By the way, I also agree with the quote in your sig, Prov. 17:15. I think it is very apropo here: justifying racists would be an abomination.

At last we find some common ground. Racism is an abomination.

Response to MEDC regarding abortion and breast cancer:


There is no correlation or causal relationship between abortion and breast cancer, except that these are both largely women's health issues.

The National Cancer Institute (from the U.S. National Institute of Health) convened experts, and here is what they found:

In February 2003, the National Cancer Institute (NCI) convened a workshop of over 100 of the world’s leading experts who study pregnancy and breast cancer risk. Workshop participants reviewed existing population-based, clinical, and animal studies on the relationship between pregnancy and breast cancer risk, including studies of induced and spontaneous abortions. They concluded that having an abortion or miscarriage does not increase a woman’s subsequent risk of developing breast cancer. A summary of their findings, titled Summary Report: Early Reproductive Events and Breast Cancer Workshop, can be found at http://www.cancer.gov/cancerinfo/ere-workshop-report . "

Their findings overall: Induced abortion is not associated with an increase in breast cancer risk.

Now, if you are going to counter with another unsupported and unevidenced argument -- that induced abortion IS associated with increased breast cancer risk in African Americans --

THEN, in order for the null statistical findings of any increase in breast cancer following induced abortion in the population at large, it would have to mean that for non-African American women, abortion would be PROTECTIVE of breast cancer.

Here is the link to the NIH abstract online.

Sorry for the delay in posting, but I can't always keep up with the reading here!

MrGGW

Mel - common ground? Individuals may have "common ground," but societal, institutional, and even "mob rule mentality" is something else again.

As was stated by another member earlier, many folks don't have a "problem," racist or otherwise, with members of a different race or ethnicity. What IS the "unifying force" behind such acceptance of one another based upon the "character of their soul?"

It begins with the acceptance that there IS a "soul" and that it transcends any "personal choice." It IS, and always will be, a matter of belief in God and not in evolution.

Differences, primary and fundamental differences between Democrats and Republicans are not connected to racism anymore than they are connected to a belief in a soul. They are based on a personal choice, a societal belief system, that IS an outgrowth of what having or not having a soul means and whether or not God, not Man, is sovereign.

That is the idea behind the much used phrase, "hate the sin but love the sinner." The "problem" comes in when humans try to twist the words of God to suit their own purposes and when humans "prefer" to subsitute something else for revealed truths of God.

Does racism still exist? Absolutely. Will it ever "go away?" Not in my opinion. Not until the whole universe has a "do over" according to God's will, not according to any human's will.

But is racism the "sole" (pun intended) province of racisim against blacks by whites? Not on your life.

Racisim is "acceptable" to a lot people because it suits their purposes. If that were not true, Barack Obama's church would not have their "position statements," and people like Al Sharpton and Louis Farrhakan, among others, would NOT be allowed by the "Black" population of 'non-racist Blacks' to "get away with" all of their decidedly racist comments against people of other races.

To Mimi's point of the "hope of her children" that Barack Obama will usher in some great change that will get rid of racisim, not hardly. No more than having a black mayor of New Orleans helped protect the people of New Orleans from Katrina, all the while he HAD available to him huge numbers of buses to evacuate the citizens and did NOT use them. It wasn't "expedient" for HIM to do so. But it's much easier to blame the police who are trying to follow orders and protect some citizens from other citizens, which IS what we have the police, rather than vigilantees, to do FOR us. Police "serve and protect," they are NOT a welfare system. Police, like every other part of society, do have from time to time, "Bad Apples" in their midst, but they are not long tolerated when they are "found out." Unlike MEDC's distain from the RCC hierarchy and how they "tolerate bad apples," Police forces WILL take action against bad apples in their ranks. Why? Because Police Forces DO serve the people, not the "State," as the "ultimate authority."

Today there is much racism that still thrives, and politicians will exploit it for THEIR OWN advantage in order to get elected. That is reality. That is where the fundamental differences between who to vote for and what Party to be affiliated with lies.

B. Obama has SHOWN us the "character of his heart" in where he choose to attend church, how he fights ANY attempt to limit ANY abortions at ANY stage of development of the baby, how he wants to perpetuate "slavery" of people in their dependence upon the government rather than in personal responsibility and accomplishment, and how he touts his nice sounding slogan of "change."

Change, by and of, itself is nothing. There can be "good change" and there can be "bad change" and there can "color change" that is surface change only. Barak Obama is, and always will be, a Socialist who says and does what he does ONLY to advance Barak Obama. He has chosen politics as the vehicle to get him what he wants, so that he can try to impose his views on everyone else, including the expansion of "State dependency" upon Blacks. That is precisely WHY good people like Colin Powell and Condi Rice are villified, not by White people but by Black people, as being "Uncle Toms" and of "deserting 'their people.' It is a perpetuation of racism from the "Black side."

Ironic in some ways in that MOST Whites are NOT racist anymore whil MOST Blacks seem to have taken on a racist position against "Whitey."

The "problem" if racism is not "solveable" on the political or national level, in my humble opinion. It is solveable on the only real level that works and develops permanent change in thinking.....One on One.....personal relationships.

REAL change is not easy. But with respect to the upcoming National election, to say nothing about State and Local elections, the PHILOSOPHY of the Parties and the impact of those philosophies on the broad population of the USA, IS the "key issue," not who the candidate is.

The "change" that either Clinton or Obama "envision" is a change TO socialism and greater State control of creating more and more dependency for the individual's life TO the "State." They both think that "making other nations like us is more important that the Constitutional duty and will of the People for the President to DEFEND the country against ALL enemies, foreign and domestic.

The CHOICE is clear. Those who will support freedom FOR the people and those who want to surrender that freedom, first to the State, and then to any "foreign" source that is "strong enough" to impose THEIR will on the free people everywhere.

One would think we might have learned that "appeasement" doesn't work, rather it emboldens and encourages enemies of freedom. But with colleges and actors, all who enjoy the "fruits of freedom," constantly indoctrinating students and citizens with a "surrender to the State" mentality, do we REALLY think that racism, classism, and socialism are NOT what they are really after, despite how they try to "couch" their words?

Mimi...others.

This was sent to me by another MB poster. Quite interesting....look at the stats. Shameful.

http://blackgenocide.org/black.html

FH, I think the tolerance of racism against other races by blacks is seen as a bit of payback and entitlement by some. There is a vastly disproportionate amount of crime...and yes, hate crime..against whites. BUT, it isn't viewed that way. I lived this every day in a city that was 50% black. NEVER would "hate" charges be added to a charge against an AA...never. But it was frequently added to the charges of a white on black offender even when they race link was weak at best. Why??? Appeasement.

Either racism is wrong for all...or it is not. So, if people want to hold the idiot Don Imus' of the world to task for their comments...they should also hold the Sharpton, Farrakhan's and more mainstream people to task as well. So, be it a popular talk show host, athletes or the average "Joe" on the street, they should do unto others as they would have done to themselves.



Exactly. Well said FH.



That mayor..if he were white..would have been crucified. Instead, he played the victim role and blamed others for his mistakes. That was shameful to see from a leader of the city. Very shameful. But, it worked because that song plays well in the community...pass the buck.

and in case anyone missed it last night...Louisiana overwhelmingly went for BO.

Atlanta, GA (LifeNews.com) -- The new report the Centers for Disease Control released this week about annual abortion figures in the United States shows abortions continue to target black women moreso than other ethnic groups. The 2004 report also shows about 10 percent of all abortions in the United States are done with the dangerous RU 486 abortion drug. The CDC shows a majority of women who get abortions are white (53 percent) compared with 35 percent done on African-Americans, 8 percent on women of other ethnic backgrounds and the race of the woman was unknown in four percent of the cases. However, the abortion ratio for black women (472 per 1,000 live births) was 2.9 times higher than the ratio for white women (161 per 1,000). Examined another way, nearly half of all pregnancies among black women end in abortion while just 16 percent of pregnancies among while women end in abortion. The abortion rate for black women (28 per 1,000 women) was 2.8 times the rate for white women (10 per 1,000) -- meaning a much greater percentage. Those statistics continue to worry pro-life leaders in the African-American community. On 27 reporting areas adequately obtained abortion stats by ethnicity and those areas showed that 19 percent of the women getting abortions were Hispanic -- with a low of 0.6% in Mississippi to a high of 50% in New Mexico. For Hispanic women in these reporting areas, the abortion ratio was 211 per 1,000 live births, and the abortion rate w as 26 per 1,000 women. However, only 46% of Hispanic women in the United States resided in these reporting areas.

No one is saying this. RACISM towards any RACE towards another RACE is wrong. Why is this such FOCUS of yours?

You keep talking about Al Sharpton and the like. I don't know those people but I can speak from my PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, having lived over 50 years.

What do you say to this? Let's talk about PERSONAL EXPERIENCE because that's what I know about and can speak about. That is the basis of a lot our viewpoints.

My VERY, VERY BEST OF FRIENDS in my whole life is a WHITE WOMAN. We went away to boarding school together and on each holiday except Christmas. She was welcomed into my African-American FAMILY and into my SEGREGATED COMMUNITY with open arms, went EVERYWHERE with my family. I WAS NEVER, EVER, EVER INVITED TO HER HOUSE. Finally, she asked her parents WHY NOT? GUESS, WHAT THEY TOLD HER? "Why do you have to have that N WORD friend?" It affected her relationship with them for the rest of their lives...She is now married to a civil rights attorney. Wonder why?

Flash back to recent time...my YS' best, best, best friend growing up was white, lived across the street from us. We travel alot. We took him everywhere with us. We often were literally stopped. People would stare at us. People would come over and question him as if he was kidnapped or something. The kids thought it was funny.

THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. IMO, and I may be wrong. BLACK PEOPLE ARE ACCEPTING OF WHITES IN THEIR FAMILIES AND IN THEIR COMMUNITIES!! Black women in my family who worked as MAIDS, raised many white children and continue to LOVE THOSE CHILDREN as adults. They LOVED those families that employed them. I did not grow up being RACIST. I did not know what RACISM was until Jesse Helms began to spew his hatred on TV where I live. I was raised to LOVE everyone.

You are FOCUSING on the negative and I don't like that. As a rule, the BLACK COMMUNITY is CHRISTIAN and LOVING. Use MARTIN LUTHER KING, JR. and YOUR EXAMPLE of the MODEL that most of us abide by....not AL SHARPTON and FARAKAHN..and the new voice of HOPE for a UNITED States of AMERICA is BARACK OBAMA.

And finally, my son is speaks of the HOPE that he inspired was SORELY BETRAYED by a group of WHITE FRIENDS in a WHITE GROUP that was a major part of his growing up experience. Just like INFIDELITY, he experienced an incident that was life-changing. He was called the "N-WORD" in a PUBLIC SETTING and was not supported by this institution and just by virtue of it even happening in these days and times HURT him terribly and he is trying to recover from that.

I really opened up myself here and will likely delete this post but I am sickened by the NEGATIVITY here. I wanted to make this REAL not about something that you are READING about in the NEWS....

Are you kidding me? This is not even remotely close to the facts(communities...families I will not speak of). I think you need to educate yourself as to what is happening beyond your limited circle of experience.


As far as what your son was called, that is terrible. But again, since the black community has frequently used this word amongst themselves AND also use derogatory terms for whites, this should come as no surprise even today.

This is SO objedtionable to me, FH. For you to say this about MY PEOPLE is just plain SINFUL and you tout your religious notions. You have no STATISTICS to back this up. You say MOST BLACK PEOPLE and I do not know ONE PERSON, not ONE PERSON who uses this word. This is PREJUDICE. You need to take a long, hard look at yourself.

Do YOU know any BLACK people? Do you have BLACK FRIENDS? I would think not if you think so negatively about us that you are thinking of us as seeing you as WHITEY..YUCK..

We welcome WHITE HOMELESS people into our church homes every week. I have plenty of white friends..on here and everywhere else and so do my OTHER BLACK FRIENDS Are we included in the MOST? You have really OPENED my eyes to who you are. You don't live in an INTEGRATED COMMUNITY and intermingle with people of RELIGIONS, ETHNIC GROUPS AND RACES? I DO...I LOVE PEOPLE...Because JESUS IS LOVE....

I think you are the one that has the LIMITED CIRCLE OF EXPERIENCE in NEGATIVITY.

I've traveled ALL OVER THE COUNTRY and ALL OVER THE WORLD.

You are speaking about THE INNER CITY.

That is NOT REPRESENTATIVE of ALL OF BLACK AMERICA.

Mimi, you can't say i do not live an integrated life...and I think FH is right. He isn't being prejudiced...he is being truthful. And YOU crying victim all the time is shameful.

Mimi...I haven't lived in an INNER city. I worked in an inner city. My experience extends well beyond those borders.

And BTW...most blacks live in inner cities Mimi. And MIMI, most does not mean all.

I find it interesting that YOU claim to know more about the BLACK COMMUNITY than I do. To what do you attribute your EXPERTISE?

I've ACTUALLY LIVED in BOTH WORLDS?

Have you?

and my information about whites being accepted in black communities comes from the UCR reports published by the FBI.

I'm nobody's VICTIM. I don't know where you are getting that from...but if you want to refer to me that way FINE..your opinion...

I didn't say that you don't live an integrated life but it's EVIDENT that you do not have an intimate relationship with an ADULT BLACK person. If you do, share your viewpoint with them about the BLACK COMMUNITY. Say it to their face. Get some OTHER OPINIONS than mine and see what they have to say. Working in the inner city is not the same as LIVING in the BLACK COMMUNITY.

FH is NOT being TRUTHFUL. He is being PREJUDICED. MOST BLACK PEOPLE are not RACIST!! That is an EVIL, SINFUL comment and it is PREJUDICED because neither him, you or I could possibly KNOW MOST BLACK PEOPLE and when he says that, it includes me and my family and my ancestors and WE ARE NOT..at least on purpose...although as FH states, we do live in a RACIST SOCIETY...in thinking that, HE will APPROACH BLACK PEOPLE with THAT ASSUMPTION.

Me saying that does not make me a VICTIM. Me saying that is SPEAKING MY TRUTH....

Well, Mimi, I grew up and worked in Philly...not inner city..but Philly. I then spent time working in inner city Philly as a cop. I now live in an all too white area that is bordered by an area known for its KKK support. Yet, I bring two black children in here...and God help anyone that would ever cross them because of their color. I think I can speak from a good amount of experience.

I will also tell you that I do not view you as someone that gives much thought to things. Even you have said that you have not educated yourself about "issues." I think you get something in your head and will play the victim card to garner sympathy.
You used that real good on FH and I would bet that he would stand against that which you have accused him of. That Mimi is playing the racism card where none exists. THAT is the crapp I think you have taught your kids and why they think they need a black president to have "hope."

Mimi...I have shared that view with my "adult" black friends and it is their views that have helped shape mine. In fact, I would say that blacks beyond the inner cities (which are NOT close to the majority of blacks in this country) are LESS tolerant of a lot of this stuff than whites. They would agree with FH too. I have no problem expressing my views to anyones "face."

And once again Mimi...I think it is time for you to pull out your little dictionary...most does not mean all.

I'm not gonna even respond to this, MEDC. Your opinion about me is almost LAUGHABLE. I'm not going to invest my time and energy today in response to it. How in the world could you have any idea who I REALLY AM..and how I raise MY KIDS from a FORUM. You only know me from what I type in this box. Clearly, as indicated in the bit that I have shared, I have NOT raised my kids to be racist! IT'S JUST NOT TRUE! All you are saying is so OFF THE MARK..about me..about them...

I'm on here to help folks with infidelity..and to get help with my continuing Recovery with that AWFUL TRAGEDY..for which I DEFINITELY WAS A VICTIM..

I'm not here to win your favor or friendship..not here to get you to know me or like me..

Think what you want...

I surely don't want YOUR SYMPATHY or anyone else's here...

I get all the the REAL LOVE that I NEED from people in MY REAL LIFE...

And there are people HERE on the FORUM that I will one day welcome into my REAL LIFE but they still don't REALLY KNOW me from this FORUM.

I can't write well enough to communicate ALL THAT IS ME..in all my FABULOCITY...

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