I earned all the money and gave her a credit card which I paid the bills on, but I would constantly berate her for spending too much.

I bought the house and it is in my name, the same thing for the previous house. Both times, I used the fact that I owned it to insist on certain things (like use of space, projects half-done, what to do with the garden etc)


Yes, I know the partners - they are who she initially went to stay with when she left me. I haven't explicitly told them but I'm sure they know, after all she left her daughter with them whilst she went to live with him, and the OM still works there (he's leaving in a couple of weeks). I'll make sure.

She was a SAHM with the babies for the first 15 months. They were planning the restaurant for a long time - it took off when the twins were about 15 months when they found what they thought was a good site for it.

Yes, I did all that weeks ago. She went ballistic on the phone with me. I was very calm, but I was second-guessing myself about it, I must admit.

I'm taking her to lunch today - at a very nice sushi place that she hasn't been able to go to. I'll bring a rose for her. She's said that she wants to be treated like a queen not a peasant.

So, was she actually spending too much, or were you just using it to be overbearing?


So, have you put together a list of actions, attitudes and behaviors as a husband that you recognize as having not been the actions of a loving, mature husband?

I'm sure you now realize that exhibiting this behavior against your wife has been instrumental in driving your wife out of the marriage?

Have you examined yourself and determined why you were this way?

If you have examined yourself, what actions have you considered taking to insure that the roots of this is addressed?


Okay. But new businesses require money. So, is she a true partner as in she has contributed capital to the launching and ongoing maintanance of this business? Or is she a partner who is contributing labor & hours only?

She obviously can't control her spending. However, you LBing only makes the problem worse. How about lowering the limit or giving her a debit card where you control how much you put in the account?

Also, she seems to depend on you for financial security. She'll stop seeing OM (who obviously doesn't have any money working for your WW at the restaurant), so all you have to do is stop enabling her and cut her off, and her affair will end. She'll try and emotionally blackmail you to continue, but you know better now.

Well, we don't know that she was actually overspending. He didn't say she was actually overspending, he said he berated her for overspending.

I think with what he has described so far regarding his attitude toward finances/home owndership etc., it may very well be that he was being overly harsh in his judgement towards his wife past spending choices.

Perhaps in hindsight, he may have a different opinion of both her behavior and his.

I would like to know whether we're talking about "You spent $800 on shoes!" or if we're talking about, "You spent $72 on groceries!"

I don't think that either of our behaviors could be characterized as abnormal. I would like to completely avoid debt apart from the mortgage and credit cards that I pay off every month. She is happy with car loans (which is not abnormal, of course), but it is not like she gambles it all away, she is not an inveterate shoe-shopper.

If she came back, I would like a solution where I get what I want (no debt and security) and she gets what she wants (equality). So I proposed that we make a budget, put both our earnings in the same pot, pay for everything and split the remainder as personal money. She can burn her money if she likes, do whatever she wants with it. I've explained this to her and she understands. She hasn't complained about it, her only objection is that she thinks I'll go back on it (there are no guarantees). As I see it, there's as much in it for me as for her.

As far as the house is concerned, I've said that we can own it and be on the loan jointly. I'd wait until we were together again for a year or something before doing it of course, but in the intervening time I'd think and act as though it's OURS, not mine.

So I've proposed solutions that I think we can both be happy with, she's free to propose anything as well. However, she only says that there are no guarantees (but when are there ever?)

I'm not so sure - she REALLY isn't the type to give up or "come crawling back", as they say. That's why I'd love to find a way for her to save face in this...I think that might make a difference.

I realize that she would never have come close to doing this if I'd treated her right.

I was genuinely trying my best to do what _I_ thought was best for everyone (and she recognizes that I was trying). But I didn't listen to her when she explicitly told me what she wanted. I thought that I was displaying love for her by looking after the babies, for instance, but it was just too far removed for her to feel it.

As I've mentioned, I have some sexual problems that I need therapy for. I just never bothered because I thought it wasn't a big issue and that we had bigger things to deal with. That looks completely absurd in retrospect. I'm starting therapy next week - although I thought I'd start with anger management since it's difficult to fix sexual problems without a partner <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> I'll ask anyway, because the sexual thing is far more important than anger management.

I bottle up things that bother me in order to avoid having arguments with people. I'm going to go to therapy next week for that.

In fact, that was the final incident that made her leave. She didn't come home the previous night (she was working at the beach) and I obviously had some inkling of what was going on, but I didn't react to it properly. I was very angry when she got home and my stepson did something minor and I blew up at him, chasing him up the stairs and shouting and swearing and threatening to hit him (I didn't hit him).

Ironically I found out later that the guy she spent the night with at beach was the guy she ended up with.

She has said that she wants to be treated like a queen, not a peasant. I didn't do the romantic things on valentines, anniversary, her birthday etc. Sometimes I did nothing. Once again, I didn't realize that this was a huge issue for her, although I knew it was an issue. Since then I've been bringing her flowers, having them sent to her work, I bought her some diamond earrings that had an effect on her.

These things aren't a problem for me as such (they are very easy to do) so, of course, I would do them if she came back.

The lesson that I take from that though is that I have to listen to what _she_ _really_ feels rather than what I think she should or does feel. I need to be more attentive to her, watch and understand her better, do the simple things that she needs to show her that I love her (notes, kisses, backrubs etc). I intend to put our marriage first and leave everything else that seemed so important to me alone. I intend to not leave the smaller problems alone either. I need to come back to something better than before and I think she needs to as well.

She knows all this and believes that I mean it, but she just says that there are no guarantees. I think she also feels that maybe she's just married the wrong person and we're too different.


She is a true partner - she setup the place and she runs the whole place, back to front. She's the only person keeping it going really - money aside. She's really very talented in lots of ways.

Lunch seemed to go OK, but afterwards she sat down with me and wanted the money. It was hard but I said that if she gave him up completely and forever and if I lived with her and she committed to try and make our marriage work, I would take care of anything that she needed taking care of. She wanted to negotiate on me living with her, but she wouldn't negotiate on never seeing him again. She was very upset and I felt terrible - I want to help her. I'm sure she is interpreting this as me trying to control her with money.

However, I'm not giving it to her. I expect her to threaten to take half of my money in the divorce next. Frankly, though, I don't care if she does, although I won't lie down for it. I want her back.

Well, she called and told me that it was over, that she would take half my money in the divorce and that I had to take the babies 7 days a week. And that I should go the f**k to h**l.

I guess we'll find out if you guys are right or full of s**t <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Good job, wibbler! You did the right thing. No more financing her affair at the expense of your marriage.

I understand that your marriage had problems before the affair but it is real important that you understand that you ARE NOT responsible for her affair. She is 100% responsible for that choice. She is 50% responsible for the state of the marriage. You are no more at fault for the state of the marriage than she is, just don't forget that.

Good job tonight! Expect her to make some idle threats to try and coerce you back into financing her affair, but don't pay them any mind. Don't allow her to bait you into a fight, just be pleasant and kind. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

WOW, she is angry because you are interfering with her affair?? I can't believe it!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Just respond with kindness: "dear, I am so sorry you are upset." Don't even try and reason with her, it will be wasted.

I feel sick. No, I am definitely more at fault than she is for us being here today. She was always a very giving person.

Sadly, it's gotten to a point where she has to make a choice. I so wish I'd never let it get to this point.

She'll probably be fine anyway - she's going for a couple of different (paying) jobs next week, so she'll have money anyway.

wibbler, do you see the result of extreme giving? The result of extreme giving is extreme TAKING, just as Harley says. This is what has happened to your wife. While you have bigger fish to fry at this juncture, just know that extreme giving and extreme taking both have negative consequences in a marriage. This is something Harley addresses in the recovery phase.

I realize you feel sick and your WW is surely hoping for that, too. Just stick to your guns, though, and don't allow those emotions to lead you down the wrong path again. Withholding the money was the right thing to do and she will respect you for this in the end.


Thats good. Both she and the OM should get to work paying for their own place.

Did you think about what we told you about exposing your children to this affair?

Good job. You are doing damage to the affair. I would make sure that she has been exposed to everyone. No money + public humiliation is enough reason finally agree to NC with the OM (after several weeks of b!tching about it). I think she'll eventually cave. Now is the time to figure out her top ENs and try and start meeting them when she gives you the opportunity. Remember, she's just trying to emotionally blackmail you into allowing her to continue her affair.

It looks like she's found some money - she's going to sell one of her 2 cars - should give her a few thousand dollars. Unfortunately it's in her name - although the loan that paid for it is in mine (home equity loan) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> What a chump! And she says that I control her with money!

Well, I started talking to her family again, telling them what's going on. But she won't talk to them. They are all on my side in this, but none of them live near here and she won't pick up the phone to talk to them.

I think that next I'm going to talk to the OM - there are some things that she probably hasn't told her about herself, so I'll make sure that he knows.

There's also a secret whereby she doesn't have a qualification/background that she claims, and her partners have invested money with her not knowing that. I just recently found out about it.

She says that she's told the OM, but she probably hasn't. I don't really want to tell everyone about this since it's not to do with the A, and I told her that I wouldn't tell anyone - plus it could maybe(???) lead to someone suing her for fraud. I may bring it up with the OM, since she claims that she told him anyway.

I find myself still anxious that she call, for instance, but forgetting what I loved about her.

My stepson is still very upset by this, I found out, I had thought he was adjusting to it - but he burst into tears while shopping with her the other day, because he was worried that I would abandon him like his natural father did. I tried to reassure him, but he still seems sad. She was angry at me because she said that I put him up to it. I don't know how to make her consider the damage she's doing to him. She doesn't seem to care right now.

Boy do I know this one all too well. My little "former Step Daughter" who I raised as my own for 8 years was at my home and began crying over all of the destruction my ex ww has caused along with lunatic OM. This is over a year after we have been divorced.

In case this goes bad be sure to look up something on in locos parentis regarding your rights (visitation or otherwise with step-son).

They are truly blind to everything around them except themselves and their own march towards destruction. Idiots!

There's a limit to how far you can take these things. For one thing, if you do end up getting divorced and you have kids, you have to be able to still bring them up together.

For another, I'm in a position where I know something that could lead to legal trouble for her. I could threaten to tell her partners, workmates etc, but I think it's unjustified because it's not to do with the A. Plus I don't want her in legal trouble! It would be more like blackmail than anything.

wibbler,

Exposure of the affair is a good thing.

Reprisal is wrong!

Concentrate on the former and leave the latter alone entirely. While you wish to break up the affair, it is necessary that you do it by making yourself the better alternative to the OM rather than using subversive antics to cause her trouble, The goal is the elimination of the fog and the return of your wife so that recovery can begin NOT punishment for her actions. If reprisal is your goal, it won't save the marriage but hasten its demise.

The question you have to ask yourself is this...

...Do you want to WIN the battle or save your marriage?

Mark