I think they already know... but there hasn't been much discussion of it in the house...

It is so prevalent in society that even with me, the lines of morality had become compromised until it happened to me. I would watch a movie and depending on the situation, would sometimes cheer on the adulterer... because their sich was so bad.

It doesn't matter. It is wrong. And besides... I am a great husband. She did not have a bad sich.

Shaden

What's appropriate babble response when she accuses me of hurting the boys by using them as a pawn or drawing them in?

Two years after her A, and she still chooses to be dishonest with you?

Do you think that you will ever be able to trust her again?

I dunno Shaden, but I suspect that even your Plan B is successful and she comes back into the M, you might be setting yourself up for a continuing cycle of pain by trying to have a serious R with someone who finds it so easy to be dishonest with you, even when it causes you so much pain.

I would likely head immediately for Plan D (and expose to the kids) after that last discovery.

The real problem is that Shaden has consistently settled for crumbs.

I'd say that was part of the problem, not THE problem. Seems to me that Shaden's WW is apparently quite comfortable lying to him. I suspect that she will continue to resort to lies to manipulate him out of Plan B if he decides to go that route.

I dunno, but I would be not be inclined to continue a M with someone who chose to continue lying to me two years after being exposed to how devastating dishonesty could be in a M.

Shaden, as you're thinking of Plan B, have you thought about what you would need to see from your WW in order to end it?

Hiya Shaden:

Stating the obvious; just because someone is no longer in an active affair does not mean they have lost the wayward mindset, reasons unknown. So they lurch from chance to tinkers to whatever chasing illusions. It would seem they are a mile wide and an inch deep.

Unfortunately real people get mixed up in the game and even more unfortunately, real kids. What would Shaden need from his every wayward wife to reconcile? How about a brain transplant? Or an ethics transfusion.

Larry

You don't have to defend yourself. You are not the one in the wrong here. It is her affairs that are harmful to those boys and they have a right to know why their family is being torn apart. Tell her "no, ADULTERY hurts the boys."

Speaking of children's view of adultery. I never knew adultery was wrong growing up because my father was a serial cheater and my mother was SILENT. I was taught that adultery was perfectly acceptable.

I watched Bridges of Madison County and thought it was a beautiful, romantic movie. My brother left his wife and autistic son for a 21 year old ho and his wife had a nervous breakdown. When deciding which woman he should choose, my father said "son you have to do what makes you happy."

So, I don't believe kids know it is wrong unless you tell them. If no one tells them it is wrong, they think they must be wrong, that it is really ok.

I think SILENCE is just as bad as teaching them to be immoral.

It still bolis down to the fact she hasn't had her feet held to the fire and become accountable because he's settled. It's all related.

BK

You are correct.

The problem is her moral fibre... she had wrong lessons growing up.

But I have been naive and trusting. I am ok... I have learned alot through this about myself and have grown.

I dated a girl who kept breaking up with me for no reason... drama queen. I kept going back until one day it clicked. I said goodbye and never went back. That day clicked on Monday.

I am no longer staying for her... I am staying for myself and my faith in God. Will this turn into us getting back together... I have no idea... but I will go to my grave happy that I did everything I could. Plan B is the last step.

I have spoken with the boys. They are upset but glad I have told them. I have been trying to reach my W to tell her but she is not answering the phone. Her loss.

The boys were so affected... held me and cried... when I told them that I was not going to divorce but was going to fight for them and for our family as long as I could. I love them and their Mom.

Shaden:

Yea, the drama queen deal. That meant you were second best - someone to be used when nothing better was in view.

Once you are through with Plan A, then what? I have often wondered if Dr. Harley allows for truth telling when Plan A falls on its face. Sounds as if you had an epiphany and that is a good thing.

Specifically at hand is the kid deal; wife parroting those who claim kids are not harmed by divorce. Of course that is totally a bunch of baloney.

Larry

I am so sorry for your boys, Shaden. But you did the right thing. Now they can be taught to protect themselves from their mother's affairs/

I called her let her know... asked if she wanted to come over and also talk to them.

She was furious. All the usual. Claimed I was doing it to hurt her. That she didn't know what I was talking about as far as something going on... give me a briek. Accused me of playing games.

I think she got another call while I was on the line... I lost her. She won't answer now. I'll wait for her to call me back.

I'm sure she's calling all her resources to tell how she is the good one... yadayadayada.

I actually feel relieved.

The boys are ok.

Shaden

Don't worry about her reaction, Shaden. You did the right thing by those boys. Let her worry about her own reaction, she is a big girl.

Your boys will also likely be relieved that it had nothing to do with them.

Boys will be boys and at times, as parents, we admonish them for such behavior. As your marriage teetered on the precipe for the last two years they certainly knew something was wrong they just were unable to put their fingers on it. I am sure at least a portion of that stress was internalized and they looked at themselves as possibly the root cause.

The truth hurts...but it can be relieving at the same time.

Beware the spin police. I believe I recall Dr. Harley or Steve advising an exposing parent to sum it all up...in the face of denials, rationalizations and justifications by merely flipping out the question "When is it ever OK to have an affair?". Your boys can certainly understand that simple fact in the face of the circling whirlwind of the spin doctors trying to reverse your moral highground.

Good luck Shaden

Mr. W

Thanks everyone.

Mr. W. I gave a similar statement to the boys. I said that I made mistakes in the marriage but there is never any reason that justifies an affair. An affair is a sin just like murder. It hurts many people.

My W tried to say that I had no right talking to them without consulting with her first.

I just said that I didn't recall her consulting with me before hurting our family or seeing other men.

This is going to be an interesting ride... but I am far more equipped to handle it than I was a couple of years ago. Back then I was a spoon full of mashed potates crying gravy all over the place.

I told the boys that I expect Mom to be furious with me. That things could not get worse than what they are now. I said that I don't know if we will be back together, but that I have faith in God. I told them that this is going to be a long, hard road because it will be a while before their Mom gets over this.

My older son told me when they were leaving..."You didn't do anything wrong by telling us the truth." Kids are smarter than we give them credit.

Shaden

The best thing about this... I now have two sets of eyes and ears over there. I don't mean that they will be spying for me... I will not be asking them or involving them. I mean that my WW (I guess I'm back to the 2 W's) will be a whole lot more uncomfortable talking on the phone with him or being online with him. It won't stop her, but it will be interesting.

I wish I had a tape recorder I could have given them to hear what she is now saying to them.

Shaden

Just be still Shaden and know you did the right thing and struck a huge blow to the heart of the affair.

((((Shaden))))

I'm very proud of you...That took a lot of courage and grace...You did the right thing...You're in our prayers...

Mrs. W

P.S. About this "Switzerland"...(I think I'll steal that nickname since Pep has "retired" from MB...)


I'm doing great, thanks for asking...and I AM EVER SO QUIET AND DEMURE too, of course!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I need to ask you.

Does your wife know about MB and/or anything about your posting here the last few years???

Mr. Wondering