Do you really want all these other men to wander in and out of your children's lives??

FTS

Cpr,

I know you're hurting like crazy, angry and probably really afraid...now is the time to not react to your feelings.

Why? Because of your little girls.

The chance of them being molested, abused and raped skyrockets in these circumstances. You can be a great father to your children...keep them in their own home and file for divorce and full custody.

We have MB members who never regretted doing what it took to protect their children legally and got custody. You can do this. Would you think about letting them leave (because they want to) if your WW were a drug addict?

Affairs are drugs...waywards have real chemicals released in their bodies and brains. Think hard and long about your WW as an addict and make your decisions not based on your feelings (like she's doing)...rather directly on your beliefs and priorities.

You can do this. Even in great pain and fear, you can choose to act decently, even heroically.

LA

What can I do now that she has the kids?

Oh, Cpr...I can spout a lot from the threads I've read...sure haven't lived it, though. I feel with you...from the huge fear I had...and I didn't have vulnerable little girls...I had a 14-year-old son and a 19-year-old son at home at the time.

And my WH left and didn't take his son. He sure came back for him, though. A great thing, btw, because then he chose to recover.

Can happen for you...and if you're choosing the divorce route, which is an understandable choice...then call a divorce attorney right now and find out your rights as a father in this regard in your state.

I looked up Mortarman's thread for you...he's actually a big success story here...this thread wasn't during that time...however MrWondering and others gave great advice, and I remember Mortarman finding another website somewhere that gave step by step instructions of what to do to get primary custody of your children.

So here's the link to what I thought might be a relevant thread for you...from the oldies but goodies (this infidelity stuff is miserably timeless, I believe):

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...part=2&vc=1

You can also click on Mortarman's screen name and read his posts to others...he's da man, I promise.

You can do searches for "father" "primary custody" "how to" on here and the web, I imagine.

And you can understand now why you don't allow children of 11 and 6 to do what they want...they want to leave with Mommy because Daddy's really mad and Mom's the victim. They don't understand, cannot reason as adults. So saying you let them go with her because they wanted to isn't where you want to make your choices from.

I can tell you from my experience of being a 10-year-old girl in the middle of my parents fight...them asking my sister and I who we would go with...my dad or my mom...right then because they were splitting up. I felt physically torn apart, btw. To put that decision on a child is horrific...we want both. Period. Same roof. We want our parents to act like adults, even when they hurt terribly, even when they fear greatly.

That's what we really want.

Your family is in my prayers...did you expose her A's to her family? Did I understand you to say you kicked her out, and the kids wanted to go with her? Did she go to one of her family members' houses? Exposure is you sharing truth with others who matter...to her family, your family, the wives of the OM...your duty remains. Infidelity affects about ten times the people than the two people having one...ripples outward.

Do so calmly, informing, and normally, you'd ask for their help in ending the A's and restoring your marriage. Doesn't sound like what you decided. I back you on that...just know that rash decisions lead to long regrets...regrets are for what we didn't do...remorse is for what we did.

May not sound like we're looking out for you--we know that walk of regret/remorse...we really are.

LA

I gave her the choice to either end all contact with the other guys or go. She said there was one that she was not sure she could let go. So she went to her mothers. Today I am not sure I want a divorce, MW says we are over. Her mother told me this morning on the phone that me checking up on the phone records was the last draw and it was wrong. She said that we would have made it through our problems if I wouldn't have gone snoooping. Crazy
Now there are 6 adults and 4 children in that house.(MW & my 2 kids in one room, Her brother and his wife in one room, Her brothers two kids have there own rooms in the basement, and Her mom, dad & mentaly chalenged sister in one room)so 10 people in 5 bedrooms.

So what do I do now, not sure I want a divorce, but I would love to have my children. Would going down and filling for custody end all chances of us getting back together? I know my first thought should be my kids.

So what do you do now, not sure what you want and not sure what to do.

I think we've all been there...understandable.

What I shared with you is...in a crisis, and yeah, you are in one...usually, we change. We change our habits, our perspective...something vital in us changes.

I'm specifically telling what to change...what I believe worked for me...not what to do. I realize I'm not great on this side of communicating because we can say "do this or don't do that", like applying water to a blaze. I'm asking you to first get clear on how you get the water to the blaze, then act.

If you base what you do on how you feel...which is where the waffling comes in, mostly, for us as human beings...we may feel like we're done one moment, and nowhere close to giving up the next. That's a signal we are trying to decide based on how we feel, not on our own goal.

And tied to how we feel is how our spouses may or may not feel...intertwined even. Makes the rollercoaster go up and down and clarity a rare commodity.

Get clear on how you're going to live your life from here on out...based on your own goals, your own beliefs, your own code...or if you're going to base your stuff on others' stuff...when they say it's done or not, when they say this is what will happen...that's THEIR stuff...not your own.

Yours matters.

And no human being can predict the future...not even, the next moment...only now is real and here and within our control, our responsibility.

You want to have your children at home, with you, in the family home. Their own place...their place of routine and routine environment...their terrority. What shakes up the routine is mom moving out...doesn't break the home. Changes the environment and the routine. Them going with her takes away all of it...their space, routines, the known parts of their lives they can put their hands on.

Which is what we crave when we fear the most...just even physical location, known areas...and what is ours.

The intangible...being able to put their hands on their mother...assure themselves she's there, she continues to exist and is theirs...and to see and touch their father, to know he is there and continues to exist...these are vastly more impactful than the physical...but that's gone, breached...so the physical becomes temporarily more important.

If you base your choice to find out your legal rights, obligations and limits...what actions you can take right now for the best interest of your children on SOMEONE ELSE'S possible response, than you'll do nothing. Because you have no control over the outcome (possible response)...only your own choice of action.

shinethrough just posted that "Infidelity is the epitome of irrationality." True words. Why would you base your logical decision to do the right thing based on the irrationality of someone else? Why you determine your steps where you walk in your own light on someone else's fog?

I know you wouldn't. Your own inner pain, turmoil and permissions are fogging you up. Not bad or wrong...go for clarity if you want to act from respect and love. Only you can choose to do so. Doesn't mean you will do anything the right way...you can darn well make sure you do the right thing in your own way.

Have faith God is with you...and your WW and your kids. He's there, I promise. Have faith that if you mind what you can control, what you are truly responsible for, and clear up those lines, then what's best for all of you will come to pass...and may be that making your choices based on your own code is the very thing which will save your marriage.

I have no doubt that if you provided a judge with the two living situations your children could be in right now, side by side, that the court would say at home, best interest of the children. Won't happen until you act...study, learn, ask and know. Gathering knowledge is an act of power...your own power...and will help you right now, giving you feelings of productivity...clarity before action.

Not guesses. Find out yesterday. Know what's in place...literally millions of people have gone before you, been in your shoes, when their WWs leave and take the kids...there's a trial to follow, struck by those who have gone before you. The ones who assume they won't get what they want do not act...and fulfill their own assumption, don't they?

Those that hold reality and KNOW they cannot know outcome and still act to save their marriage, bring their children home, step by step, with a plan...like Plan A...choose their results. No matter the outcome, their results is that they changed their whole lives by changing themselves, how they made decisions, didn't or did enforce boundaries, where they made those boundaries (around themselves or others), and KNEW in reality what their highest priorities really were without lip service...they created and acted to their own code...

and that changed everything.

Which is why we're here on MB...passing it on. Because I lived from my feelings my whole life up until three years ago...and the crisis of my life came and I changed HOW I lived, where I lived from (made the code, own my stuff), and now have an entirely different life experience.

Get a lawyer to advise you...a temporary custody hearing is in order...you're half the marriage, are brave and willing to act on behalf of your kids, yourself and The Marriage.

I know you are.

Because you're here. You can do this.

LA

Thanks you LivingAnyway!

I have me kids tonight, I am not sure if this is just for tonight. But I do feel much better with me kids here.

The one thing that sticks in my mind about get full custody is: My parents divorsed when I was 6, at age 12 I ask my mom why didn't dad take us. We never stayed even one night with him over the years. Mom said the kids belong with there mother. My Dad passed when I was 17 (The same month I ment my wife) My Mom passed when I was 20. I married my wife 5 months later. My children Love there mom very much, and I worry about making them hate or resent me.

But I know that the kids come first and my feeling come second. Well atleast while they are here with me anyways. I have never been a very strong willed person. Especialy when it comes to MW. I have invested everything in Her. MW/Kids & MW's family are really all I have. That makes it even more dificult. I feel like I have lost everything sometimes and other times I feel like I deserver better (or thats what I tell myself anyway).

I am trying and apreciate this forum. It helps more than I can say!!!!!!!!!!

if you are in your home you should NOT let the kids leave there again. That is their home and if your wife wants to be with them, she knows where to find them. Too many fathers make the mistake of letting their ww take their children. Bad move every single time.

I am going to see a custody attorny today. I made the appointment and will follow this through no how much ut hurts my soul. Because of you guys I know now the difference between right and wrong.

Talked to the lawyer yesterday, He has all the paper work drawn up. But I decided this morning that things are happening to fast and I am going to let all of this soak in before I make another move. Just don't want to burn any bridges that I can't repair.

Paperwork for temporary custody arrangements, pending a Legal Separation? Those kind of papers?

Notice the word temporary...and separation...which you are currently separated. Both are the truth...not your truth. They acknowledge reality...which is where you are to live in Plan A...not in fantasy assumptions.

You may be experiencing "things happening too fast"...doesn't mean they are. You are choosing to validate reality...temporary primary custody due to separation. Good job. Doesn't mean you aren't committed to saving your marriage, have your goal set on rebuiling and having a thriving marriage...doesn't make your actions now contrary to your goal. You can't get THERE from here without holding reality with both hands.

Good job.

Know that not acting doesn't stop or continue things changing or not outside of your control. When you hold still, you can sure see where your power ends better...and when you move, you can see how far it extends.

Both are important to know.

Burning bridges mean you choose to cut someone out of your life.

You cannot make someone else burn their bridge to you...you're not that powerful. They choose. And they can see cinders where you see an easy path. Know your half instead of studying theirs and acting from their half.

You can repair your own feelings, thoughts, beliefs, perspective and perception. Your stuff. You cannot repair others's stuff. They do that. That's in their control, not yours.

Thank you for continuing to read and be here...for listening and pondering and deciding. You're allowing our influence right now...and you can cut it completely out, allow in a little, somewhat or a lot. It's not all or nothing. You control what and who influences you, right now.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

LA

Lawyer is still on hold, and she is still at her mom's and does not want to come home. She is letting me have the kids any time I want. But she is still talking to the other guy or guy's. I ask her to stop and she has nothing to say. My question is: it be wrong of to me to tell her to stop even though we are not together? The person she is talking now is someone, I do not know and information about him is something I have not yet found. How can I stop this? She does not want to fill for divorse at this point. But I question why. I think I know why, because of her living and financial situation. Wouldn't it be wrong to threaten her with filing if she does not stop. She would just lie to me then hu. What can I do? what should I do?

Paperwork for temporary custody arrangements, pending a Legal Separation? yes

CP:

She won't be undecided forever. If you want to stay married to her, communicate that, but let her know that you do not want to be married to a person continuing affairs.

IMHO, you need to keep the kids with you. Keep them in the same schools. Prove stability. Document everything, and go to every school event you can, doctor appt, etc.

One, it's the right thing to do. Two, might just convince her that a home with you and kids is better than the unknown, and three, if things don't work out, you will look better to the judge.

I know you are on a rollercoaster ride right now, but your actions right now are the most important of your life. Don't let emotions guide you.

Use the number, i was in the same situation and telling the OMW was the best thing I did. The two cheaters love to keep it a secret as it keeps the affair burning.

WIFE moved back in yesterday, things seamed great? Is it wrong of me to check her phone records, to be sure she is not talking to the others? The reason I ask is because she changed her password and I ask her why and she said she was testing to see if I trusted her.

Uh huh. Sounds a trifle fishy on its face. Trust her to do what? Did she commit to not contacting any of the OMs before you let her come home?

LH

Cpr,

Still with you, kiddo. We're pulling for your marriage.

Why would it be wrong of you to check to see if the A is ended? Do you want to know the truth or make it up?

Why allow her to move back in without setting down some rules for transparency? Now, keep in mind, my WH moved back home before deciding for the marriage...this wasn't the way I did it...however, seems reasonable for you to have healthy marital boundaries in place right now.

Her moving back in...has she re-committed to the marriage? Then transparency (giving you all her current passwords, cell access, email, account, etc.) is her choice to rebuild trust and for you to HELP her going through withdrawal with accountability. That's right...you help her when she knows you'll check...verify.

Please keep in mind there is no reason to trust her right now...trust has to be rebuilt...through transparency, over time. You trusted her blindly before...you know that's not healthy for adult humans to do...it's fantasy, not reality. We are capable of anything...it's us choosing not to have A's...not something just in us which keeps us safe...it's a choice we make.

Half of trust is earned..the other half bestowed. Both are choices...both take time and awareness. It would be an act of fantasy for you to trust her now. Would also be an act of fantasy to never trust her again if she stays transparent, committed and communicative. Be in the middle. Be okay with "I will not choose to trust anyone blindly again. We're all human. We change. I know how to obtain the truth separate from my truth or your truth. That's my marital boundary...my responsibility to know if our marriage is under attack."

Did she agree to counseling?

Are you making O&H statements using "I" instead of "you" sentences? "I feel excited you've chosen to come home. I believe in our marriage." Things you really do feel, separate from "it being" to YOU being? "I feel great you're home."

Get clear on your communication...your half is vital. You can do this. Did you call the OMW?

Act calm and reasonable...it is reasonable to NOT trust right now and have faith she can rebuild your trust through her actions. Not trusting is a natural consequence to what she chose to do...DO NOT get in the way of her consequences, 'k? Respect her more. Act from your choice to respect what she chose and isn't choosing right now...and verify you know the difference.

LA

CPR,

Under no circumstances are you to trust her right now. Her changing her password is exactly the wrong thing for her to do. Her attitude sucks. She is the one who has to earn your trust. Make a decision right now to implement plan A. The way you love her right now will be the kind of love Jesus demonstrated. Sacrificial. I believe people need your love the most when they deserve it the least. But you decide if you want to save the marriage or not. Or give it a deadline that if she has not ended all contact by x date you ask her to leave.

Tell her you have faith in her but no trust. Tell yourself that your happiness does NOT depend on her actions. You will have to be strong beyond what you ever thought you could do. I know how much pain you are in right now and you want to go back to the way things were but that is not possible. Do Not Trust Her. My WW attempted 3 or 4 times to initiate NO contact and so far 3 have failed. Your wife is ADDICTED. She may or may not have valid reasons to be unhappy in your marriage but she will have an extremely difficult time giving up her cheating ways. You need to tell her there is no room in your marriage for more than 2 people- her and you. You need to express and tell her (calmly) how much it hurts you deeply when she cheats. You need to tell her you cannot trust her beyond how far you can see her. You need to decide for yourself to protect your own well being how much of her lies and cheating you can tolerate.

Your best moves right now, as said before, do not base them on feelings but on logic. Very difficult to do but you need to be defensive. Start keeping a detailed log of her whereabouts, ask her where she is, where she is going, when will she be home. Ask her if she is seeing anyone else but be calm about it.

I hear what you are saying. I don't trust her, but I am afraid to tell her that. I don't want to fight with her, but I also don't want her to have contact with him. I feel like she has control over me when I am with her, and when we are together it feels good. Am I in denial?

I have not said anything about any of this with her since monday (11/5/07). She calls me when I am at work and lets me know were she is going (I did not ask this of her).

I am just not sure how to approach her on this, without making her defensive. I feel like I am looking for some magic words.

She seams to be kissing my a$$, but I worry that this is just a smoke screen. But why would she come back if she still wanted something alse?

Thank You