Just say you meet someone, how do you find out about that person and if they are mentally stable BEFORE getting TOO involved with them.

I think this has been a problem for me in the past and I would like some insight on how to stop getting involved with guys who are not mentally stable. I am trying to learn from past experiences.

first three things i do are:

1. check the county jail website
2. check the state prison website
3. check the county courthouse website

the courthouse sites are a treasure of information

Go very slowly. In the beginning, only go out once a week. Adults that immediately want to spend 4 or 5 nights a week with you are Needy, not Nice.

Plus, time really tells. And listen to them talk about their past and present.

I can't find anything...maybe cause I live in a nothing town.

tally, here's your real issue. It is YOU who is picking losers. Read up about codependency, etc, and you will recognize yourself. You'll see yourself looking for wounded people so that you can boost your own self-esteem by fixing them, or you'll see yourself looking for abusive people so that you can prove to yourself you only deserve the worst. And, yes, all the signs are right out there, in front of you, if you will take the time to learn about them.

My brother picked needy after needy after needy. Every single one of them turned into a nutcase, because he picked the absolute worst type of person for his personality (low self-esteem) to date. He only got lucky when he met a woman smart enough to see around his own needy, and who gave him a swift kick in the pants. She's wonderful. If not for her, he'd be dead from depression from all the failed relationships that HE kept picking, seeking to validate his own lack of worth.

If I find out you even go out with a guy in the next year, without a solid year of counseling under your belt to learn about, and learn to like, yourself first, I will be furious with you.

Of course I am picking losers. I don't deny that...however, I wanted to know how to separate to "losers" from the nonlosers from which to pic.

The only thing basically that I have been working on in counseling is my passiveness and my lightening up on life...
My C knows quite a bit about me since she was my counselor with my exhusband and did some counseling with me afterward my separation with exhusband. I recently started going back to her since X and I were a couple of weeks from breaking up...

I have never been told by my counselor that I am codependent...really...isn't every one codependent at times...doesn't it show empathy towards another human being. I know about the whole "enabling" thing and I see it as a little different. I am not saying that I am NOT codependent, just wondering why my counselor has not told me this.

She does state that I am passive, which I agree, and low self esteem, but she hasn't metioned anything about codependency...

I have read a little about codependency and found this link here that leads to an interesting article...

http://www.thewindsofchange.org/codependency.html

If you bring up your self-confidence and your self-esteem, you'll stop picking losers. You pick losers because somewhere deep down you feel you don't deserve better. Get at that deep down belief and you'll do much better.

Oh, yeah, and break up with any man who seems like a loser or a mess or who treats you badly even once.

Didn't mean to rag on you, tally. You've done great just leaving and taking the steps you have. You'll be fine.

But it does so in an unhealthy way. Codependency means you give up what you know is right, to make sure the other person doesn't leave you.

Anyway, you don't pick losers by learning. Read, read, read. Attend self-help classes. Quit worrying about your town knowing your business. Seeing you take steps to better yourself will make them respect you, not make fun of you. Find and meet other people like you, so you can create a support group for each other.

As for the more intimate details of not picking a loser? For one thing, meet their families before getting too involved. Meet their best friends. Go to their church. Meet their coworkers. Do whatever you can to see how they live otherwise from you. If they are not allowing that, back away. Good people have nothing to hide. And the one thing I keep telling my daughter - watch to see how they treat servants and other people 'beneath' them; a great indicator.

OMG! Cat you are absolutely right! This is exactly how X was. I couldn't have said it better...............

My mom and I were just talking about this...when we had first started dating we went to this Chinese restaurant place with my family. The waitress who could barely speak English asked X if he needed more soda...he started to make fun of her and do like to talk in her language and laugh at her. I was so upset....

Another incident was when walking out of a store a man who was apparently living on the streets approached us very politely and not pushie to ask if we had any change he could have. My X didn't even let the man finish his statement and immediately put his hand up to dismis this poor man and told him to leave us alone b/c we weren't interested. I was so angry and hurt for the man.

X didn't even allow me to give my opinion about this man.

He also never wanted me to spend any time with his family. He introduced them to me but never wanted me to go and visit for a little while even when they lived right next door to him.

You're right, tally, those are huge red flags.

Ok, HERE is where you start to change. Remember this moment. Remember the very first time ANY guy tries to contain you, control you, tell you how you're supposed to think or be. And DON'T.

Love this thread.

Here are some random thoughts:

Watch how they treat a great waitress.
Watch how they treat a really poor waitress.
Watch how they handle a bad day.
Watch them around kids being kids.
Watch them around animals.
Ask them what the last book was that they read. If you know it, talk about it.
Find out if they do the things they say they do, and if they are the person they say they are.

Awesome thread!

OMWH, those are fantastic ideas. There are some basic things as well that you can learn BEFORE you even date the guy. Make sure he has a stable job and a stable residence. Personally, I won't date anyone that doesn't own his own house but I realize stable residency can vary from location to location. If a guy can't hold a job or stay in one place very long, how can he commit to a relationship of any kind?

Ask him about his family. Does he see/talk to them regularly? Are THEY stable? Be very wary if he's got siblings in jail or if he simply won't talk about them. Run away fast if he's still living with his mom.

A few random red flags:
-conversation of good times revolves around drinking with his buddies
-drug use of any kind
-reluctance to go on any kind of date other than a bar (i.e. should want to do something that might be a shared interest like hiking or museum or whatever)
-immaturity - rather general but covers things like laughing too hard at fart jokes etc.
-somebody who is way too touchy-feely on the first date.

When I saw this statement I thought of something: A relative of mine is getting back in to the dating game, she had a bad past marriage at a young age of 19. Now divorced. She is talking to a guy who lives with his parents at 30. Let me tell you the story...he has a stable good job. He was living with a woman and they broke up...when they broke up, his mother asked him if he could move in with them again b/c his father (who is a good age) has been very ill and she needed help with him and around the house. He couldn't afford to help (financially) around their house and pay rent, so he decided to move in with them and pay for repairs and help out with his dad.

She asks me if he is a loser b/c he lives with his parents? I don't know what to tell her.

That's different. I think what people are talking about are the guys who never move out. Having a woman take care of him - preferably his mother, who he doesn't have to do anything special for, to please her - is more important than living on his own. It's stunted emotional growth.

The guy you're talking about was having a normal life, when he changed to help his parents.

I have had this conversation before (about living with mom and various circumstances that surround it). There is a huge difference between someone who has "failed to launch" and someone who is literally meeting his obligations and responsibilities by taking care of elderly parents. However honourable the latter may be, it is its own type of baggage as well - some potentially heavy baggage even. If you are just dating - as in just meeting people for the first or second time, unless this guy has a 10 page resume of other outstanding qualities and NO SINGLE other flag, I would be inclined to pass.

I will give her the comments that you all have made here on this guy...hopefully she will consider what you all have to say and yalls advice.

tally,

I wouldn't even make plans to go out once a week, if they get upset because you have other plans and can't go out with them..that's very telling..

Don't let them monopolize your TIME..meaning don't sit and talk to them on the phone every day for 2 and 3 hours, sure you can talk a couple days a week, but don't talk EVERY DAY, and don't sit by the phone wondering if they are going to call you...go out with friends, live YOUR life..

Make plans to go out with friends, invite him along occassionally..see how he is with YOUR friends..

Meet HIS friends..watch how He is with them...if his friends are married, watch how THEY treat their spouses as well and if he says anything to them or not..or if he gets uncomfortable around them when they do or apologizes to you for their behavior..or if his friends are rude to waiters/waitresses and how he respondes in those situations...those are all things you should look at..

Watch how he treats his parents..it's an indication of how he would treat you..

Let me posit this.
We all have our attractions and we can be attracted to the same type of person over and over again without realizing that we're making the same bad choices over and over. How do we combat this? Work against you natural attractions by picking someone that you wouldn't normally be attracted to.

My personal opinion is that in this instant gratification culture, everyone wants instant chemistry. Instant chemistry will get you the same type of person over and over again. Chemistry should be developed over time. It might take several dates to determine your ultimate level of interest.

Catch the Seinfeld episode where George does everything opposite of what he would normally do. Try picking someone who's the opposite of who you would normally be attracted to.

Interesting that you've had a problem finding men who are mentally stable. I have problems finding a women who is not so fragile that she'll shatter at the first small bump in the road, who is not neurotic and who is not overly needy. I guess these things cross gender lines.

I hear that its also really nice if you can observe somebody in a non-dating context. Like volunteering, or a hobby, or when they are working. You can be dispassionate and not be blinded by your in-love feelings. Not that I did that with my spouse.

- WG

I think one thing to observe is how he treats his mother and sister(s).

Observe his family's interaction with one another, because those are the habits and communication styles that he will be bringing to the marriage.

Observe if there is a sense of humor in his family and if they are demonstrative with hugs and kisses.

And a very basic thing - something that is often overlooked in the early stages of a relationship but ends up often being very important later - do you share the same religion/religious beliefs, and how would you raise your children in that respect?

How does he spend his money? Is he a saver or a spender?

Does he share your basic likes and dislikes? Are your dreams of the future even remotely similar?