Hello everyone-
I have been reading some of the posts here and have taken comfort in some of them and learned alot from all of them. I am in a similar situation as orchid. I have a 4 year old boy who has had HORRIBLE fits. Screaming, kicking, spitting, and all of the above all at the same time for up to an hour at a time. He says things like he does not like me anymore and that he wants me to leave him alone. This is all usually the first 2 days after he is with his father and OW. They all had a sleepover the last time. WH said some things and OW did some things to him that were innapropriate.
I am finishing up filling out the paperwork from my lawyer. I want to make sure that my son is with a responsible adult not WH. However, I do not want to take his father away from him either. Even tho some horrible things have gone on during his care, my son ADORES his dad.
Any advise on making sure I cross my T's and dot my i's with the divorce?
I have a thread on GQII as well. If you read the last page and a few comments b-4 it you should get a good update if this confuses you.
Thank you all from MB who have helped me see the light and have the strength to move forward.
Luv YA!
God Bless

Missalot,

I'm not sure how are situations were the same. My son was 6 near DD and he didn't throw fits. He never met the OW.

I do see your situation and it may help if you find out about setting up visitation with a 3rd party for your son when he visits his father. That could be a requirement when the child custody agreements are worked out.

What proof do you have to make this type of request? Gather it and keep it in a safe place.

The lawyers needs are secondary to your needs and that of your family. Of course $$ is usually a big factor so plan wisely. Do you feel comfortable with your legal representation?

L.

Sorry. I must have got my people confused. I read so many today and I must not have been able to keep them all straight. So sorry.
Things my WH has done in the past and things he has said and done recently. Most is just documentation of conversations and text messages. I document EVERYTHING good and bad. Not sure if any of it is solid enough to have a 3rd party but in my opinion, a 4 year old should not be seeing some of the things that he has between WH and OW. There has been alot of angry outbursts in front of my son along with swearing. so,,,I just keep documenting.

I am very comfortable with my legal representation. He is the best of the best in this type of situation and strives to keep things civil. He is a good person. He is also very expensive but nothing is too expensive when it comes to my sons well being and safety.

Thanks for your response.
God Bless

Missalot, a lot depends on your state. However, you probably would hve to prove abuse or neglect or drugs or alcoholism. In my state, the court wouldn't consider yelling between OW and the Father to be reason to have supervised visitation.

Now, if the stuff your son saw includes sexual intercourse, the court will probably see it your way... That could be contributing to the dileqency of a minor or child abuse even.

MIL called yesterday to see if our son could come to her place for a sleep over. I WAS SHOCKED. She was sweet-as-pie. As if nothing had ever happened. I did not respond to her. I waited to hear from my lawyer. He recommended that I keep my son away from her until she can prove that she can act like a civil adult and treat her grandsons mother with respect. I agreed but did not call her back. I did not want anymore confrontation. WH then text me and asked if it was okay for our son to go to his parents for the night. I told him it would not work and he got VERY upset. Responding like a kid that can't get his way. Shortly after he talked to our son the night b-4, Grandma called AGAIN. Not so nice this time. The two have something planned out. WH was not at work for 1&1/2 shifts. I am kinda freaking out. My son went with WH today and I am afraid something is going to happen to him(more brainwashing or have GF give him another bath and all sleep 2gether) or me win the next few days.
Sorry I am going on and on, I am just scared and need someone to talk to.

God Bless

First thing, STOP!!! I am a man who is coming from an experience on the opposite side of the fence of an issue similar to yours. Obviously, you can take or leave what I have to say.

I was accused by my ex of "yelling and arguing repeatedly" around my children when they were with me and my new wife (not an affair.) And, contrary to what Greengables says, just the accusation of "yelling" is enough for a biased judge to take a child away from a father - with absolutely NO evidence besides the mother's word!! Orchid, your 3rd party suggestion sends chills up my spine. I have paid thousands for such supervision, yet am praised by all who have observed or have any knowledge of my parenting skills. Well, except my bitter ex. Sadly, her baseless accusations are all that mattered to the judge (Well, that and her slick attorney.) Glad to hear of another party extolling the virtues of their attorney!

You talk of your ex arguing in fromnt of your child. arguing with who - you? Then, aren't you both to blame?

Back to your issue, be VERY careful what you do. Maybe you are the exception and aren't bitter that your man left you for someone else. But, exceptions only serve to prove the rule. You are starting on a road that will cause EXTREME damage to your child. Notice I didn't say "may." You are making accusations I have heard before, with absolutely no way of knowing if they are true.

My son has great visits with me, then refuses to speak to me on the phone, but only when his mother is there. Sadly, she sounds just like you do. My son has been taught to lie, even being told to say that I hit him, and to call another man "daddy." All in the name of "protecting him from evil me." Maybe you do have a "case," but more likely you are allowing your bitterness to cloud your vision.

Maybe I am compltely wrong, and you are that exception to the rule. All I ask, for your child's sake, is for you to slow down and make sure what you believe is happening a) really is, and b) is seriously detrimental to your child. Bitter women games only serve to hurt children. How could a mother do that to their own child? Sadly, I know the answer to that. Please don't make your child another statistic.

Set_You_Free,
If you have an issue that you'd like us to address on the board, please post it. If you just plan to continue to attack women who believe they are protecting their children, then perhaps you should consider that they are not all your X wife.
Disrespectful judgements should be avoided. If you can respectfully give your view or advice that is one thing, but attacks are not necessary.

missalot-

Have you talked with your son's doctor about his behavior? Pediatricians are trained to understand these kinds of things.

He might have some advice for you and might be able to make some recommendations for play therapy or counseling, and even some things you can read or do that might help.

Everything that is going on has to be confusing for such a young child.

Newly, it's not an issue, it's a constant observation. Woman loses man, man gets with other woman (either through or without an affair), man who used to be good father all of a sudden becomes horrible, woman claims to need to keep children away from man "in the childs best interest."

Let's see, are there really that many bad fathers, or could it be that the mothers are overreacting out of hurt and biterness? Rare is the case that a woman who is truly happy after a divorce takes action against the father who "used to" be a good/great dad.

Why is it that most women have no problem leaving the kids with dad when they are married, but the minute dad leaves mom, all of a sudden dad is unfit? This happens far too often to be a coincidence.

Dads protect and love their children too, the mom is NOT the final judge as to right and wrong. BOTH parents have that right, but it is far too often usurped by mom. I don't see large numbers of fathers pulling this crap. And please don't tell me the courts get it right. All a woman has to do is CLAIM she was assaulted, and the children are taken away and the man is slapped with a restraining order. No proof or evidence necessary - ever.

Like I said, very common, too common to be real. If it was real, we'd see far more actions taken during the marriage, not all of them after. ** edit personal attack **

Set_You_Free-
Obviously you have not read or understand my WHOLE story. Read my very first thread. THEN maybe you can respond accordingly.
My WH has not been a "good" father in 2 years. Since shortly before our daughter was born. I almost delivered her by myself cuz he was too drunk to be there with me. I drove myself in and was ready to push 1/2 hour after I was admitted. Then right as the doc said in 10 min. we will start, my WH "needed" to get a "gutbomb" to soak up the hangover!!! So...NO! They are NOT all great husbands before hand. And I did NOT like my husband being at home alone with the kids when I was at work. He would call me all day freaking out cuz our daughter would not stop crying and he did not know what to do. I never understood that since she started to smile when she was only 6 hours old and did not stop till May 19th 2007, the day the Lord took her into his arms. So tell me sir...Does that sound like a man you would want your children around ALL the time?


Who is the one who seems bitter? NOT ME! I just want to move on with my life and be happy. NOT CONTROLLED! Yeah I was upset about the OW! Why shouldnt I have been? But that is NO reason for me to take my son away from his father! He ADORES his dad and I would NEVER allow for him to NEVER see his dad unless there were very extreme circumstances. With holding my son from his father when he is making very poor decisions is temporary. Days infact. Till he can calm down and think clearly again. My WH admits that he is very reactionary and hot headed.
As far as the arguing goes...WH called ME SCREAMING!!!! All I did was pick up the phone and say hello! Then the threats came.But whatever, I guess that is just my "bitterness" also.

Actually, GOD is the only "final judge as to right and wrong". Not even us as parents are the final judges of that.

Hate to burst your bubble but I AM DIFFERENT than YOUR ex wife it seems. I would NEVER make my child LIE for me, I leave that up to my WH. I would NEVER make my son not talk to his dad, in fact, I encourage it. I make him stop doing whatever it is he is doing and go to a quiet place to talk to his dad so it can teach him the VALUES of family and respect.
I am not asking for anyone to feel sorry for me. Just asking them to read about my situation (cuz it is a bit touchy) and help me with positive influences. Most all of the people here have been very receptive and encouraging. Safe to say about 99% even.
Let me ask you if you think this would be too much for a 4year old to handle in a 5 month peroid.
As a 4 year old boy sees it:
May 19th 2007 My sister,my best friend,my playmate, Dies.
July 2007 My dad is never home and when he is he yells at my mom and pushes her.
September 2007. 2 & 1/2 wks after my 4th birthday, my dad screams and pushes my mom again. 1 Day later he leaves. 2 days after that he wants me and mom to go away.
Nov. 2007 Daddy leaves and moves far away.
Nov. 2007 Daddy has a new friend. She is always around and wants to give me a bath and buys me stuff all the time.
Dec. 2007 Daddy told me that him and mommy are not allowed to talk to each other anymore. And that new lady was there with us again.

NOW DO YOU GET IT?????
I am not just pissed at my husband.
I am also a greiving mother who lost her beautiful little girl and she does not even have a headstone yet because her daddy took all the money and ran with it and hid it in someone elses account!!!
Please...Let me greive my losses MY way and let me do it PEACEFULLY!!
God Bless,

johnstwin-
Thank you for your sincere concerns. I am playing phone tag with his pediatrician. I was told 2 weeks ago by my therapist that my son should see him and that he can refer him to someone accordingly.



It sure is. I am lucky tho. He is an AMAZING little boy. He dealt with his sisters death in a very healthy manner, he talks about her all the time and still "includes" her in some activities and conversations. Soooo healthy!! The divorce tho...he has been unhealthy. Will not talk about anything having to do with it. Tries to "sneak" me the phone so me and his dad can talk, has fits like he did when he was 2, and is very emotional. We had so many resources thrown at us when Nattie died but when a divorce comes, everyone just turns the other way. They don't want to deal with it or "get involved". So sad for my little boy cuz a divorce to him is probably just as hard as losing his sister but nobody told him how to deal with the divorce. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Sorry...I am rambiling on...thank you again for your concerns. I will try to post updates.
God Bless

miss - I am so sorry for your loss.

Sad to say, sometimes wounded people do every thing they can to punish and lash out and destroy anyone who bears any resemblance to the one who wounded them. In this case, you happen to be the same gender as the one who hurt SYF - so therefore, you must be the same as her, motivated by the same evil as her... Sad. So sad.

The best you can do is put the wounded man on ignore - because you are just as wounded - and have every reason to be as angry at men as he is at women.

I would direct such militant-minded fathers to read Eph's posts on General Questions - this man did not need to have long drawn out court battles - in fact, one court hearing was all it took to see that the mother didn't have the children's best interests at heart. It's happening more and more. The courts are learning.

As for the your son - are you getting professional help - therapists, etc.?

When my son was very young, and his father was suffering from some very difficult problems - some self-inflicted, he would take it out on our son. I was extremely careful to not alienate their fragile relationship. Instead, I took him for a drive, and encourage him/let him get through the struggle to find his words as a young child - he didn't get much of a childhood. I listened, practiced validating, then taught him compassion and respect.

It's a tricky balance - to teach a child to honor and respect someone who is being so dishonorable and disrespectful at the time - and validate their tender feelings. How to do that without being negative about the spouse? or x spouse?

My son learned from people like Stephen Covey, Napoleon Hill, and Don Miguel Ruiz because I read the books with him. But most of all, he learned from Jesus how to treat his father.

Today, father and son have a fabulous relationship 90% of the time, with 10% conflict - not bad considering son's a teenager.

Crayola, just because I disagree with you or other bitters out there (Kayla comes to mind) doesn't give you the right to claim my words are a personal attack. If they are, then Kayla's words are too, but I don't see you editing out her comments.

Ever since you edited an earlier post of mine, I have tried to be PC since too many self-claimed non-bitter women here can't seem to accept the facts that they are not God and have no right to tell their child's father what to do.

So, all I can assume is that you too are highly biased and unworthy of the authority given you.

All I can tell Kayla and the Bitters is that if you had your child taken from you on nothing more than the word of the father, and if the father was given God rights to tell you what you could and could not do with YOUR OWN CHILD, how would you feel? What would you be saying?

Come on, let's hear it.

I'm waiting.

Anyone?

missalot-

I am truly sorry for the losses you and your DS have experienced in such a short time. Bravo for your concern for your DS. He is right in the storm with you and you are trying to create a place of refuge for him under your wing.

There might be some programs that can help your little guy with the D. DivorceCare is a great place to start. Some of their meetings include a DivorceCare program for kids. You can go to their website and put your zip code in to find out where there might be some meetings in your area.

Also, sometimes groups like the YMCA have meetings for kids whose parents are going through a D. The leaders of these groups tend to be specially trained counselors who know how to age-appropriately help kids get through their fears during this time.

Some states are now beginning to observe PAS (Parental Alienation Syndrome).

If you can prove that he is trying to drive a wedge between you and your son (and your state observes PAS) then you can use it to your advantage.

However, if your state observes PAS and you withhold the child it is he that can use it to his advantage.

BTW, what is WH?

100 posts in less than a week....Garak, have you ever done any reading here.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> WH = Wayward Husband <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Wayward Husband. I should call him my STBX (soon to be ex).

I found out that his defense is parental neglect on my part. Because our son got a hold of a permanant marker and colored on the walls while I was in the shower and cuz our daughter was in my care when she got into the meds. My response: Our son would not have colored all over the walls with permanant marker if my STBX had not left it lying around. As far as our daughter goes, I HAD to get the lawn mowed that day with the fear of my STBX calling me LAZY if I did not get it done while he was at work. I had the kids in the truck to be in a SAFE place while I was mowing the lawn. AAARRRGGGHH! He can be so selfish and inconciderate.

Yes, unfortunately this post was among the ones I read.