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I didn't expose; I didn't really have the need as the A ended pretty much when I asked her to stop it. NC appears to be holding but I'm aware that F?WW lies like a compulsive liar; the good news for me is that she's rubbish at it. I have enough info on OM to expose to his family & his XGF (they were together when the A started but split about 3-4 weeks into the A [if I do need to expose, is it still worthwhile to tell her?]). If he starts to cause trouble I'll expose to them. If NC breaks then it's sky-writer time. I'm still feeling the same way about mrs b.p.m. I love her intensely but find myself in a strange mood; not "not caring" per se, but close - I can't quiet put my finger on it. I suppose the mental, emotional, spiritual & physical preparations I've made for a life without her have resulted in me disconnecting from the M on some level(s). I am increasingly of the opinion that my EN's could be better met by an XBox360 & a Triumph Stag (my equivalent of a Fireblade, only with more wheels). No plans to go tho'. The last week has been a good one. Father's Day was great: I got Islay Malt, a CD, some dark chocolate biscuits & a packet of Walnut Whips (F?WW remembered that I used to lurve them years ago & got me some - it was my fave gift). DD5 spent the day making Father's Day cards for me - I got dozens <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />. Riches beyond measure as you rightly point out Bob. mrs b.p.m. is showing me some affection; I've been moved close to tears on a couple of occasions (I did shed a tear at one of them but I had my back to her so she didn't see). We are spending a lot of time with each other & I'm enjoying every second of it (I hope she is too). We've been looking at tents a lot (she wants to go camping with the kids), bought a wooden floor for the living room & looked at paint colours & wallpaper. It's all a bit surreal given our recent history. We talk a lot too. Positive signs but the jury is still out. b.p.m.
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LOL bpm ! My mechanical EN meeter is a VX220 <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> The detachment you feel is a result of your practiced "loving detachment". Afer I while you find your need evaporates into somewhere between "want" and "meh". This is also the first step towards becoming self actualized. Yes I know I am the first Noddy Holder to ever use that phrase, but bear with me. You learn that a lot of the clenched-fish-in-your-gut fear during an affair and early recovery is caused by your assumptions that your W will reliably provide certain foundations of your psychological health. Thats how I expected marriage to be, but its not that practocal. Its a burden on people to have them act as component structural parts of ourselves IMO. You withdraw from needing and relying on your W and find yourself in a place where you are able to review the situation in a more accurate manner than before. Its a FACT that you'd get along just fine without your WW in your life. It just didn't feel like that for ages. Its an interesting thing, thsi self-awareness thing. It was the time when *I* became the biggest threat to our marriage rather than Squid. When you don't NEED a person, you assess their contribution to your potential happiness. And recent WS and FWS just don't offer a bargain in the old "cheer me up" stakes. Also I found when Squid realised that I didnlt need her she fair [email]cr@pped[/email] her pants. Knowing that she couldn't assume her place in my life was a dreadful experience for her. She's not comfortable with it yet. To sum up self actualization , I'll sing you a song : "At first i was afraid - I was petrified Kept thinkin' I could never live without you by my side...." <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> You're doing great. Just understand how the relationship dynamics change as you both progress and there'll be fewer suprrises. etc.
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regarding your missus planning holidays and choosing floor coverings...I recalls Squid was telling me she hated me and would live with OM...while she was buying school uniforms with he kids...
Its a very good sign when a F?WS starts contributing practically.
Now I have developed a unique view of recovery based on my own experiences and studies of folks on here.
I think recovery has at least THREE seperate threads.
PRACTICAL - Day-to-day relationship and life support
PERSONAL - Individual recovery from overdependence and behaviours that contributed to the poor M that allowed an affair
TRAUMATIC - the recovery from the hurt, guilt and pain that D-day and withdrawal caused. Also learning to protect each other from hurt by selfishness.
I see that at least some of these three are required even if a divorce is chosen, but all three are required if a recovered M is possible IMO.
I think the first one non-MB aware folks will go for is day-to-day. Its thee natural place to start as we all have the skills, however latent to make each others lives better, which also make our own life better.
Chicken soup , intimacy, SF, openness, planning Etc.
Squid hurled herself into these tasks. She is transformed as a wife and mother since MANY years nowadays.
I realized that the PRACTICAL recovery can provide a platform that allows FWS to be confident enough to risk helping us heal from the TRAUMA without fear of being kicked to the curb.
This seems to be a very real risk of many or all FWS in early recovery.
It is goodness. You are right not to settle for it alone though.
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This is also the first step towards becoming self actualized.
Yes I know I am the first Noddy Holder to ever use that phrase, but bear with me. LOL "At first i was afraid - I was petrified
Kept thinkin' I could never live without you by my side...." ROFL. Looking forward to the next installment of Noddy sings ... ...Chicken soup , intimacy, SF, openness, planning Etc.
Squid hurled herself into these tasks. She is transformed as a wife and mother since MANY years nowadays. ROFLMAO. Ooooooh matron. Its an interesting thing, thsi self-awareness thing. It was the time when *I* became the biggest threat to our marriage rather than Squid.
When you don't NEED a person, you assess their contribution to your potential happiness. And recent WS and FWS just don't offer a bargain in the old "cheer me up" stakes. . That's exactly where I am, & what pio touched upon earlier. I'm in a holding pattern at the moment in the hope that F?WW will decide sooner rather than later to attempt recovery (she's addressing her own issues at the moment, which are legion, & wants to be rid of those before we start anything). The main things that are keeping me here is my kids (this *is* a mighty strong glue), the fact that I still do love her very much, a curiosity about what the M could be like & a score of other lesser reasons. Is it possible to accidentally stray into recovery ?? Interesting times. Thanks for your input Bob. b.p.m.
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Is it possible to accidentally stray into recovery ??
I believe that giving it a meaningful try because you want to is a far better way to attempt recovery than can't-eat-can't-sh1t-so-desperate needful.
Kids were why I stayed too at your spot on the joyride too. It became more than that ere long.
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Hi Bob,
I'm intent on giving it a meaningful try (within the bizarre context of not actually wanting to be in a relationship with anyone at the moment - I'm sure you understand where I'm coming from); I didn't really give the M a 100%, I giving 100% now tho', to whatever this is called. Desperate I ain't.
I was just wondering: F?WW is now going some way towards meeting my ENs (which are honesty, honesty, ..., & honesty with a large dose of open(n?)ess) & I meetings hers, as I percieve them to be, as part of plan A. Is this recovery ?? Probably not. I suppose that we're doing threads 1 & 2 of your 3 threads (PRACTICAL & PERSONAL).
I'm glad & relieved to hear that there's a well worn path thru' here - I shall have to look on the map to see what's round the corner.
I'm got my eye on a Jensen Healey at the mo. VX220's are a little to rich for me (they're surprisingly affordable tho', one's on eBay for £8.5k at the mo), I'd just rather have a car that's tax exempt & £80 a year fully comp.
Thanks again for your continued support.
b.p.m.
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Jensen Healey's GORGEOUS but the engine was mounted on its side to fit in the narrow nose and you need to dismantle half the car to change the oil filter. Built in West Bromwich ! My vx was new - my 40th birthday pressie. Squids present was her affair <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Yes I know where you're coming from. heres what i found were the stages of being a BS I have seen my own recovery, and that of many other BS follow predictable steps. The steps or stages may be similar but the timelines are very different. Also, once the full set has been run through, stages can be selected in seemigly random fashion.
1.- Devastation.
Fear, shock, confusion, existential pain. Loss of hopes, dreams and every assumption about God and man.
D-day and just afterwards. Don't want to go there again, ever.
2.- Appeasement.
OK, I've been dealt a [email]cr@p[/email] hand, but if she will at least stay home SOME of mt life support systems may at least function a bit.
3.- Indignation.
F'k that ! I'm stronger now and i WILL NOT suck up any more pain than I have to. Still scared, but not settling for crumbs.
This is where MB gets SERIOUSLY assimilated and applied. Turns hatred on OM as being to blame for affair.
4.- Gratitude.
The affair is ended, WW sends NC letter, exposure scares OM into darkness. THANK YOU GOD ! LA LA LA LA LA ! Still suspects FWS motivations for coming home, i.e comfort not love.
5.-"Advising others how to be wonderfully recovered like I am"
We have like SF 3 times a day, and a restored marriage is a decent possibility again and I am so PATHETICALLY grateful to not be in the deepest [email]cr@p[/email] imaginable I am hyper-happy. Yessiree, no recovery problems for me !This is it for ever and it only took us x months ! Secretly suspects FWS motivations for coming home, i.e comfort not love.
6.-"Ah, theres an elephant in the sitting room"
So day to day life has been OK for a while now. SF, even maybe some ILYs. Kids are happy. Life is ACTUALLY not happier than for years but it is so much better than during the dark times of the affair and withdrawal that it seems that way. But you start to notice the 'elephant' in the sitting room : the enormous baggage of the affair that the BS has been previously too 'fight or flight' or psychotically happy to address. Suspects FWS motivations for coming home, i.e comfort not love.
7.- "I am angry and I don't need you so whY am I here ?"
BS has operated in a loveless and hurt world for so long is now amost completely self sufficient. Is no longer even slightly desperate. Does not NEED FWW as whole life support mechnanism has HAD to regrow without her while she betrayed and sulked over the months. Feels indignation at both the insult of the affair AND the insult of FWW not contributing HARD to recovery. Feels like an ATM machine and bodyguard and hugely taken for granted. KNOWS FWS still loves OM.
8. - What about MY needs ?
BS has developed a sense of self worth independent of what others think. Has had to. Thinks he deserves MUCH more affection, admiration respect, gratitude. " I didn't put this amount of effort in just to be nagged at all the time, and never be praised. I deserve MORE than that!." The kids happiness at a stable family quells thoughts of rebellion. realises OM was just an amoral scumbag who made the most of an opportunity FWW offered him, 100% of the blame for the A is FWW. This hits hard.
9. - Resignation
The kids are happy, I am not unhappy, FWW is happy, this is just my lot in life. Better get on with it.
10.- make or break drive to get a M the BS deserves.
An effort from BS to challenge the peaceful but unsatisfying status quo in an attempt to get BS needs met. are we having fun yet ? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
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are we having fun yet ? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> It's a barrel of laughs _all_ the way <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />. Will be having fun soon - I've decided to buy the Jensen Healey (if it's any cop, & the weather doesn't get worse - in which case I'll get something amphibious). 1.- Devastation.Spent 4 weeks there. Also don't want to to go there again, ever (a feeling I also share about Slough after spending 4 weeks there). 2.- Appeasement.This feels familiar. Only spent a short while here thanks to some loving 2x4's from ML. 3.- Indignation.Oh yes. Still smarting from ML's 2x4 I laid down the law like the bada$$ muddyfunster I was. It's a bit of a 'leap & the net shall appear' moment. Never really blamed OM. At first blamed myself, I'd exhibited bad behaviours for a number of years after diagnosis with a chronic illness. Lots of "if only's". Slowly came round to the idea that I'm not responsible for her choice to have an affair. She could have talked, walked or asked for a divorce - I own that; but nothing can justify an A (not even if I was Genghis Khan's evil twin). 4.- Gratitude.Relief more than gratitude. 5.-"Advising others how to be wonderfully recovered like I am"6.-"Ah, theres an elephant in the sitting room"7.- "I am angry and I don't need you so whY am I here ?"Been through the going at it like bunnies stage. I recall it was enjoyable, esp. as my tenacious gym/yoga practice (plan A) had given me much improved love making abilities. Still doubting F?WW motives. Now SF has gone. It's a boundary for both of us: mine because of those (WS&OP) porno movies in my mind that start soon after we've finished, sometimes during - hers because it confuses her (she began to cry afterwards, don't know why). Why am I here ?? The kids, ultimately. My needs are being met at the moment, mostly by myself (& my [hopefully] soon to be acquired classic car). I can't really distinguish these phases. I feel all of them at the moment, to lesser & greater degrees. I was certainly at 6 at the start of this thread, sort of nearer 7 at the moment. 8. - What about MY needs ?9. - Resignation10.- make or break drive to get a M the BS deserves.ETA unknown. It's good to know what's in the programme. Cheers Bob.
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in which case I'll get something amphibiousWe live in a wood. I'm considering building a 'kin ARK ! Or I could just wait for work to float past me along with Bewdley and Sheffield. B_M your sang is very froid. You are doing BRILLIANTLY. I can only offer the advice of a clasic car enthusiast who lives near us when I was looking for a classic a few years ago : "Don't buy the best example you can afford; Buy the best THERE IS. Saves a lot of heartbreak". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Get down and get with it.
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I guess I am between stage 2 and 3...So, when will my WW and I go at it like bunnies again? Right now, that sounds really good...But know it will only be a mirage. And why does the "bunny" sex happen in recovery?
Romans 8:28-All things work together for good for those that love the Lord and are called according to His purpose.
BH (me) 30 yrs old (Currently in Middle East until August)
WW 32 yrs old
Married 7 yrs
2 beautiful daughters-3 and 4
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Hi GHA According to some of the wonderful FWWs who helped me out, it is in part guilt, in part reclaiming their spouse and in part the rekindling of desire for the BS. In any case Squid took advantage of me a whole lot for 5-6 months after NC held <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> My advances even in loving touch were rejected as sickening by Squid, my (then) WW. So I did a 180 degree shift. Withdrew all non platonic touch and speech. At the same time I invested in myself : got buff, bought new clothes & undies, always smelled good etc. Squid told me since it drove her crazy. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> She had to ravish me eventually, and that continued for several months. "plumbing trouble" reduced that but even now, 3 years out, she is far more appreciative of SF now than any time since our first year of marriage !
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That is some good insight...Thanks..
Romans 8:28-All things work together for good for those that love the Lord and are called according to His purpose.
BH (me) 30 yrs old (Currently in Middle East until August)
WW 32 yrs old
Married 7 yrs
2 beautiful daughters-3 and 4
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Sorry Piojitos, I don't understand your comment. Is there another poster signed GHA ? * clueless *
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B_M your sang is very froid. You are doing BRILLIANTLY. Thank you Bob. Don't look too closely though or you'll catch a glimpse of the freneticism beneath <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />. F?WW was telling me on Sunday that she posts on iVillage & reads the "Surviving Infidelity" pages so she could get a grasp on what I might be feeling. I was pleasantly surprised by this - I'd never entertained the idea that she might be trying to gain some understanding of my emotions; I always thought that if she wanted to know she'd ask me. I take this as a good sign. Had lunch with her yesterday. Bought some bedroom wardrobes as well. Sometimes I forget this A business ever happened (albeit only transient moments). Just now got a warm & affectionate kiss as she went off to work. Intersting times. Pio & GHA are having a conversation on GHA's thread - I think that is what pio is on about. GHA you need to get to #5 before the bunny action happens, or at least leave #2&3. You're posting on MB so you'll get the best advice to get to #5 (& beyond). It's fun, without a doubt, but I don't think it's was a mirage for me; the relationship with F?WW was different that's all (+ the nagging doubts about her motives). Good luck with your sit. b.p.m.
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p.s.
The Jensen Healey is a bit dear - he's asking Alfa Spider money for it. I'll have to see how much it's worth & barter him down to what I'm prepared to part with in these uncertain times. A Landy with a syphon is looking like a sound proposition at the mo.
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You're doing well, kiddo.
Stay frosty. Plan A. Police your personal boundaries.
Soon, the war will be over and teh peace will need rebuilding.
THATS where it gets snotty.
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THATS where it gets snotty. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> It gets worse <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />
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Dunno about worse, but certainly snottier.
Rebuiding a new peace can be harder than fighting a war. Ask Tony Blair.
You know your single objective in war. In peace its all more nebulous.
Maybe you're more diplmat than warrior. I dunno.
You'll cope. You have a good heart and a dignified spirit. You'll make it.
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