I saw this on the other board, and have been thinking about it. My ex was good at his job, but never really put any effort into it. He felt entitled, underpaid and unappreciated.

He also never made any effort to change jobs and find something he liked better.

On the other hand, I like my job, have been there forever, and expect to work for my pay.

Anyway, in our case, it seems to be true.

Let me be the first to post an exception to that rule. My H is in love with his career, works extremely hard, puts in extremely long hours, and is very, very successful. However, he sees no reason to put effort into our marriage and honestly thinks it should take care of itself - the classic Freeloader attitude towards a relationship.

I am glad you posted this, though. I was thinking of starting a thread along similar lines.

It seems that there *should* be a connection between someone's private-life morality and work ethic and their ability to be a good leader, but unfortunately it sure seems to me like it ain't necessarily so.

My own H is a very good example.

Bill Clinton is another. Politics aside, it's generally accepted that things like the economy were pretty good while he was in office. Yet in private he was a total man-slut who mortified his wife and daughter (especially his daughter) with his behaviour.

Rudy Giulani is another. He did a lot to clean up downtown New York and make it safe for families to visit, and is respected for how he handled 9/11, but his personal life is a complete train wreck.

I'm afraid it traces back to the idea that the more successful a man is, the more he is entitled to women and sex. It's one of those unspoken "everybody knows it" things and it sure seems to be true.

I've posted before that my H did not start dating girls at work until he started to be a success and started climbing the corporate ladder. The tramps were attracted by this success, I'm sure, as well as his looks and personality, and it never occurred to him that there was anything wrong with eating up whatever they were dishing out. It's like he honestly thinks this is a normal part and an expected perk of being a Successful Man and he simply cannot understand what's wrong with me that I would get so upset about it. After all, didn't he always come home to me at the end of the day? (Yes, he actually said that.)

I don't know what highly successful women do that is comparable, but I'm sure there is something.

Again, believer, thanks for posting this. Could make for some interesting discussion.
Mulan

I guess I would disagree with that equation and change it to one more like:

Attitude toward job, Attitude toward marriage = Attitude toward God.

I know that's not quite right either, but it would be more along the lines of Attitude toward God is reflected by one's attitude toward job and one's attitude toward marriage and spouse.

God bless.

Believer, It sounds like your husband had a flawed view on where his self-worth comes from. He probably didn't put much effort into anything that didn't bring him immediate, direct, and perhaps self-centered pleasure. When others, or institutions, didn't recognize his value, he blamed them for their shortsightedness. All the while, not making effort to see his own contributions, or lack there of, to his happiness.

I can relate to that. I have many of the same failings.

Fear probably stood in the way of honestly effecting change.

Pride is a double-edged sword. It tells us we don't need to look at ourselves, and the fear tells us we don't dare.

Mulan, I will venture to say that the more fearful your husband is in relation to other aspects of his life, the more effort he puts into his career. If his career is ever threatened, he will probably enter into an incredibly deep depression and *maybe* start looking at the false payoffs he's been relying on.

I don't believe most women were raised to base their self-worth on career advancement. That's probably why you don't see many examples like that of their failings. There aren't that many around.

It may also have to do with society's view on the power structure. Women bosses engaged in sexual misconduct isn't viewed in the same light as it is for men in that position. Given both are adults.

Perhaps an example of what you're refering to would be the female teachers we've heard about over the last few years becoming sexually involved with their students.

Foreverhers, I believe you're refering to self-reliance vs. reliance on God. Our attitude towards God could be our belief that He's looking out for us. The comfort of that, and following His values, help us make decisions that aren't self-centered or reliant on the whims of others. I'm glad He's not asking us to blow up infidels.

IMHO, it comes down to balance. If you have a balanced outlook about your job, marriage and relationship with God, then it can work out. Swinging the pendelum either way on job or M, is not healthy.

After all, we came into this world with jobs and we weren't married..... if we live our lives out to old age, our lives may end without jobs and M but we always have our R w/God.

The good thing is that an R w/God encourages us t/b balanced. Even in that R we need to be balanced. How we treat our jobs and M's along with many other things and people in our lives reflect on our personal R w/God.

JMHO, <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
L.

I feel like attitude toward job = attitude toward marriage.

My WH had a job he loved. He lost that job due to corporate decision to close the plant in '99. He hasn't been happy at home since & he's lost all confidence in himself. When the stress level & his attitude toward this last job soured, OW worked there & happened to be there to listen to him when he needed to talk about what bothered him. It soon turned to "I have a bad marriage & a bad job." And so the A began. In my part of the country, men place a very high value on themselves according to their jobs. Good job means good man. Bad job means bad man. They totally identify with their work.

My WH starts a new job on Dec. 10, back doing what he loves. Bigger place but he has friends there from the job he lost in '99. My prayer is that once he gets back doing what he loves & gets his job confidence back, he'll want me back. I do know that that may not happen & I'm prepared for that. But I feel in my heart that it will.

When my WH was happy at work, he was happy with me. Looking back now, I see that pattern in our 24 yr. marriage. For some reason, this time, he didn't think I'd be there for him. Mainly because of OW. She set her cap for him & still won't let go.

Another public figure....LA Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa. What an idiot.

My husband is very good at what he does and put in lots and lots of hours doing his job. If he had & I had put into our marriage what we've put into our jobs we'd probably be in a different frame of mind right now.

and i was starting to think maybe my unhappiness with my job (a job i've been at for 21yrs and very much liked for the majority of that time) is feeding my unhappiness with my marriage.

the job has become VERY stressful due to layoffs and out sourcing and more layoffs, etc etc....

i am working towards changing my job now.

it kinda bums me out, i always thought i would retire from this company.

i've tried to hold out, but i think it's become manditory for my well being.

the other bummer part is it will have impact on my retirement income but so be it.

I think FH was really saying that our relationship with God determines the success of all our other relationships.

I am new here but I would like to share from my own experience. I went from a job I absolutely LOVED working with a great team of girls who were all very positive. We moved and I decided to take a position closer to home for convenience. I HATED my new job. It DID end up reflecting on my homelife and Marriage. My H said that is when he started to notice his different feelings toward me. I did not like who I was becoming either. I went from a "Positive Polly" to a "Negative Nancy". we drifted apart. I lost my Faith. I have regained my Faith recently.
So in my experience:
Attitude toward job DOES = attitude toward marriage

but never lose your Faith.

God Bless

I never met a more committed employee than my boys mom. I also never met a woman that was so irresponsible outside of work.
It even haunts her to this day how she was so willing to give her best to the things in life that truly were not as important as family. Just one of the vast number of regrets that haunt her every day.

I don't know if its about attitude. I know my WW puts a lot of effort into her job. I use to think if she would put that effort into the M, things would be a lot better.

As I've thought about that more, I don't think its entirely correct. I think there are certain attitudes, habits and behaviors that people have that "work" in the work place, but are awful for M's. I don't mean anything bad, just the workplace doesn't require you to have intimate relationships in order to be effective. Because of this, some habits that are bad for a M can actually be pluses in the workplace and or for one's career. Especially in work environments that are highly competitive.