okay, LA

I have opened a new thread in recovery:
A Former Wayward seeks support.
I look forward to your continued support and advice.
Thank you,
FWHofRLT

RLT, I really feel for you.

Remember, you're not a fool. You've experienced a massive trigger, and now your body is reacting. Your emotions are running wild, trying to handle all of this new pain. I saw you talking about breathing--that's good. Try to slow down as best you can.

I wish I had better advice.

rlt-

I just wanted to respond to something your F(?)WH's friend said about not bringing back past sins because "God had forgiven". It's been bugging me all day.

It isn't that simple-and it isn't what the bible says. These aren't my ideas. They are Jesus' teachings.

He was talking to his Jewish audience and, once again, He was clarifying the difference between following the "rules" and actually living out one's faith. He said that if any of them was in the temple with an offering to God (to ask for forgiveness) and remembered an offense against their brother, that person was to leave the offering and go to the brother they offended to ask forgiveness. Jesus instructs us to go to those we have sinned against and confess and then ask forgiveness of God. (Matt 5:23-24)

Yes, God forgives true repentant hearts. But God is also interested in the offender owning what they did. Because that is what repentance is, confessing and then turning away from the behavior.

In the parable of the Prodigal son, the son had to "come to his senses" and then come back. He was prepared to ask forgiveness and then to say to his father he wasn't worthy of being called his son anymore. The Prodigal was willing to become a servant. The interesting part of this is, in the parable, the Prodigal makes his confession "Father I have sinned against God and you..." but that's as far as the father lets him go. The Prodigal had to own what he did, and then the grace of forgiveness restored him. (Luke 15:11-24).

God will forgive us if we ask, but He doesn't let us shrug our responsibility in the process.

Are you angry yet? Righteous anger at the manipulation you have endured - even today?

Your husband has not yet earned the F he so brazenly places in his MB I.D. - he is not a FORMER wayward. He is still acting on entitlement -

A precious passage of scripture defines the difference between being forgiven OF one's sins and expecting to be forgiven while IN one's sins.

BTW, It's an evil person who claims to speak for God as your husband's friend did today. An unrepentant adulterer and enabler of another adulterer is not qualified to receive such revelation.

The OW in my sitch also claimed to speak for God - so much so and I worked hard to correct her way of thinking. I lost a lot of my own recovery time trying to do that.

Please block this man's phone number from being able to call you in the future. There's a code your phone company can set you up with to program his number into your personal do not accept calls from this number. He can go to the trouble of calling from another number, at which point you can file a harassment complaint with the police department, setting up the foundation for a restraining order if needed in the future. Since he's decided to be your husband's evil puppet and evil mouthpiece, he deserves no less.

Do not give your husband another day of heart-ripping pain like you experienced today.

Time to pull out your Scarlett O Hara attitude - "I'll think about that tomorrow" - put it in a God Box and let God handle it. Check out the list I posted on SMB's thread. Get started.

You all are amazing.

I thank you.

Johnstwin, thank you for the biblical explanations about sin. It makes so much sense.

RLT

How are you this morning? Ive been thinking about you all night and this morning. Lets talk about YOU. Vent away, girl

JK,

I really don't know where I would be right now, if not for you and everyone on here. I don't know your faces, but you all have truly been a Godsend to me. My own family doesn't give me this. Thank you.

I had a rough night's sleep. I kept thinking about $hit. I prayed a lot. I asked God to please, please take this out of my brain for jus a few hours so I can rest. I asked Him for wisdom and guidance in this. And I prayed for my husband, that He would find a way to break through to him, show him the true bottom so he can begin to work himself up. I just prayed for answers, and also for my kids who are living in a silent he77 right now. They were just beginning to feel safe. Now the ground shakes beneath them, again.

We go to counseling in a couple hours. I am going armed with a list of what I need, and a list of my boundaries.

I am scared, JK, because today I am not feeling very forgiving. I don't hate Mr. RLT. I am just tired of suffering at his hand. But everyone tells me not to make life changing decisions in my current emotional state, so I am just going to sit here for awhile.

Just a suggestion for you to consider, RLT.

When you pray about this...don't ask for anything specific. Don't ask for God to do anything specific.

Instead, ask God to make His will happen in this situation.

During the time after d-day in my own case, all I could do is pray. All I asked for was God to make His will happen. If His will was for my marriage to recover, then I asked that He open our eyes and our hearts and show us that. And to give us the strength and wisdom to see that through. And if His will was that my marriage was over, then I asked that He make that happen, and that He give us the strength and wisdom for that plan as well.

After all...His plan for you, for your husband...that's all going to be far better than what you could ever plan out, isn't it?

My wife cried when she heard that this had been what I was praying for all along.

You should have seen all the miracles that happened during that time that all lead to our marriage recovering.

God is awesome when you let Him run the show.

Thank you, Owl. I am doing just that.

19.578

How could you not be scared? What you are going through is enormous. Youve been fighting for your M and sanity for a good long while and you find out that nothing is as you have been led to believe. It seems particularly cruel now, as your H purported to "understand" how destructive lies and deceit are. You question everything. What you believed about yourself, your husband and your place in the world. What could possibly make sense now? That is some scary stuff, my friend.

You are right in that making any permenant decisions is to be avoided. HOWEVER, do not let that stop you from asking for what you need to recover. Good for you for going to the counseling session with a list of what you need.

Now is the time to set absolute boundries and let Mr RLT step up to the plate. Lets see what he is made of and if he deserves you.

You can do this. Whatever happens, YOU will be ok.

I'll be thinking of you today. {{{{}}}}}}

(((((rlt))))))

You don't have to be forgiving today. You just do what you need for RLT. RLT is who is important today and tomorrow. Remember when tomorrow gets here, it's today again. Focus on you and what you need for now. What the kids need comes next. All the rest will work itself to God's will. But take care of RLT.

(((((RLT))))

Fled

Back from counseling.

She is recommending a controlled separation in the same house.

Has anyone done this?

What do you think about calling Dr. Harley's radio show?

I think the Harley's sometimes have insights and strategies that are a little different than the conventional wisdom around here, and with as crazy as things have gotten in your sitch, it might be nice to have that insight. And calling him on the radio show is free. Plus he'll probably take extra time with you even after you're off the air.

Just a thought....

I think an in-house separation could lead to even more problems and distance. Plus it's awkward and unnatural feeling -- and it's not like you need even more of that. Does he eat if you cook dinner for the whole family, or do you throw his clothes in with the wash while you're doing them? If yes, then are you meeting his needs and encouraging his bad behavior .... if not, then are you being petty ....

Do you really want to be worried about that level of minutia when you've already got enough on your plate? SH once told me NOT to try to Plan B in the same house, and that if you're not in Plan B, then you have to be in Plan A.

That's just my opinion, though, and it was in a different sitch. I would say call the Harleys for better specifics.

-AmI.

RLT,

I agree with Owl on how to pray about this or any situation for that matter. What God wants for us is so much more and so much better than anything we could ever dream up. When Jesus was praying in the garden he did NOT want to experience what was about to happen to him and yet He prayed, "Not MY will, but YOURS," to the Father.

God will give us comfort, but that isn't the same as removing our pain or suffering. The word comfort comes from two words. The preface, 'com' means "with" and the second is from the word "forte" which as any musician knows means "strength" or "power." So when He tells us He will give us "comfort" it means we can endure our trials "with strength" and "with HIS power" instead of having to deal with it alone.

This forum can be a source of strength and an example of God sending people into our lives to help us to cope with our misery. Those who have already suffered can become our guide in dealing with our own pain.

But it all stems from God having His way in our lives, regardless of what we want and realizing that what He wants for us is the BEST, not just for now, but for eternity as well. He does not want us to suffer indefinitely, and He can give us the strength, by giving us His power, to get us through.

Mark

RLT...I think the suggestion by your therapist is typical of a therapist that has no clue about what they are doing. In my opinion, your H needs to leave until he has demonstrated an extended ability to do the right thing. Actions!
IMHO, he has earned his way out the front door and needs to make a lot of changes before he ever earns his way back in.
I think the therapists suggestion is going to result in prolonged craziness for you...and I would not only NOT follow that plan...I would dump the therapist.

RLT,

I'm with Ami...no way. We did that...it was like living a fantasy. We were married in separate rooms...and it was awful. Awful for us and the kids. Confusing, overlapping...distancing.

Boundaries aren't all or nothing. They are predetermined, progressive enforcements. Not 0 or 180.

POJAing other ways of amends...which is what I hear your WH asking for...a road back where he walks a lot of steps...and your list of enforcements, carefully thought out...and your focus on your choices, not his.

You are as much a blessing to all the posters here as they are to you...there's got to be rejoicing in all the love, the encouragement, connection and prayers I see in abundance on your thread. That's part of your understanding, your growth, I think. Thank you for being here so all this can happen.

In that POJA...possibilities...communication exercises (which will also aid PORH), group support (includes MB, and another IRL); separate IC for WH...even with MC...times for walks and being together in silence...

First you decide your half...if you are going to stay in this marriage or not. And you're right...reeling from the emotional chaos isn't a great place to make that decision and hard not to do so reactively. You made the decision before to recover your marriage. Sometimes you have to rely on those reasons anew...you didn't stay because of who WH was...or H was...you chose to stay because of who you were and what you wanted.

Ask yourself...what's changed? How you stay has changed, I think. Not the why.

LA

I did a controlled separation and it was very helpfull.

Get a new MC. That is the stupidest idea that I've ever heard.