ML. Thanks, I am trying to be patient, as you say it is frustrating but it is also annoying when she lashes out at me for no apparent reason and I have to just take it.

I feel like screaming at her that she has no feelings and resents me so much and we would not be in such a mess if SHE HAD NOT HAD AN AFFAIR AND TRIED TO DESTROY OUR FAMILY!!!!
But I won't, I will continue to bite my tongue.!!

You don't have to take her abuse, braeworth. You can leave the room. The wrong thing to do is to react with anger, that just escalates the problem and gives her AMMUNITION to use against you.

See, in order to justify her affair, she has DEMONIZED you in her mind. This is why she tries to BAIT YOU into fights, so you will live up to her characterization of you as the demon! Getting you to fight with her is a DIVERSION that prevents her from looking at herself.

When you don't react, she won't be able to focus on you anymore and will begin to focus on herself and what she has done. See?

ML. Yes, I do understand, it just all seems unfair

IT IS! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> But, I promise you, it won't always be like this.

If it makes you feel any better (or worse), it was 7 months after my wife's affair and 4 months after the final contact before my wife and I had sex again. It's a marathon, not a sprint.

ML. Thanks for the reassurance.

jmwc95. Thanks for that, I am not sure how that makes me feel but at least there is hope

This afternoon DD was at a dance rehearsal, so I was at home with (F?)WW. She said she was feeling low and fed up, I went over to her and gave her a hug and a small kiss to try and cheer her up. We continued to do this while we were chatting for about 45 minutes. Afterwards I asked her if it had helped to cheer her up or relax her, she said that it hadn't really done anything. I asked her if it had made her feel uncomfortable, as those of you familiar with my thread will know she said this about three weeks ago. She said that it hadn't but as she felt completely empty towards me it did not make her feel anything. She said that she had gone along with this as she thought it would give me a lift and as she did not feel anything at all,it was not uncomfortable for her so she thought she should make the effort. She said that as long as I did not try and take things further i.e SF, then she did not mind.
My question is to the experienced MB's on here,the likes of BP*, BigK, ML etc, should I continue with this approach, maybe once a day, obviously not smothering her, or should I just continue to play it cool.
One of her top two EN's, along with conversation was Affection and I don't know if this is a chance to start to meet that EN

braeworth, I would keep doing this with her, but STOP talking about it with her. Her feelings will come back slowly. I think you did very good, but would just back off from the relationship talks for now. Don't over do it and focus on drawing her to you, without seeming needy.

In my case locking up shows of affection made squid MAD for me after a couple of months. I worked out that I'd know when the time was right to offer physical affection and words of love.

This paid me back in spades. And I felt much more dignified not looking so neeedy of affection and to be desired.

Do what you think is right.

or better still, invest £90 on a call with Steve Harley.

BP* and ML Thanks to both of you

BP* I know what worked for you and that was what I was trying to do until today where she appeared very low and I tried to cheer her up as I would have done pre-A.
Now I am confused.

ML. I know playing it cool worked for BP* and BigK, this was the approach I was trying to take, now I am not sure whether to continue with that approach or take this opportunity to meet an important EN

braeworth,

perhaps I am misunderstanding you, but I think Mel is telling you to keep doing what you are doing and what you did today was fine. BUT, quit asking her how she felt about it. Quit asking if she feels anything. Quit asking at all. If she says she feels down, give her a hug and kiss, and leave at that.

It is the quiz after the act that is causing harm. It is the mirror of the statement "I love you...BUT". That "BUT" just wiped out the I love you, because it says I don't really.

Doing something good for someone and then asking if that made them feel like they loved you or had feelings will do the same thing. It forces them to think about the negative AND it makes it seem you really don't care about them, but simply did it for your OWN pleasure.

Does this make sense? Listen to Mel, BP and others however realize that you MUST remove the "BUT" from your actions and words.

Hope this helps.

God Bless,

JL

Brae,

Did BP provide you with the toolkit????

I am interested in seeing what it is!

I am in Plan A like yourself! My D-Day was Memorial Day! My WW A was going for a month when I made my discovery!

Its interesteing because my WW 2 important ENs are affection and conversation as well! I am trying to balance not being needy but meet some of her needs.

I don't force either one on her -- in fact, I may simply ask her how was her day and let her take off from there!

As far as affection, I follow her lead -- if she strokes me, I offer a little in return!

I even upgraded my wardrobe appearance (wore an tie with some slacks) -- she said she liked it and wanted me to wear it out tonight when our family goes out!

I know you hate to hear these two words -- be patient!

Although I share these tidbits, I am by no means out of the woods yet. For instance, she sometimes does not wear her wedding ring and that is something that I do point out to her withut being irate!

Hang in there!

Swade88. I have just bumped BP*'s toolkit in the GQ2 section

JL. Thanks for that, good point I think

Hi Braeworth

I would set you a task today:
Dig DEEP. VERY deep.

Your desire to hug / kiss / comfort your WW:

* Is it primarily a desire to comfort her ?

or

* primarily a desire to have your affection welcomed and threfore validate you ?

See in my case it was mostly the latter. And I realised that when it wasn't embraced as a gift, it was actually fueling Squid's feelings that

1) I was a pathetic needy twat
2) she felt nothing from my atentions so clearly OM was her "soulmate".

180'ing that :

1) Made squid realise BY ABSENCE that she DID actually welcome my affection, particularly as wirthdrawal progressed along with my plan A.
2) I wanted her but I did not NEED her. I was doing just fine without affection or validation from her. She told me since that it TERRIFIED her into action.

After a month or so of 180'ing ( bearing in mind I was being a GREAT plan A husband, just no hugs / kisses / ILYs etc) Squid and I were installing soem storage in our son's bedroom ( ikea!). We had a bit of a laugh truth be told !.

I could FEEL she had softened towards me and my heart ACHED for some warmth, but I continued to 180. She told me afterwards she yearned for me to drape my big old arm around her. But she didn't make that clear.

When I started my 180 to make sure she realised I wasn't "sulking" I wrote her a card: " baby, I love you, but I can tell you do not welcome my love right now. If that changes be sure to let me know. Meanwhile here's a bear for you to cuddle until you feel you want to cuddle me again".

I bought her a nice squidgy bear.

It was left unwrapped and tossed in the corner for a couple of weeks.

Then unwrapped.

Then in another weekor so placed on her side of the bed.

I figured she has a mouth and arms and could show her desire for my loving very easily and clearly if she wanted.

Another couple weeks of that we were growing quite close. Having lunches together, doing family stuff an dcomfortable to laugh together again.

Then, on eweekend, we were at our holiday home in Wales for the weekend. We were at the pub with friends and getting along famously. Squid was looking into my eyes a lot.

I went to the loo, and when I came out Squid was waiting and held me and kissed me like never in years. She cried.

Then she banged my brains out that night, and almost every day for months afterwards.

And Squid was a very nasty WW in a very entangled affair when i started 180'ing. Ask anyone who was here then.

That is why I advise as I do. I would have the same preservation of dignity and recovery of real affection from your WW as I had. To do that I prescribe the tactic that worked for me any many others.

Thats all.

BP*. If I am honest it is probably the latter in my case too. It is just yesterday we seemed to connect a little again and had a nice day and evening, very relaxed around each other, for the first time in weeks, also when she left for work this morning she was smiling at me. I wasn't sure if I should take the opportunity to start and meet one her most important EN's, but I know what worked for you and maybe I just try and continue along that path

I guessed <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Thing is the removal of that awkward "shall I shant I?" stuff over displays of needy affection allowed Squid and i to connect BETTER Than otherwise.

I have seen plan A and early recovery likened to the early-pre-engaged-dating time of a relationship. WOuld you have dived in for a snog every opportunity or not come across as so forward or needy and concentrate on being all you can be ?

So you don't think I should do any hugging and kissing at all at the moment, even though it seems to be having a bit of a positive effect

How do you know its the hugging having an effect and not your rationing of it and general plan A coupled with growing NC?

The fastest horse doesn't always win, but its still where you should put your money IMO.

I've made myself as clear as I can. You do what you think is right Brae, mate.

BP*. I didn't think of it like that, you are good at this stuff.
We just seemed to really start to connect yesterday, which I took as coinciding with the affection on the afternoon, but as you say maybe it is a combination of everything and maybe the hugging was just more relaxed becuase of the other things that had already had an affect.

I will follow your guidelines as you seem to understand this stuff far better than me and seem to see things much clearer