HI I have been on ethe website for about a year- mostly checking in when I need some refueling.

Right now, I am wondering what steps I should take. Here's the brief-

FWH has been struggling with our marraige for some time. I think he thinks that it is useless. He has pretty much given up.

I on the other hand have made tremendous steps to creating an environment that supports our marriage, as we have two children. I have practically given him anything that he wants in the past year. The more I give the more he takes and says mean and hurtful things.

Our main focus has been on avoiding love busters and working on compromise. He came home Wednesday and said he wanted to go dirt bike riding on Sunday- Our only day with him because of his new work schedule. I said I dont' feel good about that. Can we compromise. I explained that the chidren and I needed time to see him and it was our only weekend day with him. In the course of this next week they would have only seen him for about 5 hours. He said that me being controlling was the reason he was miserable (Guilt trip) He walked away. I said I didn't want you to walk away if you aren't happy with staying home for that reason then we should compromise. So we talked until we came to an agreement. After the agreement he was angry. I try to talk to him to understand why and his response was Why do I have to compromise???

Wednesday he came home and wanted to go out on Friday riding also. I suprisingly had the day off anf informed him before he said anything about the riding. I said go, but maybe we could have breakfast??? Then I asked what time he would be home since he was going on Sunday and part of our compromise was that he would take us out on Friday after school. He said he couldn't give me an exact time and I would be angry if he was late. I said I wouldn't be angry if he were a few minutes late, but if it were more than a half an hour, then I would like a phone call. I said I thought that i was important to get a time as it affects what time I would come home from work. Then I went up and ask do you care how I feel. And he said I don't care at all. I grabbed his hand and asked him to come into the other room. I said I understand that you are angry, but saying hurtful thing doesn't amek anything better. Do you still feel that way?? he said yes. I asked him to get his stuff and leave. He did.

What to do????


Plan B???

Can you plan B even if there isn't another women?

I have had no contact since Thursday night when he left.
I am trying to keep busy with friends, but have no clue what step to take next???

H gets off work tomorrow morning and will be riding all day tom. I don't know if he will try to come home. (He had come home on Thursday, but I wasn't there) What NEXT. Please help.

I have written a lot of posts with no response. I know there are people that know what to do next. Where are you???

Cfc,

Here are a few questions:

1. R U sure the A is not going on...right now?

NOTE: His anger shows he isn't ready for recovery. It is still all about him. He isn't even an Xws if he continues with his Ws attitude. So PA, EA or not, he is still a WS.

2. Based on the above are you done with your plan A?

3. Do you know your personal and M boundaries?

4. Are your finances, custody and support in order?

5. Is your mind and heart in sync?

6. Do you have MC or IC support?

7. What books have you read?

L.

It sounds like you were doing a good job of trying to negotiate time together.

It does seem like he is spending a lot of time working. Is there anyway to change that?

How many hours a week do the two of you spend together doing fun things?

Here are a few questions:

1. R U sure the A is not going on...right now?
OCtober 31 2005 nad ended sometime in February 2006 (short lived) but painful. Not so much from the affair ut how he handled the recovery. H refused to talk to her again because he didn't want to talk to her again and start something new. We followed the SAA in regards to watching time away from home ( he goes to work and comes home), money ( I take care of all the finances so I know he has minimal money), I have watched every website listed on my computer since the affair. In November 2006, I recovered a secret email account. Which made me regress in recovery back to the start. H left that night after an argument that he has nothing of his own in this marraige. He says I am like his mother who would read his mail and never give him space.... (his mother hasn't talked to us in two years, which I know is a problem for him, but he wishes to not discuss it with her). H returned that evening because he had to prove to me that he wasn't lying about the email. He admitted that night he never wanted to hurt me and felt bad. Before this night I was pretty sure that things were on the mend. After this i began to feel insecure and untrusting. I am almost sure the first affair is over, but am bginning to think that a new one has arisen or he is feling depressed, or something else is going on.

NOTE: His anger shows he isn't ready for recovery. It is still all about him. He isn't even an Xws if he continues with his Ws attitude. So PA, EA or not, he is still a WS.

H has shown anger since the beginnning and is unable to let this go to recover. Last summer things seemed to be much better, but I don't know.

2. Based on the above are you done with your plan A?

I plan Aed the best I could from January to June. In June things got much better. As things have intensified since February, I have began to re-read SAA and HNHN. I began discussing these with H, but he says he can't understand what I am talking about (an excuse to avoid the issue).I have definately had 99% less anger. I just try to say to my self that he is trying to make me angry to avoid discussing rationally. Which is true he will say mean and hurtful things to avoid the problem or change the subject all together. He knows when he gets angry, it changes the subject. I took a long time to figure out that he was avoiding things. That is his main problem. He has difficulties dealing with problems (That is the reason he hasn't spoken with his family and they with him- they all would rather avoid a problem then deal with it.) I have learned to be very fair, and understanding of his needs- the conversation above is a new CFC conversation. I feel that I treat him with a lot of respect ( he however seems to be acting like a child in not being able to face the problems- of course I would never tell him this as name callign is painful)


3. Do you know your personal and M boundaries?
My M boundaries are:
1. I want to feel secure in knowing that he is not having an affair which translates to transparency ( H feels that he has proven to me that he is not cheating and finds it disrespectful that he has to share everything with me).

2. I want him to try to meet some of my needs. H refuses to kiss me, touch me, and act like he cares at all. It is painful having him in the house when I a trying to be happy and enjoy life and he is miserable, pouty, and refusing to be husbandly.

My personal boundaries are:
I want to stop the cycle of pain and if he continues the cycle, I need to step away.

4. Are your finances, custody and support in order?
NO, Finance are awful. H just took a new job in December in which he makes a lot less money. We are not making ends meet. H took another job and has increased his hours to cover some expenses, but has been putting money into his car as it needs some help. My business is breaking even every month so I have only been able to contribute enough to buy groceries and gas each month. On top of this our mobile home that we lived in while H was in the USMC 9 years ago ( we used it as a rental to bring in some extra cash) has been stolen and the insurance is unwilling to pay for it. We are in a legal battle over this. When we moved to this house 3 years ago, I completely molded due to the sellesrs lying and painting over mold in the house. We have $25,000 that we are still paying off as the whole house had to be redone.

5. Is your mind and heart in sync?
MY mind always follows my heart. I have always been a caring person so I feel badly that my H is wayward. I want nothing more than to work out our problems ( We went to a marriage counselor- who H couldn't handle and he left) H has a problem with dealing with problems so the marraige counselor made him face his problems and he couldn't take it. His attitude is why can't we just be happy?
My mind is wondering if I am only wanting him because I am scared. Of course this is why I am having a hard time with this.

6. Do you have MC or IC support?
MC- no
IC- No, but have done alot of reading and have a pychology degree. I talk with a lot of my friends and feel that I am okay with what is going on. I have tried three times to find a therapist, but have been unsucessful. I have shared Dr. Harley's ideas with them to no avail. I can't afford HArley's prices right now.

7. What books have you read?
I have read SAA, Love Busters, HNHN, and I bought the workbook to go with them- FIve steps to romantic love. I have also done a lot of reading here.

I don't know what steps to take next? Please HELP!


Thanks Believer I feel that i am doing a good job, I just wish that H would see that. I want him to see that this ia a good thing and we should be proud that we are doing this. Instead he is angry! HE must be foggy again.

H is working a lot. He is firefighter and has been off working nights for ten years. In December he got the job of his dream and now must start at the beginning again. He is working 24 hours on 48 off. Then on his days off he runs an ambulance for our town and doesn't get home until 6:30 sometimes later. The kids go to bed at 7:30 and this doesn't give them much time with him. He could go to school and help out, when he does have a day off, but refuses. The kids are seeing him a lot less. My son, 7, has started waking up nights again and my daughter, 4, has intensified her emotions. We came up with a plan two weeks ago to help the children adjust to seeing him. This involves visiting the firehall when we haven't seen him for two days. And giving the children a schedule so they know when they will see him and making a incentive chart to stay in bed at night rewarded with time with Daddy. It has ben working nicely. Of course H is gone now and we have had to revise a little to mommy time.

When he is home, we have Thursday nights as family night- playing games, watching a family movie or doing something together. Every other night he is home we put the children to bed and talk or watch a movie together. H holds me if I ask. I bought him netflix and we get movies all the time. Sometimes he will buy wine or i will get chocolate or make something special just for him because he likes my cooking. But this has deminished since September.

cfc- I can relate with your inability to get through to your spouse...

Keep trying. If there is no imminent affair per se that is the wedge between you, I would like to think you guys have a fighting chance at reconnecting. Keep trying, keep working, loving, showing him you love him.

I can relate to the financial stress as that seems to have been a significant factor in our issues as well.

But what do you think that my next step should be? H has been gone since Thursady. I know he desn't work today, but was planning to go on a dirt bike ride all day. I am not sure if he will try to come home after that. Even if he doesn't I am sure he will try to show up at my son's game tomorrow night as he is a partial coach (coming to coach when he is not working). What do I say when I see him the next time??? Or should I write him a letter before then? or should it be his job to initiate some kind of change??

I have a lot of anxeity today because I can't get out of the house- my daughter was vomiting this morning. I really don't think she is sick, but made herself throw-up for attention because she was doing this fake cough thing that she just starte doing until she threw up a little. Although we had two sickies on our baseball team yesterday whose parents refused to take them home.

I would work on improving the finances. That is one of the biggest problems that lead to divorce. You need to cut back somehow. He is working too many hours.

I have been a SAHM for 6 years now and Have opened my own school to be with the kids and meet their needs. My school has been a stresser, so has our solen mobile home, our moldy house, our dog died, the kids have been dealthy sick from the mold, my husband testing positive to a blood disease, a heart condition, and a knee problem that all proved to be negative. It has been one thing after another!

I have doen a lot to get us on the right track, but H wants to have fun without regard to finances.

Having fun without regard to finances is a recipe for disaster. It always catches up to you.

H seems to be a man without a plan. He thinks that life is a whirlwind of fun with no regard to anything that is troubling. If this is the case, he doesn't have to face reality. I have given him a ride for too many years. Doing his bills, and everything else. No more cake here.

The problem probably will be that he now may have a sense of entitlement. That is what you have been teaching him by doing everything for him for so long. It is to the point where he feels it is unreasonable for him to take you out to dinner one night.

Will he go to counseling? He may need to hear someone else's input.

cfc,

I am moving your post from the other thread here so it can be addressed for you. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />


Orchid: Actually, I had read your thread and it is one of the reasons why I felt the need to post. See when a Ws decides to come home, if it isn't for the same reason the BS expects, there will be major disappointment. Many a BS think they are willing to settle for 'just having him/her home'. In reality that doesn't last long.

Lack of trust, no plan makes for failed recovery. I don't like to see people in failed recoveries. I have experienced several myself and it ain't pretty. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

So if your Xws is not restoring your trust in him, then why is he there? Ask him. Can you?

See each time there was false recovery, the stakes for him to return went up, not down. To settle for anything less would have send the wrong message to him. Remember he wasn't recovered himself so the WS attitude still was around. Growing weaker but still around and sometimes would throw a whopper my way. I didn't like that. It make me exhausted and frustrated. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> ..... oh yea...and mad. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

So the stakes went up. My personal boundary of not having the OW in my life stood. My next boundary was NOT to have the WS attitude in my life. That one was harder to enforce but plan B helped.

Before you can plan B your mind should NOT be following your heart. Instead your mind and heart needs to be in sync. This means they have the same goal, objective and plan.

The organ which uses logic is the brain. Pay attention to what the brain says and let the heart temper it to stay balanced. With the 2 working together, the Ws or Xws can't throw you off into depression.

Your H needs to know he isn't doing enough and when he grumbles, you let him know that while you can't control him but you can control you..... then walk away. Let him wonder what that means.

When he asks note his tone. If it is a sincere question, answer it. If you detect sarcasim..... don't respond.

It is sad the way the selfish A attitude ruins their sense of decency. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Very sad indeed. Seems like you gotta teach him manners all over again. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

L.

Wow what a great surprise to wake up really stressed out and find my post on the top of the board. Thanks for responding!

I have been desparate to hear what other MBs have to say about this situtation.

Quote: So if your Xws is not restoring your trust in him, then why is he there? Ask him. Can you?

I can't ask him now because he has been gone since Thursday. But when I asked him in the past here is his response:

" I care about you a lot. Although I care about you a lot, however I don't love you. This marriage is never going to work. (This is when I ask so why are you here). Because I care about you. (If you care about me then why are you not doing the things I need to make this work???) What haven't i done. i have done nothing but be here fro you and the kids since the affair. I stoppped f%@#$%@g her what else do you want? (Both true. I say, "And I am very glad of that but i need other things from you to recover from the pain of what you have done. are you willing to do these things?) Yeah, like what, we hve done a lot things and are still in the same boat? (I explain MB ssomething) He responds I don't understand what you are talking about. Why can't we just be happy? ( I say, It doesn't work like that. When I am happy, i start worrying about the trust thing. You haven't been transparent enough to let me trust you again. He feels that I should just trust him and let him have his own life without regard to how it makes me feel. He admits he didn't think marriage should be like this and wants more freedom to enjoy life. I say so you are here just for the house and the kids?)H says he thinks so and also because I think it is going to work??he also says he cares but doesn't want to hurt me.

Little Background: H has difficulty dealing with emotions. Refuses to discuss anything with emotion (all stemming from mother son relationship). SO when he feels emotional pressure, he would rather quit than deal) SO me being as understanding as possible, tried to protect him from the pain of his actions. Wrong answer for me! Although H has been and done a lot for us in the past year since the A. He completely commited to us. Was home everyday. Did everything that needed to be done and then some, but the attitude stayed with him- most of the time (last summer being the exception).

I on the other hand, I felt that wow he was trying so hard at doing the right thing, I should not push too hard to make him feel upset. The problem is he was working on the wrong things because he didn't have it in him to work on the emotional problems. Then he didn't understand why all the superficial things he was doing didn't work.

It is like yes, you are here for the kids and reading and tucking them in, and doing the laundry and the dishes and coming home after work and spending all of your time with us, BUT you aren't able to open yourself up to discuss the emotions and you aren't transparent and get angry when we need to compromise and make change.

That nasty cycle had to end!


Now that he is gone, What do you think is next? i haven't spoken to him since he left on Thursday. He may show up to my son's game tonight as he likes to coach when he doesn't have to work.