Thanks for your input believer and pepperband. I have printed Joseph's letter but he is not very receptive to reading anything I show him. He actually was better about listening before he ended it with her. Now he just doesn't want to hear it. It's like he thinks he made this big sacrafice and now he doesn't need to do anything. I do agree that she probably broke it off and he is still hoping to hear from her, which drives me crazy. I doesn't feel very good to think he is only there because she doesn't want him anymore. I know that he told her things that he couldn't live with, and now she is angry with him. It makes me think that they may decide they don't have a future because of these things but that doesn't mean they won't stay in touch or even see each other occasionally.
I tried asking if he realized the pain this A has put me through and how I need the MC to recover and he told me to go ahead and get it on my own. So I said I would. I'm going to put in a request for a phone session and maybe that will help me with a plan or something. I asked him why he is there if he doesn't want to work on our marriage and he said that I wouldn't let him leave. I told him that I was stronger now than I was then and if he wanted to leave to go ahead. A while later he said I just need to be patient and take it one day at a time. He slept with our son last night, which is a huge trigger for me because that's what he used to do when he was still seeing her.
I have asked some friends at work to check around for me and find out if she is saying it's over or not. Her XSIL works with me as does a good friend of hers (who was very hurt that she hadn't even told her about the affair). I'll see what I can find out because I can deal with his withdrawel if I know that it is over between them.

I would make it crystal clear to him that the sacrificing has been on YOUR part, not his and that he is fortunate that you love him so much and are willing to honor your vows to him and God that you haven't moved on.

LOL

What is he, 5 years old?

You would not give him your blessing to leave .... he's acting like a big BABY <~~~ he's in withdrawl

read about withdrawl

He is texting me right now and is annoyed that I'm asking what he's doing today. Is this still withdrawl or should I be more suspicous that he's in contact with her? Wouldn't he actually be nicer and in a better mood if he was talking to her? If he is moody that means he is unhappy being apart from her right? I just asked him why he is so moody and he said he isn't moody he just needs time and space and I know why. I said actually I don't know why. Is it because you are not sure you want to be at home or because you are upset about OW? He said why would he be upset but then said that I was right it is hard to let go. I asked if he meant let go of me or her. Then he changes the subject and says what I was doing that bugged him last night. He is driving me crazy!

don't ask him those sorts of questions unless you really do need to know ...

instead
send him something in the mail
invite him out for coffee (he'll say "no" ... but ask anyway)
tell him your plans ... invite him along if he wants to go ... and when he says "no' YOU GO DO STUFF without him

when you return, tell him something amusing you saw/did/heard

he's acting like a BABY
sooooooooooooooooo

the LAST thing you want to do is act like his Mama

do things you enjoy
and allow him to wallow in his diaper without you

because he knows where your "buttons" are

and he's pushing them

so MOVE your buttons

do NOT give him the 3rd degree
do NOT pester him
do NOT ask him complicated difficult questions

he is emotionally immature right now ... so just go about your business
keep your eyes/ears open
don't lovebust

and expect little/no cooperation effort from him

do this at least 2-3 weeks

then see what happends

this link HERE

is to one of the best threads ever on the recovery forum

PLANK starts off describing "the affair world" from the BS point of view

then..........

Kiwi joins the discussion and writes out the same timeline of events from the WS point of view

it is an excellent view into understanding each other

but for now ... you're the only functioning adult

so you read this for yourself

do not try to educate your H for a few more weeks

Do's
1. Act Happy
2. Get a life (new activities, etc.)
3. repeat over and over...I will make it
4. Actively LISTEN....keep conversations at "to the point...small talk" ...don't blow it up beyond her comfort zone
5. Tend to Agree (Thank you for your truthfulness, It seems that way)
6. Expand your social relationships
7. Get sexy (gym, new clothes, etc)
8. Focus on your strengths and Positives...don't put yourself down verbally or constantly go over what you did wrong
9. Accept Uncertainty (Do your best today and let God take care of tomorrow)

DON'Ts

1. Repeatedly say "I love you"
2. Ask questions that don't have answers yet
3. Criticize, complain, whine or nag
4. Say, "I've changed"....let her judge your actions
5. Argue, Reason or Plead
6. Don't get family or friends involved in recovery
7. Act helpless or depressed
8. Discuss morality, invoke God or Dr. Laura type babble
9. Suggest marital counseling (must be her idea)
10. Tell her continually "we need to work on the relationship"
11. GIVE UP

[color:"red"] borrowed from Mr Wondering (with permission) [/color]

Thanks so much for your responses Pepperband, they really do help. I needed to hear those things. After I posted he text me saying that he really missed her and how hard it was to let go and i asked him if he had talked to her at all and he said not yet. I left work early and went out to the lake where he was and we stayed there the weekend. He already has mentioned how he felt like I ran to save him, which I probably kinda was. We had a nice weekend except for one fight where I almost left because he kept talking about how I wouldn't give him space. It's so hard when he acts like we're roommates and never shows me any affection except for when we go to bed. I told him that last night and he was a little better today but not much. I know I have to be patient and give it time. He gets better every day but I am just so scared he'll contact her and it will start over. I'm also scared that I'm close to giving up. He was nicer to me before he left her. Those do's and don'ts really gave me something to work on though so hopefully that will keep me sane for the next few weeks.

Ok I need some advise before I do something stupid. I just found out about another lie. My WH had a cell phone that I broke when I found texts from her months ago. He has since got a new number but you can still leave messages at that old number. He told me it would expire shortly on it's own so I have left it alone. Today I phoned to see when it would expire and it was topped up on June 7th! So she could leave messages if she wanted and he could phone her from anywhere. I am so upset. He admitted on Thursday that he was thinking about calling her but didn't. He says she is angry because he wouldn't commit to him and wouldn't call him but it's like he wants to keep this line open just in case. I could have cancelled it but he would find out and if he wants to call her he can anyways. It should be his decision to cancel it shouldn't it? Or should I just do it? He is at work and I would love to call him and ask him about his lies. If he thinks I'm angry he probably wouldn't come home. Should I wait for him to come home or pretend I don't even know? I don't know what I should do. Here I have been trying not to LB but there are so many things that I want to ask about. He wouldn't let me give him a hicky last night and that upset me. He said even when he does what I want, like getting rid of the other phone, there is always going to be something else I nag about. What should I do?

I wouldn't let him know that you know. He will just come up with some excuse anyway.

do not vent in his direction at this time .... he's not able to be your husband right now .... he's like a druggie without his fix ...

come here and just let it all out

you don't need to do anything right now except what is on that list

go for a walk
call a friend
go have a pedicure

So I just pretend I don't know? That will be hard for me. You're right though, he'll just give some reason about people he works with only knowing that number. But he lied to me. He can't make an excuse up for that.

Yep, but if you keep acting suspicious, it will put him on alert. Either he wants to save the marriage, or he doesn't. Keep Plan A'ing him and give him a chance to relax. That is when he will make a mistake, if he isn't serious. If he is serious, then it will help you rebuild.

But how do I know he is without his fix? How do I know he's not with her right now pretending he's at work? Now that I know he was lying again, I'm suspicious of everything he says all over again. I want to cancel that number so she can't call him but I know if they want to they will find a way. I think they are both being stubborn right now and are waiting for the other to make the first move to contact. That is why he is keeping that number open.

He's going to lie to you .... he's still wayward in his head

play it smart ... don't get all emotional

your marriage can recover .... but it is a process .... a marathon, not a sprint

save your energy
use your plan
do not do things from an emotional knee jerk reaction

ie; "HE lied again and I am soooooo mad I am going to confront him"

there are ways to discuss this continued secrecy that are constructive .... WHEN YOU ARE NOT EMOTIONAL OR UPSET

pleeeeeeeeeeeezeeeeeeeeee

do not get in his face about this right now

OK?

Ok. I hope he doesn't phone or come home too soon because he will be able to tell. He can read me like a book. I'm just not a good liar like he is. As soon as he sees or talks to me he will ask what's wrong. it's like he's always on alert for what I have found out now.

tell him you're hormonal <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

try and walk it off

you know you can't drag a man into recovery, he's got to volunteer

so make yourself an attractive inviting spouse .... and avoid LBs right now

once real recovery begins, you can work all this stuff out in therapy

Go run around the block. Then you can tell him you are worn out.

I made the mistake of confronting my WH each time I caught him. He was an accomplished liar, and talked his way out of things, and then was more careful. I wish I had just Plan A'd, and let things build up, where there couldn't be any denial.

Ok thanks guys. I'm going to go help my son with his homework and then go for a walk. It's so hard not to confront him when I find out stuff like this. I know it makes him run in the other direction though. He seems like he wants to work it out sometimes and then refuses to discuss things or consider MC the next. I think I'm a little more suspicious because he seemed to want to stay on the phone with me and was being nice today. The last time he did that he was on his way to see her. I'm being paranoid aren't I?