I wasn't sure where to ask this, but here's what happened. My husband went on a "business" trip with another woman the week after we got married and never told me before he planned it. I found out in front of all his coworkers as the other woman was excitedly talking about how they were going. It was a 20 hour car ride and a 5 day trip and just the two of them went. Our honeymoon was only 2 days long. I told him I wasn't ok with it and begged him to make other arrangements but he wouldn't. By his own admission he treated her better than he treated me on their trip. He confuses their trip with our honeymoon. She was in his hotel room. They discussed her sex life on the car ride. And when they got back all they did was flirt endlessly with each other (he will admit to this now). He even says he made her his priority. He wouldn't talk to me on the phone when she was around, because it might hurt her feelings. The two of them worked in a small windowless room for several months after the trip - just the two of them. He told me I was the biggest mistake he ever made (I was furious about the trip). They both would shove in my face all the things they did at work together. She rubbed it in my face that she knew she spent more time with my husband than I did, she laughed in my face about the trip. She lied to me about him calling her at home and getting things for her (I have the phone records and he really never did call her). He's told me how great the trip was etc. Their coworkers tell me they think she is in love with him. I know it sounds like it, but I know they didn't sleep together. The problem is it still feels like it. They went in my car and I still can't sit in it and not think about her sitting there with him. It still makes my skin crawl when she prances around the office and bats her eyes at him in front of me. He is getting better at not playing back at her, but . . . . I still can't forget what's gone on and I can't shake the feelings. The didn't sleep together, but it sure feels like it. I feel betrayed, pushed aside, and replaced. I wish he would try to talk me out of it and reassure me, but all he says is he's tired of hearing about it and he's not discussing it. He told me before that if he could take it all back he would. That she doesn't mean anything to him and there is nothing about her that does anything for him. The problem is I don't feel it. I think all the hurt is so deep that I just can't get rid of the feelings. Any suggestions on how I can move on from it and get it out of my mind?

Run for your life.



It is NOT your job to learn how to move on from this. It is his job to help you through it. And he wont do it. He just tells you he is tired of hearing about it. What does aht tell you about yoru future with this man?

he planned a trip, with another woman, that would happen 2 days after your wedding, and he did not even tell you about it? Get out now. This is one of the worst stories I have ever heard. This man has no respect for marriage at all.

Problem is - I know you won't listen to me. You will talk about how you "can't give up on him" becuase you love him. and you vowed to be with him forever and can't go back on that promise now.

But he is not engaged in this marriage at all. I think you know that. If he would do something like this so soon - you are headed for even more disaster later.

If you believe this then my dear you are in for a world of hurt. I agree, run... to the courthouse... have this "marriage" annulled. If it's too late for that, then divorce this loser pronto. He is a callous and cold man who cares not one whit for you or your feelings.

Hun, you need to get out now while the gettin's good. This is only a sign of things to come.

And you KNOW this because.........????

Let me guess, he told you so and would NEVER lie to you, right?

Your new H and you have not even completed your honeymoon, and he's calling her and he's calling her at home and getting things for her..

And you want to forget all this? Why? Your gut instinct is screaming out loud to you, and you want to forget?

Sorry, Plad13, you are attempting to burry your head and the sand and pretent it isn't true. How sad for someone who just stared their life out with a new H. Wanna live like this for about 40 more years?

I'm speechless. I could go on far about an hour over this sitch, but I don't think you are really prepared to hear this. Nor should you be as a newlywed.

I wish you much luck.

All Blessings,
Jerry

Let's see, you've been married for a week and your husband cheats on you. How to get it out of your mind, you ask? Easy. Divorce his lying cheating butt and find a decent man, there are still some out there.

As awful as it porbably sounds to you, it is a good thing you found this out now rather than after years together and some kids thrown in.

AGG

run far and fast.

Get an annullment TODAY!!!! If this guy wants to remarry you then he has to earn his way back over a long period of time.

Save yourself from future heartbreak that you cannot imagine especially if you have children with this "man"

They "discussed their sex lives", these 2 are more than friends. Tell him he is "dismissed".

Yeah I've wanted to run many times and his stuff was almost one the porch when he got home from his computer system training. The thing is this is my second marriage and I do have two kids from my previous marriage who I don't want to put through another divorce. And I know I sound really blind, but I do love him. I know he's lied to me before - but I don't think he is lying about this one. He's been so painfully and bluntly truthful about some things that I think he would have told me by now. My first husband cheated on me numerous times and although this emotionally feels very similar, that's where the similarities stop. Other than hiding the trip, (which by the way was also planned by his boss, a.k.a. his dad - who (surprise!) doesn't like me at all) he has been almost too forthcoming with some things. He hasn't tried to hide being around her, doesn't hide the cell phone bills and I have open access to his email. He didn't at first but he now makes sure they are not alone anywhere and he doesn't hold her hand in the prayer circle anymore either. And that has been confirmed by someone who works there. Call me stupid but I really think nothing happened. He did however screwed up royally, doesn't want to accept responsibility for it, wants it to go away and is definitely married to his work. But regardless I really don't want my children hurt again. They adore this guy, won't go to sleep at night until he is home and tucks them in, and it would just crush them. I know it doesn't seem like it - but he does have some good traits. So anyway, I know the easy thing, and maybe the right thing in the end would be to run away, but I really do want to try to make it work. We've been married a year and half now so he's been in my kids lives for 3 years or so now.

This all happened a year and a half ago???

yep, that's why i don't understand why i can't forget it

Well, I guess I can understand your desire to try to save the marriage, since you do have a lot of time invested.

How have things been since that initial shock? Has he been the model husband? Is everything else great other than your inability to forget?

Good days and bad days. The good ones are really good and the bad ones are really bad. Like I said the first few months were horrible with them being side by side etc. Since January or so though he has seemed to make some efforts - at least physically. I mean like he will try to come home earlier or try to help around the house a little. We went on a trip together this summer and he managed to only say one smart thing about their trip the whole time. But it is emotionally where he hasn't tried and his attitude - which is my guess as to why I can't forget it. He's tired of talking about it and thinks that I should just forget it. I don't feel any empathy from him and don't feel like he really felt bad about hurting me like that. He just wants me to stop bugging him about it.

Sometimes, plad, life and people do not offer us good choices and there really isn't an option that involves a winning outcome. Sometimes it's necessary to choose the route that will provide the least amount of destruction.

From the information you provided, it sounds to me as though some of your choices include:

* Leaving your marriage and cutting your losses.

* Continuing to maintain the status quo that you have since D-Day. From what I gather, that isn't something you find satisfying or you wouldn't be here.

* Make some very clear, logical decisions about what your standards are and what YOU require for yourself and for your children in order to remain invested and present in this marriage and allow your H the freedom to choose to meet your standards or not to.

I married my H a month after D-Day - a decision that obviously wasn't based on logic and was absolutely drenched in denial. Some of my rationalizations sound eerily similar to yours. I hear a lot of that same denial in your posts.

I did choose to try to Recover with my H. I have made a lot of mistakes and I certainly don't wish for you to suffer as a result of making those same errors.

Please don't settle for crumbs from this man any longer. Either require more from him or resign yourself openly to the decision that you are making to basically be this man's doormat.

Because any pain that you and your children endure from this point on is something you are VOLUNTEERING yourself for and by proxy for your kids.

I firmly believe that if you don't start requiring that he step up to the plate, you will most certainly continue to receive nothing more from him than what he is currently giving. There is NO WAY that he can respect you for that and I find it difficult to believe that you could respect yourself for it, either.

I understand that you do not want your children to have more pain to cope with. Pain in life is a given. It is how YOU respond to it that is going to protect you from further pain and protect your children not only from any current pain, but from future pain in their lives based on their own choices - the ones they learn from the example you set for them now.

Is that what you want to teach them? Do you really wish to watch your child/children years from now allowing someone to treat them disrespectfully?

What are your requirements for remaining in this marriage?

Also...

Have you been informed that an affair is an addiction?

As long as your husband has ANY CONTACT whatsoever with OW, you can guarantee that his affair is either still in full-swing or will be very shortly.

That's like telling an alcoholic that it's okay to hang out at the bar as long as he doesn't have a drink.

Plad, plad, plad...

I'm sitting here shaking my head... I was married to a serial adulterer for 25 years, who in spite of MY best efforts to try to forgive and forget, and get over it... dumped me for an OW and put me and my daughters through a very painful divorce anyway.

You are making a very BIG assumption: that if you somehow find a way to shut up and put up with this you and your children will be spared a divorce.

The description of your husband sent several warning bells off in my (still shaking) head. His failure to not only inform you of the business trip with the OW, but to totally leave you out of the decision, AND THEN to fail to take any responsibility for repairing the damage his decision caused you, is a clear signal that this man is about as insensitive as a husband can be. And then you had to put up with this OW basically gloating about it to your face?!?!? Girl, just how desparate to stay married does your WH assume you must be to put up with that?

IMHO your WH and the OW most definitely are involved in an EA, MOST likely are also involved in a PA, and without a doubt share the joint goal of humiliating and emotionally abusing YOU!

The BEST thing you could do for your children is to dump this loser ASAP. Children understand far more than adults believe. What message do you want to send to your children about how THEY should respond if/when this sort of emotional abuse is aimed at THEM? IF you decide to stay in this marriage you should at the very least demand respect and that the damage he inflicted be addressed BY HIM and repaired BY HIM.

I think part of the reason my XMIL put up with my XFIL's garbage was because she had already been divorced once and didn't want to go through that again... So instead she allowed her children to be raised by a monster who she never stood up to and now they are majorly screwed up and have no clue what a normal healthy marriage looks like.

The fact that your FIL was apparently in on the whole scheme is something that would HAVE TO be dealt with in order for full recovery IMHO. Either your FIL would have to knock off whatever agenda he has against you and/or your husband would have to make sure he will never again be played by his father like that.

Oh and your husband and the OW cannot continue to work together, or to have any contact with each other - PERIOD!

Thank you all for your thoughts. I think you hit the nail on the head with the EA. I've told him all along that's what it feels like and he says no. I think some of it is that he doesn't want to accept what he did was wrong. They still do work together, although he swears up and down that he doesn't talk to her unless it is absolutely necessary. Don't worry, I don't buy that either and don't think there is any time where he should "have" to talk to her. The problem is I don't know what to do about it. They won't fire her and other than that he would have to leave the family business. I'm already on bad terms with my FIL because how dare I be mad about the trip. To make my husband leave the business would not only do me in with my FIL but the rest of the family - not to mention the work that my husband loves (or just the coworker I know). I wish there was a way to really get through to him what he has done and how important it is to do whatever he has to to make things better - other than walking out on him.

plad,

I think he had a PA with her, and that it MIGHT be over for him, but maybe it's still dragging on, but he's not happy about it. I think she is the one in control here, which is why she's still working for the family business. She has him right where she wants him, and uses exposure to you to keep him there.

I would print out a copy of Joseph's letter and give it to him, and tell him that you cannot just "let this go" until you have the details of the trip, ALL the answers that you need to have. The whole truth. You don't have it yet - because you sense it, and that is what is nagging you. He tries to thwart you, because he cannot face it. He thinks by gaslighting you, it will go away. He couldn't be more wrong - and he needs to know that.

It will only get worse for him if he doesn't come clean. He will lose the marriage.

If you bury your head in the sand, you will have a very unhappy life. Maybe you will stay married. You might. So what? I'm not sure I would want a marriage over everything else - especially if I knew that there was all of this going on right under my nose, and I CHOSE to look away. I couldn't do it. It would eat me alive from the inside out. Can you do this until your kids are moved out?

Is it worth it to just "stay married"? I don't think so. Your kids will sure get some funky ideas about what marriage is about.



The OW is there because your husband wants her there, or because he is afraid to tell you about his affair with her. Or both. There's no other explanation.


Now, what CAN you do about it?

Plan A.

Plus - if she won't leave work, you could make a nuisance of yourself. Make frequent visits to your husband there. Drop in for lunch with him as often as possible. I mean, make it every single day if you can. This takes away her possibility of using their lunch hours to be together, because if they are having an affair, you will bust that time up by being with him then. If they are not active together, you will make her feel crappy, because you will be shaking your marriage to him in her face by showing her how happy you two are together - and in Plan A, you get the bonus time of spending more hours together, making him happy, and doting on him a little more.

Drop in unexpectedly at work. Take him little gifts of things he likes - meet that emotional need. If he is "into" something, say golf for example, take him a new book or magazine you "just ran across and couldn't wait for him to see". You again get the bonus time and Plan A points. OW sees you with him, and she gets upset - husband has to calm her - breaks down the liason between them, and builds points for you with your man.

See, the idea is to do great things for him in Plan A.
By doing them at work, you also get the advantage of watching what he's doing there. Add to that: the OW sees your marriage as being a good thing (and this works against her imaginings of his having a bad marriage, his being unhappy, and all the rest). You build love bank deposits because you are doing nice things, spending positive time, and while you are with him, being sure to put in a few admiring comments or gentle touches, etc. You will be doing lots toward breaking down the affair, as well as building your marriage.

With any luck, at some point, the OW won't be so happy at work anymore. Because you now invade that "sacred" space that was her domain, it will become a place that she sees as tainted BY YOU! Because you drop in unexpectedly, and his time is no longer managed by her, and you seem to have taken control of him, she will become more threatened. Maybe she will leave of her own volition.

Whatever you do, just don't talk to her, or do anything that could be remotely deemed as unkind, snotty, mean, vindictive, rude, or pushy toward her. To you, she is nonexistant, unless she speaks to you first. If you must speak to her, you merely acknowledge she is present (say, "hello" politely, smile, nod your head sweetly). You are polite to her, as if she were a person you did not know but were nice to. That's all. You are NOT evil, mean, or discourteous. Do NOT give her any ammunition to be used against you. You do not speak about her to others AT ALL, especially to those who work there. Don't let anything be used against you. Whatever you say to anyone in this workplace will get back to her - and whatever you do, don't talk to your FIL about her. THIS IS WAR.


About your husband: tell him you intend to fight for your marriage, and that you believe that he has had either a PA or EA. Don't let him know about this website.

Tell him that there are lots of ways to overcome affairs, and that an affair is NOT the end of a marriage. That you can and will forgive him, but that the first step is that he has to tell you the truth about what happened.

And then, give him Joseph's letter.

Start there.

But do this at a time when you will have a few hours to talk - not late at night!

SB

That's because there IS nothing you can do about it. What you are so desperately seeking are all solutions that are beyond your control.

You want to feel safe. You want to feel protected. You want to heal. Am I right? Are those your true motivations?

If they are, your current methods for accomplishing those goals will never, never work. The reason for this is because those methods rely upon someone else in order for you to accomplish them.

Not to mention that your plan is to rely upon someone who has/is showing that he doesn't have your best interests at heart. Pretty scary, huh?

Do you want to heal and to feel safe and protected?
Or do you want this marriage at the expense of those things?

It is okay to want both the marriage and the protection and safety, but you can't control him and can't force him to provide those things for you.

So YOU have to decide for YOU which is the higher priority and then...you offer him the freedom to choose.

Control and manipulation are not love. If you want genuine love and care from this man, he has to be free to choose.

I understand that is a scary thing...to let go of control of the outcome. The truth is that you CAN'T control him and attempts that you made to do so will only drive him further away.

Decide what you need in order to heal and offer him the choice.

I can understand your position. It sucks to have crappy choices - ones that both involve potential loss, but you can spend your time and energy trying to change your choices or you can accept the ones you are faced with and take responsibility for protecting yourself. This is how you avoid being a victim.

Quite possibly, he could choose to make your marriage a high enough priority to provide the protection that you need. That is not going to happen magically. It will only happen if you make it a requirement.

Again, thank you. It's kindof baffling how perfect strangers would spend so much time trying to help. I know I've read Joseph's letter but I have no idea where it was. I guess I need to get a little catty and suck it up a little better. It's so hard to be so nice and sweet to him sometimes. It ends up making me feel like I'm the fool. Like I think everything is fine and there's nothing going on. I struggle with pretending to ignore it because I guess I feel like if they both know that I know then they won't do anything. But whoever said they enjoy making me look like a fool is probably right. I need to make it seem like they aren't hurting me and take their fun away that way.