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JinGa,

No more helping out the WS. Help you H but NOT the WS. No bailing out $$, no extra kid time, don't be flexible because if you notice, the more flexible you are the more angry he gets towards U!

It's hard to tell them apart sometimes. The $$ was a one-time thing, a few days after GF left... I had erroneously thought that it was OVER - he was broke til payday, I loaned him $50 (which he promptly repaid).

As for the kids - I *will not* use the kids as pawns in a chess game. I also won't let him use them as pawns. For example the "vacation" was NOT about the kids, it was about him and GF and for that and other reasons, I would not budge on that issue. As for extra days/time with him - if that's what my kids want and need - that's what they get. DS is currently at his father's, DD declined to go this time. That's NOT a bargaining chip.

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He whines, give him toilet paper (industrial strength kind). He isn't fit for kleenex. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Well when I thought the fog was lifting, H had reappeared, but lately, he's back in WH mode. He hasn't whined to me because I think he knows I won't be too sympathetic to the laments of his being without his faraway girlfriend. Besides, in a couple of short weeks he'll *be* there with her for his wonderful vacation <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Wonder how the reality will match up with his expectations? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

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As for the DJ's, well with a WS everything a BS does is considered a DJ to a WS when we all know that's not true. So you say what you need and mean what you say. Be comfortable with that. If it hurts his feelings, tell him it's meant to hurt the WS in him but it would not hurt your H because your H would NOT want you to put up with such a jerk.

Well the only DJ he's accused me of was not wanting my kids to go see his GF. There's no reasoning with him on that, and now the issue is settled and put to bed.

Most of the time he's behaving like an adult, and even like a new and improved version of my H - however he regresses at times. It's like a tug-of-war and one moment he can be himself, the next he's had his head pulled up his rear again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Time will sort that out. Once his R has unraveled completely.

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Stop working so hard to cushion his blows. Kick 'em back. Give him back his guilt.

I understand where you are coming from on that - it's just hard for me to break old habits. I won't just take a random shot for the sake of doing so - but I can stand up for myself, and I have been.

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You are in a better position right now because he whines easily which means he is vulnerable and weak. That is a good position for the WS t/b in. Good for you and your family.

I actually believe this is the calm before the storm. He's behaving quite confidently right now - trying to convince the world that his relationship is solid as a rock. (And yes I know that's a DJ...)

I believe that within a couple of months of the end of the vacation, the house of cards will crumble. *Then* maybe my real XH will make a more permanent appearance.

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Keep pummeling the WS, maybe he will leave and your real H (even the D one) may come back to his senses.

Actually I think it's more like I'm trying to talk to and get through to the real XH when he's "there" - and ignore WS when he's at the wheel. I don't think antagonizing WH would be productive. I'd rather not acknowledge him at all, but when the real man appears, appeal to him.

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If you placate him, what reason are you giving him to give up his selfish WS lifestyle?

That's what boundaries are for. However, he hasn't really approached any of those boundaries. If he was pushing for more time with *me* (ie a date) - then I wouldn't go for that as long as GF was in the picture - but thusfar he's still firmly attached to her, so he won't even go to dinner with the kids and I.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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I think that DS staying with his dad is great. It doesn't you worry you though not knowing for sure where he's going to be? Am I too much of a worrywart?

If you look up worrywart in the dictionary - you'll find my picture <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

No, I'm not worried. DS is less than a mile from my home, he's got a cell phone (my second line), and he has friends in the apartment complex. In a pinch he could walk home, and he knows he can call me at any time, day or night. He's 13. When I was his age I was out running the roads all summer <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> (Not that that would be a good thing...)

He is sufficiently capable of looking after himself at XH's and like I said, he's just a stone's throw from me here. My shop is midway between XH's and my place.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Well last night was good. I had a snag with an incoming shipment, and I had to pick it up last evening (100-mile round-trip). During the day when I confirmed the shipment's arrival time, I emailed XH to let him know what was happening (the shipment should have arrived in the very early AM and I should have been able to fetch it before store opening).

He agreed to stay and cover for me while I went to get it, then he stayed and helped me put it away. We were done by closing time. He only called me 3 times for help while I was on the road (he is rather helpless in the shop on his own at times!), all with customer questions.

There appears to be no lingering stress from the blowout last Sunday, he truly appears to have put it behind him, thankfully.

We worked well together in close proximity of one another to put the order up - we chatted about this and that - nothing big.

DS is still with him, DD went to a friend's last night. They will both be going to the library with XH tonight, and both kids will be home tonight. The weekend is XH's with the kids - Father's Day and all. Additionally, his vacation starts next weekend so this will be the last weekend they spend together until his return.

I'm worried about this trip - for many reasons. I know worry is wasted energy, but sometimes I can't help myself. Last night XH received a "Bounce Protection" notice from the bank (he never changed his address with the bank - bank mail still comes to my house) - meaning he's overdrawn on his account and the bank covered whatever, and charged him $30 for it. He gets paid on Friday so I expect I'll receive a few more of these. He's got a week before he goes away, and his next pay is on June 30. He assured me he'd make his mortgage payment (on our home)before he leaves (due on the 1st, he usually pays from his mid-month pay on the 15th - last day of the grace period). A little simple math on my part comes up with him falling short on his trip out there. He'll be paid again *while* he's out there, so he should have funds to get back.

I know none of that is my concern... but I'm concerned. If he overdraws within his limit, the bank will float him, charging him $30 each time he swipes his debit card. This was a pattern while GF was living with him, and he'd done well - he hadn't overdrawn since she left (less expenses!). I figured he was saving up for his trip... perhaps I overestimated.

My *only* major concern is that if he runs out of overdraft space and gets stranded along the way, he might call me to bail him out. That poses a major moral dilemma for me.

I do NOT want to help "WS" or enable him in any way. So the obvious answer would be NO if he calls me from the road somewhere asking me to lend him a fast deposit to his bank account. I'd likely tell him to call his GF and have her fix the problem since he's on his way to see her.

However, I'd have a really hard time saying, "Tough" and not helping if he was really stuck.

Perhaps I'm being a bit paranoid - but if he's stuck and desperate, this scenario *is* possible. I'm just trying to get in the right mindspace for this potential scenario.

Last year when he made this trip, he got into a huge financial mess, that rippled down to the kids and me. He assured me *that* wouldn't happen again - but I'm not so sure. At least this year I can anticipate it and be prepared to cover the payment for the roof over my head if necessary ... but I really don't know how I would/should react if he gets into a bind.

If his car breaks down, he's toast <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I am probably giving all that more thought than it's worth, but last year he nearly dragged me into the financial dumper with him... just trying to avoid a repeat performance.

JinGA

Last edited by JinGA; 06/14/07 07:02 AM.

F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Morning Jin. I can't offer any specific advice on how to handle the possible money scenario with XH. As far as worrying about XH being on the road and getting jammed up for cash for himself, etc... I say follow your own advice and put it in God's hands. Consider it all GOOD information, even if it's not what you want to hear. You have spent some time considering possible outcomes on this trip (either he breaks it off entirely or he moves out there), so you are willing to take the good with the bad. Consider his actions though in determining what YOU ultimately want. What will be good for YOU. If he gets himself into trouble, perhaps consider that as a warning signal. Though this GF of his might be the catalyst for his poor decisions, he's still making the choices here. He can't claim insanity, even if he is in a fog.

Not saying to throw the baby out with the bathwater or anything. Just make sure you're open and processing ALL of the information coming in - good and bad.

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You're right, Seabird. All information is good information. I'd rather be aware of the potential hazards of the situation than not. Last year I got caught unawares. I knew he likely couldn't afford the trip, but I didn't realize it would affect me (ie foreclosure call from the mortgage lender). I had to borrow money FAST to get the loan caught up (it's in his name only - doesn't affect my credit), and seek legal means to get reimbursed.

I just wonder sometimes how many times he has to hit rock bottom. He hit it the first time - hard, when I moved into a new relationship about 7 months after we separated. Then he found his GF. He hit financial rock bottom last year upon return from his vacation with her, and it has literally taken him nearly a year to bounce back from that, and given that he's overdrawn again - apparently he's not out of the woods yet.

Then he hit another rock bottom when she announced she was moving back home. Not as bad as it could have been, and he bounced back quickly since they are still 'an item'.

Now I see him heading for another financial mess, and possibly an emotional mess sometime in the near future. Another rock bottom is waiting in the wings.

It's hard to watch <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> But I can't fix him, I can't prevent him from making bad choices - and yes - they are his choices. I'm doing what I can to be prepared for the ripple effect that may affect the kids and I, but beyond that there's nothing I can do.

If I said something to him about it, I'd likely get the same AO I got last Sunday. It's really none of my business - so I'm just going to take the info I know into consideration for myself, and just let things unfold as they will.

It's kind of selfish of me, but I was sort of hoping for some sort of "roadblock" to his vacation... no harm to him of course - just some reason why he'd opt not to go (ie: car breaks down on the way to work or something benign like that). I know that's not very nice... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> This situation for him could be a road block but my *guess* at this time is that he is likely to ignore it and throw caution to the wind.

Maybe he'll surprise me - but I doubt it. I think he's been living and breathing for this vacation for a couple of months now.

Guess we'll see what happens over the next 3 weeks.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Well tonight he stopped in for a grand total of about 5 minutes. He's taking the kids to the library and for supper at the restaurant we trade at, then home.

For the *first* time, he actually asked if he could pick up some take-out for me to have when I get home. Impressive <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I said yes, please, told him what I'd like, and told him I appreciate that very much. He hasn't taken the kids there for a long while - and he's *never* ever offered to pick anything up for me. Granted - he's not paying for it (it comes off the credit the store has with the restaurant) but the kindness of picking something up for me is new, and welcome and appreciated.

When he told me he's taking the kids home tonight (DS has been there all week, DD was home with me except last night she stayed at her friend's), he told me he's going out tomorrow night. So I said, "So you won't be coming here tomorrow night?" and he said correct.

I think his office must have some sort of social do once a month or something because he went out one Friday night about a month ago. That's good - get him out and having a bit of a life again - he's been pretty much living like a hermit the last couple of months.

We close early on Friday nights anyway so it's no biggie if he doesn't come in - although last time he went out on a Friday night he still stopped by on his way home to change. I am taking the kids on the outing we're invited on on Saturday - if I have anything to tell him about what's ongoing here I'll either leave a note or call I guess. No biggies there either. I was hoping he'd help me get some livestock priced (I know the prices off the top of my head - he doesn't, and it's hard to keep everything marked with so many constant changes...dry goods and hardware always have price tags)... he was not willing to work unless all the livestock was tagged - he said he'd help with that but I guess not <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> That's OK it's quiet tonight so I'm working on that now and what I don't finish tonight I can get done tomorrow.

I still expect him to call me 50 times on Saturday with questions - I keep thinking that working this place alone now and then he might realize how much I do and appreciate it a bit - but that's asking a bit much right now *g*.

So not much interaction with him today - but I was really impressed that he offered to pick up food for me. That was really nice of him.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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May I assume you DO know the power of a warm smile?

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

use it

and then add a light touch (like on his arm or his back) whenever you can

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Yep - I know the power of a longing gaze too - but I don't think he's noticed. I make eye contact and smile too - but it's not penetrating the fog yet.

As for touching - closest I've got to that was wiping some bird crap off his back (I have 2 small parrots as my pets at the store, and XH likes to play with them - funny as he HATES birds <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ) I was was wiping him down, lower back and butt. He sort of stopped me and lifted the shirt away from his skin so I could finish without actually touching him <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I think he kinda liked it LOL! Just not sure why he shifted.

He was only touchy feely during the M (and most likely with GF too) I have to tread carefully there. Too "friendly" too suddenly may make him uncomfortable.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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I think him getting a little uncomfortable is a darn good thing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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I think him getting a little uncomfortable is a darn good thing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

OK - so how does one distinguish "good uncomfortable" from "bad uncomfortable"?

I've got a POJA question too - but I'll post it in my other thread to you, Pepperband...

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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I read a passage in another thread over on EN, and it really struck a chord with me:

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Rocks in a River, from Steve Harley, quoted by Extremely Lost:

You find yourself on the bank of a wide river. It is too wide to jump across, and yet you still need to cross it. What do you do? You start picking up rocks and throwing them into the river. (These rocks are each small affectionate thing you do for your spouse). For the first 499 rocks, you see the rock hit the water, and then it disappears. These rocks are sinking and landing on the bottom of the river. Eventually you get to rock #500 and it hits the water and part of it is sticking up above the surface. You now realize you are getting somewhere. You can finally see progress. For the first 499 rocks, you knew they were stacking up, but you had no proof other than common sense telling you that they were building up. We have to approach our relationships now as if every piece of affection is one of those rocks. We will not see any progress until a number of rocks have been thrown. However, just because we are not seeing these first 499 rocks does not mean they are not having an impact. Believe that they are, because they are.

That pretty much sums up what I'm trying to do. I also read the Parable of the Net. I realize now that at the end of my M, my net was full of debris, as was his.

I have cleaned out my net, and continue to keep it clean. I can't speak for XH just yet but I'm hoping he has cleaned his net out too.

I'm continuing on throwing those rocks in the river. I almost think that his bringing me dinner last night may have been likened to one of those rocks actually sticking out of the water.

I posted my POJA question in my other thread to Pepperband... but here's what's going on. XH and I agreed to my time off tomorrow, based on certain conditions - one administrative (which I will have finished by the the time I leave here tonight. The other condition (sorta) was having help. He knew our help may not be available - but he accepted anyway. I am only a phone call away if he needs any questions answered (that's standard when I'm out of the shop - which isn't often).

I've sent him an email - awaiting a response, letting him know that our help is not available tomorrow and asking him if that's OK. He can always ask me to forego my outing (which I don't *want* to do - that would be a sacrifice).. but business is business. Hopefully he'll agree anyway - at least he has a heads up on the situation.

I also threw another rock into the river. Since Sunday is Father's Day, I have let him know that if he'd like to take the day off, and spend the whole day with the kids, he's welcome to. I'm not sure when we'll get back Saturday evening but I've offered to drop them off at his place either Saturday night or Sunday morning - or he can pick them up - whichever is his preference.

I would have liked the same thing for Mother's Day as I mentioned - but I didn't ask and he typically doesn't think about such things (if I'd asked, he may well have agreed to it - but I don't know since I didn't ask). He did cover me for the evening of my birthday at our kids' request (it was a "surprise")... one good turn deserves another, right?

I sent the email - awaiting his reply now - we'll see how he responds.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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OK maybe I'm just being a tad bit sensitive - somebody 2x4 me if I am.

He never replied to my email, so I sent him a second one to make sure he got the first one (had to catch him before he leaves work - I'd rather not phone if I don't have to - eats his cell minutes)

Anyway he finally replied - the plan works for him etc.

NO word of a "Thank you". I didn't have to offer him a day off - I thought it would be nice, and he said I could drop the kids off (usually he picks them up) on Saturday evening or Sunday morning.

Am I being a bit too sensitive in thinking that a "Gee thanks" would have been nice?

For somebody who considers appreciation one of his own top EN, one would think he'd at least say thanks himself now and then - but he hasn't at all lately <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Jin - I don't think that wanting a thank you is unreasonable.

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Maybe not but I don't think I should have to solicit one <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I nearly punctuated my reply to him with, "You're WELCOME" but I refrained from doing so (LB).. and posted here instead.

Maybe one day he'll learn how to say thank you. He's already made some pretty good changes - Rome wasn't built in a day.

Normally he's got good manners - please, thank you, excuses himself etc. I guess I'm being a bit sensitive.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Please don't excuse his poor behavior by feeling that you're being too sensitive. I feel a little annoyed when I hold the door open for a stranger and he/she just walks through without any sort of acknowledgment. Bad manners is bad manners.

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True enough. One thing I've observed in relationships is that often people treat complete strangers better than their loved ones. In fact I have been known to ask my loved ones to "treat me like a stranger" - meaning if they'd say please or thank you to a stranger for the same action - then I deserve the same (or better).

My dad is like that - he'd help anyone do anything - give you the shirt off his back - but my sister and I barely exist.

I could never figure that out. I was raised with good manners - so was XH - and usually I can't complain about that - he's usually pretty forthcoming with please and thank you - and I've been making sure to show appreciation each and every time he does something that benefits me - personally or in the business. Like I said - he always complained that I did not appreciate *anything* he ever did (and that always got thrown in my face during an argument) even when I make extra effort. Then when I do thank him, he blows it off and either shrugs, says, "no problem" or "whatever".

I used to have a hard time accepting gratitude or compliments - lots of people do. I have learned that when you do receive a nice comment, "Thank you" works really well <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> So does, "You're welcome."

Don't get me wrong - I'm enjoying the opportunity to do things for him, I just wish I had a sense of acknowledgement or appreciation.

I guess to some extent he's still quite in "taker" mode - although he's showing me signs of being a giver too - like last night's dinner, and tomorrow's outing (which is going on as planned, BTW, even though our help can't come in). I told him thanks - and Sunday when I drop off the kids I likely won't see him - but if I do I'll thank him and if I don't, I'll drop him an email on Monday to thank him.

He didn't come by tonight - but I didn't expect him to. I close up in an hour. I won't see him tomorrow at all (but I'll likely hear from him!) and I won't see him Sunday. We're closed Monday so I won't see him then either - so that's it til Tuesday. Then he's off on vacation as of Friday night (probably not leaving til Saturday).

Before he goes, I want to give him a hug and ask him to be safe... but I'm not sure if the hug will be well received. I'm worried about him going on this trip - I just hope he comes back safely.

I have a feeling the *real* work will begin when he gets back. I want to move forward a bit with my Plan A but I feel like I'm a bit stuck until after his vacation is over. Then sooner or later he's going to have to choose whether to let GF go or move there - because at some point one or both of them may realize that long-distance won't work forever. He won't have any more vacation til next year, and unless he wants to foot the bill for her to fly out here periodically - and how long is that "enough"?

For the next few weeks I could use some good advice on how to kick it into high gear upon his return. Until now I've been pretty passive - making quiet little deposits into the love bank... but once he returns I think it will be time to fight for my man. Only question is, does he want me to?

He seems to be enjoying the things I do - he's responded positively to them, and to negotiating etc... so how do I ease up to the next level without freaking him out?

Inquiring minds want to know <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Well today was a great day. The kids and I had a *blast* out with our friends at the amusement park.

XH only called me 10 times. Most calls were unnecessary - he called to ask if a particular item had been sold (it had), that we needed to order a particular thing (could have left a note...) That's OK... we had our day together.

I'd already offered him tomorrow, Sunday (Father's Day) off to spend with the kids. DD's boyfriend's family has 4 extra free passes to another amusement park, and they expire tomorrow - so DD asked her father if they could all go (they'll use 3 of the passes and go with DD's BF parents and family). So my kids get a second day of fun - for free (hopefully XH will bring $$ for drinks etc), and XH gets a great chance to spend some really fun time with his kids again before he goes.

Win/win all around I'd say. I'm beat - we were on the road at 7:30 this morning and just got home a short while ago. Thank God for SPF 50 sunscreen or I'd have been *fried*.

There's no tired like a FUN tired... hoping to really sleep well tonight.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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Well I dropped the kids off at XH's about an hour ago. I'm home alone now - I have to go to work in a couple of hours.

Feeling kind of lonely right now. Wish I was going *with* them. That's OK - it will be a good day of fun for the kids and their dad - the kind we used to have together as a family. On one of his many phone calls yesterday, I told him how nice the park was that we were at (he's never been, it was our first time there too - and I know he'd like it there). I stopped short of saying that we could all have fun there someday... but he seemed interested in it.

I'm hoping that all of this gives him some food for thought, as it pertains to his R with GF (something tells me she's not the sort to go to an amusement park). If he moves away to be with her again, he won't be around his kids, and times like today will be a thing of the past. I don't think he wants this, but he's at a point where sooner or later he's going to have to make a *choice* - to leave his kids behind, his job, and any chance at coming home - to be with GF and her kids and her family and her baggage, or *wake up* and realize that whether we get back together or not - his LIFE is here. His kids are here, his job is here - and yep, his home is here.

I wish with all my heart that he'd change his mind about making that trip. As far as I know he still plans to drive out there - pros and cons to driving versus flying.

Driving he gets less 'net time' with GF and a LOT of time to think on that long drive. Driving is more risky though - long drive, older car... more risk to personal safety.

Flying he'd have more 'net time' with GF, less time to ponder it all - particularly on the voyage home. 3 or so days on the road, driving away from GF, and heading back to his life here - might be good therapy for him. Hopefully he'll have had a huge dose of reality by then, and hopefully he'll be pondering, "what next".

I do hope he does some serious thinking about his situation - either way - he's got some decisions to make going forward. Until now, for the past couple of months he's kept his R going long-distance or at least she has - she calls him a LOT. I don't know if he calls her that often - at least he does not do that around me.

Even if he doesn't even consider the possibility of coming home - moving for him would be a huge life-changing event. Leaving his kids has to be the biggest. Initially he told me that was not an option, and it never has been as long as we've been apart. We were apart because of his job for 2 years - he came home to see us once a month. He wouldn't see his kids but maybe once a year if he moved. He'd be leaving a job he's worked the better part of 18 years to get - that's going very well for him. He'd be leaving all his social and family ties here (there's only us here - we left home and family to come here)... and all he would have there is GF, her kids, and her family (none of whom he's terribly impressed with).

From a logical standpoint, none of it makes sense - but he has behaved a lot less than logically in the last couple of years. Every now and then a glimmer of practicality seems to burst through, only to be buried again.

He has done so many things that contradict one another. Our phone number in his cell phone is still, "Home" (even though he bought that phone AFTER he moved out). His bank mail still comes to my house - he never changed his address. He still loves our business even though we are trying to sell it - he never asks me how the sale process is going (waiting on an offer right now). He's not in any hurry to change things as they are right now.

He's been filling some of my EN without thinking about it - but he's still distant at times.

He's allowing me to fill some of his EN, and responding very well to POJA in most instances, even though he doesn't really know why - he doesn't know I come to this site, and I daresay he has no clue why we're getting along so well <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Sometimes he's a very deep thinker - other times I don't think he looks beyond the here and now.

He doesn't seem to want to be around me very much - but sometimes he finds weak reasons to call me or have me come in to the business when I don't really need to be there. (Like on Memorial Day). He stops in at the biz most weeknights, but doesn't stay long - sometimes just a few minutes - why bother at all for 5 minutes?

Sometimes he seems to show jealousy, sometimes indifference. Like when he seemed to get the "wrong impression" about a male client who's very friendly (and VERY married - nothing there but casual friendship)... once I sent the message to him that it's only that, he's been very friendly himself toward that client.

He says he's thinking of moving, but accepted 2 beds from a friend of mine, for our kids when they stay with their father. Why take on more furniture if he thinks he's leaving?

I dunno - maybe it's just how I'm feeling today. Some days I think I'm gaining ground, other days, like when he blows off a compliment or gratitude, I think he doesn't want to hear it. I sit here wondering if *any* of it counts? I'm sure it does, but does it count consciously to him? I really don't know.

Part of me wants to just tell him that I wish he wouldn't go on this vacation, another part of me says to let him go - let him see it firsthand that it won't work out for him. I'm hoping that my patience, my careful application of Plan A will float to the top of his mind and heart when he's out there with GF who will be undoubtedly be pressing him for a timeline of "when" he's going to pack up and move there. After all - she's not going to sit there and wait forever - she's the one that packed up and left - but why did she do that if she's not done with him?

I know that Plan A means NOT begging, bargaining, pleading, groveling or sounding desperate - and I'm not doing that - but I have to make a conscious effort NOT to do that.

Still, I feel like I want to sit down with him and tell him all the things I've been feeling, ask him why he's doing this? Why is he waffling? If he wants to move out there like he says he's thinking of doing - why isn't he just doing it? (I do NOT want to push him into doing that!!). Yet I feel that if I did any of this right now, it would only speed his departure out there.

No - I think I need to just let his R run its course. It's been dying for a while now - a slow, very painful death. It's hard to watch - it's painful for me to watch. I just wish one day he'd wake up with an epiphany, realize that at the very least, his R is a major dead end, and take some time for himself to decide what it is he really wants out of life.

While I was composing this post, XH's brother called to talk and tell me about our niece's wedding (which was lovely - can't believe she's a grown-up married woman now!). He was unaware of XH's vacation plans. I doubt the rest of his family is aware either. Bro knows how I feel - I asked him to be there for his brother over the next few weeks. Bro doesn't think he'll move either (and said he'll kick his keister if he does!)... but now he knows what all is going on.

*Sigh* it's so hard to be so close, but yet so far...mixed signals continue to abound and I would think that if XH had no love in his heart left for me at all, he would send a clear message of that - but actions speak louder than words - and even the words are confusing.

I just want the next 3 weeks to be done and over with... I'm going to lean on the good folks here to help me through this. Once he returns, I think I'll have a better feel for how to proceed - but any advice/suggestions for the meantime would be most welcomed.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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XH called me from the amusement park a few minutes ago - he wanted to know how I felt about DD going on a "Fearless Leap" ride - it's sort of like a bungee-jump-slingshot thingy. She would have gone on it with her BF (2 or 3 people can do it at once in the same harness). He clearly had reservations about it - and I appreciate him asking me - I'm not really comfy with it - and I could tell he wasn't either - hence his call. I asked what BF's parents felt about it - they felt the same.

I'm not sure *who* decided - while I was telling him to go with his gut about it, "they" decided that the kids will "wait until next time"...

I asked if they were having fun, he said an enthusiastic YES, and that DS is tired (we were all worn out after yesterday!) but yes they are having a good time. I said, "Good!"

I'm glad they are having a good day together - for next week XH leaves for 2 weeks. I hope he stays in touch with the kids this time - last year he didn't answer his cell phone or return calls from his kids or even one of his brothers, prompting all the worry I talked about in an earlier thread.

Hopefully today will reinforce his bond with his kids even more. Clearly he's feeling protective or he wouldn't have second-guessed his own instincts regarding DD's taking that scary ride.

If he's not here, how will he protect her? He knows I always will - but there's no substitute for being here oneself.

*Sigh*... this is a very hard day for me.

It's quiet at work - as I knew it would be. Families are together, doing things for their Dads, Grandfathers, uncles, stepdads... I had to come in and hold down the fort - and I don't mind... but in so many ways I wish I was there - or at least I wish he wanted me there. It was a good sign I think that he called. I'm glad he wanted my input on a decision like that.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,082
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Well I'm confused now. Kids came home - they had a great time.

DS told me that his dad is "taking a plane" on his vacation (whew - that makes more sense than driving)... BUT he said that XH is leaving "after July 1" and will be gone, "About 2 weeks." I guess he's changed his vacation dates.

DS also told me that XH has not even bought his ticket yet. Weird. I wonder what's up with that?

Well if he takes 2 weeks beginning on July 1, that will run into DD's band camp - even if XH has more vacation time, he won't be able to take the kids anywhere during the remainder of the summer, because DD's band schedule won't permit it.

Wonder if/when he's going to tell me all this? Hard to plan for the business this way.

JinGA


F/40, DD15 DS13 M 1989 DDay his EA May 1998. S Aug 2004. D Dec 05. I filed. 4/07 Post-D Plan A with 180, with hopes of R. 6/23/07 XH said no to R. 8/24/07 Went on a date with someone new, "B". 1/22/08 Still seeing B, life is good! Learning and growing each day. Ask me about Geocaching!
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