Mimi, it is the utter INJUSTICE of his remarks that enrages me. The implication that it is all about the money to them - on a FREE FORUM, by the way - is very false, unjust and ungrateful. I have no intention of debating this subject again, but I did want to explain myself.

nope....the bullcrap is yours Mel.
He quite simply did NOT call them charletans -- that is you stretching and twisting his words.

And his actual words do not imply anything of the sort. They are the truth. It is marketing. And its clear he admires and respects them. He did not accuse them of fraud. No way No how.

And the second quote? Where did MEDC say anything of the sort?

You owe him an apology. My opinion.


I think we all admire and respect MB. MEDC's admiration is of their business model. It is impressive. Mimi and Mel seem to be approaching this from a different place...

Mimi, I know you have an affinity to Mel... so, all I will say is I hear where you are coming from... but I do not believe that my posts said anything that could be considered maligning the business of this company. Now, as I have said, if it were a ministry, I would have a different opinion about some things. But from a business perspective, I stand by their right to handle this as they choose.

Sorry, but it is not the "truth" that they "make up little catchphrases to MAKE MONEY" off people's grief. He was not able to EVER substantiate such a thing so I STAND BY my assessment.

If anyone owes anyone an apology it is he who owes one to the HArleys for maligning them on their own forum which they freely and generously provide to him. He'll sure as hale never get one from me.

he did not say they "made them up".

Nope.

That is YOU jumping to conclusions, not reading the factual content of his statement.

And the second statement???

And really -- in all likelihood it is the publishers or webdesigners or marketing specialists that probably highlighted those phrases. And the purpose is to draw people to the topic (buy the book, visit the website, etc...)

And there is nothing wrong with that.

But this IS a for-profit business people!

huh? You are differentiating "making them up" and "having them?" The point was never that they made them up, but that they USED them to make a quick buck off people's grief. You are trying a little too hard to defend something that is indefensible, Lexxy.

Lexxxy, continue if you will...but no point in you too catching this wrath.
Mel is not used to people standing up to her...and she doesn't know how to handle being wrong.
I would suggest just letting it go...it really isn't worth it.

Man, you are working overtime with the rationalizations! First off, MEDC never said it was a "web-designer" he said it was the HARLEYS who used the little "catchphrases" to make a buck.

Even so, being in "business" does not mean you pander people's emotions via "catch phrases" to capitalize on their grief and make a BUCK. And that is the implication here. That would be UNETHICAL.

Mel --

He didn't call them charletans.
Nor did he say he that Dr. Harley HOPEs people have affairs.

And all your twisting in the world won't make that true.

Show me -- without your twisting, rephrasing, and drawing conclusions -- where he said what you accused him of?

Show me quotes where he used the words you did.

My definition of a charletan is someone who pretends to CARE but makes up little "catchphrases" to capitalize on someone's grief in order to make a buck. A FAKE. JUST AS MEDC DESCRIBED. So, I stand by what I said. Sorry.

MEDC
The free information on this site ( comprehensive as it is - not a partial "freeware" type offering as with many other self-help sites ) was instrumental in saving my marriage and my life.

The policies contained in the " basic principles " component of this site are catholic in scope , leave nothing out and run to many hundreds of pages. Far more comprehensive than many books by other authors that I bought for cash in fact.

I don't know how you can look at this resource and see only "free sample of the real , chargeable merchandise". But, opinions vary.

Also, I am a visitor to the other site, all of whose members you insulted. I never did you a knowing disservice there nor here; nor have I done so with anyone else. as evidenced by my recent affair marriage campaign, I have no issue with calling out what I see as wrong, and have no need to conspire on another website to do that.

Finally, I do not think it propitious to constantly refer to the acts of charity or social care you have committed, especially when you cite them to differentiate yourself as better than another person, as you did with Mel.

You have no idea what contributions to society I make or anyone else makes if we do not boast about them as you do.

I understand you are a Christian, MEDC. If so perhaps you know Matthew 6 ?


I have said my piece now. I do hope the unpleasantness can now stop. I see no marrigebuilding support whatsoever in the mud slinging match here today.

All blessings

Already did.

Wanna know what kept me on this particular site when I had hit on so many when I was searching for answers?

Check out your screen right now.....see the promo on the right side of the screen for the Marriage Builders Weekends? All those phrases being cycled:

"I just don't feel that way"
"I need space"
"I can't change my feelings"
"I LOVE YOU BUT I'M NOT IN LOVE WITH YOU"
"Too much has happened"

Then it has a checklist:

"Answers"
"Solutions"
"Plans"

That is what kept me hooked on this site long enough to find out what else was offered. It gave me direction. All those phrases "catch" or otherwise, caught me and held my attention long enough to look a little deeper.

I will be forever grateful to this site, recovery of my M or not, and for-profit or not on the Harley side. I am grateful it is here.

I don't see it being condemned by anyone. The intent of the Harley's is perceived differently, that's all. Does it matter what the intent is? It is an incredible service no matter the intent.

I"m going to throw something else out there that is probably going to be controversial but is something to think about. I am not in any way saying the Harley's do this.

Do you believe therapists, counselors, etc, reach their patient by coming to them from the patients point of view? If someone is very religous, does the therapist, counselor, etc talk to them on a more religous level than someone who is not as religous? Using a patients own beliefs to get a point across? It doesn't even have to be religion, just individual experiences, whatever works to "connect" with that patient.

I'm not saying this is a bad way to go about it. It's kind of how we deal with the waywards. They need to think the idea of repairing their marriage is their idea and not ours. They are more likely to buy into it if it is their own idea.

Fox

Well said, Bob, agree with every word. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Bob... my references to my past were in response to Mel calling me out about what I have done to help others.

Sorry if you don't like that but I stand by what I said in that entire thread.

And I did not continue this today Bob... Mel brought this here... I would be happy to never address her again.

Not even close Mel.

Just because YOU drew a conclusion; then YOU rephrased his words -- does not make you RIGHT, or allow you to attribute those words to him.

Actually I am probably the one who "brought it here."

Lexxy, nor do your hairsplitting rationalizations make you right. But that is ok with me; it interests me not a bit if you agree with my assessement or not. What matters is that I stand by it.