What do you mean by that? Am I a bad person for what I say or think about it?

What more is there to explain?

This was not a slam to your character. Pariah is simply pointing out that since you have not been in this situation, you can't possibly understand what it means to go through it. That doesn't make you bad or good, just not qualified to give advise to those who have. Consider yourself fortunate.

PG
i dont think you realize the pain and agony that affair causes. my wh and his OW are now living together. are they happy? no. 2 families were destroyed because of this. ow is married and has 4 kids. wh and i have a 16 year old daughter together and then he has a 17 year old daughter as well( my step daughter) when i found out about the affair it felt like my heart was torn out and stomp on. that the vows we said before God was just words. our daughter cant stand him ( she was a daddy's girl) she is hurt and heartbroken over this. not only that but income for the household is stressful too. you go from 2 to 1 with the same amount of bills. you try to keep your spirits up for your kids. i am an adult i can handle it but when your child hurts that puts in a new ball game.
yes wh was part to blame. OW is the one who contacted him( she told me this) i am sorry i hate this woman. i cant stand to see her drive down the street. i do feel sorry for her kids because they are innocent same as ours. but to me when she contacted my wh even when she found out he was married she did have any regards for her husband, her kids or mine. to me she was thinking of herself.
and yes no marriage is perfect you are going to go thru your ups and downs. and me and wh have discussed recovery. it is being discuss. he is my husband that was a vow i made to him!!! not ow. i know i should not have hatred either. but i do not wish her the best. and forgiveness is far far far far far down my road. that is if i dont run over her first!!!!

bsj220

PG,
Can I ask you some Q's without offending you?
It has occured to me and many others here, that we question why you are here on this forum.
You have stated that you have not even had a relationship with another person, so why then, are you here posting on a Marriage building website, shere many of us are hurting from the blinding pain of infedelity?

Do you think you are some kind of gaurdian angel for those of us who suffer? I truly don't understand your presense here?

Have you thought about opening a free "my space" account on Yahoo or something along those lines?

You seem like a very lost soul in being on a forum where you do not belong.

Is there something else we can help you with?

All Blessings,
Jerry

To answer your questions:

I know what you & everyone else is thinking of why I'm here on this forum. All I want to do is to help out others on this forum to overcome their obstacles on what is happening throughout their troubled marriages, & to help overcome their anger towards other people who have hurt them by not having them being judgmental on them by thinking things positive, not negative; even though many people don't feel this way (This is what I've been taught. Same goes for the OM/OW in relationships as well). But knowing that one person said that I'm not able to give out advice to anyone because I've never been in a real relationship before, I'm not sure what to do now. I do use MySpace, & I'm also trying to make more friends, whenever possible. I don't want anyone to think that I'm a bad guy; I'm always trying to be helpful towards people, good or bad. We're all human beings, & no one is perfect, not even myself. I feel that God has created this planet for peace, not for destruction. That's why I try not to judge anyone, as there is no purpose for that.

Guess what.


You make it worse.

PG, you are obviously young and admittedly have never been through this h***** yourself. While we appreciate your thoughts and efforts, you simply don't have the experience to be giving us advise. All of us were once naive like you. I had no idea how much this could possibly hurt - or that anything in life could hurt this much until it happened to me. Like you, I could look at other couples who had been through it and wonder why it had to be so bitter and hateful, or even wonder how it is so many marriages fall apart. Now I know - but I still can't offer much in the way of advise to people and when I do, it's just little tidbits - this was how I handled this particular event and it either worked so try it or it was disasterous so whatever you do don't do it. Broad statements like - you shouldn't hate the OP because it's not God's way - well, sorry it not only doesn't cut it, it's downright insulting.

Again, I truly appreciate that you want to help. If you really want to help, lend someone an ear or a shoulder to cry on. But don't give advise about something which you know nothing. Especially advise that bears the implication that we, the BS's, are somehow responsible for our pain because we won't forgive or let go our hatred of the OP. That hatred is our to cherish and is an important part of the healing process.

How about this PG, I think you are a voyure and are fulfilling some sick need of watching others in pain, all in the name of "god".

Just like all good church going "christians" do with their gossipy destructive ways to make themselves feel superior through being sanctimonious.

I think PG has a point underneath his inexperience. Pariah, you said “That hatred is ours to cherish and is an important part of the healing process.” Is “cherishing” part of the healing process? I would agree that the initial anger, disgust and loathing have a place in the healing process. But, I doubt that “cherishing” a hatred is ever healthy. Cherishing implies actively caring for, holding onto, even feeding the hatred. How is that constructive? How would it be healthy for one to put energy into hating someone when that person becomes an integral part of one’s children’s lives?

Now, before I’m misunderstood, I’m not suggesting anyone needs to forgive the OP and the WS. The break up of a marriage, for whatever reason, is a life-altering event. It changes how we see relationships and the world. Infidelity is like getting stabbed in chest. (As opposed to my marriage’s demise which was much more like cancer—not as painful upfront, but just as deadly) I’m just saying that letting go of hatred is not bad. Recognizing that the OP is not Satan incarnate is not the end of the world. My mother even expressed sympathy for my dad’s wife (OP)—of course, it’s been 20 years, but still, my dad married his secretary for heaven’s sake! What a cliché.

And, Pariah, I attend a church which is not at all santimonious. Not all churches are like yours. (That said, because my church tends to avoid casting the first stone, WSs and OPs are given a chance at redemption.)

Ummmm, no I didn't.

And he has ZERO point.


Good for your church.

Doesn't help the fact mine abandoned me and is helping my wife justify her fornication.

In fact your bragging about your church makes me even more bitter.

GG, I'm afraid I was the one who said my hatred is mine to cherish and perhaps you feel it is a poor choice of wording but I do believe it describes how I feel. I do view the OW as Satan incarnate and blame her for everything under the sun. I could probably rationalize how she is responsible for the war in Iraq. Why would I "cherish" this? Because my hatred of her gives me focus and that focus allows me to continue basic functions so my entire life doesn't fall apart. It allows me to do at least what is necessary at my job so I don't get fired. It allows me to hold back my tears when I talk to my DS so he doesn't feel like he's in the middle. It allows me to do those things around the house that I have never done and have difficulty with - I actually killed a spider myself this weekend and couldn't have done it if I didn't visualize her face on it.

I'm sure someday this will fade and maybe I will feel sympathy for her. In a weird way, I already do. She's stuck with that lyin' cheatin' piece of crap after all (not that she deserves any better). She has also ensured that her daughter will hate her when she's older. In fact, her future looks rather grim.

But right now, she is the epicenter of all evil in the world to me. I use her name as a swear word. WH continues to throw her in my face and probably won't be happy until I move across the country and change my name or get run over by a bus - whichever comes first. She has no redeaming qualities whatsoever and if god loves her - fine, I do not.

As for church(s), I don't regularly attend and I'm rather on the outs with religion right now. While I can appreciate that forgiveness is divine, I couldn't cope with a group of people who would give an OP a chance at redemption - especially one that is still actively engaging in infidelity with no intention to stop (other than when the divorce goes through and it is not longer officially infidelity), and one that makes and takes every opportunity to crush the BS even further into the ground. So though I didn't write that comment, I feel about the same.

Excuse me? How dare you think that I'm that kind of person who is fulfilling to watch people suffer? I am NOT that kind of person, & you have no right whatsoever to think of me that way! I'm not a voyure, & I never gossip about anyone to make myself feel good, nor do I feel superior about anything. Did I ever say that I feel superior? No, I did not! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> And what do you mean that I have zero point through my inexperience? For your info, there are some people like myself who feel this way that this world doens't have to live in hatred.

Pariah, I was not bragging. I just dislike judged based on what another group of people did.

Sorry, I misattributed the quote.

Tabby, you're really new to the whole pain of infidelity stuff. For you, I'm sure it really can be a way of getting through it. Naturally, even my amazing mother couldn't say anything good about OP in the beginning, so she just bit her tongue. It probably also helped that this particular OP, it turned out, wasn't the only OP. Still it was 25 years down the drain and Mother thought she'd lose everything and be on the street.

About the redemption... I think everyone gets a shot at it, but I'm not sure how my tiny church would react to a WS or an OP who were still involved in infidelity. I was thinking more of after the divorce. Still, I don't think we'd shun them even if they were still involved in the affair. I don't think we'd consider it our place to turn someone away from God's house. Though it would be tempting at times.

Oh, and Tabby, you might find it reassuring to know that even though we kids get along with Dad's wife, we had zero sympathy when she hit some bad times. I think we all thought "As ye sow, so shall ye reap." In other words, we still haven't forgotten her role in our family splitting up.

I understand what you're telling me. If I were to have a bad relationship of what happened, I would definitely post it here in the future (I have said it time & time again that I would be angry if someone else were to interfere in my relationship & try to take her away from me). Perhaps I was being too nice to people & can't get out of my rose colored glasses to see this board is being hurt & damaged. I'm sorry if I come off as insulting by saying those things. I will do my best to comfort those who are suffering in relationships & I'll turn towards people who are understanding & caring.

Thanks for your help on this.

First of all YOU have zero business here.

Second, your "advice" is irrelevant.

Third, I can think of you any way I choose. You aren't my superior.

Fourth, just what do you think you will do about it?


Suuuuuurrrrre. Whatever you say.


Your actions show otherwise.



Exactly that. Learn to comprehend.


Then go find the other hippies.

They aren't here.

Until you experience this tragedy, stay out as your advice is meaningless.

Boy, you're in for a ruuuuuude awakening when your spouse betrays and humiliates you, if you ever find one.

You say that you can think of me in anyway that you choose? How infuriating! Do you think that you have a right to judge people like me or anyone else? I never said that I was your superior, nor anyone else. Have I ever, in my entire life, been a voyure or gossip about anyone to make myself feel good, or to make anyone feel bad? No! Unless you have anything nice to say to me, I would suggest that you stop & not say anything at all. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Oh no, some internet expert on non-hatred is going to beat me up.

hypocrite.

Your assumptions on what you THINK we may feel is down right insulting not to mention your new found word, infuriating.

Pariah, I think you are feeding a troll.

I've gotta whole box of TrollSnax.

It feels kinda goot to bat a troll around a bit.

You know, to take your frustrations out on.