrong here? Maybe this IS normal, I really have no way of knowing...

I told myself that this was what a long-term relationship inevitably turned into... Now I think that I CAN have a loving long-term relationship, just not with the person I have been trying to have one with for the last seven years...

"Love transitions over time.So when the love feeling changes,people may think something is wrong or they need to go be with someone else and find that feeling again.That's one reason I think relationships break up so much and divorce rates remain so high.You can't just keep "upgrading" every time things aren't super happy."

I agree with you. If you really love someone in "that" way you should WANT to work things out, right? What does it say that I really don't want to work things out anymore? I feel that if my only reason for working things out is due to obligation or guilt then I am doing things for the wrong reason - external locus of control again... I honestly think that I should only work this out with her if I TRULY LOVE HER in the sense that she says that she loves me... That love IS NOT there and now I can't deny it...

"Marriage isn't about that.It's about love,care,respect,committment and many other things.Not just the high of the infatuation stage.If that's all people care about then they will be going through partners every few years."

Recently, I have had a hard time understanding why this is wrong...

"It's those couples who understand all these things that are the ones that last for years and have silver and gold wedding anniversaries."

I used to think that I wanted that... Now I don't understand why I should desire to be with the same person for so long unless I really love them and I guess I'm just not getting the whole "love" concept...

"Anyway,good luck to you with what you decide.I know it's a difficult situation."

Thank you, I really appreciate alot of the things that you have said. I especially found your first couple of paragraphs enlightening. Much food for thought there!

Thanks again,

Greg

Greg,

"Oddly, I seem to have more feelings of gratitude and love toward her after spending time talking with the OW... Any idea why this may be?"

Not odd...very usual. OW is a clean slate...you have no history, no realness as a relationship. Same as you did when you first met your long-term GF.

What I believe you've encountered are two of the three phases of marriage. Phase I is the attraction...and if you'll read "Getting The Love You Want" by Harville Hendrix, you might be surprised at why you were attracted.

It's where we show best self-images to one another...not real selves. And as you get together and live real life, experiencing it daily with each other, you get to Phase II...where we begin to show our not so best parts of our self-images...which is usually where the greatest conflict begins.

Doesn't take marriage to get there...takes time, forming a mutual history. The phrase, "warts and all" comes into play. It's a tough phase, Greg.

Some people don't get through it to Phase III...which rocks, in my experience. Well worth the crap. Hugely worth it.

The difference between love and in love...is like Phase I and Phase II...only love is a choice you make, Greg. What I hear you seeing love as is a feeling...there are loving feelings...they come as a result of us choosing our belief we love. We choose who we love, and act from our love...not to get love in return...which is giving to get (and has tit for tat in it, as well)...which is earning love (backside is punishment)...and mostly, it's a parental love...not a partnering way to love.

I think you've been craving partnering love all along.

I'd be interested in what you think.

Living your life directly from your beliefs, not your feelings, is the flip around correction which gets us to clarity in life. Feelings are real, valid...they are signals about us, for us, from our own beliefs.

Which is why living from them is crazy-making. Because it's backwards, indirect and confusing.

You're not bad or wrong...you're living, by choice, kinda backwards.

I'm totally for your marriage, Greg. You both can grow together, heal together (from your whole lives) and learn to partner together. Takes learning about healthy boundaries, living from respect and awareness...and choice.

Lots of great stuff out there...and you have real love with your wife. Go no contact with OW...and in three months you'll be able to see where she was fantasy...and how you use fantasy to soothe a lot of your own stuff...mostly fear and pain.

Which isn't you being defective...just you being human.

Thank you for being here on MB, for being brave and posting...and considering and staying here. Good to know you make good choices for yourself, too.

LA

Excellent post LA