I need help dealing with feelings of guilt and mixed emotions for my ex-husband. I had been married to a man for 10 years after being together for 6 years. Five years ago we were divorced after he had an affair and wouldn't stop. Well, he married her 3 years ago. Together they have 7 daughters. She had 5 girls of her own and then our 2. I have primary custody but they go see him during his visitations. Anyway,I have not been with anybody else since our divorce. (Actually, he's been the only one I've ever been with.) Well, to make a long story short. Last summer he started making passes at me which I refrained from taking him up on them of course for many different reasons. Last fall he caught me at a very vulnerable moment and we ended up having sex. (Something I'm not proud of). I knew I should never have done it but I don't even know how to describe how I felt. Anyway, it's continued where it happens maybe twice a month and he calls me 3 or 4 times a week. His wife had forbidden him to talk to me last summer after she found out that we had been e-mailing eachother. She's made my life miserable ever since. When I call him regarding our kids she has to answer the phone and I have to ask for permission to speak with him.She took his personal cell phone away from him and his e-mail.He's abided by her rules except for when he's at his evening job which is where everything has taken place. Of course, she doesn't know about the phone calls nor the get togethers between us.You know how they say revenge is sweet. Well, I've never threatened my ex to tell his wife about us because I now think I still care very much for him.

I feel so used because all along he's always been so sweet to me on the phone and when we have our get togethers. But the instant we see eachother in public like at our daughter's sports events he acts like I'm not even there. Lately, I've been feeling that ball in my stomach everytime my daughter's mention him and his wife in the same sentence. He used to call me like clock work and then when he could he would call me from home whenever she's not around but it's been several weeks since he's done that. The other night I told him that we have to stop doing this (but I didn't tell him that I have feelings for him or I am scared that he's going to dissolve this stupid affair) and I don't want to get hurt.So I feel that if I blow off his phone calls and don't talk to him anymore my feelings for him will go back to dwindling. I can't believe I'm feeling like this again because when he left me for his lover it was an ugly thing and she was so mean to me because she would call me to tell me things that they would do together and say about me just to make sure I got rid of him and it worked.

I guess what makes me sickest is that a lot of people have told me that he is afraid of his wife because she's very controlling. And it hurts know that when he had his affair with her he was soooo wanting to be with her 2 or 3 time a day and constantly on the phone with her. But for awhile I thought maybe he was falling back in love with me because of the way he was when he called but as of late I just feel like a stupid fool who got used by him for a cheap thrill and/or adrenalin rush. I feel this way because with me he can wait 2 or 3 days before he calls me and he can wait a couple weeks before having sex with me. And Lord forbid he not respect her rules while he's in front of her such as when I do call him and she's right by him he's pretty rude to me just to prove to her that there's nothing between us. Yet at the same time I feel like I am no better than she ever was because of what I'm doing. Although, my ex is her 6th husband and I've only been married once. I guess this was not as short as I had planned for it to be. Sorry. Anyway, he's supposed to call me at 6:30pm tonight. I am going to do my best to ignore the phone call which I have done in the past but then he calls my daughter's cell phone to ask her where I'm at and usually my daughter will give me her cell phone and tell me that dad wants to talk to me.

I know I have to do not only what's right but also to keep my heart intact. I could use anybody's advice and/or honest opinion on how wrong I've been.

Post Extras:

LovingAnyway
Member


Reged: 11/19/04
Posts: 5399
Re: Infidelity On My Part [Re: vicker]
#3234406 - 05/04/07 07:02 PM Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply

Welcome. I'm wondering why you don't go find someone who isn't attached to someone else.

Your ex sounds like a serial cheater. I think he deserves just what he got. I urge you to have no contact with him, and look around for someone who will treat you like you deserve to be treated.

Hi, vicker.

I recommend that you tell his wife, in detail, about your affair. Then you should stop all romantic and sexual contact with him immediately.

All the best,
Gimble

I agree with Gimble and Believer. Tell his wife and MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE...

How do you like being the #2 harem wife?

"You know how they say revenge is sweet."
...
"Yet at the same time I feel like I am no better than she ever was because of what I'm doing."

Is this what you aspire to be? Be sure to include your XH in that second sentence because your actions are reflective of his character also.

Revenge can be a powerful motivator. So can being without a significant other in your life for several years. Don't let those emotions control your actions. Your XH made his bed, let him sleep in it...without you.

The best revenge is getting on with your life and proving to yourself that you can move on and be happy without your XH.

Unfortunatly, you have left a mess in your wake that you need to clean up.
End the affair. Tell his wife. Accept accountability. Move forward.

Hokay, lemme see if I can make some sense of this:


It would appear that your ex has found someone he deserves, or they deserve each other or something. The only issue I see here is the kids.

You were lonely, vulnerable and needy. You did something to find a connection to another human being because of your needs. And you went in the wrong direction toward an emotional train wreck instead of something healthy you could enjoy long term.

No matter what you do, there is NO good outcome unless you can find the resolve, the courage to do the right thing for both yourself and your kids. The first right thing you do is something you have already done, which is to find help.

You cannot excape the connection because of your two kids. You're bound legally because of that. So it is going to take extra courage for you to terminate the intimacy you have established with your ex. Think of all those kids!

I suspect you have self-esteem issues. Get help for that online. There are a ton of online web sites you can visit and learn from. Make friends so you don't feel so lonely and you can go to Church with your two daughters. Exercise and socialize, both of which will help your mental state, yet if you are like some women, socializing is tough to do, so you gotta make yourself.

Whatever you do, forget sex with the ex. Given the obvious past of both him and his current wife, I would be seriously afraid of what I could catch from him and you don't need that. How is catching a serious STD going to help you raise your daughters? How is having sex with your ex going to help you raise your daughters? You sure don't want him back in your life; that fantasy is exactly that, a fantasy.

Because of the number of kids, I have reservations about telling his current wife. On the other hand, if he will cheat with you, he will cheat, period. And she is no paragon of virtue either. I can only imagine the social dynamics of that household, househole. Some people have no business breeding. *sigh*

It is your decision to tell or not. I can see plus and minus for that one. I can see no good outcome from letting him use you. Yes, I understand you are using him as well, so how is that working for you? Not so good, right?

So stop it already. He is who he is and he is not healthy for you. Find a relationship with someone who respects himself and you; your husband doesn't do either.

larry

Vicker,

I told you that you'd get more response.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Please heed these opinions...they care about you and your choices. You, as a human being, get to choose how you live, what you experience in your life...and if you want to live from truth, you must share it.

Please expose to his wife...not for revenge...for truth. This is reality. This is what you've been choosing. And you no longer choose to do this because you now realize it isn't healthy or truthful. Living a lie hurts us inside, deeply...you've not only walked in her shoes and his...you now understand how affairs cannot stand the light of day, or self-honesty.

Takes a lot of self-deception (and I see you as truly being aware and owning all your ways of self-deceiving in your post)...and you don't want to live that way anymore.

I believe you must do this to save yourself...

However, I see their marriage as not completely real...doesn't give you one iota of rightness to have an A with your XH.

What if what you really want to do is to fight now for what you didn't fight for before? Your marriage? What if you're regreting choosing to divorce...which was revenge, retailiation...and what you really want is to act from your belief that your marriage was worth fighting for?

I don't know...very complicated...tell us why you chose to divorce five years ago...where your decisions came from...and what you want right now. Do you want to own your own stuff...learn to live from truth and respect? Are you in IC? Have you been reading all the Harley materials on this site, and his books to understand infidelity, relationships? Yourself?

This is separate from who your XH is and his choices...focusing on your own...understanding your boundaries, your power and limits. Now that you know the wayward mindset...entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect...can you see where your marriage was real, had real love, and his infatuation with OW was fantasy? That he goes to fantasy to self-soothe, isn't afraid to attack and destroy others as long as he's soothed...and that he found someone just like him?

And could that be who you really do not want to be? For you have walked this way, too, from the same formula?

Orchid is a poster here who really helps other distinguish their feelings for their real partners and the WS...you may be perceiving your real H, pre-A and divorce, which is why you want so much to hold on...and what you're holding onto is your xWH...who is not worth it. They choose who they are...so do you. Know the difference. Read and learn and know you aren't bad or wrong...you're hurting, and acting from that hurt...that self-soothing...even after you've seen how destructive and wrecking it was to your own life.

LA

First of all, thank you all so very much for your honest opinions. I'm glad to be back. I've had computer problems and I just now got it fixed again. So it's a concensus that I need to end things with my XH. (Gosh, that sounds bad)!

Well, first of all I just wanted to say that I had been married to my XH for 10 years and when he had come to me to tell me that he was having an affair but that he wanted to work things out with us I agreed to it. But not having the first clue on how to go about this we didn't do much other than try to get away by ourselves for a week. Then we came back to reality. When the other woman found out that my husband wasn't going to leave me she took it upon herself to start calling me and telling me things that he was saying about me, that they were still having sex, and that he loved her and not me. Needless to say after a few days of this I packed his stuff and kicked him out. We stayed separated for 1 1/2 years before she pushed him into getting a divorce. I know this because she called and told me so herself. Anyway, we got divorced and I moved on with my life. I'm a 44 year old, still single, with 2 beautiful daughters. God has blessed me with sooo much and I have become such a stronger and different person since the divorce. (Or so I thought). I don't even know how things happened. In the past whenever there was an issue with one of our girls he would call me or I would call him and that's all we would discuss. Then last spring we started sending e-mails to one another and after about 3 months his wife caught him sending me an e-mail. He was crushed. The ironic thing is that he called me to cry on my shoulder. I even acted as his friend and gave him advice on what to do because he was afraid she was going to divorce him. (I knew better though). According to her she called me to tell me that my XH had promised her that he would never speak to me again if she did not leave him. I told her that was fine. Then it hit me that I was the one who tried to help him out. I didn't even care though. And that was good for me. Within the next couple of days he was able to get out of the house (because now she's keeping a watchful ear and eye on him) and he called me from a public phone booth to tell me that he wasn't going to quit talking to me. And the saga <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> goes on until the fall when I gave in. He had been after me for months but I wouldn't because I had morals. Then boom, I guess one night I had no more, it happened. I just feel like I had taken 2 big steps forward and 3 steps back. I thought that I was falling in love with him all over again but I don't feel that way anymore.

Actually, I really don't know how I feel other than stupid, cheap and used. I will say that my daughters do not know. I would be mortified if they ever found out. I don't want to confuse them anymore than they already are.

Since I have read everyone's posts I feel stronger and I am going to end the affair. I'm not going to tell his wife simply because I don't want to put her daughters nor mine through anymore turmoil than I'm sure they've already had. He will cheat on her with someone else and she can catch him with that other person then I don't have to feel any worse than I already do. (Selfish, huh)?

I will say that I am going to continue posting because I know I'm going to need support and I will keep reading up on Dr. Harley's concepts. Thank you everyone and I hope to hear from you again. I don't know how to get rid of that smiley icon I accidently got in the middle of my paragraph.

Vicker,

Thank you for coming back and reading. I hope you continue to read here.

Couple of things about your first marriage...not seeing your own choices.

When OW was calling, you could have chosen to change your phone numbers, filed a harassment charge or gotten a restraining order. Know your choices, your levels, what you're willing to do and why.

Was OW married at the time? Know that exposing to her husband would have been the right thing to do. Wasn't you causing her marriage turmoil...it would be an act from truth. We have to choose to live from truth, otherwise, we live in fantasy.

Your choices are solely yours and they are your power. When you aren't seated in your own power, then you are giving it to others...and feeling like life is doing to you. It isn't. Just the experience we have. Learn to sit in your power.

Now for your present marriage. You have decided to end the A with your XH. Okay. When you end an A, you go no contact...none at all...how are you going to do that with the father of your DDs?

Also, you have already caused BW turmoil and pain, as well as her daughters. This is good to know because the act did it, not revealing truth. Living in truth is how we stay within our boundaries...each time we lie, including by omission, we move our boundary. Which means others are then permitted to lie to us and we cannot enforce our boundary. We moved it.

Consider telling XH's BW. The harm has already been done to their marriage...and their marriage was based on fantasy to begin with...time for truth and honesty...long over due.

Tell your DDs...explain what you did, why you are not going to do it and how important it is to own and amend. They will learn and grow from it. Keeping it a secret (and as children, WE KNOW) festers and broods and poisons your relationship.

The smiley icon comes from hitting the colon : and the parentheses ( or ) or stuff. It happens. You can also insert them after you hit continue and review your post.

Also, ponder you helping him out...or anyone...when it means a lie...that means you get in the way of their consequences...you enable them to continue having A's...continue the pain and suffering which ripples through generations...and has no respect, no love in it whatsoever.

The more you see others' choices clearly, as their own, the better you'll see your own. OW didn't push XH into getting a divorce. He chose. He chose to have that A, not end it, not recover your marriage and he chose to have an A in his second marriage as well. All choices.

Will you also consider Alanon as a resource for you? There you will learn your power and limits...so you cannot be chased into anything (because you can't)...you can't be made to give in or made to fall in love...they really are all our choices. Self-deception will give you a life experience very different. Doesn't mean it's real. We aren't made powerful enough to control, cause or cure anyone of anything. You can certainly experience it as if we can.

You will feel BETTER, get better signals, with every brave choice you make from truth. You will feel worse and worse the more you lie by omission, create and hold secrets and get in the way of others' consequences...because you won't be understanding your own.

The difference you will experience will be one of health or sickness...very, very different. I hope you'll choose healthy ones. You're brave, courageous and worth every act from truth you make. So are your DDs.

LA

Vicker,

I must say, I think you will feel better motivated to move on when you consider that YOU are the role model for your daughters, and you are NOT setting a very good model right now. You truly don't want your ex's current W to be their model do you?

Time to get a real life. I think frankly, you are lucky to be out of this marriage. From my end of the telescope, your H wasn't a very good one, and was a user, he still is. Only now HE is getting used big time by the OW that turned into his W.

You would be well advised to stay as far from this situation as you can, and clearly you MUST end the affair. You are being used. IF your ex really wanted you, he would divorce his W. But, in reality even if he did, you don't want a man of his character. You really really don't.

You say you are stronger now, will use that strength and move on. Nothing good will happen as long as you are entangled with that man. Surely no other man will find you attractive while this is going on.

Please stop the affair, and by a model of what a good strong women is for your daughters. Lord knows they need at least one good role model in their lives, and there Dad is not, and neither is his W.

God Bless,

JL

I am going to take a different approach that many will probably disagree with...

If the OW and your XH don't have any children of their own aside from her kids by other husbands and your two daughters then I would recommend you read Jim Talley's "Reconcilable Differences". He has a website too.

He believes that divorce and even remarriage (like to an affair partner) is not necessarily a reason to not consider reconciling with your XS. If your marriage was your first and especially if it was both of your first marriages then he sees that as the valid marriage and worth restoring.

It would be better to do it in such a way as to not be having an affair with your X. Check his website and book for a different perspective.

Though it is a possibility if your X were to come back to you that he would continue to be a WS and possibly have further infidelity even as much as have an A again with his current W; maybe he'd always be a 'having you cake and eating it too' kind of guy...BUT, I do believe that people are capable of changing when they want to and are given the tools...i.e. Marriage Builder's materials/program and some IC.

I believe that if I understood your situation correctly that it may be best for your marriage to be restored and your daughters to have both her parents intact. JMHO.

If that is the desire of your heart...check out Jim Talley's writings/ministry. He give advice on how to go about it. I think he is a Christian pastor and his approach is from a Christian/Bibilical perspective.

I question people here respecting a crappy affair marriage to a woman who was married 6 times before. He obviously made a huge, stupid mistake...

I think that having your marriage restored with the father of your children would be a better example to your children than his staying in his affair marriage and you having an A with him.

If after exploring that possibility that is not at all what he (or you) would be interested in then obviously you should break all contact with him aside from what is necessary for parenting your daughters.

Thank you so much for your reply. You have given me so much to think about. I will tell you that I have been ignoring my XH's phone calls this week. I know that I am going to end the affair and I know that there is no wrong or right way to do this but I don't know why I'm scared.

I started looking for Alanon groups around here and this city does have 1 group. I don't know how strong it is but I am going to go to my first meeting next week. I know that I'm a big time co-dependent and I need help.

I do want to be a good role model for my daughters so when I end everything I will be honest with them and tell them the truth. Hopefully, they will not hold it against me.

I will continue reading and posting because I do need advice and support.

Again, thank you for your input.

Just Learning:
Thank you for your advice. You are so right about being a good role model for my daughters. I've always thought that I was until all this happened with their father. You are also correct about not allowing XH's wife to be their role model.

I know what I have to do and I am going to end the affair soon.

I know it will be better for me all the way around.

Trix: I thank you so much for your point of view. I want to expand some more on your views but I am going to get back to work right now. Tonight I will come back and post exactly that those were my thoughts when I first started the affair. Now, I just think it's not possible with someone like my XH and all the mixed emotions and thoughts I am having.

I will post again tonight when I get home from work.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Hiya Vicker:


Uh, when is "soon?" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Now, after six husbands, she is probably well acquainted with cheating, affairs, and from what you say, is controlling. Guess she has her reasons. Six marriages. Sheesh, what a role model. The reality is that she cannot force your XH to have no contact with you since you have common children and presumably court direction for how you deal with those kids unless she presuades him to set up a third party channel for communication.

You can set up a third party channel to handle communications with him if you want. That might be the best thing to do. I understand that you do not want to hurt your daughters or those of his affair wife by exposure. I am not sure that is the right decision, but it is your decision to make. I do think that her marriages may be money based since she can't seem to keep a husband after a LOT of attempts. I also do not get a good feeling about your XH. He doesn't sound like someone who would be good for you or your daughters long term.

I understand what Trix is saying, it just is that in your situation, I am not at all sure it would work out.

Larry

Well, here I am again. I just had wanted to expand a little bit on your point of view. When we started the affair I'm not exactly sure how I allowed myself to fall into the trap. My gosh, at first I thought that maybe he still loved me but as time has gone on he's never mentioned anything about leaving her and I've never told him how I feel. I just pretend that everything is kosier (spelling). Which at first, it was because I just felt like I was using him as much as he was using me. See I have never been with anyone else other than my XH. But now I feel like I've developed feelings for him all over again because when we talk and he mentions the OW name it makes me sick. I have never asked him how he feels but other than sex and having casual conversations with me on the phone he's never brought up his new marriage (good or bad). I had gotten to the point where I could hardly wait for him to call and if he didn't call then I felt disappointed. This was when I started realizing I have to stop what I'm doing.

The straw that broke the camels back was when we were together the last night his wife called him on the walkie talkie and he said "shh", and walked about 5 feet away from me so he could talk to her. I could have blown his cover right there but I didn't. Although, it was right then that I realized that I am being used and boy do I feel all kinds of negative things about myself not to mention like a failure to my daughters.

When I found out about his affair it totally just devastated my world and now here I am doing the same thing with him. An affair is something I said I would never do. If I sit and think about it too much (obsessively) I just feel like dying. Here I thought I was a good, strong and positive role model for my kids and I just became like putty in his hands and did all the wrong things for the last few months. I've allowed him to have his cake and eat it too. How perverse is it to have an affair with your XS? Gosh, how stupid am I?

Last Saturday he and I got into a huge fight over the phone because he could not have our girls due to something his wife wanted to do. Well, some very not nice words were said to one another and when he told me that next time I take a "me" vacation for a week that I need to find someone else to take care of our girls while I'm gone. I just told him to go to #*ll! I've never said that to him before but I did and then I hung up. He's tried calling me several times since but I have let my voicemail pick up.

Anyway, I figured him all wrong. It's weird how you think you know someone for 17 years and they can turn out to be somebody that you never even knew.

I was taken for a fool and now I have to live with an affair on my conscience and deal with it the best way I know how. I must be honest and say that I've missed talking to him this week but at the same time I feel stronger. Who knows, if I can continue being strong and just ignore his calls I may never have to say anything more to him. Anything, I have to say to him from now on my daughters can relay the message to him.

Thank you so much for your advice and I will continue reading and posting because I know I'm going to need it.

Vicker:

Over time, people change:


He is not the same person you married. People either grow together and get stronger, or not as the case may be.

Allowing him to start intimacy with you and I don't mean just sex, set you back in your quest to be your own person.

Always ask yourself two questions; Am I doing the right thing and how is it working for me to see if it is the right thing?

Larry

Well, I ended things yesterday with my XH. He came to bring my daughters home and after they went inside the house I went out to his truck and he asked me why I had been ignoring his phone calls. My reply to him was the following: "Don't call me anymore because what I did with you should never have happened. There was absolutely nothing good about it and if you ever try calling me again I will go to your wife and tell her everything that has happened between us. From now on, the only time I will call you is when I have an emergency with our daughters. Otherwise, any message that needs to be relayed between the two of us I think our daughters can handle calling the other parent. Or if they get stressed about doing this or it seems to upset them then I will give you my sister's phone number and she can be the in-between and she can relay any messages from you to me or vice versa. He looked at me and said "go ahead and tell my wife, you do whatever you feel you have to do. If this is what you really want so be it". I turned around and walked back into the house.

Last night I felt so proud of myself and this morning I have a lot of mixed emotions going on but I'm not going to let it get me down. I know I did the right thing.

Don't make threats. Just do it.


Don't put your children in the middle of this. They should not have to be relaying messages between the two of you. Your sister would be a better option.


Arguably, the right thing to do would be to tell his W. Instead, you are keeping the affair your dirty little secret and leaving the door open for it to continue.