Pepperband - Thank you! This looks like a great book. I guess I didn't explain my question very well... now that I reread it, it just sounds dumb. But I think you understood what I was trying to ask, and your answer helped. Tahnk you again.

How long have you had a long distant relationship? How well do you really know each other? Why has nothing been done so you can live closer? I understand you're in college...what's he doing?

My marriage started off as a long distant relationship. I wouldn't recommend any marriage starting off that way. You guys need to be living in the same city. Long distance relationships are so difficult.

Tell us more about your relationship. You remind me of me...and I'm interested to see if there are any more similarities.

ANN,

We started dating at the end of my senior year of high school. I graduated from HS in 2001, and attended the local Community College for a year and a half.

In January of '03, I moved 45 minutes away from home to attend a 4-year college, but was able to come home every weekend and on breaks.

In January of '05, I went to a study abroad program in Mexico for four months. When I came back, I moved back in with my parents. He works day shift (an auto mechanic), but I would up working evenings for a year while I was home in addition to taking on-line MBA classes. Even though we spent a few hours every day together we were both really busy.

In September of '06, I was accepted to my dream school - he was very supportive of my desire to finish my Master's, so I moved to Boston. (He and I are originally from Michigan).

So I've been out here for about 10 months - I've been home 5 times, he's been out here 3 times, usually just for a weekend. I call him a lot, but he really dislikes talking on the phone. I have tried writing letters, but he has a hard time reading my handwriting. We've tried webcams and IMs, but he still has (very slow) dial-up, so that is frustrating as well. Even though I know that it isn't 'really' me, I always have the feeling that he doesn't want to talk to me. But in person, this isn't an issue.

He lives with his family - for a while his mom and dad were having financial issues, so he was helping them. Yesterday, his sister left her abusive boyfriend and moved back home with her 1 year old daughter. He wants to move out here, because the economy is so much better, but feels responsible for his family as well.

I don't know if I should be thrilled or terrified. My SO (i figure that's the best term to use) and I managed to have a serious, no yelling, no crying conversation about the A two nights ago. That's a first for us. But is that a good thing, or does it mean that he doesn't care anymore?

He is incredibly hurt by the fact that when he first found out about the A, he asked me "why." I tried to answer honestly, but the only thing I could pinpoint was that I had felt unhappy in our relationship. That made it sound like I was trying to blame him - I know now that the solution to my unhappiness would have been to talk to him about it, not go running off to a 'friend,' and I told him this during our serious conversation, but I know the damage has been done. I can't fix the past - how do I help him to heal? Would he be better off without me? (I know that someone - or everyone - will answer yes to that one. No matter how sorry I am, he would be better off in a new relationship. The noble thing to do would be to 'let him go' and stop trying to 'prove myself' to him. I've heard it from others. Please don't say it...)

I discovered the other day that he had set up our phone bill to track OM's number, to make sure that the A was over. He's been tracking for 3 months. Is it twisted to take this as a positive sign? I mean, if he didn't care a tiny bit, he wouldn't be tracking it, right? I have nothing to hide anymore, and I want him to know that.

This was getting long, so I broke it up.

I have been confessing my actions to various people I'm close to (he didn't reveal the A, part of his requirement to even consider reconciliation was that I do it). I've told my parents and my only two close friends (by that I mean, the only people I talk to outside of class/work). A few days ago, I told his sister (who I have know longer than I've been dating SO, and have always been very close to) what I had done. Obviously she was very upset with me...but then told me that he didn't have any right to be mad at me, because he had admitted to her BF that he had cheated on me! ('just sex, didn't mean anything')

I don't know if I can believe that, though. SO told me that she had come on to him, and that he threw her out (they had been friends). He swore that nothing had happened. Sister's BF hates SO, so could have been lying. Then again, when the supposed OW heard that SO and I were having problems she did send hims pics (nude). Then again, I know that because he told me and showed them to me.

Before you ask, no, I'm not looking for 'extenuating circumstances' for my A. No matter what he did/did not do, I was still wrong. Normally, I would just ask him and he would tell me. But not only do I have no proof (sister will lie if I bring her into it. She said so.), I don't want to sound like I'm trying to make my actions his fault.

Maybe it doesn't matter. Maybe I don't need to know.

He's also registered on MySpace as single. But I f'ed this up, so I don't have any right to be upset or jealous. I'm the one who screwed up. So why does it bother me?

In addition, I'm flying home tomorrow to see him. He's picking me up at the airport. We're going to the amusement park on Sunday. And I'm scared ****less. I'm sure I deserve to be - 8 months ago, I would have been thinking "serves her right" and smiling self-righteously to myself.

Galia,

""He's also registered on MySpace as single.''

Very large, terrible, telling red flag!! Did he tell you this to twist the blade a little, or did you discover it on your own?

To register as a single??? Come on, snap out of it!! You have a right to set a boundary here or there.

The boy is fading away from you.

IMHO

kirk

Krusht,

I didn't actually expect anyone to respond. Thank you very much for doing so.

I discovered it on my own. I'm still at the top of his friends list, but his details now say that he's single. It scares me, but I was concerned that I might be overreacting. I asked him about it, but I think I might have tried too hard to be subtle (I said I had noticed, and didn't he get more porn invites that way? The answer I got was that it doesn't matter, he was getting them anyway.)

I've never had to set boundaries before - I can count on one hand the number of times I've ever stood up for myself or fought back. Pathetic, I know. Any suggestions on how to let him know how much this bothers me, without sounding like I'm trying to control him?

Galia,

"" I know. Any suggestions on how to let him know how much this bothers me, without sounding like I'm trying to control him?""

Simply say, "BF it really bothers the [email]H@ll[/email] out of me that you have re-classified yourself as SINGLE on your My-Space site!! Why in the world did you do this??"

You should probably be screaming this in a loud, fairly high-pitched voice, with a little spittle flying from your mouth. Your face should be very red, the veins in your neck should be standing out and your fists should be tightly clenched.

This does not sound like you are trying to control him.

""I can count on one hand the number of times I've ever stood up for myself or fought back.""

Ya know, I (we) kinda figured this out from your previous posts. You are a good natured, easy goin' midwestern "gal".<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

But you are "growed" up now and will soon be making your own way in this cruel world we live in. I suggest you start believing you are worth it and start STANDING UP for yourself. YOU have to start looking out for YOURSELF.

IMHO

kirk

Kirk,

I've gotten that same advice from 3 or 4 people in the last week. Looks like I need to quit hiding and do something about it, eh?

I went home this past weekend, for my birthday, and spent the entire time with him. It was actually really nice, a lot of fun.

The only point at which the A came up was Saturday night. I had a few drinks, and started apologizing for everything I did, for having hurt him, for the lies. Often when we fight he tells me that he doesn't feel like I regret what I did, only that I got caught. I guess that I wanted to tell him in person in the hopes that he would be able to see that I really do mean it. Of course, I started crying. he held me, told me to calm down, and then told me that until I can get past this and stop being emotional about it I will be unable to make amends to him.

While I suppose this does make sense (it's hard to be rational when you are upset), I'm afraid that if I try to move past it he will feel that I am dismissing my actions or that I don't really regret and feel guilty for them. I asked him about this (look at me being brave! Just forget about the drinks for a second...) and he said that he honestly doesn't know if that is how he would feel. He won't know until it happens.

I'm sure that's an honest answer, but now I'm nearly paralyzed with fear. I want to help him through this, but if neither of us knows what will help, how do I do it?

Galia,

""and then told me that until I can get past this and stop being emotional about it I will be unable to make amends to him.""

Well, I don't really know what to think about this. Unless HE had way too many drinks too.

I guess you don't bring it up again, unless he does. My FWW never brings it up, but I know she feels the pain of the her actions every day. She has said so.

So he is past it??? And he is telling you to get past it?? The roles seem reversed here.

This can only lead me to believe that the damage done was minimal in his eyes.

So treat it as such, forget about it, get past it and don't bring it up again.

This is where most WSs would love to be. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

When you were back there, was his BF/your OM close by?

kirk

Actually, he hadn't had anything to drink. I had had just enough to get emotional.

His BF lives about 20 minutes from there, and on Sunday my SO was driving and someone left a message on his phone. He handed the phone to me to check (a first. kinda nice gesture) and it was a random message from OM for him.

Honestly, I was disgusted - I don't want anything to do with that man. I told my SO what the message said, and couldn't give the phone back to him fast enough. Oddly, he seemed to think that my reaction was pretty funny. I dunno...

I would love for him to be past it - he and OM seem to be buddies again, hang out all the time...but from time to time SO still tells me that he doesn't know if he'll ever be able to trust me again, and he refuses to tell me he loves me (well, he had been telling me, then there was that whole phone thing at the beginning of the thread, and now he won't tell me again.) I just don't get it.

I know that a lot of people on here are in worse situations that I am. Krusht, I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to me.

I would stop posting and just lurk, so as not to waste everyone's time, but I need somewhere to put my thoughts. I hope no one minds.

I am incredibly paranoid this week. SO and I had a great weekend, spent a lot of time together, got along really well. Then Tuesday night I tried to call him - no answer. My phone broke right after that, so I used a friend's phone to leave him a message. Told him to call me back at that number. No call.

Wednesday I got my phone fixed, called him. He didn't get my messages, and fell asleep early Tue. Ok, I can accept that. He didn't notice that he hadn't spoken to me that night (I always call) or Wed morning (I always call). It's possible. I wasn't too worried.

Call him Wed night...his phone is off. For 4 hours. Gave up at 1 am. Maybe he's asleep, or the phone died. Who knows.

Call him this morning, he answers (yay!) Ask in a friendly manner what he was doing last night. Did he go out? Did he have fun? Etc. Answer? Didn't do anything last night.

Paranoia - what is he up to? So I check his email today (I helped him set it up, I know the password) - he is signed up on not one, not two, but FOUR singles sites. And has been since before D-Day. I'm so stressed I'm physically sick.

I'm sure that if I bring it up, he will not only be angry that I checked his messages, he will also tell me that it's none of my business because I cheated on him. And I kinda feel that it's none of my business for the same reason.

But this is the man who 10 weeks ago was telling all of his friends how excited he was to be getting married, two weeks ago was choosing groomsmen gifts online, and 6 days ago was asking me about wedding photographers. Does he really want out? Is it just an ego boost? Should I even bother?

I love him, I know that I want to make this relationship great...but I don't even know if he wants to work on it.

Or perhaps I am blowing things out of proportion. I have been known to do that from time to time.

I think it's over. I think he cannot or will not forgive me. The only way he is willing to consider working on this is if I move home, and give up everything I've worked for out here. I'm okay with that. I'll be moving home in 6 weeks, after I finish my classes.

But I have lost hope.

How much longer do you have before you get your Masters?

6 weeks. I did the program in a year. I graduate on August 10th.

For anyone who cares:

The most recent blowup happened the night before last. I had spent all day hanging out with my female best friend. Around 11m we decided to walk down to 7-11 for slushies. As we were leaving, she got a call from a male friend of hers. She invited him to go with us, as he lives less than a block away.

He did, the three of us got slushies, and while we were walking back, I called my SO. Even though I told him what had happened, he believes that I am sleeping with the other guy. He yelled, I cried, and he hung up. My female friend stayed with me that night and took care of me.

I called SO yesterday, and we talked for 3 hours. He told me that he isn't the forgiving type, he has never forgiven anyone for hurting him. However, he also said that he misses how we used to be. he doesn't like who I've become since I've moved out here - I don't like it either - I am naturally a sociable and outgoing person, but I have been isolating myself in the hopes that it will give him less to worry about. He says that it has actually made things worse.

Officially, we are no longer engaged or even dating. He broke it off Saturday night. I am unable/unwilling to accept this. I just want to rebuild our relationship. I want him to be happy, and I selfishly believe that he would be happy with me. maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I should let go and take the pain as my punishment. But I feel like that's the easy way out.

I desperately miss going to church. I haven't been in more than 6 years, and now it's all I can think about. I need to find one out here.

Congratulations on doing your Masters. Good job.

Was the plan for him to move to your city? I don't understand what you mean by you have to give up everything you have worked for.

Yes, the original plan was for him to move out here in September. I've been interviewing for jobs, looking at apartments - up until three days ago, this was still the plan.

I am majoring in publishing, so Boston would really be the best place for me to find a job. he currently lives in Michigan, where the economy has really gone down the tubes. He would make at least half-again as much if he moved out here, and I would make nearly twice as much.

However, as of our discussion yesterday he has decided that he does not like who I am here, and if he moves out here we will have no chance. He wants me to move back to Michigan. he was even looking at places hiring in the area for me, however they were all retail type jobs - not what I have been in school for so long for.

He would rather that I moved home right now, and didn't finish the last six weeks of my degree. I'm afraid that if I stay out here, he will take it as me not caring enough, not wanting to make it work.

My parents said that if I want to move home for a month or two to figure things out, I can move back in with them. At the moment, that sounds like the best choice.

Poor Michigan. I've heard lots about how bad the job and housing market is there. However you might be able to buy a nice home, since the market is down. That is, if you got a job.

You absolutely MUST finish your degree. Don't even think about giving that up.

I always think that if people are meant to be together they will BE together. I'm sure this can be worked out if you both discuss things and look at all of the options, and not give ultimatums.

Have you read the Policy of Joint Agreement stuff here?

I had read it when I first came on here, but not recently. I'll go back and reread it now. Any suggestions on how this would work if he doesn't want to POJA?