swade,

I'm still against the romantic dates. I agree with BigK. Your relationship with WW right now is like the First Law of Thermodynamics. This law, in simple terms, states the you can never get ahead - the best you can hope to do is break even. So your top priority is to avoid LB's.

Maybe romantic dats impressed KiwiJ but I can tell you they made my WW uncomfortable. But that is only half the equation.

You are the absolutely the most impatient person .... well... next to me. I can promise you that if you try to do romantic things for WW and she does not respond, you are going to get pissed off and guess what swade does when he is pissed off? That's right! LB!

I think you need to help your WW feel comfortable and safe while she works through withdrawal. Do fun things together with the kids. That will also help her reconnect with the family.

I hate to disagree with KiwiJ but...well... No. Come to think of it, I don't really hate to disagree with KiwiJ. What was I thinking?

I know Jen but it was different for you because you weren't in withdrawal

swade,

You aren't going to hit any home runs right now. You know when you are behind in a baseball game but your team is starting to score runs and catch up...do you know what they call a home run? A rally killer. What you need to do is just get men on base. Slow and steady wins this race.

OK I agree with Pio. Jen did appreciate it because she was not in withdrawal and Rob was able to make significant LB deposits. That is a huge difference to a situation where you bust up an affair when the affair is in full swing.

Totally different bucket of hamsters.

Pio, I explained that I was cold and distant but it still registered with me.

BigK, I'm still not sure if you're being funny or not. Not in withdrawal????? Are you kidding me?????? I was in the most horrific foggy nasty withdrawal which I'd hidden before d-day with alcohol and distance from my family. After d-day I didn't hide it any more. My withdrawal lasted a year. It nearly killed my H - all he wanted me to do was to get over the b****d and it took so long, TOO long.

Edited to take out the icky stuff.

swade,

Just stick to star gazing.

Told WW I wanted to take her to lunch after her Dr appt today.

It was cool, something different, and off the cuff!

Nothing romantic -- just an opportunity to reconnect.

WW seemed to enjoy it. We did have a good time relaxing at a greek restaurant sitting outside in beautiful So Cal weather.

Talked, laughed, it was just as fun as star gazing Pio!

My WW does not seem to have hit the "withdrawal wall" yet.

It has been 2 days of confirmed NC (unless WW has hidden cell phone or calling cards). I could find neither of these items.

Maybe the withdrawal kicks in later the more NC is in effect.

Meanwhile, I am just in plan A trying to be the best I can be and also meet her needs.

I keep telling myself at this point, "do not expect anything in return" -- this helps me mentally to control my emotions.

Three days of supposed NC.

I realize I am in plan A but my WW does not appear to be showing any visible signs of withdrawal.

I do think I have been doing a fairly good plan A and I feel naive to believe that it was taking effect this fast!

She seems pretty mellow and 'normal'.

I would have expected her to be withdrawn and basically 'zoning out' at times. I have checked her computer with no visible signs of broken NC.

I need to see what is going on when she goes to the gym alone.

Again, she says WW is on East Coast for the summer. I need to check those cell phone records. I also checked for calling cards and found none.

The last thing I need to check is to see if she is using a pay phone.

I am wondering if I am just paranoid, or perhaps she is waiting for things to calm down and then reusme activities.

I hope I am wrong on this!

My WW hid her withdrawal from me. I never saw any of it - not one bit - even to this day. She felt it was unfair to subject me to it. She believed she was protecting my feelings. Unfortunately I, like you, wanted to see some signs as feedback because everyone had told me to expect it. I too was paranoid.

Found out that WW did NOT remove cell phone password!

Regardless, I will see trhe contact made at end of month when bill arrives.

Should I bust her on this now or stay plan A until phone bill arrives?

If I see any calls to OM, I plan to suggest she leaves household until she decides she wants to commit to M.

Waiting to end of month also could allow me time to get logistics support worked out for daycare for DD5.

End of month will also be 2 months of plan A!

I have set up IC session with S Harley for WW next Thur and myself afterward at his request.

Man, this drains me mentally and $$$$$!

Would it be considered a major LB to hack into WW cell phone to remove passwordinstead of confronting her straight up to hold her accountable?

After all I will eventually see all calls made at month's end. If get into phone, I will see calls made now!

Honesty goes both ways.

Hacking at this point would be a mistake. Ask her to remove the password. If she refuses, ask her why she need to hide anything.

Hi there,
you don’t have to wait for the cell phone records to arrive.
You can go online and set up an acct, depending on witch cell phone carrier she has and check any call and txt msgs everyday.

It gets posted within hrs of the call. Just go to the phone carriers web page, click “ my account” and follow instructions on how to set it up.

It will tell you also if she has already done so, in witch case you just need to get the password from her, and if she has nothing to hide shell give it to you. Good luck. And GOD BLESS

I can hear her WS answer -- "I do not appreciate being treated like a child"!

My come back -- In 13 yrs of M, you never ever had to password protect anything from me until this point in time!

People with nothing to hide do not password protect their cell phone.

Besides, you told me 2 nights ago you removed the password - WW lied!

You are not treating her like a child. You are treating her like some who has betrayed you and has continued to lie about contact wtih OM. She promised you NC. You have a right to verify that. Has she read SAA BTW?

You know, it might be almost time to see if you can get her to start posting here. You might want to do a little house cleaning first. But I do think maybe she could stand to hear from some FWW's.

But seriously, the password simply has to go. Unfortunately neither one of you will be allowed them for the rest of your married lives. If she won't remove the passowrd, ask her what she feels she needs to hide.

Aren't you in phone counseling with the Harley's?

Pio -- We both have individual sessions next week with Steve!

I had an initial counseling with Steve and he asked that my WW has an IC session with him followed immediately with one for me!

So next week we will both have IC sessions with Steve.

Two bad we could not have a "2-for-1 special" -- those $$$ add up! I pray a breakthrough is made next week!

I will suggest to WW to start reading the entire SAA today to put into perspective what we both are experiencing!

I feel like telling WW to 'move out' if she will not agree to any BCs.

Then again, I want S Harley to speak with her next Thur to see if he can make any sense with her!

I will ask WW what she feels she needs to hide -- then again, why should I expect a 'logical' answer -- she will simply spit some A justifiable verbage to me.

I want to tell her without LB'ing that I feel like I am really trying to be honest and understand what she is experiencing, yet she continues to be on the defensive or avoid talking about the A altogether!

My WW does not appear to trust me (I am the enemy to her A), but even more sadly, she is deceiving herself!

With my rambling this morning -- you may tell that I am just venting over this matter!

This plan A is really something!

I guess I need to get that voice recorder placed in her car -- then I don't need to worry about her password!

Bu then again, surrendering her password is at least a gestur to understand that my WW wants to work on our M instead of 'pretending' to want to work on it!

Well since you both have IC next week, I would avoid upsetting the apple cart too much. Do ask her to read SAA. That's a start. Yes you are her enemy #1. That's because you have destroyed the thing that made her happy. I've been there. She can get over it.