This morning, my wife of nine years told me that while she still loves me, and deeply cares for me, she is no longer IN LOVE with me.

We recently (three months ago) dealt with a one-time infidelity issue on her part. But it was just that - one time. I found out before anything escalated. And we agreed to work on things to patch everything up. But now, things have changed.

There is no affair going on. So there's nothing to "expose." But she tells me that she doesn't even want to try marriage counseling, as she doesn't think it will give her that spark back.

I'm irritated at that. As far as I'm concerned, our marriage is worth saving. But she isn't willing to even try.

Do I have any hope here? Could marriage counseling help?

Any help would be appreciated. Right now, I feel dead inside.

I'm probably wasting my time, since you blew off everything you were told in the other thread, but IMHO, your WW is still in her A ... she never stopped, because you never made her stop.

... and you have the further complicating issue of the enabling/encouraging best friend.

I'm sorry, but you're no where near where you think you are. You need to gather the evidence that the A is still ONGOING, and then expose and institute NC with the OM and the BF ... OR you could go ahead and get lawyered-up for the inevitable Plan D.

For your own sake ... go to this website:

www.womensinfidelity.com

and read up on what is meant when your WW says: I Love You, but I'm not In Love With You.

There is no affair going on, I assure you. I know everything about where she goes, and what she does. The only time we're not together is when she's at work.

MWH,

And the likelihood is that she is still in contact with him while at work. Can you check on that?

There is a big gap in your knowledge base if you think that she cannot make contact while at work.

Please think about this.

If in fact she is not having an affair even emotionally, my guess is that you need to speak to someone about helping you convince your W to try.

God Bless,

JL

MWH,

Do you understand the wayward state of mind? It's was is present before there is infidelity...the prep work, you might say...even if the infidelity is a one-time blip, as you say.

The mindset persists. Gimble said it's the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect.

Ponder this...this mindset kills marriages. Takes the fantasy that you are making her resent...building it for years...through sacrifice, etc...without owning she creates and works to maintain her resentment.

Which blocks resulting loving feelings. Have you felt love for her every moment for the last decade? Or did you KNOW you loved her even when you didn't have resulting loving feelings at times?

Her one-time infidelity issue requires the same steps to recover that a year-long affair does. For you to heal and for her to heal...for your marriage to heal.

If you treat it as a blip, you aren't addressing her choice, respecting her power, her half of the marriage. So your marriage will fail.

I don't believe you want that. I believe you want to build a new marriage without blind trust, with great awareness and healthy boundaries. Without resentment, entitlement, and WITH respect.

Your choice is solely your own...if you want to save your marriage, do it. Read Surviving An Affair, Torn Asunder...study and become expert on your half of the marriage...figure out ENs, identify and elminate LBs...and love the changes you make for yourself, to be a great partner.

She is talking the WS script, right down the line. A's begin as fantasies in our heads...where we dwell, forming our treasure...which messes up reality, generate fogs.

You reading Harley, YOU know in reality, we can fall in love with our partners over and over again. You cannot educate or convince your WW of that. You can example it. You can listen and repeat and hand back her words with reality.

"I hear you're choosing to believe that you can't fall in love with your husband over and over again in a lifetime, is that correct?"

Calm, respectful...listening to know. She's choosing from her feelings (which result from the beliefs she chooses)...like living backwards. If you buy into her stuff as the truth instead of her truth, you're sunk. Don't live by her stuff, 'k? Choose your own.

Be brave and true, 'k?

LA

LovingAnyway, that was a great response. Thank you.

As to the previous response, I am not naive, I assure you. It's not about someone else. It's about her perceived ability as to whether or not she's capable of being a good wife - and everything that goes with it. She doesn't know what's wrong with her, and is afraid that she's simply going to hurt me again - which is what she absolutely does not want to do.

Where do you think most As start?

I was completely unaware of my FWW's workplace A - until she confessed it to meet 2 years after it started. Of course, once I started looking back at a few things that happened during those 2 years, it became pretty clear that they were A-related. She was *really good* at keeping it under wraps.

MWH,

Cheating is a choice, MWH. Did she get to why she chose to cheat? Understanding her own whys helps you both put sounder marital boundaries in place and enforcements.

Not understanding leads to worrying she'll do it again. Like something that blows in, out of her control.

When you say it's not about someone else...beware the fantasy comparison...that's where she compares you to a fantasy in her head...not a real person. Full of "If only he would <blank>, then I'd feel <blank>" or "If only he wouldn't, then I wouldn't."

Enmeshment is real...not knowing where you end and she begins and vice versa. You are two separate, whole, complete human beings in one union.

She didn't slip...she chose. That's her power. Respect only she chooses her actions...you can't make her choose differently...nor she you. Respect each other's power and embrace your limits...we hold the power of others' influence...we control how wide we swing the door to them, even, to each other.

Often in emeshment, we make our partners our enemies...we live through them, their eyes, and we can convince ourselves they don't love us, wouldn't care if they knew. Sounds like your WW doesn't believe that. Sounds like she does recognize your devastation and pain from her choice to attack your marriage.

For my marital and personal recovery (we all have both after infidelity), we used MC, books, exercises, and put into practice Harley's 15 hours of UA, and used those as RC time...so we could return to being allies, teammates, instead of enemies. Changes our resulting feelings.

My DH's phrase, "I know we're in this together, come what may" was my rock for the last three years. Not one destroying everything...both with power, limits and choice.

I don't see how people recover without MC, without changing their patterns and habits...without awakening to the possibility of marriage being far more rewarding, thriving and fulfilling.

That's me...I searched for a Christian, Pro-Marriage Counselor and asked WH to go...he went for his own purpose...to decide to leave for OW, leave for himself, or stay and work on the marriage. My goal was to save the marriage. Okay to have two different goals...not okay to not go.

You can call the Harleys for help...Steve Harley has advised BS's to ask their WS's if they would consider the best possible scenario would be to fall in love with their spouse, father of their children?

My DH chose to work on the marriage because he chose in his mind, not his emotions, to do so...because he believed it was the only path to his ultimate happiness.

He says he was right (three years later). I like him being right.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

LA

Infidelity is no longer the issue. In fact, it never really was. My wife is now struggling with whether or not she's capable of being a good wife.

Does she long for that "spark" again? She thinks so. And that is why she cheated to begin with. She thought that perhaps she could find that spark with someone else, since she no longer had it with me. She would like to find that spark again. She just seems to think she won't be able to get it again from me.

What do you believe, MWH?

LA

I believe it can. But I'm not the one who needs convincing.

What LA is saying is that you can't "convince her" by telling her to feel a certain way. You can't do or say any particular thing and have her come away with a brand new mindset that coincides with what you want her to believe.

Your wife may not be in an active A right now, talking to or seeing another man. However, what she is saying is identical to what WS say. The fact that her feelings and behavior began with a known physical A and have continued since make it seem that her feelings ARE affair related, (or her A was feelings related if you prefer) active or not. Whether she is actively involved with someone specific or not really isn't all that important, although it is good if she's not, obviously. What you KNOW is that she is displaying the characteristics of a WW involved in an A, so perhaps you should treat her like a WW involved in an A, and follow the MB plans accordingly, presumably you don't have any better ideas? (not an insult, I had no clue what to do either, and everything I did failed and oftentimes made things worse!)

What that would entail is probably you going into Plan A, which would be to be the best partner you can possibly be. Find out what her needs are and meet them consistently for a set amount of time (6 months if you think you can hack it?), with no expectations of ANY of your needs being met. If she meets some of your needs, great, but the point of Plan A is for you to become what you should have been anyway, a great husband. If you do it, and her feelings don't change, then you know that you have done everything you can to be the best H you can be, and the choice then is hers. You see, that isn't "convincing her" to want to be married. That is showing her what you are capable of in the hopes that she will realize that you are the best choice. See the difference? YOUR actions, HER choice.

I read your whole blog, MWH...you'll find many threads here conveying much the same pain, fear, anger, sadness and views you have had and are experiencing right now.

Please READ this website...click on the link at the right of your screen and read the Basic Concepts by Dr. Harley. Get those books...Surviving an Affair...because they are all pertinent to what you wrote in your blog.

Do the Emotional Needs (ENs) questionnaires on this website...you mentioned being shocked at one of them...Attractive Spouse...when your WW finally opened up. Read the Love Busters (LBs) and do those questionnaires...her not including you (even to the red flag of thinking of divorce and not being honest with you about her feelings, thoughts) is called Independent Behavior (IB).

You guys NEVER fighting...conflict is a healthy way to experience intimacy...not having it is the same as having it all the time...either extreme, not healthy.

Sounds to me you really want a radically honest marriage...a truly intimate one...read Harley's Policies here...

And know you cannot convince your wife of anything. Never did or will. She allows your influence or not...not under your control. What you can REQUIRE is transparency, MC, communication exercises in order to recover your marriage.

Make your OWN boundaries...draw a finer line...own your triggers and share them with her...choose real healing from this affair...we all experience immediate "better" marriages at first when the A is over and our spouse recommits to working on the marriage. Doesn't mean we're healed...means we're relieved we didn't lose our marriages. Means WE have a second chance to be fantastic partners...because we choose to be...learn more on how to partner, not parent, one another. We grow side by side.

Require of yourself to learn all you can about healthy marital boundaries...transparency (you get all passwords to her email accounts, online cell phone account--don't wait for the bill--and change your cell numbers, if necessary to insure future No Contact)...I saw where she already sent a close semblance to the No Contact Letter Harley advises.

You change...your marital dance changes. You're here...she's not. Change your stuff...set your own goals, and live from them...keep posting (hopefully to one thread)...and thrive yourself...

You can do this. A lot of us have done this. You are not alone.

Dang...look at Tyk getting it before me. Way to go, Tyk!

LA

For the record, after some talking last night, I believe my wife is now ready to try marriage counseling.

That sounds like a plan to me. Thank you for taking the time to tyoe that out.