My husband ended his affair on Sunday and was with me pretty much the whole day. He was saying the right things and affectionate and we were intimate. It has been 2 1/2 months since his affair began. I was yerning for attention. He has an apartment but went back that night. We had a good day together. He said he was commiitted and said all the right things. Now, two days later, Tuesday, he was with her all night. I am heart broken again. He said it is really hard. He said he cares for her too. I understand that he will go through withdrawals but he didn't come to me. He went to her. Why?

He said that he did break things off and but he isn't perfect. Please, he is still wanting his cake and eating it too. How stupid can I be. I want to save my marriage so much. I ended up yelling at him and it is turning him away cause I am so heart broken. I feel no matter how I react it is just pushing him away. I told him we get the divorce (which I filed) or he comes home TONIGHT and we work on our marriage for real. He said he didn't like the demands and threats and said that I pretty much decided for him and so it sounds like he wants the divorce. What does he really want. On Sunday he was telling friends and family that we are getting back together and the kids were around and saw us snuggling. He just gave the kids false hope. His mother even stopped by and talked to me and just said to not let him back in because he will do this again and I will go through this all over again. He hasn't even given us a tried. Sunday was the first and only day he actually tried. Monday we didn't talk and Tuesday we talked for alittle bit but still living separately. Don't you think he should be back home and work on his marriage? Yet, what if he moves back and continues to sneak and see this woman? I will be even more devastated. Should I just cut my loses? Is there still hope?

There is hope....but stop the threats and ultimata. Why are you filing for divorce if you don't want one? It's a power-play and it won't help. Get on board here with a real Plan A. Complete the important steps necessary to move to Plan B if you need to. Give the Harleys's a call so you have guidance through these troubled waters.

Talk about Plan A. What do you know? What have you done?

Suzanne, You have been posting all over the place for the last month but have never seemed to start a plan.

But First! Have you been tested for STD's? It's everyones personal call but having SF with an active WS is truly dangerous. And you are pregnant. Be careful.

You have indicated he is a 4-time serial cheater.

Do you want him back? if yes:

What have you really done as a Plan A?

Have you read Surviving an Affair yet? It has been suggested a couple times.

Are you trying to fill his missing emotional needs and have controlled your love busting behavior?

Is this OW married? Have you exposed to everyone? I believe this one is a co-worker. Have you exposed at work?

Exposure destroys affairs.

What is your children situation again? A DS4 and 5-mos pregnant?

With cake eating this profound you should probably get serious in understanding the goals of Plan B. You need to establish and enforce some firm/clear boundries or this will just go on and on.

What is the status of your divorce?

Your situation would really merit a call to the Harleys.


Then you need to calm down and start a real plan. Stick to one thread from now on so everyone can catch up on your situation.

Chrisner,

Thanks for the advice. I don't know how to do threads. This is new to me. I have been really nice and not doing any angry outbursts. Sunday was the day he ended it and I left him alone and just sent a text telling him I was thinking about him and he wrote back and said, "thanks for believing in me." Then that night he went with her. I was so angry. I did confront him and I had an angry outbursts and that didn't go well at all. Yes, almost everyone knows. His main reason for stopping is the kids know. He knows he is setting a bad example. This OW is single. Don't know relatives of hers.

Yesterday, he talked to me and said that he ended it again and told her she needed to transfer from his department asap. He said he doesn't want to come back to the house though because he really wants to work on himself and do those things that will strengthen him. So, I am starting to be nice again to him. I have filed for the divorce when I immediately found out back in June. He defaulted and didn't do an appearance so my lawyer is setting up a court date in October. There are days I just don't think this marriage will ever work and using the divorce to protect myself. Then, there are days when I look at my kids and want to work things out. I don't know what he really wants. He says he doesn't want the divorce still but knows there are alot of problems but he doesn't seem to take any initiative to solve our problems.


I have another book on surviving infidelity but I haven't read Harley's Surviving an Affair. I am ready, Falling in Love and Staying in Love. I feel hope when I read that once I get an opportunity to do so. I feel like I have 1 1/2 months to figure out if this marriage is worth saving. The court will be scheduled in October. Don't know if it will be final then though cause it is the first court appearance. If my husband has ended it again why doesn't he want to really try with me then? He is just staying at the apartment. Now his brother moved him with him too so it seems he is getting comfortable. He told me awhile back he would move back home after August but now his brother is paying 1/2 the rent it isn't much of a financial burden now. Everyday is something different. I just want to know if he will be committed or not. He knows he needs to change and wants to get his spiritual strength back. I know I can't do that for him. Sunday he said he was so committed and now that is all gone. I don't know where he is at. Thanks for listening.

"He knows he needs to change and wants to get his spiritual strength back."

Spiritual strength doesn't come from boinking the other woman. Next time, explain to him that spiritual strength comes from staying with his family and living up to his vows. He is still cake eating. Continue Plan A and see what happens. Quit the angry outbursts.

To recap. My husband ended his affair on Sunday and was with me the whole day and things were really good between us. I made him a nice dinner and we talked and were affectionate. He said really nice things to me. He said he wasn't ready to move back to the house. On Tuesday, he went with the OW. I was furious, gave him an ultimatum and did angry outbursts. Wednesday night he talked to me and said that he ended it again and didn't want to continue with her. He said she needed to transfer out of the department asap.

Today, I apologized for my angry outbursts. I said that I recognized his struggle (withdrawal he is going through a bit). He keeps telling me he wants to do the right thing but it is hard. I texted him if I could come over tonight and just read some scriptures, talk, etc. He said he isn't ready and my step daugther was over at his apartment. I wrote back and just said ok. He text back and said, "I'll try to be ready soon. We need to date though." I don't understand what he is waiting for. If he ended things and wants to do the right thing, shouldn't he come back to me? I think he fears that he isn't 100% strong and doesn't want to come back and hurt me again if he isn't ready. If he wants to date and do things with me then he needs to take the next move and ask me. I have asked him and put my heart out there even after he crushed it. Any advice on what is going through his head? Thanks

"Don't you think he should be back home and work on his marriage?"

One classic line of a WS is "I'm confused." They really don't see right and wrong in what they are doing. They don't want to see right and wrong because the OW is the source of so much joy and passion. There must be something right about this affair, something different, that makes it acceptable.

If he is seeing OW and you are having angry outbursts, it is time for Plan B. Be sad, not mad. Tell him you are hurt by what he is doing and need to remove yourself from him. Don't allow you on Sunday and her on Tuesday. You shouldn't have to compete with any other woman because he made a vow to you.

One thing Harley has said on the radio show is that women cannot compete. They go nuts. Men can, but women can't. Just think about how you'll feel and how you'll react if you date him and he's sleeping with OW. Is he trying to compare the two of you to see which one he prefers? What happens if he comes to you for a time and then slides back to her and then comes to you and someone else wanders across his path?

I regret not having asked my husband to leave when he was showing more care for his former co-worker than for me, his wife, and this was when I didn't even know there was an affair. Don't underestimate the stress you are under.

Cherished

PS. You have no control over whether he decides to make a commitment to you. That is up to him. By removing yourself from him, you make it clear that his commitment is internal to him and not dependent on your behavior.

OMGOSH suzanne, my WS did the same thing to me...first he told me he wanted OW, I begged him to stay and he said he didnt see the point. A week later I started moving out my things...then he wanted to work on the M, broke up with the OW that night, I was sooooooooo happy!! over joyed, thrilled!! We made love......10 hours later....he told me he wanted to go back to her. So I know exactly how you are hurting.

I left for a month, and for that month he went to the "im confused" story. You say you dont know what he wants, well let me tell you exactly what he wants:

He does not want a divorce....I'll repeat: HE DOES NOT WANT A DIVORCE, HE WANTS TO HAVE YOU AND HER BOTH! He may tell you or he may not...but that is exactly what he wants. So now you know.

And it hurts and it sucks. So like i said i left, and then instead of just wanting her and all the back and forth he decided to just say he's confused.....and yes, he was one confused nut. After a while I decided to fight for my M that why i would have no regret. I decided to do Plan A. I told him I did not want him to see her however i expected to see her anyway. That's what plan A is sort of, a contest...who's the better prize. But to my surprise he ended it the next day. I was glad but not like before. I'm waiting, snooping, expecting the day where i find out he never really ended the affair at all....that way i wont be hurt as bad like the last time. but I'm still implementing Plan A...I have one month to go...if there's still no sign of contact, at the end of Plan A i will have to regroup, if i find out there has been contact...at the end of Plan A....on to Plan B.

WakingBeauty, thanks for the advice and for everyone elses input. Glad to see that others are going through this roller coaster ride. I think he is trying to end it. She is still in his department and hence contact. He wants her to transfer asap so he doesn't have to deal with this. He is telling me what I want to hear all the time but no action. I don't know if he will come home. His brother is now living with him and paying 1/2 the rent so it is making less of a burden on him financially to stay at the apartment. I did file for the divorce and he will get the papers in two weeks of our court date. I have told him that I would stop the proceedings if he shows me he is committed. He seemed very committed on Sunday then two days later tells me it is hard and doesn't know if he can stop. Then on Wednesday he said that he ended it again.

He text me and say that he will be ready soon and wants to date me. However, how nice should I be? Part of me longs for affection and obviously his #1 need is sex. Yet, if we go out I don't want to feel like he can get with me whenever because he knows I want him back. I saw a movie last night and the girl stopped a guy and said, "you can have me when you love me." That really struck me because he has told me that he doesn't love me, yet he cares for me. He is willing to have sex with me though. It just breaks my heart if he then goes back with her. How will I really know if things are over with him and her? He is in this crazy state of mind right now. I'm sure she will be after him again somehow. Yet, I don't want him back in the house either if he isn't going to be committed but how can we restore our relationship if we are separated? He lives 2 miles away and we have a 4 year old. We keep some type of daily contact due to our son. Deep down I don't want the divorce too but I am using it as a protection for me. I don't want to be in a competition but is that what PLAN A is all about? How life would be like if my WS came back? I want to start healing, forgiving him, and making him happy but how can I do that when we are separated. I just think I should not contact him. It is better if I don't know what he does actually. If he wants to date then it will be up to him to plan something. He keeps saying that but no action. Out of 2 1/2 months of being separated he gave me 3 hours this past Sunday of his undivided attention. This is it. I guess time will tell. I'll definitely keep everyone posted. Thanks so much for all your insights.

He wants to keep both you and the other woman in a relationship with him. It's very simple.

If he were to go back into the house with you, he would lose her. Thus, he tells you enough to keep you waiting and hoping for him.

When he's talking to her, he's telling another story.

Husbands and wifes don't need to separate from their families to rediscover themselves or their 'spirituality'. He isn't a tibetan monk fasting and depriving himself of sleep in order to find his inner self... he's just trying to keep himself in that grey territory where he has both you and his girlfriend waiting for him.

He'll keep all three of you in this situation until he is forced into a new plan.

Sundog,

I want time to show him I can meet his needs yet I don't want to give him the satisfaction that he can have both. It is either me or her. He tells me it is over yet who really knows what contact they have. Then, I feel like not having any contact with him at all because my heart and the baby can't take this emotional stress. Harley says to do Plan B if he is cake eating. Again, I fear I would be giving up opportunities to spend time with him and show him how we could work things out. I'm confused too. Thanks

If Harley says it's time for plan B, then definately listen to the person with years of experience and training.

You can be the sweetest and most attractive woman on Earth, but if he thinks he can have you AND the other woman, then he will. It's the addictiveness of the affair that's a big portion of the problem.

Plan B protects you and your child. It also hopefully causes your husband to end the affair totally and completely (because this will be part of your condition for ending your plan B darkness).

If my H comes back and says that he has ended it then I still have to take that risk and learn to trust him again and help him through this withdrawal stage. If I start Plan B but he starts to contact me and ask me to do things with him, should I take those opportunities to better our relationship or should I completely not give him that choice. I can say that he has to completely end the relationship and come back to the house but then I am being demanding and he starts being defensive. Again, either way it is a risk to believe him whether he said it has ended and stays at the apartment or comes back to the house. I agree that if he wants to "do what is right" coming back to your wife is the what is right yet I tried to be understanding and said that I do want him home but understand he is not ready so I am not pressuring him. He says he wants to do this on his own. If he can stop on his own and withstand whatever OW is doing to tempt him, then he says he is ready to work on us because he doesn't want to come back and hurt me. Is this a line of crap? After knowing him for 8 years, part of me really believes him and after all of this drama, I don't know what to believe anymore from him. Either way, the less contact I have with him the better. If he wants to try at all with me then it is up to him. I hope for the best but I am planning for the worse and I am still proceeding with the divorce until I really see that he wants his family. Do you think I am wise to try to protect myself too? Thanks for your input. I appreciate everyone's help.

You must protect yourself and your family from the WS but if you still love your H (not the WS), you need to let your H (not the WS) know that he can come back to a family who loves him and wants to help him.

You may be wondering, how can I get a message to my H and NOT to the WS? Is that insane or what?

In the real world it w/b insane but realize you are dealing with a non-human entity. The WS has not qualms in destroying your family and will yank you and your family up and down (aka: rollercoaster) to get his 'control' thrills.

All the while your H is kept in captivity having to watch the horror. Every once in a while, your H gets a glimpse of his family and the WS. He gets the chance to peek out and see there is still a real world out there.

Where does that leave you? Well it could leave you baffled and depressed... or.... you could go get a POA (plan of action).

Let us know which one you choose.

L.

Suzanne, he's pulling a line with you. He’s wording things so that he doesn't have to 100% commit to anyone. He wants to be single. and like Sun said, he's giving you hope. False hope, Actually he's just stalling. If he can have you both without losing either one of you for the next year...why choose today. NO, no dating, unless you guys are living in the same house. And I'm just telling you this so you won't get hurt. please expect the worst...not so you think everything he says is a lie, just so it'll hurt a lil less.

Wish you hadn't of pulled the D....but it may work. But you dont want to scare him into trying because then he will just tell you anything and still have the A undercover. Remember; don’t do anything until you are really truly ready. If you do things just to make him jump, eventually he will call your bluff, and then it will be even harder and longer for him to change because he will think you are bluffing.

If he's living outside the home then you'll just have to implement Plan A to the best of your ability. Some ideas:

1. Set a Time limit for Plan A. I suggest 3 months.

2. Clean: Keep your house clean, self, kid, car, whatever. pamper yourself, get hair nails all done, and hang out with friends (this will keep you sane) and eat (don't starve yourself because you dont feel like eating), you need all your nutrients so you can think clearly.

3. If you want to date, I don't advise it because you may still be having sex with him. Even though you may say you will not...we love our WS and they know just the right advances to give us to make us melt. Limit the time you're around him alone. I only say this because I think he's still seeing OW(s). Protect yourself from STD for you and your son.

4. Be a friend, take him and his brother lunch, dinner, WS favorite meal. Do this when brother is there or when you have somewhere you have to be because now you're on his territory, and you dont want to be there long--you guys may have sex.

5. As much as I hate this: Clean around HIS house, let him know you still care. But DO NOT get into any long emotional conversations with him....he may suck you right back in....save those for when he moves back in and tells you he wants to work on the marriage. (When I moved out, I still had the keys to the house, so I would go home (WS home) when I knew he wasn’t there and would clean up-and leave.

6. Anything he's ever complained about, make it not a complaint. Any tiny little thing. AH especially. Matter fact-all the LBs. He will notice.

7. When he leaves you or u leave him, you want to leave him with a positive memory of you. Even seeing him for only 4 mins-leaving him with a + is a whole lot better than leaving him with a - memory. Funny how much stronger negative influences are, and to him (to justify what he's doing) is going to try to find any lil - thing about you. He may even pick stupid fights or give you DJs of his own, but be strong. You have tools, you have a plan, an agenda...he's just having a tantrum and not thinking clearly as WS do.

8. Stay sexy for him, where his favorite perfume. THIS IS HARD: Stay sexy at home, even when you don’t expect to see him. He may just pop up, or someone he knows. In my case, and my WH wouldn’t tell me who….but word had gotten back to him that “I was living my life and looking good, couldn’t tell that we were separated because I just seemed so happy.” Is this true or just WH Bulls*it to see what I say, don’t know. But do it. Always look your best!! Affair or no affair you should always look your best.

9. Don’t stop here, I’m sure you can think of stuff on your own to do.

10. At the end of Plan A. STOP. Silence, NC, just stop. Don’t answer his calls, don’t answer the door when he comes over, just disappear. Don’t talk to his brother, mother, friend, don’t ask about him, don’t go to his neighborhood. And if he wants to see your son, he needs to make an appointment. He just can’t drop by whenever he feels like it. Be strong, he’ll say things like “oh I guess you don’t care about me anymore” “I might as well be with OW since you’re not there” “OW is there for me” “Lets work on the M, but I can’t move in until my lease s up” Be strong Suzanne…..Listen to what he is really saying, but don’t fall for it. This is Plan B. Read up on Harley’s Plan B.

Once you're in Plan B, its you're way or the highway. Do not enter Plan B until you are ready, stay in Plan A.

At the end of Plan A before you start Plan B, you give him his choice, "either end it for good and allow this never to happen again or I see no hope for this marriage, which is a shame because I believe that this marriage could turn out to be really great".

Give him the stipulations...and when he comes back talking that smack...go down the list, if he missed one...oops, sorry buddy BYEE come back and try again later.

Wakingbeauty,

Thanks again. Ok, he just came over unannounced. He started to talk about how it was easier for him to end things this time with the OW because she got another tattoo and that is a big turn off. Yet, he still says he doesn't want to jump right back in with us because he feels I will give him drama and start talking about the affair and he just wants to forget it. He said that she was transferred to another dock at the warehouse so he wouldn't see her and she is in the works of getting transferred out of the department. Yet, a friend called and said that she was going to try to stop over to see him.

He said he was up until 5 a.m. and wanted to call me really bad last night. I asked if he wanted to do something today and he said no. He said he just wants to be with the kids and that will help him. I started to say that I know it isn't over and she will try to contact him and that he is just cake eating with him not coming back to the house. He just keeps saying how we have problems but how can we work on them? He got really defensive when I said he was cake eating and said "then get the divorce" and said he was leaving. I then said that I was sorry and asked, "what do you expect of me." He said that he is trying to be honest with me and I said that I understand it is hard and that you have feelings for her. He said, "no you don't understand." He just told me to be nice to him and not get upset when he tells me the truth even if it isn't what I want to hear. I might try baking some cookies and bringing it over to his place for him and the kids. He said he really wanted to call me last night and have me come over with our son. Then, when I asked him if he wanted to do something today together he said "no" and just wanted to be with the kids. He is driving me crazy. I'll try one more month of Plan A.

My husband comes over again the 2nd time for about 10 minutes looking for a boating license. He was alittle dressed up and had cologne on. I asked, "Are you wearing cologne" He said, "Why, is it turning you on." I just said yes but asked what he was doing and said that a friend invited him to go boating and fishing. If it was a guy friend, why would he wear cologne and get somewhat dressed up. He said he wasn't going with OW and said that he was done with her. What if he is going with a different woman now? This is driving me crazy. Each time I see him and he leaves it is heartache for me. He told me earlier that he would probably go golfing today too. If he wants to date, he could of set time aside to do things with me but he keeps turning me down. Yet, I am suppose to be nice and understanding. I just want my feelings to be understood for once. He has really done a 180 on me with this affair and his reasoning.

You notice how his return is all about him and NOT about you and the family?

Think about his tactic and figure out if you want him back in this condition. He is still very much a WS at heart.

The OW's tattoo is a turn off for him because he wants to get back some control over you. Do NOT give him that control.

His cologne s/b a turn off for you when you realize the WS is wearing it and NOT your H. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

As for fishing being dressed up and smelling nice.... any person who fishes, knows that's a line of crap. Even I don't dress up when I go fishing. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

L.

I don't know if I should continue Plan A or go straight to Plan B. I thought to be nice and bake some cookies and bring them over to his apartment tonight, but I am going crazy over his lip service he gives me. He has given me no action that he truly wants to work on the marriage. He says he is done but not ready to come back to the house. I asked if he wanted to do something with me today and he shot me down. Then I find out he is going boating, with who I don't know. Yet, I don't want him back if he is going to keep doing what is wrong, yet it will give us more of an opportunity to work on our marriage. The times I don't contact him but I am amicable around him he warms up to me. But, then my heart breaks when I hear or see him still going out and turning me down on spending time together. My lawyer said that she will have a court date set up in mid October and by then I should know if we will work or not. I have told my H about the divorce paper and he then gets defensive and says that if I keep threatening him it won't work out with us and forcing him to do what I want. I have done everything on his terms. He hasn't committed at all to me. Again, all lip service. Is it time for Plan B and just cut him off until he totally comes back to me or if he does?