I'm in a kind of tricky situation here:

We have been in recovery since March this year. Things have been up and down, but mostly in the right direction. DH has been doing his best in being honest with me and showing me his effort in rebuilding.

Here is a situation I don't know how to handle. I know his on line activity to put it this way. But he doesn't know I know. Every time he is alone at home, he would be on his computer. He works from home sometimes and he is just on his computer a lot.

I found out several months ago that he tried to get on p**n sites whenever he got a chance to be alone at home. He usually doesn't have any chance to be alone at all and I can see he doesn't want to be alone, he wanted to go to all kind of activies with us, but occasionally he would be alone with his computer and I could see he would try to get on those sites. Also we have a filter so he wouldn't be able to get on those sites, he would try to break the filter but couldn't. Then he would settle for some sexy pictures of actresses and stuff which are not filtered. Not really very bad stuff, but I still feel uncomfortable for him to view them at this time while we are only 7 months into recovery.

I could see he would resist the urge, but he failed most of the time. He would talk about going to gym several days before the day he would be alone ( like the Vets day that he had a day off from work and I didn't and kids had school also, so he would be alone and he knew that before hand). He would talk to me about his plans for that day, trying to reassume me and stuff. And I can see his resolve and I truly can tell that he doesn't want to be alone at home.
He didn't know I monitor, but I caught him viewing sometimes and he would feel ashamed. So he knows about my fear, which is probably why he wanted to assume me beforehand about his plans and stuff...

But when the time came, he still would try to go on those sites, knowing he wouldn't able to, then settle for some not so good quality pics...And the cycle goes on...

This does hurt me because unless I confront him, he wouldn't talk to me about his urge to view them.

I know if I tell him I know his activities, he would get more strength to stop it, but I don't want to reveal my source to him.

Am I being dishonest here?

How do I bring this up safely to him? I know he is trying and I can see some inconsistant success sometimes, but he doesn't seem to be able to resist for couple of months at a stretch.

Other than this, he has been doing his best in all other things. And our SF is good also.

But this little thing that comes when opportunity comes (him being alone) still erodes my trust and I feel I need to confront him, but couldn't do it in a proper way...

Am I asking too much here? Is there a way to bring this up to him and get this solved once for all?

Thanks a lot in advance for any advice.

LA

Perhaps he needs some better distractions for those days when he's alone at home. Are there any projects that he could start or finish that has been put off? How about getting him to do the yard on those rare days off, so that you guys can have more family time on the weekends? Maybe he could arrange to volunteer at the kids school on those days... Try to find him something constructive to do on those days to help him resist the temptation.

I certainly would not reveal your source, because I'm assuming that source would probably be removed and then you'd have no way of monitoring email or anything else either. And if you can't reveal the source you can't really confront either... It's a catch-22 for sure.

you are his wife...not his mother. It is not up to you to find distractions for him...he needs to be responsible even when not being watched.

Let him know you know. Let him know that this is a personal boundary of yours. Most assuredly do not monitor his internet access without his knowledge if he is not wayward.

So, yes, you are being dishonest and it needs to stop. I suggest you read up on the policy of radical honesty.

Best of luck to you.

Give up the source and get him on board with knowing it's there and accepting of that fact. Your boundary is it HAS to be there.

Try to instill that you are merely his accountability partner and NOT his parent.

If he knows it's there...he won't go.

I don't think my wife is keylogging me (but she's always welcome to suspicious or not)...but I behave on-line as if she is.

Lots of temptation out there and I'm not perfect though I've never had the slightest problem with internet porn. (It takes EFFORT and WILLPOWER not to linger when you accidentally stumble upon such sites)

Of course...he MAY just switch tactics and bring in print materials. Maybe do research TOGETHER about the damage and harm caused by porn in a marital relationship. He needs to see, read and decide for himself the man/husband/father he intends to be instead of it appearing or being YOU who is being his parent (despite what his friends think who are merely trying to justify THEIR behavior and bring along a friend).

Mr. Wondering

A recovering wayward who is still trying to access porn....still has a wayward mindset and is still untrustworthy IMHO. I'm very upfront with my husband about the fact that I intend to monitor what he does now our life has changed because of infidelity.

"People who have nothing to hide.....hide nothing."

I couldn't care less if my husband looks through my email, my Internet history etc. I don't care....because I'm not hiding anything. I'm not his mother....but I am his betrayed partner....and if he wanted absolute trust....he shouldn't have cheated on me.

He blew it. I'm not that girl anymore.

I've forgiven him....but he needs to understand that the kind of innocent, blind trust that I had before, has been destroyed forever. That's not entirely a bad thing either. It's healthier to understand that marriages in this society are constantly vulnerable and that all of us need to be onguard (especially with a partner who has already proven unfaithful).

Being aware of what your partner is doing online....is SMART. I hardly ever look, because I no longer feel much of a need to....but I've told him that I intend to to spot check every now and then for own my peace of mind and to keep him honest. He accepts that. When I find something I don't like....I tell him. Usually I find nothing....but the rare time that I did....I was glad I did because I was able to nip something in the bud.

Tell your husband what you know, and how you know it. Be upfront about the fact that you are naturally going to be more cautious and inquisitive for a while. You're entitled to that.

Part of recovery after an affair is ACCOUNTABILITY. This is all part of it.....and if he's not doing anything he shouldn't be doing....it's pretty painless compared to the h3LL he's put you through. Privacy is about what you do in the bathroom....not what you do on the Internet. You haven't invaded his privacy....you've invaded his SECRECY. This is something he's "hiding". And he's hiding it because he's ashamed of it....so try to be compassionate.

Now....go tell him the truth. There's nothing "tricky" about the truth....it's either the truth...or a lie.

Good luck

star*

I am not convinced that you should give up your source.

I'm not advocating dishonesty - more like cautious lack of openness, but is it WISE for her to show him her whole hand at this stage of the game?

I don't necessarily believe that the Porn is as a result of the infidelity - I could be wrong. I also agree with Star that blind trust was a once-only offer in a marriage pre-infidelity.

He should know you monitor him and why and even how. I don't see a problem with that. It's the same as checking a cell phone for activity IMO.

I would ask some...wondering questions. Mention that something has seems to be bugging you and you can't put your finger on it. Ask him if he knows if anyone has been up to no good, then watch his reaction. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

L.

I don't believe it is, either.

But like an affair, it IS an escape - and one that is typically progressive and addictive.

It's also a red-flag that he is withdrawing from the state of Intimacy.

LA:

You KNOW what the problem is.

It isn't that your H is on the internet.

It your utter inability to be open and honest with your husband.

You have asked similar questions on the recovery forum and they have been addressed by schoolbus, justlearning and a little bit by me.

And in the end, your still in the same place.

You have this info.
You have a "source"
You have had it for quite a while.

Yet:

You refuse to talk to him about your concerns.

You let the fear of the conversation consume you.

And THAT eats away at the intimacy of your M.

Your H has issues, and I do not think that porn is one of them. He can't get to it at home anyway. You have filters for that.

So, he surfs for pictures of actresses, etc.

Improve the intimacy in your M. ASK your H what he is looking for. What he thinks about this particular actress and WHY he finds her attractive.

And just let him answer. And DO NOT compare yourself to these actress's! Even if your H had an A, he STILL CHOOSE YOU.

Get past the fear.

LG

Are his SF needs being met?

Hi LG:

Thank you for posting to me again...

I do get you, LG. I know the root to our problem is OUR fear of touching any negative feelings at this time. It's both his fear and my fear. I got this fear because during his A and the long withdrawal peroid ( 6 months ), I brought up all kinds of negative feelings but I couldn't control my anger and hurt and it all turned out to be big set backs to our recovery. So I developed this fear of touching those topics again, even though now he seems to have fallen in love with me again and doing so much to help me and kids, each and every day...

I need to learn a way to communicate negative feelings in a calm and respectful fashion, which I don't know how to sometimes. He doesn't know either. During this A, when it came to communicating negative feelings with OW, they failed miserably also, which almost led OW to threaten suicide and him fleeting back home after that...No I didn't set boundaries when he ran home and I very much regretted it. I have been since trying to establish my personal boundaries and it has been a hard processing but we are making progress I'm sure...

Yes, it's fear of communcating negative feelings that's preventing us to go deeper in our intimacy. I think I have been making good progress after seeking advice from the board. I tried to talk to him about my feelings, not directly face to face (because I'm still not confident that I could do it without LB), but through email and he had replied and we had felt closer after that. He never replied before to those kind of emotional emails, and I think either my way of presenting is getting better, or he truly realized the impact of his A. I see those as progress. But I still need a lot of encouragement, or concrete examples, to help me get more confidence in talking to him about difficult stuff.

You advice about asking him who which actresses he likes and why, etc in a casual conversation is a good idea. I would guess his response is to change topics, because I have felt that he was not comfortable talking about anything related to women since his A. Yes, I agree with you that p**n is not one of his big issues, the fear to communicate with me on those sensitive issues is a big issue for him also. But I can't change him, right? I will try to make it safer for him to talk and we are making progress, although in baby steps, it gives me hope also.
We have great SF nowadays, the best ever actually. And I can see this helps both of us to get closer and to open up little by little. But I still need advice and concrete examples in TALKING to him, especially face to face...How do I control my anger when the topic is very charged? How do I stay calm? What kind of language should I use to be unthreatening and encourage conversations instead of his perceived attacking? How do I deal with his rejection if he wouldn't engage, or get angery when I bring up sensitive issues??

Also we are from a different culture and we learned nothing from our parents concerning open communication. We have never seen our parents show any kind of affection to each other all through our lives. And we hadn't been much different than them before his A although we had deep love toward each other. Now we are learning everything from scratch and it's a very rewarding journey so far. We have been showing affections in front of our kids for the first time and we are feeling the love to each other so much that we don't want to separte for a short errand during the weekends sometimes...

But we need to learn how to talk to each other about those sensitive topics. We have to.

Thanks again, LG and all others who are posting and helping...



LA

Uh UH!!!!

Using pornography has nothing to do with sex or physical attractiveness and EVERYTHING to do with fantasy, escape and fear of intimacy.

And it has nothing to do with YOU.


And I would wager that by reacting that way, you have made it pretty unsafe for him to give you the kind of honesty & openness you are seeking.

I'm not blaming you for the problem. His reaction to YOUR reaction is still his responsibility. I'm just saying that by doing that, you aren't making it any easier for him to give you what you want.



If that's the case, then your marriage has a very BIG problem. Because without being able to discuss negative topics or emotions, you have no productive way of resolving conflict in your marriage.



I struggled with this also and have since learned new skills. So I can tell you what has worked for me.

The way to communicate negative feelings in a calm and respectful fashion...

Take responsibility for your feelings. That means no blaming.

Express them by using "I" messages.

Do not attempt to express negative emotion when you are "flooded".

Simply say, "I feel angry. I feel hurt, etc..."



What kinds of things are you doing in the way of establishing personal boundaries?



What kinds of concrete examples are you looking for?



I believe you are right. Pornography is a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself.



By waiting to respond until you ARE calm. Give yourself time to process, if need be. After you have mastered that, you will have learned the skills to respond, rather than react, in the moment.



That would be a great question to ask him, actually. Something along the lines of, "What kinds of things have I said/done that have caused you to feel attacked?" "What can I do during these times to help you feel safer?"



This is a boundary issue.
Why do you perceive it as rejection if he doesn't feel comfortable talking about an issue?

I think the biggest part of helping him talk, is him knowing you love him regardless and want to help him with problems, rather than accuse, blame, yell,...etc.

That is, if you do want to help him....which helps you....which recovers marriages.


Exactly!!!

I would venture to say that many affairs are in the same boat.

And I would agree.

Different symptom. Likely the same underlying problem.

Ridiculous. LG...you are joking about this right. Ask her h what he finds attractive about a porn actress to improve the intimacy in their marriage? Please say you are kidding.

LA:

I will decipher these paragraphs for you:


I will HIGHLIGHT the difference: "I think...my way of PRESENTING is GETTING BETTER"

You have made it SAFE for him to respond to your Emails. You can write something, think about it, compose it, and then finally, SEND it.

And then your H, may read it, contemplate it, think about it, and then compose a reply.

And his world doesn't get blown up. Becasue the IMMEDIATE emotion are left behind, and the ability to think it though is available.


Keep doing it. Keep the emails to one subject, however. And allow him time to respond. And you need examples, use this:


And then let him answer, and stop DOING THIS:


If you bring up a topic, let him talk. If he doesn't want to, that's ok. But if you CAN NOT get a conversation started with an EASY subject, how do you expect to have conversations about DIFFICULT subjects?



So, continue to keep taking those baby steps. And don't be afraid to lengthen your stride, he will keep up.


These are all things for YOU to work on. SB and Lovinganyway, gave you many hints on how to do it.

1. Count to 10.
2. Then count to 100.

3. Understand that maybe you are not perfect, and that's ok.
4. Understand that your H isn't perfect, and that's OK.

5. Get comfortable about talking with each other about little things. Weather. Sports. the kids, the neighbors kids, etc. If you see the conversation moving to an area that might not be good for you, redirect it, or slow it down.

6. Count to 10

7. Let him talk. Maybe YOU respond by email tommorrow.

8. Start writing up the cue cards I recommended before.

9. Let him talk. Sometimes, the easiest thing to do? Is to just be quiet, and let them talk. You may be ready to explode. So, let them talk.

10. It's all about you.

LG

MEDC:

It's a conversation.

And I didn't ask her to discuss porn stars. I asked her to talk to him about what HE found attractive about the movie actresses. That he was viewing on Entertainment tonight like internet sites. She has blocked everything else.

It's a conversation.

And until she and her H can have a CONVERSATION, without her exploding, it's about finding something SAFE to discuss.

Everynight? No. As something to start talking? Sure.

Her H could also be looking at race cars. She could ask him if he likes Chevy, or Ford. And then LISTEN to his answer.
Her H could be looking at Art from the 1930's. She could ask him which artist he likes best? Picasso or Klimt? (those are artist's, BTW)

That's my real point. They have to start talking to each other.

LG

Gotcha..I thought we were talking about porn stars.

Sorry for the mix up Larry!