FM,

I will definitely say a special prayer for them tonight. I'm so sorry.

I'm glad you had a nice night. I would think the prayer will stick with him. This sounds like it was a good night, sounds hopeful.

Thanks for the prayers TMTS! It definately sounds hopeful just have to continue working!

FixingMe,

You wrote and asked

First do you realize that anger is considered a secondary emotion driven by primary ones such as: fear, pain, frustration, anxiety, etc.? If you think about this for a moment and reflect back to the last time you felt this anger rising, what was it you were actually feeling?

Did you have an expectation of some act or statement that did not come true? Did you fear harm to (oddly) someone, like us parents getting angry with our kids for doing something dangerous. Why get angry? Because we FEAR our child will be harmed. Do you see what I am talking about?

Part of what you need to consider is that most people are lousy mindreaders, and I'll bet your H is as bad as I am. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
The second thing you might consider telling yourself as I do with my family "Nobody leads their life like I would life it for them." This I have found to be a powerful way to be engaged with my family, but also emotionally detach when I feel they are doing something stupid. It is NOT my life, it is theirs.

Now that my children are "adults" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> I take a similar tactic and really only offer advice if asked although I don't want them to make mistakes in life.

My point? Stop and analyze what is driving the anger. To finish this point have you ever met someone that seemed to have unreasonable fears of say narrow roads, or steep roads? You know what I mean? I read an article that pointed out that these people often have a physical situation that puts their body in a uncomfortable place and gradually that feedback to the mind will generate these phobias. I had an Aunt that had from birth a deformed heart valve. Today easily fixed, but in her day, no way. Over the years I beleive it lead her to avoid anything that might excite her because her heart would not respond well to the stimulus.

So think about your reactions and what is driving them, most times it actually is not the person in front of you, but other things going on and they become the lightning rod.

TMTS, made a good point about holding your H. I would like to expand this abit.

Ever paid much attention to men or even boys? Ever watched them when one is hurt or grieving something? They don't talk, but they stand around one another. Perhaps put a hand on the others shoulder. Go to a bar and drink something, but not talk. When men are hurt their tendency is to not talk, and when offering comfort it also is not to talk, but simply to say "Let me know if you need anything." Just a simple statement.

The next thing you need to know is that men RESPOND to a woman's touch, perhaps because we do NOT make contact with men if at all possible.

TMTS's advice was to simply hold your H. You may feel that is sort of a weak way to comfort him or let him know you are there for him, but reread what I just said.

For most men NOTHING is more powerful, than their spouse being near them, in contact with them, and saying very little. He KNOWS why you are there, you don't have to say it.

Your H has had to deal with your affairs. He is now dealing with losing his job, which to most of us guys is a really difficult thing, we identify ourselves with our job.

If you want to help him do what TMTS said...regularly. Just hold him, just be "still" around him, act with GRACE around him. AND as you learn to control the LB's, he will begin to feel comfortable around you.

But here is something you may notice as well. IF you do these things YOUR feelings for him will grow as well. This stuff is very nonlinear.

Oh, don't think your H doesn't hear and remember every word you tell him, he may not act like he notices but believe me he does. You are onto a good approach in changing your habit of using HARSH words toward your H. It will serve you well, it will serve your Marriage well, and it will change your life.

Must go. Hang in there I think there is hope for this especially given now that you are starting to learn and grow.

God Bless,

JL

Hi Just Learning, Thanks for the insights you gave me about anger and your right I think it is a secondary emotion...fear, pain, frustration, anxiety, etc. like you said. I think most of the time its my expectations, I don't know how to get rid of them. I have always been terrible about expectations. Also I would have to say that I struggle with fears, fears of the unknown, fears of money issues, fears of just everything. I want to say thank you for the advice on what to do with my husband, believe me I am lacking in that department, I have the touch but I also have the mouth and the words to go with it. I will start to just try to hold him and be silent. I was reading The Power of a Praying Wife..and she talks about being silent too...something I am not good with. Thanks for your advice its extremely appreciated!!

Hello everyone I bet you thought I just forgot about this Post but I didn't. I have been reading all week and educating myself but couldn't find the time to post. I am feeling extremely frustrated at this moment and tired and worn out. My husband is back to not talking to me. I have done everything from working 2 jobs, to having the kids basically full time, Cleaning the house, doing laundry(which I might add I am better then my sisters <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />), doing homework, running here and there...with hardly no help for the past 5 months. I am tired and worn out, last night I expressed that to my H and what do I get a bad response as usual. I understand this was my doing and its my fault we are seperated...BUT at any point is it expected for him to chip in and help? Is it wrong for me to expect that...see thoughs expectations again. I hardly ever complain about this but I just have gotten to the point where I feel in some ways taken advantage of. Anyone have any advice..am I wrong? I don't mind hearing it if I am. Thanks!

Hey FM! I have read some of your thread, but want to read the whole thing, and we are in the middle of the Green Bay game. DH wants to finish watching it and then we'll be back. Hang in there!!

Hey FM, I have a few questions first if you don't mind.

Where is your H currently staying? Has he found another job? How much time are you spending together as just a couple and also as a family (per week)? How are your girls dealing with all of this? Have you been able to get them some counseling to help them deal with their pain? Have you been honest with them about what happened? If not, I think you should at least let them know that much of what happened between you was due to mistakes that you made and that their dad is having a very difficult time forgiving you, and for good reason. I don't mean to sound harsh, but children are very perceptive, and they may feel very rejected by their F (I read that he has gone a week without seeing them on a couple occasions). The worst thing that could happen is for them to hear you blaming him or speaking badly about him in conversations with them or with others. They need to understand at least the gist of why you are separated. Then you should tell them that you have a plan to try and fix things. That you are working to become a better person and that you both love them very much. Tell them that you would like to be a family again and that you will do the very best that you can to make that happen. Ultimately it is his choice, though, because you have done some very bad things for which he must forgive you. They may be angry with you at first, but as you make your changes, they will come around.

You have gotten some great advice here so far. I also have had issues with anger, or AOs. Getting to the bottom of why it happens, and fixing those things about yourself will be a huge step in your personal recovery, and for your M. As many have said, this will be a long road and there is no quick fix. You cannot simply tell him you've changed. As you may have already witnessed, he will not believe it until he has seen the changes for himself, and for a long enough period of time that he can trust the changes are permanent.

I know you feel overwhelmed right now, but as you said, this outcome is what you have to expect because of the choices you have made. I would do my best if I were you to bring him home so he will feel more connected with you and can help with the family stuff. If he has no job now- he is not going to be able to give you any money. Once he has a job, though, he is obligated as the girls' father to help with them financially. Whether it will be enough to sustain you and your home is for you to determine, as I don't know your finances. If it isn't, you may have to downsize into a smaller place, etc to make ends meet.

I think it is wonderful that you have been doing everything you possibly can to improve the person you are and learn from your mistakes. I am trying to do the same thing right now. It is hard work, but it will be worth it!

I would like to leave you with this thought: stop saying I am sorry and start showing him that you are sorry. Sorry means nothing right now, unless you can back it up with action. He must be able to FEEL your changes. Do as much personal recovery/improvement work as you can now, before he moves back into the home. If you do, then you will have more time to concentrate on re-building the romantic love between you when/if he comes back home. Remember, you cannot control what he does, only what you do.

Good luck to you!

P.S....see if you can get him here!