Hello,

I am new to MarriageBuilders and I have a quandry. My ex-husband and I have been divorced for 10 years. We have two children from the marriage. A boy who is nearly 18 and a girl who is 15. Since the divorce, their father, who lives in a nearby town, has spent less and less time with them. The custody agreement we put into place allowed him to take the children every other weekend. This has happened only rarely. And as time goes on, he has less and less to do with them. He lives about 45 minutes away and his place of work is only about 20 minutes away, yet he never sees them.
It's as though he divorced the children when he divorced me. He calls them on the telephone fair bit -- maybe three/four times a week. My daughter doesn't seem to mind the calls but my son rarely takes them.Both have indicated that they are hurt by their father's lack of involvement in their lives.
To complicate matter, the ex remarried soon after the divorce and his wife doesn't really enjoy having my children around.
I know there is no way to enforce a custody agreement if the non-custodial parent does not want to visit with his children, but boy is it heartbreaking to see my children suffering so much. And they have been suffering since the divorce.
I would like a chance to talk to him about this. We've spoken in the past but he always has an excuse about why he hasn't seen the kids. He always claims he's too broke to make the short trip here. And he plays the "poverty" card on the kids all the time. The kids are left to feel guilty because he is paying child support--which had to be enforced by an agency since he wasn't paying the agreed-upon amount.
Does anyone have any advice?
Thanks,
Francis_Bean

I think it's common from what an attorney friend told me, the divorce the wife, they divorce the kids too. Happens both ways too, some women leave as well. What is your relationship with this man, have you openly talked to him about this? If he's too "broke" to drive to your place, can't the kids drive to him, or you meet him half way so it isn't 1-1/2 hours+ round trip every time? Your kids are at an age where naturally they might not want to spend their free time with parents anyways. Do you remember being 15 and 18? Did you consider a good time hanging out with mom and dad on weekends? Have your kids shared with you what your ex's family is like, are there kids there? There's likely a number of factors but you could share more if you wish...

Thanks for responding horsey2. My relationship with my ex is strained but we try to keep things civil for the children's sake. I have had conversations in the past with him about his lack of involvement with them and he always says the same thing, "I'm doing the best I can." Spending one night twice a year at his place hardly seems like a monumental effort to me, however....The ex and his wife have no other children. They are on their own.
My children have indicated to me that they would like to see more of their father. Neither has their driver's licence so driving to their dad's on their own is not feasible. I used to drive them there myself, most often with o compensation, but as a single mom, it's been really tough to find the $ to do that. The biggest obstacle, from what i can gather, is simply a lack of interest in doing anyting "active" with the children. It seems a phone call suffices for him.
I guess i just hoped for better for my children. Luckily they do have some male influence in their lives. My boyfriend of three years has four children of his own. He's always been an active father, and now he includes my two on family plans etc. He's been a positive influence in that regard though we've have some tense moments during disagreements. He hears "you're not my father" with some regularlity from my children.
I guess you can't legislate or force someone to visit or take an interst in their kids if they just don't want to be bothered.

Thanks for listening,
Francis_Bean

Nope, from what wise people on this site would say, he's going to be the sort of father he wants to be. You can't control him. You can try to help your kids see their dad by driving more half way perhaps if you can be civil with him. I think a lot of men feel pushed out of their kids lives after a divorce, they resent but put up with child support, most of course don't like their kids being with a boyfriend and other kids - they slowly drift away. An article said men living out of state see their kids 2-3 times a year, that's all. I know a father that's an online friend of mine who's given his side of all of this - and I can see it. We women see our sides perhaps, we typically get the children and intentionally or not we do exclude fathers somewhat. I don't know what can be done about this. My ex was so resentful of me leaving he saw his boy every 3-4 months the first year after I left. I cried about it to him, asked how I'd tell my boy about all of this. He refused a dime in child support as well saying I chose to leave him. I had to hire an attorney and suddenly he's dad of the year because he was told that since he moved out of state I could say he abandoned his boy. I should have but I still wanted my boy to have a father so I let him show up every other week the past year as a "record" of it. But how long can he keep this up? I'm just weary of it all. I feel sorry for children that get caught in the middle of all of this more then anything. If your children are actually telling him he's not their father then I'm just wondering what counselor would say? Have you tried coulseling? Of course they resent his lack of time, even if you were biased your kids were smart enough to judge your ex for themselves. A counselor once told me to try not to voice my resentments to my boy, to just let him figure it out on his own. Mostly she said they figure out the lack of time that father's spend and then they see reality and the truth. But how sad the truth must be for kids. I have two little kids next door, neither of which have seen their dads in years. It's all so sad isn't it? I don't know what's best honestly. All you can really do is to control yourself, try not to bash the man in front of your kids, be as gentle and kind as you can, he's their father after all. You can kindly suggest that he see the kids more but that's about it isn't it? I'm not "there" yet, my boy is only three. Just some thoughts.

Wow my Mother could have written that original post.

Some men just detach. I'm lucky in that my XH is still active with his kids, but your story is very similar to mine - I was one of the kids of a divorce where once I was Daddy's Girl and then I didn't exist.

My father was on-again-off-again for all my life. Finally when I was about 25, after so much angst, trying to be something I wasn't to try to please him, and being hurt and disappointed every time, I realized HE had the problem, not me.

Took me a lot of tears to figure that out. I'm a very lovable, happy and fun person - and he didn't take the time to see it. HIS LOSS. He's missing out on my sister's life too - and her two kids. He's walked away from a huge chunk of his life - but we're all doing fine.

When his mother died last year, my sister (who makes the effort to contact him a few times a year) called me to give me a heads up that he'd likely be in touch - probably a bit of his conscience bothering him. He called me in Feb or March and I spoke briefly, politely with him. He called again in May (my b'day) and I think in July or August. I was polite each time - but I'm not letting him "in" again.

He called again at Christmas but I wasn't home and he was on his way out of town - so I didn't return the message left on my machine. Haven't heard from him since, but I guess when my b'day rolls around again he might remember he's got me again.

I don't care. Sad to say - but I spent more emotion on a man who was too busy screwing some OW, then getting remarried, then screwing another OW... he even brought me (on one of his few visits) to OW's home to eat supper with her husband and children!!!! (talk about cajones!)

He is what he is. He's my father and on some level I will always love the good daddy he was when I was less than 7 years old - but when he was caught cheating (twice) and thrown out he became a different person and the Daddy I loved is dead and gone, I'm afraid.

It was hard to get over - maybe I'll never completely get over it - but I keep my fond memories, and I no longer allow him to get under my skin. It's too painful. I don't even call him my father anymore, I refer to him by his first name.

I feel for your kids, Francis_Bean what they are going through SUCKS. It's good for them that you are sensitive to it, all my mother ever did was run him down over it - and I'm sure she was equally frustrated but she made no effort to hide how upset and disappointed she was.

Do your best to be there for them. Whether they acknowledge it or not, they are getting a positive male role model in your BF - nobody "replaces" daddy - but sometimes families are "made", not "born". They are at a challenging age - and they may be hurt and resentful now, and may act out toward you, but believe me, in time they will see things as they are, and they *will* appreciate that YOU are the parent that was always there for them. I know I've told my own mother countless times how much I love and appreciate all she did for us when we were younger - even though I was a little schmuck at the time.

My Mom is my hero.

Be your kids' hero. You can't control what their father does, but you can be there for your own.

God bless you - it's a daunting task, but I think you're doing the best you can.

In support,

JinGA

A girl I grew up in church's dad had an affair. Her mom kicked him out. He left and never contacted her or her brother ever again. She got married, had babies and he never looked back? He seemed to be one of the best fathers in church, I remember staying overnight at their house. It doesn't make sense but there must be more to the story. I dont' know though, you hear of this. Even a girl at my current church said her ex didn't see his daughter for eight years. I asked how on earth could men do this? She shook her head, so did I, it can't be understood. Then again I left a woman at the mall the other day who abandoned her own kids, ran off with a boyfriend, showed up in town a year later and tried to do a custody battle but only really wanted weekends because it was too much work for her. So it goes both ways I suppose, but more often men I'm sure. It's beyond me that my ex took out on my boy what went on between us and barely saw him for a year. I cried and cried about it and I'll never understand how he could call watching his own kid that he hadn't seen at the time in three months "babysitting" and how I wouldnt' find another "babysitter" to watch him on a Sunday so he wasn't going to watch my child? Can you imagine this? My ex is a banker, dressed in suits, acting the part of Mr. Nice Guy, now seeing his boy more because an attorney put the fear of god in him or something. I don't know what motivates him. I wish I could do what people on this site say to do. Be a good mom. Forget trying to second guess him and figure out if he'll be a good father, when he'll show up, etc. as he's going to do/be what he's going to do/be and I can't control it. It just eats me alive. I feel sorry for my boy, for children in the middle these messes.

My father seems to go in 7-year cycles. 7 on, 7 off. Last year when he popped up out of nowhere was almost 7 years to the day when I'd spoken to him last.

I never asked for much-I wanted his *time* - but his current wife (of over 20 years now - she stayed joined to his hip so he couldn't cheat and now he's impotent after prostate cancer!) has 4 sons all older than me.

Over those years I've gone without so much as a Christmas card or phone call, yet I can remember years (when he was in touch) where HER sons got elaborate gifts (I could care less about "stuff" but it's the principle of the thing)... and her youngest (a few years older than I) got into some trouble with a drug dealer once - he was fronted about 7K worth of "stuff" to "resell" but he snorted it instead - and my father gave him the money so he wouldn't have his face rearranged.

Over the years I've heard of people he's helped - senior citizens he takes out shopping, visits nursing homes - he's quite the philanthropist. He and his wife even played Mr. & Mrs. Santa Claus in the local parade, then gave out gifts at the seniors' center.

But he doesn't even give a flying fig about his own flesh and blood.

Usually he'd "dump" us the moment we made demands on him - and my sister and I only ever asked him to spend TIME with us. Visit with us, come to our homes, or invite us to his. We weren't after money, gifts - nothing. We just wanted a relationship (as adults) and he had nothing to give us.

One time, when I had a chance to tell him how I felt, I asked him to please treat me like a stranger, because he treated strangers on the street with more courtesy and compassion than he treated his own kids. That p*ssed him off and he vanished for another 7 years.

Sad - but true. And if I'm too much "like my mom" for his liking, I'll take that as a compliment. I'd rather be that than turn out like him.

As a parent myself I can't even fathom it. My XH is a loving father - he's had his issues, but he loves his kids, and while neither of us is perfect, I cannot see him abandoning his kids, period.

In fact, his GF that just left him to move back to her home state, invited him to go with her (IMO she was bluffing!), but he told me flat out he wouldn't leave his kids.

We were separated for job reasons for 2 years of our M, and he came home one weekend a month as that's all we could afford. What should have taken a couple or 3 months to sell a house and move, took 2 years. It was ****** on him - the kids were a lot more adaptable than he - he was greatly affected by it, and I can't see him putting himself in a position far away from them again. As it is he lives less than a mile from us now, even though his current job is probably 20 miles away and he could have located closer to that. He didn't. And I respect him all the more for it.

It is shameful how some people can detach so easily. Despite what happened in my M, I knew I could always count on him to be there for his kid - or I'd have never married him or had babies with him in the first place.

JinGA

And the counselors want me to come in and talk about my childhood! Really compared to most of the world I had a good Christian upbringing. Last shrink was grilling me about my dad to figure out if that was my problem. Of course they always like to point at parents (scary to think of my 3 yo going to counseling in 30 years talking about how bad I did). Anywasy my dad died of cancer two years ago, the theme at his funeral of 300 people was how every day was the same, he was a stable father and all he ever talked about was his kids! Sure he was old school, would come home and plop in front of the tv as my mom cooked and cleaned but in the end once we were raised that changed and he helped out more. Perhaps that is my divorce/marriage problems though - not because he was cruel or abandoned me (some insane shrink two weeks ago sat by me and said, I understand, my dad left me when I was a child - really, didn't listen to a word I said, was working out her problems with a client) - but because he was such a good, quiet, decent God loving man. We grew up in church, we didn't have a lot of money but my folks did the best they could. I just can't even imagine for the life of me men who could care less about their own flesh and blood. I'd jump in front of a moving truck and die for my little boy, as a mother. I would do about anything for him, he's my life and my love. Of course my first year of marriage I knew my ex wasn't like my dad, I even told him he didn't light a candle to a real man. I guess I was verbally abusive but I was so disappointed. I can't remember my father ever criticizing my mom and here the man I married was ripping me apart. Seemed like his goal was to bring me down. And somehow after so many counselor I kept the marriage together, had a child and then finally am getting a divorce - what did I expect? That the man would be a doting father? All he said he ever wanted was a child, once born he called the boy "my job." Wouldn't help, moved down the hallway, sat in the basement drinking at night, when I left called it babysitting and refused. Can you even understand this? I realize I was part of the problems, I was there, but really his true colors show over and over again. Guess I never could just admit early in my marriage, or even my dating years, that a man I "loved" could be just such a complete out right neglectful jerk. But I, my mom and friends never dreamed he'd be such an awful father - lately he's coming through seeing my boy and I don't know if it's because an attorney said so or what - or because he's gotten lonely and realized waiting it out wasn't working and I wasn't coming back - he's a very strange man, but I think most men are anymore. I think the good decent husbands and fathers are hard to come by in this day and age. These guys are a dime a dozen, as my mom a retired teacher who's substituting says - as she watches with horror all the garbage going on with her first grade fathers... a dime a dozen. It's sad.

Ladies,

Here is a thought. If a child is especially lovable, then it is harder and harder on the none custodial parent to be continually leaving. Some choose to end the pain by limiting the contact, others try to increase contact.

In the case of the first lady posting here, I would suggest that the kids ask their dad to do something specific with them: go to a movie, bowling, go to a HS game, something specific, and yes even invite his new W. Sometimes the kids can achieve things that the ex-spouses cannot...not as much baggage.

I have observed the phenonmena with many of the couples I have known over the years. And usually it comes down to pain and pain avoidance. Doesn't help the kids any, that is for sure.

Just some thoughts.

God Bless,

JL

Interesting observations, JL. My father always said I was too much like my mother, if seeing her was painful, I guess seeing me/my sister was painful too... I told him if he didn't want me to be like my mother, to teach me otherwise - but he never did.

H2, when I went to MC with XH (10 years or so ago) all she wanted to talk about was my childhood because I came from a divorced home (but didn't want to repeat that in my own family). The whole time XH was having an EA, (I had no idea), and doing other things that were destructive to our M and the family) but nothing was ever his fault - it was all on me.

Now I do own my own contributions to the problems - MC did help me see that, but the one-sidedness of that particular MC did us no favours to save our M.

Find an IC that you are comfortable with, who will address the problems. See if XH will participate too - this *IS* about his children too.

It's toughest on the kids, there's no doubt about that.

JinGA