Scott,




I can not disagree with you strongly enough here. Cinc didn't do anything wrong here. It is the actions of her WH that would be getting him in trouble, not her exposure of them.

Exposure isn't about revenge or punishment. It is about using the resources available to help put pressure on her WH to end the A.

Her WH is in the military and he knows the potential outcome of "conduct unbecoming" on his career. Cinc is fighting for her marriage here, not trying to save her WH's career.



Absoulutely!

And BTW, I have worn a uniform for nearly 31 years and have never seen an article 15 given for an affair as a first resort. Normally, there are several counseling statements and the SM is given ample opportunity to stop the A.

Again, I stress, if her WH is so concerned about his future and his career then he shouldn't be blatantly breaking rules.

Who

I'm going to legal before I do anything else. I will have to go to COC in order to get an ERD and if I know some people in his chain they'll be prying into things anyway.... but like I said, I'm going to legal first.

I guess I'm going to continue Plan A until I get things together in order for me to leave which will still be a few months, but I want to go ahead and start getting myself prepared for Plan B. (Again, I live overseas. It's a pretty big process)

I'm still wondering was what he was saying just babble again.... esp saying that he doesn't regret, that he's glad he did it. I thought he was actually feeling remorse for what he did but I guess I'm wrong????

I can't believe he's doing this to me. He really didn't seem to be the kind of man that would do this to somebody. I didn't think he had a mean bone in his body, but I was obviously wrong.

This hurts so bad.

Cinc,

We know how much this hurts. Honestly. And we are here for you to "talk" to. WS are really like aliens. Most of we BS could never have imagined that their WS could be so cruel, and hurt them in the worst way possible.

Heck, my FWH won't kill an insect in the house, he catches them and releases them outdoors. While he was having his A, he got promoted at work because the woman he was working for wasn't doing her job well and he felt so bad for her that he negotiated with his boss to give her a new position with the same salary.

Yes he felt bad for a 400 pound coworker who really was incompetent, yet he was showing zero compassion for me, the one he had vowed to care for and be faithful to.

I understand the early return date issue and the need for orders if you are command sponsored. I ran into that when I left my XH. He dragged his behind and I ended up just purchasing 3 plane tickets for my 2 DD's and I.

I still remember the day I left, with six suitcases and 4 & 5 year olds in tow. I was so scared that I spent the entire plane trip between Frankfurt and Heathrow in the plane bathroom vomiting.

Please tell me that you are taking your child with you when you go.

Also, good call on going to legal. FWIW, your WH is probably going to ruin his career over this OW and when the FOG clears, and it will clear, he is going to sit back and wonder what the heck happened to his life and his career.

Take care.

Who

Are you sure you want to go to legal before going to COC? I would caution you legal might have a "legal" requirement to take formal action... I suspect You COC can handle this informally with potentially better results. I would recommend you give the commander or senior enlisted rep an opportunity to straighten this out before it's no longer an option.

I'm sure his/your command has a wife's club or onbudsman?

Look for support at lower levels before talking to outside commands.

Outside knowledge may tie the commanders hands in how to deal with this.

-JKT

cincv,

I would ask you to consider looking up "Captain's" thread in this forum. He may have time to give you sound advice from an active duty senior officer's perspective.

I was an NCO in the US Army for a LONG time. That's what I'm basing my advice off of.

If you go to his CoC, you're going to give them the option to handle it accordingly. If they don't, you still have the options of going through other channels, such as legal, IG, etc...

If you DON'T go to the chain of command, the odds are HIGHER that he'll face actual punishment under UCMJ. You're taking the choices OUT of his CO's hands.

What are you afraid will happen if you talk with his CO? The WORST that could happen in truth is that they ignore you, and take no action at all. In which case, you still have the options of going through his chaplain, going through the legal side, appealing to higher in the chain, or going to the IG. If you report misconduct, and they do nothing...they become liable for action under UCMJ.

What are you worried that could happen if you report this to his chain of command?

Had I had a soldier's wife report to me that their spouse was cheating with another military member (or civilian for that matter)...I would have been forced to deal with it. Ignoring it would have gotten me in deep stuff. Not to mention...I have always had zero tolerance for that kind of stuff. You can bet that I would make it clear to them exactly what their misconduct would result in if it continued. I'd probably have gone ahead and reported it up my chain to make sure that it wasn handled correctly.

Why are you balking at this step?

OK, Captain is Navy I believe, I, on the other hand, am an Active duty Army Military Police COL. While it has been awhile since I have been assigned to a troop unit, the general policies are the same.

First and foremost, the Commanding Officer is still the one who has to initiate actions under the UCMJ, not the JAG office. Second of all, you don't even have to start with the CO, depending on your WH's rank, you can start with a squad leader or platoon SGT or even try the 1SG.

Sure one or even two of those folks might just ignore your request, but sooner or later, someone in the COC will realize that you aren't going to give up.

I was, perhaps mistaken re your going to the legal office. The legal assistance office would be appropriate to assist you in knowing what your rights are as a military spouse. They won't be initiating any disciplinary action unless the CO requests it.

Cinc,

At least there is one thing that you can be sure of, and that is that the military will insure that you receive support from WH, and that is more than some folks get with out a fight.

Who

Whome-

The IG wouldn't initiate UCMJ action...but if they were notified of the affair/misconduct, they would be forced to ensure that something was done, correct? If she's concerned that his CoC might 'ignore it'...she can take the route to go through the IG's office and ensure that the issue IS investigated and acted upon. Yes?

And either course is better than not taking action, IMHO.

And...I totally agree. The military is FAR more likely to ensure that his dependents are taken care of than would happen in the civilian world.

I'm going to legal to ensure custody of DD.

So, I caught WH talking to OW on the phone this morn about our relationship. I knew it happens. I've read it on here before... I've also suspected it b/c there have been things WH would say that sounded like something OW would say, but wow to actually hear it!! She was basically coaching him on what to do to get rid of me. Now, shouldn't WH require OW the same??

thanks by the way, for all of your replies.

CH,
Love your "handle"...if only every man understood wife's position as CINChouse... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Stumbled on your thread and am trying to fill in the details. I'm so sorry this is going on. As you are a military spouse, there are MANY support mechanisms available to you.

As a former Commanding Officer, I take very seriously your comment...



Who, exactly, in his COC did you expose to? You mentioned a chaplain, but who else? Do you know the Ombuds? Describe their attitude/experience. How is your relationship w/ Ombuds? Is your spouse enlisted or officer? Rank and how many years in? How large is command? Describe your WH's COC. What support/friends do you have locally? Are you in base housing? Who knows about A?

Some thoughts:

- Depending on how large the command is, the CO has a lot of things on his/her mind, and HOW this is brought up to his level is the key. Human nature being what it is, COs are no different from any other person and they will often react as any other human would. If you are the screaming/needy/accusatory/"crazy" wife, chances are you will be discounted and the command's Master Sargeant/Master Chief (senior enlisted, if WH is enlisted) will "insulate" the CO from such "trivial" matters.

My Ombuds was an invaluable resource, and I leaned on this "professional" volunteer very heavily. If she came to me with a problem, I'd listen very seriously and would take immediate action whenever appropriate.

One very real possible solution is to reassign OW's H. If ombuds agrees this woman is a "troublemaker", that could be easy. Also, I've had a case where a servicemember's spouse was "de-screened" for overseas duty due to behavior that was contrary to the good of the command.

I've had to deal with a number of "craziy" spouses before, and they can often be their own worst enemies, so be cool, calm, collected and articulate clearly the FACTS. I would take my Ombuds' take on the situation in order to sort out the "truth" of the situation.

After you approach Ombuds, you can ask her to help arrange a meeting w/ the CO. This helps get her on "your side", rather than calling him directly and demanding justice. When you do see CO, make clear that you are not trying to "punish" husband, but rather are asking for the COC's HELP in eliminating this inappropriate behavior. Your WH needs to have some senior leadership pull him into their office and give him a "man to man" talk.

You mentioned the Chaplain...what did HE say?

As for custody, do NOT get sucked into discussing this w/ WH. This is something for the courts to decide (if it came down to a D), and anything he may say is irrelevant at this point. This is something Legal should have told you.

Pls provide more details so we can provide more specific and "targeted" advice and guidance.

Again, I'm so sorry you're having to deal with this situation...remember first and foremost that this is NOT your fault, you are NOT crazy, and you WILL get through this one way or another, and will be a better person for it!

Standing by to help...

Hi Owl,

You're correct the IG wouldn't initiate any UCMJ action. They are very likely tho to ask Cinc who she has spoken to in the COC. IMHO, the IG is a step better saved for use after the COC has failed to take any action. It might not even be necessary. She does really need to give the COC a chance to deal with the sitch.

If notified, the IG will investigate and present findings, but again, they don't really take any disciplinary action as that again falls to the COC.

Capts post is dead on with regard to stressing that CINC expose to COC in a calm, dignified, manner. I recommended earlier on this thread that she make an appointment to see either the senior enNCO or CO.

I do understand her reluctance, but unfortunately in the time this thread had been here, her WS has become more and more entrenched in his A.

Who

Okay, so I ran things up the coc. WH is of course pi$$ed beyond belief, but I expected that. They are going to try and help us to reconcile and if all else fails give me an ERD. That's about all I know right now. They've spoken to us both one on one and I guess in the morn they want to speak to both of us.

Legal wasn't much help with the custody. I guess they want WH and I to settle on our own terms.... HA! But also encouraged me to go to COC and gave me a bit of advice I already knew about by coming on here.

This is so stressful!!!!

I still just want my husband back!

CINC: Thats great news! As with all WS, and exposure. He will (try) to spin this into you being vindictive. Pay no attention to the verbal BS.. You are fighting for your family. YOU have done nothing wrong.

Capt: Thanks for posting, I know you have a full plate.

Whome: Sorry I missed your previous post(s). I did not mean to discredit your input. No disrespect intended.

V/r, -JKT

cinc,

Good for you. I know that it must have been hard. I knew in my heart that you had to do it, but also know that it would be painful and embarrassing for you.

I dont know why we BS are ashamed at the behavior of our WS, surely, if we had any say, they wouldn't be acting the way they are.

As far as your WS being pissed, well too bad. It is about time that he got a dose of reality. This is what happens when you have an affair. First, your wife and family suffer, but eventually, you get some of your own back.

Stay strong.

Who

I also wanted to say that the last few days he has been pushing me and pushing me to leave. And BEFORE I went to the COC he even commented on how I don't trust him and he doesn't trust me (believe me he won't stay out of my stuff he's so paranoid!!!!) and that he quit trying b/c it's pointless. He still blames no one (read some of my other posts) and wants to know why I don't hate him.

thanks for the posts! It really helps!

oh, and I wasn't so much embarassed as I was scared to death of what WH would do to me.... (nothing phys) not to mention what COC would do to him

CH...you GO!

I know this is hard.

Remember, you said it yourself - you want your husband back. Right now, he's not your husband, he's some second-rate imposter. Do NOT respond/react to that imposter. Do NOT get embroiled in "stupid" conversations - such as custody, until you are speaking with a rational person. Doing so now, either with him, or CoC confuses the issue.

How high in CoC did you go? Who's going to be at this meeting w/ the two of you?

Remember - cool, calm, collected and clear-eyed. You are fighting for your husband and family - you do NOT need to argue or get defensive - you already occupy the moral high ground.

Pls keep us posted...

Wish I was his CO... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> ...that would be fun <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Don't forget to breathe...you WILL survive this.

I don't know what's going on with the COC right now. I thought they were going to keep me better informed and although WH has told me a few things he lies so much I don't trust anything he says.....

BUT tonight I really just want to vent!!!!!!

I am so sick of all the lies he's telling not only himself but everyone else around!!!! It just down right pisses me off I can't take it anymore!!! Is he really that stupid??? What started it was he actually told his COC that he can't sleep b/c he is so upset about loosing his daughter. BULLSH*T!!!! (He works mids by the way) If he was so concerned about his daughter he'd be in there playing with her actually taking care of her etc instead he's up all day talking to OW!!!! OMG!!!!! but then yesterday I heard everything in between. How we're just different no big deal it happens. Why can't he accept the fact that HE destroyed the marriage by having an A?!?!?!? He tells me to leave OW out of this that she has nothing to do with it he just fell out of love with me. people get divorced all the time it's no big deal! WHAT?????? actually told me I was blinded by OW!!!! Now I'm just getting mad again. Oh, and he had the nerve to tell me that I can believe whatever I need to to make things easier. I cannot believe he honestly believes this as truth!!! SIGH I think I need to read the 'just found out' section again. I'm losing it here!!!

I also found out some dirt on OW today too. Apparently her H is still here!!! I have been wondering all this time how on earth he could not see what was going on.... He can't see it b/c he's not there!!! He's still AD and she seperated (from the mil) and moved back to her home (with her son) to go back to school. I also found out that she recently e-mailed one of my friend's H telling him to try and get stationed nearby so they could party (He was one of the guys she was hanging all over one of the first nights I met her) She also seems to tell everybody just how 'abusive' her H is. Saying that she can't go out b/c he keeps a tight leash on her.... WHATEVER!!! She didn't have any probs running around with MY H!!! Apparently she and her H are rarely seen together though and when they are he makes her sit right next to him... which I have seen that myself. She's also nice and polite etc when he's around. (not hanging all over other men)

I am beginning to believe there is a billet/MOS for THAT couple at every command.

CH, breath deep and hum, "I've heard that works".

If not...

Go deep in the woods, blow something up and scream... I KNOW that works!

Keep your head, it gonna be a long ride.

Oh ya... It time to make a friend, and open the communication channels with OWH. Only you and OWH need know about this.

-JKT