Night before last we had an intimate encounter of course out of obligation.

On a previous post I mentioned that I was doing a 180, W attempeted to come on to me and I ingnored her and acted as if I were asleep.

She told her GF, that she tried but I was asleep, but she noticed the next am, that I was pissed (a frigin lie)!!

So now I am back to block one were she thinks that 1-2 intimate encounter keeps me subserviant. Meanwhile she continues to talk behind my back in a negative fashon.

TWO FACED LIAR!! I just dont get it!!

This am I am having a rough day. My sister in-law is convinced that I have a WW, where some good friends of mine, (who have survived and affair), is convinced that she is not. Conversation with my friends H, he suggests that I let this go, let by gones be by gones and build toward the future.

I don't know if I am capable of doing this. IMHO we cannot continue with ANY progress until the secrets are eliminated and she can start being truthful, honest, forthcoming with some fortitude.

I CANNOT get her to open up to me!!! For sure, she is definately closer to her friends and freely volunteers information with them rather than me.

What is wrong with my picture? I am going insane!!

THe A subject is on the back burner. I feel that this issue with trust and honesty is way more important if we are going to get past this.

Someone please adjust my attitude and let me restart my day!

Thanks for your timeand consideration.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sorry, LT, I think the A subject needs to be on the front burner. Because, if there is an A and you don't deal with it, than she will never open up to you, you will never be able to build a future, and you will never be able to get past this.

If there is an A, you NEED to know about it ASAP, because you will need to use specific affair-busting tactics and have a strategy for restoring your marriage.

And, if there is an A, you need to find out about it as soon as you can, so that you won't be emotionally bruised and battered and will be fit to deal with it. Or as fit as you can be.

Also, if she has just started an A, and you catch it now, you could nip it in the bud before it gets too entrenched. I know she's been distant and withdrawn for 5 years, but you don't know what's going on.

You NEED TO KNOW. If you can rule it out, great, but you need to thoroughly investigate it.

You want some honesty from her. If she is in an A, you'll never get that honesty. So, the A issue and the honesty issue are linked. One follows the other.

Hope this helps, although I suspect it isn't what you want to hear.

Are you guys in any sort of MC?

You aren't sure of an A, don't have any supporting evidence of one, but you suspect it based on her behavior which you see as withdrawn and manipulative. And neither of you are meeting each other's needs -- is that about the gist of things?

You've done the investigating that people have told you to do and haven't found any evidence to support an A, correct?

Have you ever actualy said to her "This isn't working. I want a better M than this. I know a counselor who can help us." ?

What actions have you taken to improve your M? You're only responsible for your half, but you are responsible for your half. So what are you doing to make yourself a really great H? What is your plan for improving your M? I'm not sure what plan it is that promotes pretending you're asleep to get out of sex, then being angry about her reaction to that .... but I think you need a better plan. That one seems dishonest and manipulative to me.

-AmI.

Good points coming from both of you, thanks for the replies.
CC teh A has been pretty much ruled out. After monitoring communications, logger on computer, semen detection all are without remarkable results.

The bad mouthing and body language are all I have. I think that there are some other issues here that I am having to identify and address (hence my confusion and difficulty).

AmIok - good points. I am practicing meeting her EN and avoiding LB, I am driving home everynight (1hr 20 one way) rather than remain out of town 2-3 nights per week).

The avoiding sex is two fold:

1) I am developing a sexual aversion to her because I am not stimulated when I look at her and am aware of the lies and deceipt.

2) Starfish had recommended a 180, which is what I have been doing, with some success.

No we have not been to a counselor as of yet. I am hoping to regain employment in the town in which we reside before persuing that course.

I have asked her to complete her EN questionair and provide me with a date for which we can sit (just the two of us) uninterupted by kids and have this discussion. This has already taken a month without any results.

We are going to get our marriage blessed (Catholic) in November and hopefully this will allow her to go to confession and maybe get rid of all this pent up....whatever has been eating at her for the last five years.

I am giving it 6 months before initiating plan B

OK, that's good. From your post, I did not get the impression you'd fully investigated, but it sounds like you have done some investigating.


From what you describe, it does sound like something has been eating at her. My wife was withdrawn and distant, mostly sexually unavailable, and badmouthing of me to her friends for about five years, too. In her case, it was based on severe neglect on my part - lots and lots of BIG ongoing Love Busters. Once I eliminated them, she reacted very quickly.

Based on what you've said, you've started eliminating Love Busters. This is key - I could have tried to meet my wife's ENs for months without any response from her as long as I continued to Love Bust. How long has it been since you stopped LB'ing?

Sounds like you have a plan. Stay flexible, in order to deal with new developments, but otherwise stick with your plan. Don't let a bad day derail you!

Good luck!

Which lies and deciet are you thinking of when you're developing this sexual aversion?

You were pretending to be asleep .... how is that honest?

Is it safe for her to tell you how she feels? You are here yelling that she's a two-faced liar when she tells her friend how she feels .... how do you think you would react if she said it straight to you? How have you reacted in the past?

Maybe she's not lying when she's telling her friends how she feels. Maybe she really believed that you seemed angry this moring. Maybe she is unhappy and those are really her perceptions of your actions. Just like you percieve her trying to initiate sex as an attempt to keep you subserviant.

Neither one of you are being honest with each other. And you're doing the same things you're accusing her of -- pretending to be asleep, coming here and bad-mouthing her behind her back, all while you're also making arrangements to have your marriage blessed (which I assume is some form of re-comitment?). Talk about mixed messages and manipulation.

If you want Open and Honest -- you start first. Get open and honest with her. Start sharing your stuff and make it safe for her to share hers.


Regarding your other strategies, as far as I know, 180 and Plan B are affair-busting strategies. You've ruled out an affair so, in my opinion, neither of those plans are going to help you build a happy M. And neither is allowing yourself to build up more and more resentment and "aversion" toward your wife. Have you read His Needs Her Needs? How about Fall in Love, Stay in Love?


Also -- how are you meeting her EN's if you don't know what they are (since she hasn't done the ENQ)? A month with no results -- maybe you need to take some action. "Honey, things are not going well. I've got a babysitter coming to take the kids to the park tomorrow afternoon so you and I can sit down and talk about ways we can improve our M." Or "I scheduled an apointment with a marriage counselor on Tuesday at 3. I would really like you to be there with me." Can you really fault her for not taking action if you haven't done it, either?


You seem really angry with her. I'd bet that she feels similarly. If you keep fostering that situation, then you'll just both end up even more angry and disconnected than you already are. You're the one who's here, you're the only one you control, so you decide -- do you want to take the actions and steps you need to take to to pull yourselves out of that spiral, or do you want to just keep creating more frustration and anger and resentment for you both?


-AmI.

That is what I am talking about!!!!

I was just having a bad day and needed some re-assurance.

AmIok you are exactly correct. I am ashamed for speaking of my wife in such a negative fashon. But what better place to vent and table concerns and frustrations?

Its members like your self anc cc who keep members like myself in line.

I have been deligent in practicing meeting her EN's and avoiding LB for two months and I have read HNHN cover to cover. It really opened my eyes to the tings that she needed that I was not providing.

On the flip side however, I am not receiving any reciprication. Based on the feedback that I have received today and from what my friends are telling me, I need to be more patients and continue with my current courser of action.

Thanks!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I think AmI makes a lot of good points here. Although, I don't think 180 is an affair-busting strategy in particular. I know star*fish thinks highly of it as a strategy for changing things in a non-affair situation.

LT, you said you'd give it six months before trying a Plan B. If I were in your shoes - and I was in similar shoes a few years ago - I'd try to put my ego aside for a while and just roll my sleeves up and address this problem. You and your wife loved each other once. Try to remember how you felt when you got married, and instead of focusing on resentment, focus on the good in her. Use that as much as you can to keep going.

Remember, your marriage doesn't have to be this way forever. Your goal is to change things around and rebuild a loving, intimate marriage with the mother of your children. You took vows with her, and one of those was "for better or for worse." Well, this is the "worse". Work on making it better, and you need to make sure you stay positive - including staying positive about your wife.

How does a W reach a point of feeling safe to share private information with her husband?

She wishes for the marriage to be blessed so she can legitimately go to confession. She has been unable to do that for 14 years.

CC,

Thanks and once again you all are right. I am in this for the LONG haul, I just get frustrated at times and feel like nothing is working.

When I reach this point, I am compelled to come here and get an adjustment (consider this a mental chiropractor)! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks again!! I really appreciate you alls time and consideration <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

LTK, I love this line...

"(consider this a mental chiropractor!)"


Great image. Thank you.

LA

ahh, ya had to throw in the chiro line, lol almost!