I can't seem to link my previous threads but they are
My Story - Started 12/06
Help W is Planning something 2/07?

Anyways - I contributed greatly to the distress in our R/M and W started talking with a coworker in Oct 06 and after our last argument we have been at a stale mate.

I tried MB principles, spoke with the Harleys on air, Saw an IC which turned into a fiasco, exposed to family my findings, enlisted the help of a pastor all to no avail.

In fact it seemed that everything I did made it worse, I messed up in Jan with major LB's and for the next few months basically coexisted.

In March she retained an atty for a LS but after several days she came to me and asked what would I say if she said she thought she made a mistake, I was beginning to believe we were done and ready to move on, I trusted her that night and it seemed like a peek out of the fog, I still kept an appt I had with an atty the next day but only for a consultation - Atty said I did not have to answer anything unless I was served with D papers.

I thought we had a good talk the night before and that we had a basis to start working on things but as unexpected as the night before was - After 24 hrs she was asking for a LS again.

Back and forth we went, I found what she had written and told her I would not give in to those things, I didn't want a LS or D. After another month or so and many more talks and LB's on both sides, I decided things weren't getting any better so I started looking for an apt.

I went to her in early May and said I found an apt, She was to have had the LS rewritten to favor both of us and said that the reason she wanted the LS was to do as the Pastor suggested and start dating again.

A week or so went by, The new LS was given to me and it was worse than the first which opened up more discussions and she said it was not what she asked for and she gave him the changes that we discussed but he put things in that she didn't ask for.

I had held hope that she was serious about dating, I even said if I don't call you would you call me - Her reply was Yes. She also said that she wanted things to work and I said I did also - We both agreed that since we both wanted it to work then there was no reason it shouldn't.

Against advice from some here who have been following my sitch - I moved out on June 7th and 8th, Things had become strained again - She had her car inspected and asked about a GPS that was found - Even though I thought about it and others suggested it I never put one on her car, She never showed me the device so I think it was just BS - I mentioned that I had priced and thought about them but did not do it.

A week after that she was getting colder and icier as she has been most of the time and it was a bout a week before I was leaving when she said she was getting calls on her cell from a woman chastising her for "forcing" me out - At this time I said about the calls and the GPS - "Why would I do something to push her further away" I would not have asked nor would anyone I know do that. In fact any females that I would have contact with actually think I would be better if we did D.

As I said against the advice of people here, I did move although haven't changed my legal address, didn't take my name off utilities etc. - I am paying the agreed upon amount and have signed receipts stating we both agreed to.

2 weeks before I also took our children out for clothes and shoes and spent almost 500.00.

First weekend in my apt and she was dropping our kids off and she was standing at the door when I said we didn't even say good bye - She said it sounded too final.

Several days later I asked about a "date" she said it was too soon, No phone calls from her unless I initiate, even then it is only about when I will pick up or drop off kids.

My S10 has been a wreck through all of this, W in May said to the kids that it was temporary and at that time both kids said well if it helps then they were ok with it.
Since then my S confided to me that he was not ok with it and my D12 does not want to talk about anything associated with concerns to our "family"

W seems so cold and uncaring, We both get caught up in things which probably doesn't help but I felt I did what she asked and haven't "punished" her.

I have been on again off again on this site and I updated things the other day - My curiousity got to me and went to the house when no one was home and found some things that suggest she may going for a D, A few notes scribbled

Contact atty, Dave is out of the house, going on vacation, change locks,sell house. I wanted to confront her but decided against it - Instead when I was dropping off the kids we spoke in the driveway and asked if she wanted to get together before they went on vacation to visit family.

She said Yes but didn't seem like she really wanted to.

My questions are - What should I do now? Wait to see if she files and stay living in apt (month to month lease)? Do I move back home? Although that didn;t seem to be helping.

File for D? I guess I never really Plan Aed very well because I still felt I knew things would help but only made things worse and she really does not seem open to any Plan A right now.
Plan B going dark other than the kids and hope that after some time that we could move forward.

As I said I brought a lot of garbage to our M but know what I now have to do to be the best husband and father I can and want to be.

When we talk about things she says she doesn't want to keep dwelling on the past and I don't think she means the things I have taken blame for - She hates being reminded of what she has said or whatever since all of this has taken root.

Sorry for the length but I am even more confused than ever.

One other thing I should have added as to why I left was because I was feeling if I stayed my love was starting to fade because of all the back and forth.



Her lies and blame placing, Although as I said I focused much of everything on things I brought to our R/M.

She still denies it was anything but friendship and blames me for putting her in a bad light with family and church.

If you are able to go back home to work on your marriage, go back home.

Thanks Mimi, My original plan was to let everything set in for my W with me out of the house although I believed her dating spiel.
I was trying to lay low thinking that she would come around and with her impending trip coming up I was trying to wait it out but I can't deal with the lonliness and sense of loss.

That being said, In order to move back I would have to give a months notice, Which coincides with our anniversary Aug 7th or forefeit my security deposit.

If we ended up working things out the security deposit would be worth it but if she has filed or is going to file then she is stubborn enough to see it through I will have cost myself money.

Her mother mentioned to me when she was more of an ally that my W has a stubborn streak which I knew of but not at the cost of our family.

As I said I did leave for 2 reasons 1) she said to me as well as our children that it was a way for us to heal, Ifelt if she told our children that then she couldn't be lying.

2) As time went on her attitude and holier than thou (which I at times reinforced) attitude was driving me to a point where at times I really disliked her so to save any feelings I had I gave in.

I guess the uncertainty of her thoughts and or plans and the lying I had overlooked until her "friendship" has me feeling so off balance.

I was trying to distance myself from any R/M talk although as I mentioned earlier I found a note pad with some scribblings and I didn't say I found it but when I had my kids last Thurs. my son asked "Dad why do you have to take pictures for insurance Mom was taking pics of all the rooms"

When I dropped the kids off I asked her what she was planning - She replied nothing taking pics to show my grandmother in Texas what "I" did with the house.

I corrected her and said what we did with the house, Things didn't go well and we still haven't been out on a "date" and communication is terrible, I called her work phone after I left Thiurs. night and apologized for my part of our conversation.

Sunday she was picking up the kids and I said have a safe trip and please let me know that everyone makes it safe. She said she would.

Yesterday, I went to check my mail and found that she changed the lock on one of the doors but not 2 others.
We are not even legally separated, I moved out to give us a chance and my name is still on everything.

My son called to say they made it to the hotel @ 6:30pm, My phone rang again @ 7:45 from my W's cell phone and my daughter was on the other end and she was asking her mother what did you want me to say?

Finally my W got on and said that the place where she dropped our dog off (a married co worker)called to say that the dog was being aggressive and could I go get her and keep her until she got back.

I can't have a dog in my apt, Said that if she made arrangements I would pick her up and drop her @ a kennel.

I really think she is going through with filing for a D although I don't want to burn my bridges - Should I suck up my pride and do this, Do I let her lay in the bed she made?

She couldn't even have the decency to call me herself, Had my daughter do it. I hate hanging on to hope when I feel the walls closing in but I also don't want to mess things up but feel so used.

Getting her to move out was her first step to divorce you. If you don't want a D or you don't want to lose your house or risk losing custody of your children, I would suggest moving back in.

I do see your point and wish I could follow that advice but I feel if I did that then it would only add to everything.

Sometimes I wonder if I am really "in love" with her anymore or is it more because she doesn't want me?

I keep reading others threads and the limbo is almost as bad as Dday for me, Can't someone whom you have children with finally be honest with themselves and the father of her children to say Yes I am going for the D.

I also wonder if she is just trying to push me over the edge to totally get fed up and file myself, I don't know what the kids really want my D has been pushing buttons with me and my S always says how much he misses me and us as a family.

I don't know what her parents know or don't concerning where W is or if now they are encouraging her to move forward but deep down I can't beleive that.

Somedays I really love, care and miss her but then when I think of all that she has done in the last 8 or 9 months and can't help but feel she is exacting her revenge for my poor behavior and choices.

I let myself be cut out of the "family" but got caught up in losing everything that was at this time last year. Even though there were difficulties the last few years we were still saying I love you, SF, laughter and other things.

How can someone let go like she did and how and where did I go so wrong trying to reach her.

She still hasn't called about the dog, So now I am left wondering and I don't want to call her to see what she came up with and in my heart I guess I would pick up the dog and do what I have to but it feels like I am being used and thinking by doing a good deed for her I will still be the odd man out at the end of the day.

I hate feeling sorry for myself, If any WW's read this could you give some insight.

dg63 - If I can get brutally agressive here for a minute, you are as bad with using your "feelings" as your wife seems to be.

Here's the bottom line to you, "Mr. Conflict Avoider." Move back home (it IS your house and your marriage too) right now, not next week, OR file for divorce right now and spare yourself the dragged out drama of what your wife is planning "when she has all of her ducks lined up in a row."

If you want real help, you better start realizing that those who have "been through this" might have an inkling or two about what you need to do IF you really want to save your marriage. You, if you'll pardon me, are NOT qualified to make these decisions all on your own. You CAN choose to "go it your way," but just like a person in serious trouble with the law who tries to represent himself, you will have a "fool for a client."

So, DO you want to save your marriage or don't you.?

Yep! You had better get an attorney, get back in your home, plan A, lay the consequences of her actions at her feet and so on or you not only are going to lose your marriage, but your children except for every other weekend, your money, your home, your self respect.

Well, I am good at avoiding things and now I know where everything is at.

I had the day off after the 4th, STXW and kids are in Texas and about 1/2hr ago I found out.

Saw a car pull up out front of my apt and rang my bell,knocked on the door and came to my back door I couldn't bring myself to answer.

When he was going to get back in his car I saw the manila envelope and as much as I was crushed knowing she was moving forward, I still am in shock and I let myself get sucked up into believing lies. And how could she even call me to ask me earlier in the week to pick up the dog when she knew this was coming and planned it the way she has.

I am such an idiot and feeling so empty and alone, I know its feeling sorry for myself but I can't help it.

GET BACK IN THE HOUSE BEFORE YOU CAN'T GET BACK IN IT ANYMORE AND YOU LOSE CUSTODY OF YOUR CHILDREN!!!!!!!!

With all that has happened and believing her when she said she wanted to date and me falling for it and moving out pretty much have already done me in.

I mean signing for an apt, moving out and providing CS, I didn't legally change my address nor did I take most of the utilities out of my name either.

If I moved back in I know it would be more contentious than it ever was and the things she will probably have are more concrete than the proof I have of her A.

She must be willing to sacrifice kids comfort because once either of us file she will not be able to keep the house.

When I consulted an atty in Mar she warned me about the conversation my W and I had about her making a mistake.
I kept holding out that giving her a little of what she was asking for would enable her to think we could get past this.

She did say to stay in the house as long as possible but that if I wasn't going to fight for full custody it wouldn't make much difference moving out and I couldn't put the kids through a nasty custody dispute and somebody has to take their feelings into account.

We will both lose on the house, We owe more than what we will get and it still needs work she cannot keep it unless she buys me out or I agree to leave my name on the mortgage but I cant do that, I should just move forward but even after this I still have a glimmer of hope.

If I moved back it would probably make things worse for ever having a chance for renconciliation and I did leave to salvage anything I had left. As I said I did leave with everyone in mind including my sanity.

Also now that she has most probably filed I would lose my security deposit and an affordable apt, I just can't afford to do this all over again if things get more contentious.

She is just being the stubborn person her mother said she could be and now she feels justified but the lying to the kids let alone me and of shaking their world as she has.

I was hoping that the financial and emotional cost would have at least given us a chance but now she has gone further I will have to retain the atty I saw and all she deals with is family law - W's atty is a jack of all trades if she is keeping the same one.

She only paid him $500 to do the LSA which I wouldn't sign, In NY children wishes can be taken into acct when they reach 14 and I hope I can show them that I never wanted things to get this far and that I tried.

Almost everything I have done has been for the family and marriage - Just feel so stupid and backed into a corner.

Avoiding a nasty custody dispute by giving your children over to your WW along with alimony and child support isn't going them any favors. Get back in the house.

Don't waste our time asking for advice if you are just going to ignore it. You've clearly decided not to do anything anyway,

Your conflict avoidance has brought you to this point. How's it working out for you?

You are taking more risk by being a conflict avoider. Don't worry about LBs, just move back in the house for your sake and your children's sake.

Right now YOU are letting the CHLDREN take the brunt of the WS' attitude. What kind of father does that? I know that was a low blow but you have to realize that as long as you keep himming anh hawwing about the little stuff, the BIG stuff will step up and bite you in but!.

Now you have asked for help but keep ignoring it. Let us know WHEN you w/b listening and working with us.

take care,
L.

So, if she's out of town, what are you waiting for?

Are you fighting for your marriage or working on a divorce settlement?

The reason for waiting is because my W has accused me of being controlling along with the 3 instances in our marriage where things became physical with 2 7yrs ago and one this last Jan. along with the LB's which could be considered emotional abuse but I think that can be proven on both sides.

I still haven't been served and I wrote this letter to her in hopes that after her spending time with family that she has had second thoughts.

It is long,

T,
I want to ask one thing that is almost as important as when I asked you to marry me, Please give us some time to try and heal some more and I guess that is asking a big question at this point of our lives but one that needs asking. Ever since seeing you that Sunday when you picked up the K and A to leave for T I have been doing some real soul searching and I have held out hope for months that we could find it in ourselves and each other to work on things.

I still hold out hope, Although that seems to diminish at times and I was hoping that we could take 6 months or so to learn how to trust, respect and become friends again like we started years ago and that is the only reason I left our home along with the fact that all we seemed to do was each try to make our points and maybe we both were listening but I don't think either of us truly heard what the other was saying. I was feeling that we have shared so much that it was in all of our interests to work on things and I can only guess but you must have thought you have seen enough and couldn't see working on things.

Stepping back I can see where you are or were, I can only ask that we have some more time since this August would have been our 14th year of marriage and we were once friends before we were romantically linked and I remember how the first time I saw you I thought you were what I was looking for in this world but we didn't jump into anything we worked on our friendship and after several months we began to date, From the phone calls to meeting for our breaks and lunch at work to going out and spending time together seemed so right and special. Over the years with all that has happened to each of us as individuals and a family we seemed to have lost that part of our relationship and that is what I have realized that I have come to miss the most.

Early on I think we both connected so well that maybe one or both of us took that for granted and add responsibilities and outside influences and it was a recipe that brought us to where we find ourselves. As we both have said the last few years have often times been a struggle but we kept going albeit sometimes not in our best interests although I still deep inside hope we can learn first to try to regain a friendship, rebuild trust, compassion and empathy for one another like we had in the beginning when what no one felt or said hindered our blossoming relationship.

Both of us must have felt like so much has come between us especially these last several months and it is with a heavy heart that I was operating from and nothing else I felt if I could say the right thing or show you a reason to believe in us again that we could start to put this behind us but unfortunately with feeling and emotions being so much a part of all of this we find ourselves where 14yrs ago we never would have envisioned where we would be.

Without K, A or you here the last 2 weeks I have really started to think how lonely it has been and wishing it wasn't like this and hope, dream and try to imagine that we could be in a better place maybe not in the short term but long term. I really only left our home because I thought that it would be the best way for us to cope and move ahead in our marriage and had I thought that we would find ourselves so far apart I don't know if I would do it again, Although I was really only trying to give you what you were asking for since November was time and space and wishing that we wouldn't have had to go through all we have to see that and for that reason I am asking you to please give us some time if only to see whether or not time can heal.

I know I have brought things up especially in the last few months about our good times and you may have been focusing on our difficulties and being on separate pages probably has driven us further apart instead of helping us grow back to one another but one thing I know I have learned is that in order to have a happy family you have to have a happy marriage and I guess we both have felt at times especially over the last few years that there were starting to be more unhappy times than good.
We both probably have felt stress and pressures both in and outside our marriage that moved us into the downward spiral, Things we could control as well as things beyond our control and we should have tried to look at it as friends first before partners because even in business partners don't always see eye to eye but generally friends will or seem to have each others best interests at heart, I know I can and want to be your friend first and always and I miss hearing your voice without the stress of everything that has come to define where we are at this moment in time.

I think about how we may have added to our stress by trying to do things so quickly or get wrapped up in work, the house or other things before remembering to put our marriage and family first and maybe we both have thought we did at times but I have realized the true importance of doing that on a daily basis.

T, I am asking you to please take some more time to give us, our marriage and our family some time to attempt healing our wounds and possibly growing our friendship and marriage. I understand it could take some time but I am willing to invest that into something that is so important and I would like to be able to show you how much you have meant to me on many levels.

As I have mentioned before, We did many times in our lives together make a good team whether it was being with one another in the hospital or being there together watching the birth of our children. To watching the sunset on the ocean a few years ago or just laughing together the four of us. When we used to give the kids a bath when they were younger and watching them when times were simpler. But the ironic thing was the more we thought we were moving ahead the more we grew apart.
We thought having a house would make it a home, We thought making more money would make us comfortable but looking back it has all brought us the pain we are feeling today and I wish that we still could have one last chance at trying to see our way through this and be the friends, partners and spouses we want.

Instead of each of us focusing on what we have or haven't done could we focus on what we can do and shouldn't do to ourselves and one another and if for nothing else but to gain back trust and respect for one another. I don't want either of us to look back and feel like the last 15+ yrs have been to only have brought two beautiful children into this world and to have lost the gift of each other and the love we shared.

There are many ways we can do this but can we try to meet each other midway without one of us feeling like we are giving too much, I do realize how much I want to give to this but won't ask for you to give more than you can. Let's just focus on one day at a time and hopefully over time we can each give a little more.
We can stay living apart and I will do all I can to make it easy for both of us to heal individually and collectively.

You know at times I have thought how far we have fallen in only a years time, Last summer was stressful but we still did have our good times and although they sound trivial they were still memories I think of, From watching the dvds of that show to working on the decks, putting that grill together to sharing that day in Aug at B and Ls anniversary and had I known then what I have come to know now I would have tried to make more times like those and put aside the others.
I don't want this anniversary to be the last and I know it won't be the best but let's have something to grow from and maybe one day we can look back together and hopefully realize it was worth it.

When I think of our relationship it was built on our friendship and dedication to not only each other but those around us, I understand that people grow and hope that we can grow again and that this would be like a garden that has needed sun and water in the proper amounts to strengthen and flourish.

It's a shame that we have had to focus so much on hurt, anger and distrust instead of what we promised one another and I would hope you feel the same, And I guess I can only sum it up like this I don't want things to be like what brought us down I would like it to be like what brought us together and each of us may be able to find happiness and contentment somewhere else but how happy and content were we and how happy and content would others be namely our children if we were able to see things in a new yet old way.

Trying to "get through" to a WS is a complete and utter waste of time. I guarantee that whe won't even read the whole thing. You need to let your actions do the talking for you, and that is getting back in the trenches, moving in, and fighting for your marriage and family.

The reason I haven't done anything is for the reasons I stated yesterday, Along with some of the reading I have done on this site and other things I have heard Dr. Harley as well as others speak about abuse and I do not want to make her feel controlled or of me trying to guilt her or feeling threatened.

I misread the posting on MB radio page as I had previously spoken with the Harley's on air and he had mentioned the last time I spoke with him that we may need to S to heal.

I misread the vacation schedule and thought they were back on the air Mon 9th but actually they were not going to be on air starting the 9th.

So I am confused because all the vets here say to go home but Dr. Harley spoke with me 3 times previously and the last time he said we may well need to S.

So that is why the uncertainty and sense of defeat I have been feeling, She has been so angry and icy for some time and along with her stubborness and me continually talking about things and admitting my faults and saying things has given her this air of superiority and if she has spent money to serve me, she must have paid the filing fee and index # so she would just be more determined to continue.

I say that because she was extremely upset when I wasted her money by not giving her the LS she paid $500.00 for.

I have spent the last week going between anger, grief and/or feeling defeated and the only thing I have left id to make sure my kids are ok, But she also did this when she left for a 2 week vacation and I have called my kids daily but the last few days either no return call or when they have they are disinterested or distracted. I only have her cell# to call and always seem to get voice mail.

Feeling she did this on purpose for 2 reasons one she could do so without being in the city where I could attempt to see her and face me. And 2 because she would have the kids out of the way so they would have no contact with me.

I hope it explains my hesitancy and I am not purposely ignoring the advice here. I am thinking that no matter what I do I am cooked and there is no way to stop this train from crashing and hoping to control the damage.
Its just that I still hold on to a sliver of hope.

I just found a local support group in my area that deals with people who are separated, divorced or widowed and not completely sure it is for me b/c it talks about moving on but I think I am going to check it out tonight.

Also going to enroll in a class/seminar for parent going through S/D to be a better parent, The atty. I spoke with in March warned me about my W baiting or tricking me and suggested I do that to show in the event of a S/D that my kids are important to me.

I have also moved over to another board, Hope I won't be there but it doesn't look good, I do think I might contact SH to see how I should proceed since there is so much baggage cluttering my sitch.

I guess the other thing I thought about was, If she did file for D from all I have read she can still in essence bar me from marital home since I was the dummy who believed her and left,

I should have listened Jim and never moved out once again my believing I knew best has probably bitten me on my butt.