Chai,
great progress in Plan Chai!
make the most of this time to yourself. feeling comfortable in your own skin is very satisfying.
keep up the good work.
hugs,
cgw

"I know that you said you had a new man in your life and that you were done with your XH, but you also said in one of your posts that you thought the feelings could come back in time. I guess there is no guarantee that a new person wouldn't cheat on us. Maybe your XH now realizes what he lost and would be so happy to have you back that he would treat you like a Queen. I don't know... Just thinking out loud I guess."

Well, Mrs. Chai, I am dating, and have one that I like better than the others. The problem with my ex, is now that I look back, he wasn't that great of a husband. He tried real hard until we married, and then got very lazy. I made the best of the situation and had a nice life anyway. So I would never even be interested in working on anything with him.

Hey Ace, CGW

Thanks for contributing. Ace, I read about your new sitch, so I'll get back over to that thread and chime in on it.
CGW, looks like you have been M as long as I have and been through quite a bit, almost up to D. I hope that your recovery is going well.

Believer, I was just trying to get a better handle on how you got to where you are. It's hard to imagine getting there at my stage of the game. Funny, never thought whether WH was that great of a spouse or not. I guess after being M for that long, I'm not even sure what great would be. I don't know that anyone could be what my interpretation of great is.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hope you all have a good weekend.

Who knows Chai? Maybe I'm rewriting the history of the marriage. But I'm much happier now. Life is better WITHOUT my husband. Sad, huh?

I guess I found my happiness in other things - my job, our kids, grandkids.

Believer,

You are one of my role models here. I've been so fearful of growing old alone I guess. This just comes at a time when we had started to prepare for retirement etc.

As I said before, due to family history and lifestyle I probably would have outlived my WH anyway, and I would have been single at some point in time as I got older. The difference in that scenario though was that I would have been better off financially because we both have retirement accounts, life insurance etc. that would go to the surviving spouse. Plus, we would have never given the house away under those circumstances.

As it is now, we are pretty much wiped out financially because of all of this. I went through a lot of what you went through because of all of the money spent on the affair. And now OW will be the recipient of half of the house proceeds (which wasn't much due to the condition and sale in a down market) , his life insurance, and half of whatever else we split. And I'm sure that she'll go through it quickly because she had major financial problems.

Anyway, I hope that I can move ahead as you have done and build up my financial base again. One thing I like is being able to spend what I want, when I want, and on whatever I want. That's kind of nice.....

Well, it was financially devastating to me. Actually to my ex as well, but I don't feel bad about that as he was the one who blew through all the money.

But money isn't everything. Life goes on.

I never planned to be alone and it was awful at first. But there are lots of good men around. If things don't work out with your husband, I'm sure you will run into them.

But I STILL think your husband will be back. Most come back, even mine, who was so madly in love with his "soulmate", who practically ran over me on his Harley when he left.

Too bad for him. LOL

I don't know Believer. I know now that I'll be OK whether or not he returns. Right now, I don't think he will even if his A ends. He's been so hostile for one thing, and for another I think he feels that he has done too much. He was caught in so many lies. I'm not sure that his pride would let him come back at this point.

I estimate that this whole thing has set me back over 6 figures so far when I consider loss on the house, cc debt, and attorney fees. If I can't manage to hang onto my business it could be double that.

I'm going to keep following your example though and forge ahead with maintaning a nice life. Heck, in a lot of ways I have it better. I have a whirlpool tub now!!! And it doesn't spit garbage anymore either!!! Wow, what a life.
I get the whole master closet and armoire, every drawer in the bathroom vanity, my choice of channels on cable, and I can eat a salad every night. You gotta love it.....

Chai,

Glad to hear you sounding a bit up-beat. You go girl, we're proud of you!

Who

Hey Who,

Glad to see you back on my thread. Thanks for the encouragement. I'm doing pretty well overall. I try to keep very busy with work and the new place so that I don't think about it too much.

Xmas is my 1 year d-day anniversary, so that will be a hard one. I'm sure holidays are tough for BS's anyway.

I'm almost totally done with unpacking which I hope to finish up tonight. I'm getting there.

Hi all,

I seem to be doing well. In fact I'm doing very well. A little scary considering that the day we moved (one month ago) I felt like life was over.

My friend came for a visit this weekend and we had a blast with shopping, eating etc. She asked if I would take WH back and I really had to think about it. I surprised myself in saying not sure I want him back. YIKES. Is this normal so soon? Is it the AD's?

I'm just starting to get angry. When I think of the fact that he lived with someone else behind my back for almost a year, I start to get very resentful. Then I think of how hostile he was because I wanted to sell the house. Maybe it's just a phase, but right now I have no feelings of love and not sure I even would want to talk to him.

Normal? Am I done? What??

What you are going through is normal. It is part of the process.
I will warn you again that you are very vulnerable right now, and it would be easy to fall into your own A at this time. I know you didn’t believe that before –but you are probably starting to see that now. Any little bit of attention from a man right now could easily put you into a situation that you would eventually regret. Please believe me when I tell you that right now a man could approach you who has been in jail 3 times, currently unemployed, with 5 kids from 5 different women, but if he complements you, and pays attention to you – you will convince yourself that he is your soul mate. And he will string you along in a dead end relationship for 6 months before you finally get up the strength to say “no more”

So when I say, stay away from men right now – it is not just because you want to recover your M. it is also to save your self-respect. If you get into a bad “rebound” relationship right now, you will kick yourself later.

The best thing you can do right now is just make a decision that you will NOT allow yourself to be alone with another man, or talk to another man on a personal level until your D is final. And also decide to wait the length of time suggested by the Harleys (was it 1 year, or 2?) before you actually file.

Your H has made some bad choices. He has done some really stupid things. BUT he does not sound like a bad man. I am sure that you are losing some of your loving feelings for him – but they can come back. I am 100% sure of it.

I think you guys got off track at some point, living separate lives. He lived with another woman for almost a year – that is a horrible thing! BUT, it sounds like there was so much distance between the two of you that it was pretty easy for him to do that, without you even noticing. I am not trying to beat you up here – my own WxH carried on with more than one OW, for years, and I didn’t notice.
I am just trying to point out that even though he did a really bad thing – I still believe it is something you can forgive, and heal from.

It is good that you are starting to look at him – and your M – more objectively. He will eventually attempt to come back. And you need to be negotiate a new M with him. Neither of you wants the old M back. So now you are gaining the strength, and confidence, to say, “WH, I am willing to listen to your suggestions for reconciliation. But please understand that I have certain boundaries that I must enforce, in order to build a good M.” and you will be prepared to list those boundaries, and stick to them. Things like: no more job that involves travel, no contact with OW for life, etc. I am not suggesting that you make a huge list of “demands”, but spend some time considering what your boundaries will be. Because the day will come, when he will suddenly show up. And you need to be prepared.

If your WH should some how become the rare exception, and he never tried to come back, no harm done. Your list of boundaries can follow you to the next R.
Try not to dwell on the “bad stuff” there will be plenty of time for that. And don’t; forget that any man in our (45-55) age range is going to come with baggage. In the case of your WH, at least you know what his baggage is. I am glad that you are not sitting home crying any longer. But that does not mean the M is “over”. The fat lady has not yet sung.

Hi WofF5,

I know what you are saying about being vulnerable. Jennifer has also warned me several times, but honestly, I have no desire right now for any type of relationship. Believe me, I've had comments from a few males who know that I'm now alone, but I want no part of it.

A business contact that I know wants me to "meet" her husband's best friend because he is "perfect" for me. Oh, and he owns his own law firm, he's wealthy, good looking, a wonderful guy etc. Oh, and he's been married and divorced THREE times but "it isn't his fault." Huh? Let me just say that I don't want to be someone's 4th wife. Geesh. The matchmakers will be circling won't they?

You'll like this. My DD called last night very upset because WH told her that he can't get her anything for Xmas because of me. Because I "stuck" him with the credit card debt, and because I sold the house and lost all of our money. She says "mom, he makes you out to be the scum of the earth and says he wants nothing to do with you."

OK, he ran up 2 "secret" credit cards giving OW money etc. Obviously I proposed that those should be his. On our joint CC, I proposed that he should take that too because much of it was also run up by him taking cash advances. We know where the cash advances went. I still came out on the short end because I agreed to take all of the debt for the business which is twice what the cc debt is. He doesn't see that though. And the interesting thing is, my Atty gave him the LSA over 4 weeks ago and we've heard nothing.

Do I think he'll come around? Honestly no, not at this point. He hates me and blames me for the loss of assets, and if he did manage to reconsider, I don't think that he would try. It's too much work. And no, he wasn't a bad guy, but after an A you do wonder who you married.

So, bottom line is that my mindset has shifted thanks to being on the boards here and listening to advice from you and the others. I'm removing myself from the triangle and focusing on my own happiness and peace. AND IT'S WORKING!!!! I'm finding that happiness in my new job, my new place (decorating etc.), and starting to do some things for me like taking piano lessons again and just sitting in the corner to enjoy a magazine or book. Oh, and I won't forget about my faithful companion - my little doggie. We are buds.

Now, to get through the holidays.....

Well, after 4 weeks my atty just sent an email telling me to come sign D papers. I filed for LSA but WH came back with D. I expected it, but it still gives me a little stab in the gut.

As I stated in my previous post, I'm doing well and will continue to move forward.

At this point, I'm not sure I want to recover, although I would give it another try if he were willing. Do I stay in Plan B (dark) or do I reach out one more time? After so many false recoveries I'm afraid to extend the olive branch again.

Any words of wisdom out there?

Chai,

Well, I haven't been in the place you are right now, but I don't really see any point to your not staying in plan B for the time being. As many here can tell you, filing for divorce doesn't mean it's over quite yet.

I can certainly understand why you are not sure that you want to recover after all you have been through. What you are taking away from this all is a newer, stronger, better Chai. That might just make you too good for your WH, so make sure if he does make an overature towards recovery that you make sure he meets all of your requirements before you let him back in.

In the mean time, try to enjoy the holidays and don't let WH blaming you for all his woes get to you. He has to blame someone for the current state of his life, and isn't quite ready to see that he has brought it all on himself.

(((((Chai)))))

Best,

Who

Stay in plan B. If you didn’t – what else would you do? Suddenly go back to plan A? Don’t you think that would make you look a little flaky??

If the D proceeds, plan B will become his reality. Why would you suddenly come out of plan B, and form a “friendship” with him after a D? You would only come out of plan B if/when he finally shows a true repentance – a full on admission that his A was wrong, and over, and he will never speak to her again. If he has not reached that point – you need to stay in plan B, otherwise you lose all credibility.

I would suggest another call to Jennifer. She really is your best resource.

Meanwhile, I know that you are not really in the mood for a full-scale battle, fighting against the D. But I would still suggest that you stall for a while. Just to give yourself every opportunity to say “I tried everything”.

The biggest lesson I have learned in these past 5 years is this: if you continue to remain above board, not retaliating, not trying to seek revenge, his garbage will come back to haunt him. He used to tell your DD that you filed for D – but now he has filed. That pretty much cancels out everything he said about you filing. He knows you didn’t – he knows that he did. In fact, he will likely start to brag about it. Getting in the last word sort of thing. Of course you don’t need to make a big deal about it to DD, just a simple “Honey, just wanted to let you know that in response to my LSA, your father has filed for D. Just wanted to keep you posted. Please don’t worry, everything will be ok”

And his talk about how he is broke – and it is all your fault? That is just crazy talk. We ALL get that. But here again, let him ramble, you don’t need to do a thing. He is creating a big pile of crap for himself. All you have to say is “I am sorry he feels that way. I wish things could be different for us, would you like a cup of tea?”
You continue to have a nice Christmas, visit with friends, send a card to your in-laws. Just be the adult.

Eventually, people will not believe a word he says. It just won’t add up. They will see that “all he ever does is complain, whine, and cry. Yet she is calm, friendly, nice.”
You won’t be fueling his fire. He will become more and more ridiculous for awhile because he has to search SO HARD to even find anything to complain about.

But at the end of the day – you will sleep like a baby. And he won’t . the best revenge you can have – is a life well lived. This is so true!

You will someday have to say “WOF – you were right. He just called me”

He may not have the heart wrenching, tear stained apology that Sexymamabears H had. Your WH will reach out in his own way. It may be something simple like “I guess you weren;t such a bad W after all.” But it will happen. You two have WAY too much history for him to totally forget. Way too much. When I see a couple on here who have been M less than 5 years, I think to myself “cut your losses now” But in your case, you have lived through too much together. I am 100% sure that he will reach out at some time. But it will just look different.

I wonder if you realize this simple truth – he still loves you. I know that from your shoes it does not look like it. But I am 100% sure of this fact. You may have heard this little phrase: “the opposite of love is not hate. It is indifference” I understand this now.

I do not hate my Ex – I just don’t feel anything for him at all. A little bit of pity – but that is it. He is someone I knew in my past. I do not feel like “I will always have room in my heart for him” I do not feel like “I will hate him forever”. As time goes by, I have fewer and fewer memories of him. We were married for 18 years. It is hard to believe that I am “over it” but I am.

But your H is not in that same position with you – he wants to talk about you. Granted, it is all negative right now, but he wants to talk about you all the time. Unfortunately for him, he is running out of people who will listen to him. Think back to an old boyfriend you had in the past – perhaps in high school. Do you still want to talk about him? I doubt it. Can you see where your WH’s behavior is so over the top that he obviously is not erally “moving on” with his life?

BEAUTIFUL post, wof!!!!

Hang in there, Chai!!!

(((((((((Chai))))))))))

Typing that last post to you, I was trying to remember how my WxH first reached out to me. As I was saying earlier, it wasn’t the heart-wrenching tear stained break down I was looking for. He was not on his knees begging forgiveness.

I think the very first time I realized that he had regrets was when he called me at work, after OW#1 got a restraining order against him.

Our D had been final a couple of months. One day he called me at work, in tears. He is a security guard at a community college ( he calls it “public safety officer” but lets just call it what it is ). A uniform cop showed up and served him with a restraining order, saying that he was not allowed to contact OW. She claimed that he was stalking her. I don’t think he really was stalking her – I think that once she broke it off with him, she just wanted to make sure he never called her again. She had a friend who worked at the courthouse so she easily got the RO.

Anyway, he was crying and said “ she just had me served at my work. In front of all my friends. I can’t believe what she has done to me”. And I replied with “look what she did to ME. I lost more. I lost my family”.

He then said “I know. I am so sorry. What can I do? How can I make this better?”

That was the big event. I stated my boundaries, he tried for awhile, but for him, the lure of a new R was just too much, and he started up again with another married woman.

My WxH is socially stuck in high school. He is not interested in amature, adult R. He will continue to move on to another “girl friend” when wife number 2 becomes too much work. That is why I am through with him. I want so much more than that.

I was just like you – I was certain that he would never come back. That he was too stubborn, too proud. But when he really hit bottom – he called me first. Because who else knew him as well as I did? We were married 18 years – no one on earth knew him like I did. I cleaned up after him when he puked on the bathroom floor!!

Chai

Like you I don't believe my WH has what it takes to come back to me, even after the A ends. Too much pride, not enough strength of character to do the work of recovery. And he's also stalling on signing our LSA (neither of us can file for D until 1 year of separation, but I'm going to take of that myself next summer.) And like you, I seem to be getting to the "moving on" phase pretty quickly. As the months pass, more of my thoughts turn to planning for life without him and feeling good about it!

But I smiled when I read your post about not knowing whether your WH was all great when you were married. While I've been in Plan B, I've thought about that same question as I've pondered whether I would take him back on the small chance he wanted to come back. As I look at it, I can say no, he was not that great of a husband. He was too self centered and too immature to be good husband material.

It's funny though, before the A, if we had split up on more amicable terms (is there such a thing?) I would have said he'd make a really great buddy--someone to hang out with, have fun, get some advice from, have coffee or lunch with every so often. But when I add the newfound knowledge of seeing how he can lie and disregard the feelings and lives of others, he's off the buddy list too! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, I'm rambling now but I wanted to post to say I'm right with you in Plan B--recovering for me. WH will do what he will...

Smartie

WofF

Question for you...when did you know you were done with WH? Do you have any relationship with him now?

My WH had the nerve to say (before he scooted out to live with OW) that he wanted to dance at my next wedding with me. If my jaw hadn't been on the floor I'd have laughed my head off.

Seriously, since we have no kids I don't see myself ever contacting WH again. That is a strange realization since we spent 20 years of our lives together. I'm trying to reconcile having someone who was with me for half my life just be GONE.

Smartie

I love you Smartie...

You never told me about the dance part....Girl, don't you hold back on me. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Let's talk this weekend, ok?

Queenie