I really, really want to understand for MY OWN BENEFIT what you are saying HERE.

I can understand if your answer continues to be NO to my request.

But, I wanted to let you know that I really want to hear what you are saying HERE.

This is an issue that I'm continuing to try to understand..

There's something about this GODDESS OF ALL THINGS that is bothersome to my H...

I can't put my finger on it..

I cannot be anyone but myself..know less..be able to do less..and he RELIES on me for a lot of stuff..ASKS FOR MY HELP...

BUT..there's something ATTRACTIVE about being able to HELP a DAMSEL..

DAMSEL vs. GODDESS...can that be one in the same person...

This is partly HIS ISSUE..his insecurity..I CAN'T CONTROL THAT...

But what CAN I DO better??? If anything???

Mimi:

I'm not sure exactly what you are asking.....

"I never moved out"

No, I never moved out. I snuck around and lied and cheated and hid and lied and did any of a number of things, for 4.5 years.

If I HAD moved out, at least TO ME, that seems a more honest thing to do.

Along the lines of "I have found someone new and I have moved out to explore/examine this new R." There is a more basic honesty to that compared to the CAD behavior I persued. All the ugly activities that an A engenders, it like saying which of a number of bad things is the best... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

That's my point. Can not say that is right thinking or not. It's sort of the perspective I have now. With a greater amount of knowledge.

I don't know what else there is to explore.

Can you help me?

If you were asking about this line:

"But why he stays away?

I will expand if this is what you wanted...

LG

Mimi:

This second post of yours is something else entirely, and maybe more on point to what you were looking for in the first post????

However:

I will start with:

"BUT..there's something ATTRACTIVE about being able to HELP a DAMSEL.."

OF COURSE!

Every guy wants to save the beautiful woman.

Come riding in on the white stallion and save the damsel.

However, these things can't be faked....

And we can't be saving you all the time....

Sort of like Lassie running away from Timmy because that blasted kid won't stay away from the well....!

If you KNOW how to do everything. It diminishes your NEED for US.

And it can be very subtle sometimes....


A Damsel needs her Prince to open her car door for her, and he gets a big smile and a thank you.
A GODDESS shows her appreciation later....
A Damsel, even if SHE DOES know the answer, will allow her Prince to come up with the right answer without looking foolish....
A Damsel, lets her prince KNOW what she needs, so that the prince can act on that need, proactivly.
A Goddess? She knows what she wants, and tries to get it.
The Damsel? She just needs some support to get there...

Does this make any sense?

LG

I hope you don't mind me jumping in here.

This is good stuff and a GREAT question Mimi, as I obviously am struggling with the same thing.

There is very little I can not do for myself. It may not be easy, but I can usually find a way. It was how I was raised and is something I take a lot of 'pride' in.

However, it has created issues with Drac's needs as well.

Please keep this conversation going,,,,,

This is why I believe that in the majority of the cases the WS's are dealing with something the BS may or may not can affect, without changing who they are at the core, even the good things.

Let's say my ex WW wanted me to be a snake in the grass, lying, unemotional and dispecable individual because she looked better to herself in her eyes (like she does now with POS OM). I can't do that regardless if it would help her self esteem. Its not in me to become that person.

H&P,

I don't disagree with you, however, there is SOME middle ground here.

Part of me needs to be able to "let go" of doing for myself. In that regard, it is also important that when I do let go, that I would know that Drac will pick up from there. For ME, my history is that I found in MY experience that when I did that, more often than not, I still had to pick up and "get it done"

When Drac and I got together, he WAS my knight in shining armor. At that time I needed and wanted to have someone to "take care of me". The problem was that I didn't properly communicate that to Drac, and the result was that in MY eyes, he let me down. I grew in resentment and it came out in all of the wrong ways.

was also a "professional, self sufficent, confident woman" when we met, and he told me these were things that he admired about me. I was different than any other woman he'd been with before. Yet, in many ways, these were the qualities that he grew to resent in my as I became less and less the woman who wanted/needed him to take care of me.

Am I properly describing the vicious circle here? It is not so different than the SF need as described in Dr. Harley's books.

"In that regard, it is also important that when I do let go, that I would know that Drac will pick up from there. For ME, my history is that I found in MY experience that when I did that, more often than not, I still had to pick up and "get it done"

This is me EXACTLY. When my husband met me, I was competent and a hard worker, and a DOER. I continued, and was very valuable to him, as he brought 6 kids to the marriage. As the years went on, I did more and more, and he did less and less. If I stopped doing so much, it did not get done, and I'm talking about important things.

I really think his laziness wore at his self-esteem. He ran off with our neighbor, who is stupid, never worked, irresponsible, and abandoned her daughter. It was EASY for him to feel important.

I own my part, and will never do it all again. But he caused a lot of his self-esteem problems by being a SLUG (oops, I know, a DJ), but that is what he became. Actually he still is, and I think THAT is why the OW dumped him. She left a go-getter husband for my WH.

Bugsy, I think this is more of a RECOVERY ISSUE....

LG, helped me with what I needed..it was a REMINDER...



I can be HIS DAMSEL and HIS GODDESS...

In PLAN B, the OW couldn't reach the level of being A GODDESS...

The OW gives the illusion..in their fantasy world..that she will be able to pull it off...become THE GODDESS...

My job is to also be HIS DAMSEL along with being HIS GODDESS..

Mimi my darling....

Being a goddess does not mean that you never need to ask for help from other people

Being a goddess means that you recognize when you need help, and you are SECURE enough in your fabulousness to ASK for help.

A Goddess can receive gracefully and gratefully!

Goddesses do not get made in isolation...we are all members of the human race...we need each other.

The never-needing-help-I'm-so-cool-Goddess is a lonely fraud.

Asking for and receiving help is NOT weakness. It's a strength.

It's a strength our husband's need us to practice.

Actually a better NAME for the OW is SEDUCTRESS..not DAMSEL..

In the affair, they live in a FANTASY WORLD..filled with ILLUSION, FUN, THEATER and PLAY...so the OW plays ROLES..like in a PLAY...THE SEDUCTRESS..."I'll be your damsel and you'll be my knight"..(GAG)

That's the VALUE OF PLAN B..she/they can't keep that up 24/7..she thinks she has CAPTURED him..she let's the guard down..he begins to see her warts and begins DEMANDING, "Where is my DAMSEL?"...

Ahhh..if only I can get a taste..a whiff of MY GODDESS...The GODDESS is REAL..the GODDESS cannot only be a SEDUCTRESS but also can be a FRIEND, a CONFIDANTE, a HELPMATE

I don't know what I was thinking yesterday...

I really GET THIS...

Good idea to bring MY PERSONAL POWER post over here to keep us focused:

PERSONAL POWER

As I look back over my time here, I consider this one of the GREATEST GIFTS that I received from this forum.

I remain here for that sustenance.

The POWER helps me in my MARRIAGE to this day.

It weathers me through CONFLICTS with my H..yes CONFLICTS from which I used to FLEE..I walk head on into them and SPEAK MY TRUTH...and I see my H valuing ME and RESPECTING ME...AHHHH...PERSONAL POWER....I LOVE IT!!!

Becoming convicted to WORK YOUR PLAN will lead you HERE to where I am...

It has to be YOUR PLAN..not about HIM...

It has to be how YOU WANT TO CHANGE TO MAKE YOURSELF INTO A BETTER PERSON...

Then THE PLAN is REAL, SINCERE AND MEANINGFUL to YOU and that will be communicated to your WS and others....

Starting with the FOCUS ON YOURSELF prepares you for PLAN B which takes all the PERSONAL STRENGTH and CONVICTION a PERSON CAN BEAR...

It is hard to PERSEVERE AND ENDURE during PLAN B..it involves WITHDRAWAL from your WS and RECREATING YOUR LIFE...it did for me...

Yes, Plan B for me was ONLY 3 MONTH or so...but THE MENTAL PREPARATION, SOUL SEARCHING and LIFE CHANGES STARTED WAY BEFORE THEN on D-DAY...

I decided to CHANGE INTO THE NEW ME that I am today and have not turned back...and will not turn back...I WILL NOT BE THAT PERSON EVER EVER AGAIN...

I have a sense of PERSONAL POWER and PURPOSE..my H knows for sure that I WILL AND CAN SURVIVE WITHOUT HIM..I am certainly ENHANCED BY HIS PRESENCE IN MY LIFE..but also HIS LIFE IS ENHANCED BY ME....

I felt compelled to say this this morning...

I am so thankful for getting to this place...

It is VITAL FOR YOU GUYS..especially MY GIRLS..to get HERE, TOO...

Diva Shades and a VS Account are not ESSENTIAL but can be HELPFUL...

At least, MASCARA and LIPSTICK..LIP GLOSS will suffice...

Most importantly: Stand Tall, Head Held Up, Shoulders Back..SPEAK YOUR TRUTHS...calmly yet assertively...TODAY and EVERYDAY...

And we all say AMEN!

Great stuff Mimi, as usual!

I will have the pleasure of spending tonight with another Goddess,, My MOM. From whom I learned my Goddess basics!

Bugsy reminded me of my grandmother..MY GODDESS MENTOR..the true PROVERBS 31 Woman who lived to the age of 92..she and my grandfather were married for 71 years..and yes, there was INFIDELITY in their history from which she ROSE triumphantly... I read this at her funeral..and strive to be like her in my LIFE'S JOURNEY...

To me this is the GOLD STANDARD for being a GODDESS...

This is from the NIV Version of the Bible..Proverbs 31:10-29

THE WIFE OF NOBLE CHARACTER

A wife of noble character who can find? She is worth far more than rubies.

Her husband has full confidence in her and lacks nothing of value.

She brings him good, not harm, all the days of her life.

She selects wool and flax and works with eager hands.

She is like the merchant ships, bringing her food from afar.

She gets up while it is still dark; she provides food for her family and portions for her servant girls.

She considers a field and buys it; out of her earnings she plants a vineyard.

She sets about her work vigorously; her arms are strong for her tasks.

She sees that her trading is profitable, and her lamp does not go out at night.

In her hand she holds the distaff and grasps the spindle with her fingers.

She opens her arms to the poor and extends her handle to the needy.

When it snows, she has no fear for her household; for all of them are clothed in scarlet.

She makes coverings for her bed; she is clothed in fine linen and purple.

Her husband is respected at the city gate, where he takes his seat among the elders of the land.

She makes linen garments and sells them, and supplies the merchants with sashes.

She is clothed with strength and dignity; she laughs at the days to come.

She speaks with wisdom, and faithful instruction is on her tongue.

She watches over the affairs of the household and does not eat the bread of idleness.

Her children arise and call her blessed; her husband also, and he praises her:

Many women do noble things, but you surpass them all.

------------------------------------------------------------

No one else will ever be able to fulfill this role for YOUR HUSBAND...no TEMPTRESS..no SEDUCTRESS...

Losing YOU would be a MAJOR LOSS for him...A TRAGEDY...

And, of course, this is not to be taken literally these days....but figuratively...

But there is MUCH WISDOM here..

I strive everyday to be the PROVERBS 31 WOMAN...GODDESS SUPERIOR...

It never hurts to know that you are the beloved and beautiful daughter of the most powerful force in the universe.

I'm SOOO EXCITED about the new books I ordered today:

THE POWER OF POSITIVE THINKING by Norman Vincent Peale and

THE BODY SCULPTING BIBLE FOR WOMEN...

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