http://men.msn.com/articlemh.aspx?cp-documentid=4725722&GT1=9311

Absolutley sickening.

Hi, MEDC.

The number is a lot higher than 1 million. The studies sited in the article have the lowest percentages I have come across.

Many studies put the figure at almost 30%.

Gimble

any woman that does this to a man and her child should be stripped of all parental right immediately. If the H wishes to raise the child... then he should be given the right to do so along with the bio dad who was also most likely never informed of his parenthood. There is nothing that a woman could ever say to make up for this kind of betrayal and any physician or health care provider that participates in the scheme should have their license removed. How about that one doctor flat out lying to the father!!!!!!!!!! Absolutely horrible.

What I don't understand is why in some states the tricked father STILL has to pay child support. And I'm a HUGE supporter of child support. But it seems like extortion to me.

I agree medc.

I personally think that there should be jail time, and compensation for the fraud committed.

The subject of paternal fraud is one of my pet peeves. I have spent considerable time researching it.

Gimble

Hi, believer.

The justice system, when it comes to custody and children in general, is massively stacked in favor of the female. Men have few rights.

Gimble

So right Gimble... and I am a dad with full custody and my boys mom only sees him when I say so... and supervised at that! And get this, early in his life, I was forced to pay child support while she denied me access to him for 17 months! It is a wonder I ever let her see him at this point!

Usually, Gimble, but not always. I never received a dime in child support. And it took me $10,000. and 2 years to get sole custody, even though hubby had 3 drunk driving tickets. The court forced me to let my boys go with him, and he would come back drunk.

The last time he did it, he pulled up in front, got out of the car and fell down passed out drunk. I called the cops, he went to jail, and that was that.

So the courts aren't always helpful to the woman either.

believer wrote: "So the courts aren't always helpful to the woman either."

I agree that the justice system itself doesn't work so well.

I had read of your travails before, and you are in California, land of the no-rights-dad - they really botched your case beyond all recognition.

God bless,
Gimble

Well, they finally tried, but then ex moved to Florida. When I ran him down there, he moved to Oregon, and on and on. But I got sole custody with supervised visitation, which he never did.

And in the end, he died a lonely man, full of regrets. It was sad.

But at least a woman knows that she is the mother. Men get tricked so easily. I've advised a couple guys here to get paternity tests when wifey turned up preggars and there was an affair. But for some reason, they trust their wives.

I know what you mean B... there are a few I wish would make a point to do the testing...but I think denial runs very deep!

Oh Boy!

That is a very very depressing article. Especially when the Medical profession seems to happy to collude with the wayward W to keep the man in the dark.

It makes me wonder what I should be advising my sons if/when they become fathers or think they are. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

JL

From Penalty Kill

Like many of the stories on MSN, this one, to me, smacks of sensationalism. How many women are raising children with absentee fathers who won't pay child support?

I suspect that number is much higher than the number of deceived fathers. It's all about the novelty of DNA testing, whether it pertains to the justice system or the family. Our brave new world.

PK, whose children resemble their father greatly. Dimples, ya know. One of those inherited traits. Bring on the dna test.

I see two totally seperate issues there....and frankly how many women do not get child support because they have used their children as a tool to harm the father? What percentage of women that are ordered to pay child support do so? (I will give you a guess on this... it is 1/7th the amount of fathers that meet their obligation...said another way... a woman, ordered to pay support is 7 times more likely to be in arrears than her male counterpart).

I see nothing sensationalized in this story... the estimates that they use are very low... very low and do not include fathers that suspect that they are not the bio dad. I found it to be very reserved reporting.

Hi, Penalty Kill.

I think you will find that the story minimized rather than sensationalized the problem.

Independent studies show the percentages far higher than those cited in the article.

Independent testing firms are seeing results as high as 30 percent.

Since there have been few "normalized" studies done, it would not be unreasonable to see a 20+% incident rate across the board.

The facts are, women lie about the fathers of their children, and do so often. This goes back as far as history. At least now, a potential father has a method to prove parentage before he invests his emotion and money for the rest of his life. I think that is quite fair, and about time.

Coming from a family with an unacknowledged "other child", I can tell you that it DOES make a difference to the child, maybe not in every case, but in many, if not most. You wouldn't believe the devastation "self discovery" can bring to the other child.

What I find amazing are the many stories of women that actually believe, as a matter of course, that the legal father shouldn't be bothered by the fact (unknown to him in most cases) that he is parenting a child sans his own genetics. Just as men have their built in weaknesses, women likewise have their own. The ability to overlook paternity in many cases, seems to be one of them.

Wouldn't it be fair that women have to pay back moneys unwittingly spent by non-paternal fathers on their children? That seems just as fair as child support payments to me.

God bless,
Gimble

From Penalty Kill


Well, you're right there, I won't argue with your figures.

However, I feel compelled to mention the inequities in pay for men and women working the same jobs and the way society and thus, potential employers, view women who elect not to work or to work part-time while raising their children. It's very difficult to jump back into the work force and make a good living. This is what many divorced women find, which may partially explain the lack of child support payments.


Well these days anyone with a suspicion can easily have it confirmed or denied. All you need is a tooth or hair brush.

the pay differential means nothing since child support calculations are based on the amount that each party makes... I paid child support for 9 years... an amount that was three times what my boys mom has been ordered to now pay me...and guess what... she's behind on her payments so much that now I have to have her salary garnished.

From Penalty Kill

Gimble: I wonder if the 30% cuts across socioeconomic lines. It just seems unbelievable to me that 30% of the kids I know have unknown fathers.

Perhaps I am naive. But as the saying goes, motherhood is a certainty, fatherhood is a matter of opinion.

I think my view is influenced by my own actions. As a FWW, I was terrified of pregnancy and disease. I wouldn't see the OM during the fertile part of my cycle, and used a condom each time. When I look back on that time I think that I must have been insanely self-destructive, since I am not a risk taker by nature and I stood to lose everything that I held dear. All I felt after I ended the A was relief - that I didn't have to be secretive about the computer and cell phone and that I didn't have to fear pregnancy. I never experienced withdrawal.

It's hard for me to fathom a woman being so cavalier about pregnancy and fooling her H with someone else's child, but I have no doubt it occurs.

I think that some people are just delusional. I was at the Dr's yesterday listening to two women talk about their 3rd and 4th pregnancies. Both claimed to be totally surprised (and upset) by being pregnant. I can understand a teenager being surprised....but two women in their late 30's/early 40s? Do they not understand how the process works?

From Penalty Kill


And that will probably work only if she remains in the same state. As I understand, wage garnishing is much more difficult if the individual moves out of state.

My sister opted to have the parental rights of father of her children terminated legally (forget the term). He was happy to sign the papers since it meant that he didn't have to pay CS. Of course we all wondered why she chose this guy, but whatever. Her biological clock was ticking. And it wasn't like he was "tricked" into pregnancy. She had three in-vitro attempts.

I liked the line from Boyz N the Hood: "Any fool with a **** can make a baby, but it takes a real man (woman) to be a father (mother)".

Penalty Kill wrote:
================================================
I wonder if the 30% cuts across socioeconomic lines.
================================================

It is worse than you would imagine.

No offense to anyone, but in the broad base caucasian community, it is estimated at about 28.2%. In the black community, almost two thirds. In the hispanic community, it is the lowest at somewhere around 10%.

There are a lot of opinions and a lot of numbers. There are studies with good parameters underway, so the next few months should net some meaningful data. Regardless. the outcome is going to be quite surprising.

I am amazed at the sheer bulk of people having casual unprotected sex, affair or no. It is surprising that pregnancies are still a surprise to a lot of women that seem compelled to have unprotected sex.

If you want to get a bizarre glimpse into the world of paternity gone wrong, have a look at the Maury Show. Many of the shows are all about paternity tests. The real shocker there is the attitudes, and the ratios. It's worth watching a few times.

God bless,
Gimble