Good suggestion, I know her and her mom are going to be looking at houses for a long time today. Ill mention it to her, of course she still has "Surviving an Affair" she hasnt touched lol.

On the topic of her not reading SAA, try to cut her a little slack. It doesn't necessarily mean that she doesn't care or something along those lines.

For a long time after D-Day (and sometimes still) it was really, really painful for me to read books like that.

I can remember after D-Day "trying to Recover" with Patriot, we printed articles from this website on the topic of recovering after an affair...we were reading them aloud and every time we came to a part where Dr. Harley referred to the OP as "the lover", it felt like someone was stabbing me directly in the heart. To hear the OP referred to as anything with the word "love" in it was disgusting to me and very painful and it made me really, really angry.

Once during one of those recovery attempts, I outbursted at Patriot and then grabbed the printed pages and flung them across the room.

If she spews venom (or outbursts) at you about the affair again, try to remember that it is simply a childish (and destructive) way of dealing with overwhelming pain and negative emotion.

I'm not advising you to believe that you deserve to be treated that way (you don't), but if you respond childishly to her childish response, the damage will escalate.

If she verbally assaults you and you respond with something like (just an example), "Okay, you are saying that you hate me and that you think I am a mean, cruel person for doing this to you, are you really trying to express to me that you are hurting right now and that I caused you a lot of pain?"

That would probably serve to diffuse and keep you both on track, while at the same time lead her to learn how to express her emotions in a less destructive fashion.

Thanks for the advise Frozen, we havent done a ton of affair talk really, she knows every single detail of mine. I know very little about hers, I really dont care to know details. Sometimes I wanna ask her a few ?'s, but I know im better off not knowing, I dont want things to eat me up like they have done her. But I can say we have been doing pretty darn good. We have a lot of thinking to do weather to build a house like we planned on before all of this happened or buy one. We both are leaning towards building one.

We are going to switch sunday school classes this sunday at church. We are going to go to the young couples class where we learn about money,relationships and such young couples run into. But we both are putting forth effort to make eachother happy, shes feeling pretty good today she said.

But me on the other hand, the last few hours of work I feel like ive came down with flu like sickness <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />. I feel horrible and I have to work 6 days this week, lucky me lol. Oh well its life, Im so much happier and have so much more than I did months ago, so I can smile still.

Again thank you all so much that has stood with me and believed in me. I hope with time we can be a great success story. I know with so much help ive had here we can do it but yet I still have so much more to learn and so much time to continue doing it. Im not going anywhere, I might not post as much but I will defiently get back to you guys everyday or so.


Update yall tomorrow!!

Hey Zach:

Been a few days, how are things going?

Resolve the cell phone issue yet?

Scott

Sorry! Been very busy the past few days and have stayed away from the computer. The cell phone issue doesnt really seem to be a big issue anymore, havent had any texts or phone calls. We have had a few arguemnts just normal ones but we have learned how to listen and resolve when we do which im pleased about. We are doing good, and are looking for a apartment.


I have a big Valentines day surprise for her. Shes ALWAYS wanted a Teacup Yorkie pup. Shes been talking a lot lately about one and I have worked 6 day weeks the past few weeks and imma get her one. I have made the deposit for one and its a cute little dog. She will be so happy, you know how girls want cute little dogs haha. But I know she will be so happy and pleased to get one, she would never think I would care that much to get her one, esp when they arent the cheapest thing in the world.


Ill keep ya updated day to day <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You are swimming in trecherous waters and refusing to put on your life jacket.

Zach, have you actually read SAA? I know you said you did. Go back and read about extraordinary precautions. There are OW and an OM in your marriage. You MUST take extraordinary measures to PROTECT YOUR MARRIAGE. It doesn't matter if she hasn't gotten any texts/voice messages from him. You both need to be willing to eliminate his ABILITY to contact her, as well as OW's ability to contact you.

You do not yet understand that the entire MB program is based around protecting your marriage. Go back and read, STUDY the sections of SAA that teach HOW to recover.

Neither one of you have taken steps to actually recover your marriage. You both are living in a fantasy world. The work is just starting. You can't sit back now just because she has taken you back. NOW is the time to CREATE the marriage you both desire. SAA describes HOW to do that.



Don't kid yourselves. You haven't LEARNED, you are LEARNING. But I really don't think you've done the necessary work to even begin to make the changes necessary. SAA describes the Point of Joint Agreement and Negotiation. Have you studied these? Do you know how to do these and are you implementing them in your marriage right now?





Zach, this is nuts!!!! You have shared here that you have debt. Buying this dog is not a responsible thing to do. Changing your ways includes making sound financial decisions. Buy her a card and a reasonable gift. And perhaps share with her how you plan to provide a good life for her by making good financial decisions that in the long run will build your assets and provide a stable, comfortable standard of living for her and your future children.

Buying a dog is a major life decision that should be agreed by the both of you through the Point of Joint Agreement process.

Zach, you need to slow down and realize you and your wife have really not started the recovery process. Yes, you both have said you want to work on the marriage. But neither one of you have started the work. You need to study the MB principles, talk about them, and implement them.

Dr. Harley says that although many couples stay together after an A, many of those marriages aren't "recovered". Why? Because they didn't implement the MB principles that move their marriage into a state of recovery.

Are you willing to settle for just getting back together, or do you want you both to have the marriage your both have always wanted.

Things you need to study and implement:

No contact - letters need to be sent by BOTH of you to the Other Persons

Extraordinary precautions

Emotional Needs

Love Busters

Rules of Protection

Point of Joint Agreement

Negotiation

Zach, sexymamabear is quite correct. Here you are, shaky marriage, in debt, and you're making an expensive impulse buy - of an animal!

Zach, do you have any idea how much it costs to care for an animal every year? Do you know anything about a teacup yorkie other than the fact that they are cute? Do you know how much a typical vet bill runs?


Oh, you "know" this? And how about when the dog makes messes all over the apartment? Or chews up her newest pair of shoes? Does she want a dog badly enough to "happy and pleased" to deal with that?

The fact that the dog is expensive seems to please you. Will you still be pleased when the dog breaks its leg and you have to pay to have it fixed? Broken limbs are not uncommon in teacup breeds. Just ask Britney Spears.

Zach, if you want to do something good for your marriage, pay off your debt. Be responsible, rather than impulsive.

In case you are wondering, I have nothing against dogs. I have a great dog. But since I was going to assume the bulk of the care of the dog, I made sure that I was good and ready. It was a POJA between me and my husband.

An animal should not be a surprise.

PK

Thanks for the posts.


I have paid off most of my debt. Ive paid off my credit cards and bills. I only have my monthly car payment now. And im in the process of selling it and using my daily driver everyday which is paid off. I also just got a huge raise at work and my finances are getting caught back up. I DO understand how much it costs for a dog. I have a $2200 miniature english bulldog I bought 3 years ago, and as you all know bulldogs have bad health problems. I understand what this dogs health issues are and I read up a ton and spoke with the breeder for a while. I actually told my wife last night about the pup im getting her and I havent saw her eyes light up and smile like that since our wedding day.


I am fully aware of how much animals cost. Ive owned tons of snakes,cats,dogs,bearded dragons and I have a mini bulldog. Her MIL is keeping the bulldog cause their other bulldog had a heart attack and passed away and shes so attached to ours we arent going to take him from her. Yes we're both young and a dog is a big decision, im 20 years old making over 60k a year. I can handle the finance of a dog. Like I said, I told her about it last night and we are aware of the vet bill ect. We take our english bulldog almost every month to the vet. Thank you for your concern and I do appreciate it but yes I have thought this over a lot and am fully aware of how much an animal costs.


On the phone issue I agree with you, there is still ways of contact and that really bothers me at times. I was going to let us settle down some and ask her to change her number. I know this may not be the right thing to do but right now Im not sure if she will change her number willingly. She doesnt wanna do the whole new number thing. I know we have been through these things but I do trust her.


I havent read all of SAA, but I agree I need to go back over it and start doing the MB principles. Thanks for opening my eyes some more and help me realize some of the things I need to be doing.



But anyway, we just got home from church and lunch with my Family in law. We switches sunday school classes to a young couples class that teaches us about life and finances, children, ect. I just got done washing her car for her and we're going to pick up some older friends I work with (they are very happily married couple) and go uptown.


Ill post tonight. Thanks!

You do realize that this job could be gone tomorrow, don't you? It happens all the time. People who are totally confident that their job is completely secure end up laid off, fired, or the business just closes. What are you doing to plan for that possibility. It is recommended that people set aside enough money to cover 3 months of bills. And that is on top of the long-term savings that you should be doing. How much money have you put away to provide for your family in the case of financial hardship? How much money are you putting away monthly for long-term savings? How much money are you investing to increase your net worth to better provide financially?

Are kids in your future? If so, NOW is the time to get some savings in place. NOW is the time to develop the healthy habit of saving.

With all the "extra" money you have coming in now, I would suggest that counseling with the Harley's be your TOP priority. Why have you not invested in that?

I realize that the puppy lights up your wife's eyes, but I am disapppointed that you do not yet take seriously the need for implementing MB principles RIGHT NOW. Zach, this is your MARRIAGE we are talking about. The marriage you were so desparate to have back. Right now you are dropping the ball.

Have you not learned anything here? If your wife is refusing to send a no contact letter and eliminate ways that OM can contact her, then she is purposely keeping the door open for OM to re-enter her life, and you would be a fool to trust her. Dr. Harley says we SHOULD NOT trust our spouses. But instead we should do everything we can to protect our marriages and he tells us HOW in SAA.

Your marriage IS NOT in recovery. Your wife is right now a typical wayward refusing to close the avenues of possible contact. If she is not willing to send the letter and change her cell phone, then she is very wayward right now.

You are kidding yourself right now. You are thinking you are in a sweet honeymoon, but you are presently living with a wayward wife.

I suggest that you bring her here and have her post her story. She will be told the things she needs to do to take steps to protect the marriage and work toward recovery.

You will end up in a false recovery if you both do not deal with the no contact issue right now. One of you WILL be contacted by the OP in your marriage.

And let me tell you, Zach, false recovery is VERY PAINFUL!

Zach,

Are you ignoring me? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Zach,

Are you ignoring me? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Zach:

I don't care what these people say, congrats on getting a dog!

That was my advice way back!!!

Anyways, glad to hear you are still doing well. I am on here less and less but best wishes to you, your wife, and your new dog.

ps I have four!

OMWH,

The dog isn't the issue.

It is about Zach being responsible. It's simple money management. You HAVE to plan ahead. I suspect he has not. If not, now is not the time to spend the "extra" money. It's time to establish a habit of saving. My husband's wise financial decisions at 18 and 19 years old, allowed us to have a HUGE downpayment on our first home. It is also why we have NEVER had any debt other than our mortgage and why THAT is almost paid off. I thank God for a man who is wise with our money.

Also, the biggest issue right now is Zach realizing that they are not IN recovery. They are rather at the front door, and right now are choosing not to walk in. They must start implementing MB principles if they want a fulfilling, AFFAIR-PROOF marriage FOR THE LONG HAUL.

They have not done anything to AFFAIR-PROOF their marriage.

SMB- No im not ignoring you, my laptop got broke when I stepped on it the other day. So Im only on at work, or imma use the W's computer since she brought it over.


Ill read through it here soon.

OMWH,

How has infidelity touched your life? Are you a BS, a WS, or an OM?

Have you implemented Plan A? Plan B? in your own life?

Have you implemented Dr. Harley's program for marital recovery?

What experience do you have with Dr. Harley's program to make marriages affair-proof? Because THAT is what needs to happen with Zach and his wife. Or this marriage is doomed to repeat the same destruction again.

This board is here to help people recover from infidelity by implementing Dr. Harley's program of affair-proofing their marriage. Most (if not all) of the advice you have given on this thread has NOT been about helping Zach work Dr. Harley's program.

Patting him on the back and boosting him up about NOT working Dr. Harley's program is NOT helping Zach's marriage. Please stop.

I'm here because I care. I want to help Zach and his wife have the marriage they desire. I am giving my time to work with a WS even though reading from a WS's viewpoint, has at times caused me to trigger.

Please don't continue to give Zach positive strokes for NOT working the program.

I speak this with a tone of respect for you. I believe your intention is to be helpful.

Sorry ive been busy with work and my computer broke I havent had the chance to hop on here much.

Well we've been doing ok, I woke up this morning and her phone was lit up and saw a few texts of her and her friend talking about the OM's myspace, his picture and so on. I got a little mad ect. about it, didnt say anything to her but I did leave the text up on her phone when I left to work to show her I saw it. She did delete him off of her myspace and confronted her about why would she even care about his picture and ect. She agreed to change her phone number cause she wants this to work out. Her friend brought up the subject about the OM. We're going to look at apartments this weekend and probably move into one we found.

Just a quick update.

SMB:

Who appointed you as an advice policewoman?

You are exactly the kind of person that makes this website bad, giving out what you think is expert advice when you don't even know his situation completely.

Yes, I support his efforts to change himself and be a good husband. If you disagree with that, then have a good day.

But don't tell me what to say and what not to say. It's a free country.

OMWH,

You are free to post whatever you want. However, don't expect to get pats on the back for patting Zach on the back for NOT doing the work to recover his marriage.

I take it you are not willing to answer my questions above. That would indicate TO ME that you have little experience actually implementing Dr. Harley's marital recovery plan.



Zach,

I caution you to be careful who you listen to. If you look long enough, you will always find someone to tell you what you want to hear. Is that what you are at MB for? Just to hear someone tell you to do what you want to do?

I tend to believe that you came here because you want help in recovering your marriage.

You have been advised by more than just me to take this seriously and start implementing recovery steps.

If you continue to ignore people who are trying to help you understand the principles and put them to work in your marriage, the few vets (and I don't mean me), will eventually get tired of wasting time and will stop reading your thread. It appears to already be happening.

There are plenty of people on this board who DESPERATELY WANT to work the program and WANT help in learning how.

Zach, it is really no skin off my back whether you take any of my advice or not. It seems you don't really want help to recover your marriage FOR THE LONG HAUL. It appears to me that you just want to feel good, you want the pain to stop. And when it does stop and you do "feel good", you think your work is done. But in reality, it is just beginning.


Your marriage is in major crisis....really! This "honeymoon" will wear off and you will still be in a marriage that has not healed or recovered from these affairs. What steps that Dr. Harley recommends have you taken to protect your marriage from future infidelity?

What are your plans to begin recovering your marriage?


What about my earlier question... Are you willing to use all the "extra" income to invest in your marriage for the long haul by calling the Harley's???

Zach,

I also share the hope that you will develop a plan. While things might "feel" okay at the moment, I don't think they will stay that way unless you take steps to change the habits that led your marriage down the path it took.

I'd love to see you take advantage of that opportunity as such a young age.