BTW, MyRev, I DO acknowledge that this is a very typical A....I even spent all weekend explaining that exact thing to W's family that I was around. I admit that I only recently opened my mind up enough to realize it, but I DO know what you are saying.

I want to do the right things now instead of trying to do what "I thought was right". I know I will have lots of questions on how to handle different situations through plan A / plan B, but I want to do it right...really, I do! I would appreciate your continued help (and no, I'm not begging!!!!) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

ILA, personally, I think you're getting it and you've done a pretty good job of listening and implementing what you know to do.

Unfortunately, recovery is NOT a sprint. Many times it's more like a marathon. Just calm down and work on yourself for right now. Do Plan A stuff that will make you feel you're bettering yourself...for a future with or without your WS.

You've notified her bosses, her family, and her friends. Good job. She's mad, but that's expected. Don't let it get you discouraged.

It wouldn't hurt to consult with a lawyer about your finances, if you think she might be using your marital assets for continuing her A. You don't have to DO anything at this point, but it never hurts to be informed and aware of your options, etc.

These threads may be helpful to you, ILA.

Lighthouse thread

carrot/stick of Plan A

Lori

Quote from another thread I just found. This is exactly how I feel....I really think I need to build a strong plan A first.

"Remember that the biggest reason for Plan B is to salvage any love you have left for her and really isn't about pressuring her to return. That is why Plan B can only help if Plan A has been stellar. You have to make her enjoy spending time with you before you cut her off from spending time with you. It is the first part that has the effect, not the second. She has to like being with you enough to miss you when your gone."

Any other thoughts on this.

My Rev, Fog Free, At Peace.....sorry, in an earlier post I mentioned Lori as being MyRev's FWW........I got you all confused! My apologies for that. I'm still trying to get everyone straight. It's been a whirlwind 2 weeks!

Thanks

No problem, ILA...I hadn't even caught that!

BTW, I think we cross-posted a few minutes ago. You may want to scroll up.

Lori

Yeah, Lori, got your prior one. Thanks for the support. I really do feel like I've committed myself, just a few days ago mind you, to following the plan A to a tee.

What you said about the marathon not a sprint has finally sunk in. For the last 2 weeks I've been trying to solve everything right now, thinking I could still make a difference.....that's just how I'm wired....I'm a 'fixer'.

I finally have settled on the fact that this will be a long process and feel that I'm finally ready to start plan A the RIGHT way.

This is not to say that I won't try to keep pushing the exposure and doing what MyRev and Tyk are saying....but I also have to quit LB'ing and start to "play nice" a little bit to rebuild my Love Bank balance don't I ??? I'm trying to prep. myself with Rev. Babble so I'm ready to do it properly and avoid the "wrong" discussions.

Good attitude, ILA.

It's not easy...you're gonna screw up sometimes...there will be days when you find your hope almost gone, then days when you're super hopeful...this isn't called a rollercoaster ride for nothing. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hang in there. Don't forget that your ultimate goal should be personal recovery, even IF your marriage doesn't recover.

Lori

I don't think you're doing horrible, certainly no worse than I was at times, probably in many respects better than I was. At some point, really, there is very little you can do.

Plan A, you work on yourself, you identify your problems in the marriage, you fix them, you SHOW your WW that you "get it". You do that consistently, for however long you can, for however long you think it is having some effect. In my case, I did it for about 6 months. However, I didn't find MB until about 6 months into my situation. Had I found MB right off the bat, who knows what would have happened. I would have used exposure MUCH sooner and more effectively. It can never be known, but I suspect I could have and would have shortened my 6 month Plan A adventure by a good 2 or 3 months had I gotten here sooner.

Anyhow. . I don't think you're doing to terribly bad as far as working the plans ILA. As I said, there is in all reality only so much you can do. You need to really work on the relationship talks with your WW. There's just no point in it, after a point, as has been discussed. You need to really work on and identify your truth. Practice acting from it. There is no need for deception, either self deception or attempts at manipulating your WW.

Its a tough road ILA, there's no guarantees. You do your 1/2, act with honor and integrity and the rest is up to your WW.

Thanks Tyk. I have come to the same conclusions now....a week ago I didn't fully "get it". My MC even said the same things.....and said not to "judge" WW. MC said to act honorably and give it time...don't start getting involved with anyone of the opposite sex for several months at least. Everything I'm hearing now, I truly believe.

My #1 focus now is on stopping the R&A talk. I'm hoping to learn rev. babble and keep practicing how I will respond to different situations.

Just talked to W's Aunt for about an hour (that's who W is staying with). Aunt had been away for 1-1/2 weeks so wasn't fully up to speed. I guess my W DID tell her that she was going to Vegas with OM though. I know my W will be more honest with Aunt than anyone else so I have to keep her Aunt informed. Also, W doesn't know that Aunt and I have talked at all.....so that makes it even better. Aunt really liked the theories I told her about (mostly everything from this website) and really bought into everything. I just hadn't had a chance to explain the whole situation to her as well as other family so this makes me happy. Aunt is very analytical and spiritual and is as much 'intrigued' by the situation as she is disappointed. It's almost like a case study to her so I know she will be a huge ally.

I plan to try to keep my contact to the W at a minimum....let her come to me. I plan to continue working my plan and making ME better. I plan to occassionally ask W out on a date or go on a walk or dinner with her Aunt & Uncle, etc......just to try to get some face time with her and show her the "new me" and what she's walking out on. She will probably deny many proposals, but nonetheless, I plan to keep a positive, happy exterior.

Does this sound right, y'all? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Thanks for everyone's continued support. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

BTW, Lori, great link to the plan A stuff.......thank you!!!!

Is it ok to keep asking WW for NC? Right now I just get laughed at if I say that. She would call me dilusional. I don't know if continuing to ask the question (even if it's not A talk....just a reminder like "I don't feel comfortable talking about YOUR relationship right now....but if you promise NC then we can talk about US". Is that type of statement ok, or does that just cause more problems??

W is so foggy right now that she won't even consider US....but does this continual NC reinforcment help any or just hinder????

There is no point in asking for NC right now, she's actively wayward.

IMO, the way to "ask" for NC is to simply state "I believe in our marriage, I believe it is possible for us make this marriage a relationship that makes both of us happy. I believe I have found a way for this to happen. It will not be possible while OM is involved."

That isn't asking her to do anything. That is telling her what you want and telling her the first step in how to get there when she decides she wants it too. No sense in beating her over the head with it over and over, but you also have to be firm in your stance that there is no "working on us" until she ends the A, as there is no point in you doing so. You know what the M is like with OM involved, and it isn't a workable option for you, so unless and until the A is over, recovery simply isn't possible and there's no point in you pretending it is, to yourself or to her.

Very good, Tyk. I'll keep this in mind. Thank you.

Right now just keep ramping up the pressure on the affair and plan A with conversation. Don't talk about the relationship at all. If she wants to talk about the pressure you are applying just say you aren't okay with what she is doing, and she can't stop you from doing what you are doing just like you can't stop her from screwing OM.

Ok, will do. I know I can't script my conversations, but I read that I should try to keep them as "normal" as possible right? Just talk about her day, what she's doing, what I'm doing, maybe family & friends, etc. right? If she tries to bring up R or A just reverse babble and shut her down....am I getting this correct?

I haven't talked to her since Friday b/c she's been doing God knows what in Vegas all weekend. I guess if she was going to run off somewhere with OM, Sin City is appropriate right?....I think I'll use that <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

ILA,

I think I'll just lurk and read for awhile ... looking for some meaningful and consistent actions on your part.

While you are getting some great support and advice here, I'm afraid that you're using this site as a crutch and picking and choosing the advice that supports your continuing weakness to justify your continued inaction.

Here's an example of what I've been hoping for your situation:

FogFree and I took a short quail hunting trip over the long weekend with our english setters and we had a lot of "windshield" time to just talk. Invariably, MB topics came up, along with our own R talks, and we were discussing your situation.

I told FogFree that if I were you, I would expose to the principal and asst. principal on Friday afternoon, and I would do it at the school, where news of our meeting would likely get back to the WW or OM just prior to their little Vegas getaway. Then I would have followed up the meeting with a TM to let them know that their jobs were potentially in jeopardy due to THEIR actions.

Let's see how much "fun" they have with that hanging over their heads for the weekend. Let OM deal with her in a "real life" situation and see how much LBing he does. Bring "REALITY" home to roost for the weekend.

See, IMHO, the WORST thing you can do is allow the A to continue openly. It shows incredible disrespect for you, and makes you look VERY WEAK!!!, which is not an attractive alternative to the OM.

However, if you would have acted as a strong BH trying to save his WW from her own terrible choices, while the OM was scrambling to save his own sorry a$$ in the aftermath of a strong work place exposure, you present yourself as someone who truly loves his WW and is strong enough to fight for her, even when she behaves her worst. It's a powerful message for a WW to absorb.

...but, that opportunity was wasted and you sat alone all weekend like a used up jilted lover, while your WW partied in VEGAS with the OM ... now how do you look as a viable alternative to the OM???

You only get so many of these opportunities to make a difference, and this one was a HUGE missed opportunity. Look around for other upcoming opportunities to make yourself look better in comparison to the OM and TAKE ACTION. When you do, I'll be right there cheering you on.

I understand what you're saying, MyRev. You do have guts! Maybe I did miss the opportunity..but I also think I'd be getting divorce papers today if I'd done that. It seems like a tough call to me.

I did however get a call from W this morning. Apparently her friend in Vegas spilled the beans that I was thinking about talking to her principal (I guess I must have mentioned it in a past conversation). W wanted to know if I'd called him.....I said No (I gave him a letter). W said she hadn't had a chance to talk to him yet and wanted to know what he knows about the situation....I said "I have no idea what your principal knows" (don't know if he 'read' the letter). No direct lies, no admission....that was it. I said it's a shame that the only time she calls me is to attack me on stuff like this. She claimed she wasn't attacking me. I asked how her friend was and told her to have a great day at work. That was it.

She's obviously been wondering most of the weekend if her boss knows something, so I guess that part was good. She must be a little worried, but at the same time the tone of her voice told me that she was already essentially "married" to the OM and she was planning to go spread the word to her co-workers and bosses that they were now an item. She is still so damn adamant about things....it's really hard to hear her talk and be convinced that this A will ever end. They have their whole lives planned out already.

I hope she feels like the eyes of the world are on her today in her first day back at work....but I don't see it doing any bit of good.

BTW, Rev, I'm jealous of the quail hunting trip. I grew up doing a lot of that too. I have a German Shorthaired Pointer <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Lies by omission are still lies. You need to stand up to your WW, you need to stop fearing her reaction. You should have just told her that you talked to him. I'm sure her and OM are VERY worried about this. However, perhaps its best to have them off balance and not know how to proceed as far as damage control. Still, it is never a good thing to lie, its going to come back and bite you in the [censored] as she's going to use the fact that you lied to further justify her decisions. If something comes up and you don't want to talk about it, just tell her that.

The fact that she thinks her and OM are in a legitimate relationship will have no bearing on what other people think, especially people that know you are still trying to fix the marriage, people like her boss.

You're right, of course. I need to get it through my thick skull that she's going to find out and that it's OK if she does.

I'm finding it soooo difficult to have any sort of positive, plan-A type conversation with her b/c it's always about this type of stuff. That's why I tried to not get into the discussion too much this morning, and tried to change the subject as quickly as I could to something more positive....small talk, right?

I guess that's by far my BIGGEST problem right now.....everytime I want to engage in some good, plan A conversation she calls instead to confront me b/c she just found out that I exposed to somebody else and she's mad about it. How DO you plan-A your WW when day after day she keeps getting news that I've exposed to someone else. I feel like she's mad at me constantly and I feel I'm only getting buried deeper in her dislike for me. How do you balance that????

Once this is all over, I'd love to talk bird hunting and bird dogs with you. My son has a very nice GSP female at the moment, and I have a kennel of 5 english setters (with a litter of puppies being delivered AS I POST ... we are at 5 and counting).

Tyk already mentioned what I was thinking ... you should have been honest and up front with your WW. "Yes, I spoke with the principal and I won't apologize for taking every action possible to break up your A and save our M. You are still my W, and I won't stand by while you carry on your A and do NOTHING".

Honest questions:

Since you are flying solo with Plan ILA and basically disregarding the advice you seek, how is that going? Are you any closer to breaking up the A? Does your WW view you as a viable alternative to OM?