Earlier in the spring while I was in the throws of separation, she told me she wanted to leave her H. She insisted there was no A and that he was a wonderful man but she just didn't want to be with him any more and wanted to be on her own. I actually directed her to this site at the time. Well, she did move out.

The other day, she called and was in terrible distress. She discovered that her STBX was seeing another woman. NOW she admits to having an A, though she didn't leave him for the OM but to "be on her own so she could find someone like the OM". Everything was fine until she realized her STBX was moving on.

It got me thinking. I recently went on a trip with someone I'm dating. I told STBX myself - was sure he would have heard through the rumour mill but didn't and I wanted him to know the house would be "guarded" (he still has a tendency to come by and steal stuff when I'm not there). He said he was happy for me (he knows the guy) and that was that. Then recently I ran into a woman he works with and she asked me how my trip went. Obviously he told her about it. She knew where I went, when I went and how long I went. (she also knows with who but never mentioned his name)

After listening to my friend's distress the other day (as a WS just discovering her BS has moved on), I wonder if my STBX had the same thoughts. Why would he tell this person this information? It's not like she was ever a friend of ours where she might ask about me from time to time.

What I think happened is that my WH/STBX, despite being deeply committed to his A (they have been living together since D-day and just bought a house together), actually felt some loss that I had "got away" from him. Now I don't know this for sure and I probably never will. And it doesn't matter much because I HAVE moved on and I'm fully committed to the path of personal recovery without him.

But maybe some of you BS's out there would be comforted in knowing that underneath the lies and deceipt, and behind all the crap, your WS really does still have feelings for you. They will NEVER let you see these feelings, at least not while the A is still alive, but they are there. If you are still working to restore your M, have hope. The human being inside the WS monster is just sleeping.

Tabby...

Why are you dating while you are still married?

Mrs. W

Probably the same reason that I'm dating and still married.

My wife tossed me away and is now dragging the divorce SHE filed for out.

What business is it of your's regardless?

Because this is a website for MARRIAGE BUILDING...That IS the sign on the door Pariah...Dating while still married is NOT part of the principles of this website...Dating while still married IS infidelity/adultery...And just what kind of person decides to date someone that is still married??? That is not the makings of a healthy relationship...

And it's quite likely that Tabby's WH is using her infidelity to justify his own by telling others things like, "Look, she's doing it too! That makes what I did A-OKAY!"

Further, when things are posted on a PUBLIC FORUM they become the business of anyone reading said forum Pariah...Don't know what your beef is with me, but I suppose I'm willing to listen...

Mrs. W

Married is MARRIED. Separated is not DIVORCED. Divorced is DIVORCED. There is no almost divorced.

If you date while still married, you are committing adultery.

Do you have any idea how many BS on this site over my several years on this board have recovered their marriages EVEN AFTER divorce was filed? Hundreds if not thousands, because they followed Harley's principles which includes NOT dating while you work the plans. There are no guarantees, but dating while married certainly does not help your efforts. Quite the contrary.

Again, separated is NOT divorced.

And BTW: What type of person would date someone who is still married? Answer: One who does not value or honor marriage or commitment. One that may very well cheat on YOU. But I guess that must be okay with you considering you are also participating.

Something to think about.

Jo

Can I get an "AMEN"!



I said this very thing to WS regarding OP... In fact, OP has already shown to WS that he's a liar, cheat and coward...what a scum...

I find it TOUGH to steer my thooughts away from "needing" to be needed by someone else... Spending time w/ kids and focusing on improving MYSELF and getting to know MYSELF, and being comfortable being ALONE are all key to recovery - whether it's w/ WS or not.

Reading all posts here have helped so VERY much over the last year. There's nothing new here, either on the WS or BS side. Yes there are variations, but the bottom line is always so very similar.

The plan WORKS. That's not to say that WS will always come to their senses, but it'll work for BS, no matter what the outcome of the marriage is - if that makes sense. In the end, the BS will be a BETTER person and spouse - period - and that's what MB's all about.

I agree. Married is MARRIED. It's like being pregnant...you either are or you aren't.

It doesn't matter what your WS or STBXS is doing or has done. You should maintain your integrity instead of sticking your toe into the scummy infidelity pond.

There are some here that do not agree that it is wrong to date while awaiting divorce papers. I am one of them and you would be hard pressed to find anyone more aggressive against WS.
I have said and I still feel that if a couple is divorcing as a result of infidelity that the BS has a right to move on with their life IF THEY HAVE ZERO DESIRE TO EVER RECOVER THEIR MARRIAGE. I do not believe that a BS should have to put their life on hold while a WS drags a divorce on and on. They have already wasted enough of the BS time. The legal process has made divorce in some areas difficult and takes too long. As I explained before, even the Bible is very clear on the requirements for divorce....and it isn't what we have today in our court system.

BUT...all that being said...it is NOT adultery to date while separated. People have different opinions about that...but a date is not adultery in any jurisdiction. Sexual contact is adultery. I would recommend against that in all cases.
Adultery to me involves lies, deceit and cannot thrive in the light of day. I know quite a few wonderful couples that met while one was separated as a result of an affair...their relationships were never in the shadows...never in the dark...no lies, no deceit.

I would never consider a person merely waiting on the state to sign off on paperwork to be a WS. But a firm warning for any BS out there...you should wait a while before dating. You need time to heal and get over the pain of what happened. For some...infidelity in any form is the end of their marriage...no plan in the world would make them want to recover their marriage. I have no problem with that...for others, they just hit a breaking point with a WS and would not want to turn back.

I will use Lilsis as an example here. Today she posted that her papers are still not signed...so she is technically not divorced. While I do not believe she is even close to be emotionally ready to date...I think that the years that her husband has wasted in her life have been enough. If she wanted to date someone that she met, she would have my blessing if I were her friend. And I do not know one person IRL that would have issue with that.

MEDC, the problem with DATING while separated but not divorced is that one runs the risk of developing "in love" feelings for the other person, which can possibly lead to sex...which would then be adultery.

Separated is not divorced, regardless of how long the divorce is taking. The BS would do well to use this time to work on him/herself instead of jumping into the dating pool.

I don't agree. I understand where you are coming from...but I do not agree with your position.

When my first wife left me some 20 years ago I went to a psychologist to help me through it. I was hanging on, hoping, trying to keep it together. In the meantime she was sleeping with her new lover.
In a session some 6 months into the separation I referred to my marriage.... he looked at me and said, "that is not a marriage". It woke me up. He was right. I did not have a "marriage" anymore. It was then that I realized I had to move on.
When one spouse leaves the home, and lives with another person, that is not marriage. Legally yes, until the judge rules otherwise. There comes a point over time that the lies and deciet kill the love and the marriage dies. When it dies, you know it.... a marriage is many things, one of course is a legal union. When there is nothing left but the "legal" union, then adultry can only be viewed in the "legal" sense.... and in my state, adultry is not "illegal"....
So for some of us who have been left in a marriage that has died, the remaining legal union is not a legit argument for labelling a sexual relationship as adultry.

This is only my opinion so please take no offense. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Robm

Assuming we're talkng Harley's principles since we are on their site, I'd guess that hypothetical BS stayed in Plan A far too long.

Hey MEDC,

Are you saying you would date a BS that was not yet divorced?

Just curious.

Jo

maybe...it depends on the circumstances. as a rule, I usually only date women with kids..and I would suspect in the vast majority of cases, these people would require more healing time.

the signature of the judge means nothing to me however.

Harley's plan...yes...but remember, even Dr. H would have no desire to recover from infidelity.
I remember his video where he says when someone comes to him after infidelity and says they want a divorce..his response was "I am right there with you." His plan works well for people that WANT to recover their marriages. For those that do not, I don't feel as though their lives need to be put on hold during a protracted legal battle.

I don't want to join this debate, but just a comment:
I don't know about that. I think a long Plan B can have the same result.

The BS grows, creates a new life (without dating), gets stronger, finds joy, recognizes the endless possibilities of life...

The WS just may be so far away at that point...such a distant memory of a life that WAS, that the BS realizes that the WS just isn't worth it, or that there is really no place in the BS's life for the WS. Particularly given the extreme challenges of going through recovery.

Too much time in Plan B can be just as draining on the love bank as too much time in Plan A.

I think what I was trying to illustrate is that Harley designed Plan A and B where the BS should go to Plan B before they loose all love for their WS.

If they stay in Plan A too long, most times they have little to nothing left for their WS.

I, like many, did that very thing. So if its taken as a criticism, please know I'm criticizing myself.

Jo

Yeap, I'm aware of that. He said he would divorce his wife if she ever cheated. I believe him too.

But, I'd venture to guess he would wait till after the divorce was final (+ heal time) before he dated.

Maybe we should call into the Radio show and ask him.

Jo

ask him what?

I am not the least bit confused about my take on this. I imagine the doc would wait...it's his choice.

I agree with everything MelodyLane says! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />