Hello all! I haven't posted in a couple years, but I'm back.

My WH (EA) says he wants a divorce. I have asked him for his lawyer's contact information to have my lawyer send an offer of sorts, and he won't give it to me. Why wouldn't he give me his lawyer's contact information? The only thing I can think of is he doesn't have one. Any other ideas?

Hi, Amanda!

Could he be bluffing? Sometimes a WS will threaten divorce in order to get the BS to back off and let the affair continue.

i say he doesn't have one and really deep down doesn't want one .... that is my opinion.... just from the things i have heard and seen on these boards

Thanks. At this point I'd really prefer that he DID have one. He says he wants an uncontested divorce and I've typed up a list of what I will require in order to agree to one.

Our 15 month old son hasn't seen him in 11 days, now all of a sudden he wants to come pick him up tomorrow? And not tell me where he's going with him? I don't think so! There is NO WAY I'll have this baby around the woman who has destroyed his life! I'm totally freaking out now. I can't legally stop him from taking him, but I don't know how to get it through to him that taking off with him tomorrow is not in Michael's best interest! I just don't think after a nearly 2 week absence Michael is going to take well to him showing up and yanking him away like that. I've told him several times that he can spend time with him here. I'll even go hang out with a neighbor or something while he's here, so long as he doesn't start taking anything out of the house, that is. I want to be nearby and I want Michael in a familiar setting.

Should I tell him he either spends time with him here or he gives me his lawyer's information so our lawyers can figure out when and where he sees the baby? Or is that too much like an ultimatum?

I just spoke to the police department. They said to call in the morning and they will have an officer come by to mediate. I'm freaking out, though!

I told him it does matter where he's going, and that I do not want him around OW. He said:

See you brought her name up not me. there are no plans for anything like that so dont worry your little head about that. I WILL NOT STAY IN THAT HOUSE WITH YOU.... THAT IS ALLLLL
THAT HAS TO BE SAID ABOUT THAT.


And I have typed up this response. WDYT?

You aren't going to bring her name up, I already know that. I'm not stupid. You've lied and hidden stuff from me about her for MONTHS. You sure aren't going to volunteer the information that you are going to take our baby over there. I have the right to know where he is going to be, and I do not trust you to stay away from Heather. She's worth throwing our marriage away, so what's to stop you?

I have never done anything so horrible to you that would preclude you from spending time here if I am here, so I don't want to hear that. I have only stood up for our marriage, expected you to put our marriage before others, and not gotten a full time job, which is only an excuse, not a reason to throw a family away. Get over it. No one else has any trouble seeing the fact that my job is more beneficial money wise than anything else I could get. Especially once I get through the training for this other job. Even if I had gotten a full time job, it would have come to this because you have never been committed to this marriage, Greg. Was it simply a marriage of convenience for you? Did you ever love me? Or did you only like my earning potential? So sorry to disappoint you, but I guess I'm just a terrible person for wanting to put our baby's best interest before our recreational desires. Those can wait. He's only a baby ONCE.

I do not want to fight with you, I only want what is best for Michael, and I don't think taking him off tomorrow is in his best interest. I know he's going to be happy to see you, that's why I've been asking you to come see him, but considering the long absence you've taken from his life I think it needs to happen here where he's most comfortable and where I am nearby. I never said I was going to hover over you. I can go visit with a neighbor or something, but either I know where he's going to be, or he stays here.

Too many disrespectful judgements.

I'm confused too. Where has hubby been for 11 days? Is he having an affair?

Dear WH,
I have no information of where you are going to take our baby, and I do not know if it would be at (ow name) home. I have the right to know where he is going to be, and have a say in where our son will be.

I have never done anything so horrible to you that would preclude you from spending time here if I am here. I have only stood up for our marriage, expected you to put our marriage before others, and not gotten a full time job, not a reason to throw a family away. My job is more beneficial money wise than anything else I could get. Especially once I get through the training for this other job. I wanted to put our baby's best interest before our recreational desires.

I only want what is best for Michael, and I don't think taking him off tomorrow is in his best interest. I know he's going to be happy to see you, that's why I've been asking you to come see him, but taken from his life I think it needs to happen here where he's most comfortable and where I am nearby. I never said I was going to hover over you. I can go visit with a neighbor or something, but either I know where he's going to be, or he stays here.

Okay, I revised your letter to take out the DJ's and get your point across more clearly without insulting your WS. Just my suggestion, take it or leave it.

You seem so very angry.

Please try to step back and not react to things. Decide what is healthiest for you, family, and marriage if you choose to want to save it.

It is absolutely okay for you to need to know where your son will be with visitation.

Good luck and best wishes,
Love in Christ,
Miss M

edited to take out MORE of the dj's <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

I just simply asked what time he plans to have him home.

OK, now that I'm calm enough, here's some background information.

We were friends with our former next door neighbors. Hung out a lot, cookouts, spent lots of time together. Then he started spending more and more time over there without me. She used to text me and say, "Hey, y'all come over" and we would. Then he took the text message package off of my phone without warning and put a passcode on the account so I no longer had access to the records. She started texting him instead and he wouldn't tell me, he'd just get up and leave.

Soon thereafter I noticed on the phone bill when it came in that they had been texting back and forth 200+ times a month, and spending lots of time on the phone while he was at work. I looked at past bills and saw this was not exactly new. I could ask him to help me with something and he'd go to sleep on the couch. She could text him half an hour later and he'd jump up tp go help her with something. I told them that all this made me very uncomfortable. I thought I was talking to my husband and a friend. Seems that wasn't the case. I was talking to the man I married and a woman who pretended to be my friend. She has even since volunteered information to another friend of mine that she only put up with me to get information for H.

They immediately accused me of accusing them of having a PA. I never said that, I never even used the EA term even though I knew that was what it was, or at least very close to it. All of a sudden she's going around telling neighbors about it. One even apologized to me for listening to her for so long. Then I'm accused of telling everyone they are having a PA. I never suspected that, and still don't, and I certainly never told anyone that.

We've separated 4 times since then, and every time it is after an argument about her. He has thrown around the D word everytime, and gave me no indication he was returning. Then he wanted to get mad when I went and applied for assistance to feed my boys. The third time I asked him for the name of his lawyer, more so to feel him out than anything. He refused then as well, and asked me who mine was. I gave him a name and 2 days later he was calling asking what did he have to do. It was quite simple. Cut off all contact with her.

It didn't stop immediately, but did slowly phase out. I got a part time job and he watched the baby while I was at work. One neighbor told me on a few ocassions that when OW walked outside, he would go back inside. She never stopped texting him, but up until Feb 7th, he did not respond. Things changed drastically at that point. I could tell he had been talking to her even before I knew it. I sent her an email video of a horse (the Stacy Westphal video if you've seen it) because I knew she liked horses, just to test the waters. She emailed me back telling me not to email her anymore. I said that was fine. I'd remove her email address from my address book as soon as she removed my husband's number from his phone and stopped using it. She said she had done that months ago (yea, ok, phone bill showed otherwise) and saying it just helped that they worked the same shift (she's EMT and he's a firefighter for not only different cities, but she's in another county, so how does that help?). I emailed her again saying look, H asked you to back off so we could work on our marriage months ago. Now I'm asking you again to do so. She then filed a police report against me that I was threatening her via email. Funny part is that all that came out of that is she was told to leave my husband alone. HA

She continued to text and call him, however, so I brought that to the detective's attention. He called her right in front of me and asked had she called him that morning at 8:30 (he had gotten the phone records) and she denied it, saying it must have been her husband using her phone (yes, she's married, too. Third marriage, 1st anniversary in April). He then called the husband and he denied having talked to him, too. He told both of them that there was to be NO more contact, period, or he would see to it himself that it stopped.

That night WH called from work and said it was over. He didn't come home the next morning, even to get Michael so I could go to work. If I didn't work for my dad I would have wound up losing my job by now, as I haven't been able to go for 2 weeks! I don't have the money to pay anyone to watch him. He came by on Thursday the 21st but didn't even look in on his sleeping baby. Then he came by on Sunday the 24th and did at least look at him, but didn't try to wake him or anything, so the baby hasn't seen him since the 17th. I have sent him several messages asking him to come see the baby, and asking if he could come get him so I could go to work. He never responded to any of them.

He's been staying at his dad's house.

good!!

More info.

Have you read HNHN's? Have you studied up about Plan A and Plan B?

Do you have a plan?

I am amazed that the police have been involved and told your WS and ow no contact. LOL.

I have never heard of that.

Have you figured out what your WS's needs are? Where you might be lacking? Sounds like you have had a lot of trouble since the baby was born?

I think they have been gaslighting you, by saying you accused them of a PA when you didn't. However, I think a PA has been going on, and them accusing you of saying it was to put you off the trail.

And it is on again, you can bet that. Hopefully the wise ones will come and help.

I am very concerned about your letter full of YOU messages and dj's. Are you acting out?

Stay away from all talk of ow right now. Get a plan. Read up on MB principles.

Best wishes,
Miss M

I've bought so many copies of HNHN that I don't have any idea how many it is now. LOL I bought a copy, loved it, and decided everyone I know who is getting married will get a copy. So, I pass it on and buy another. And another. And another.

I've never been able to get H on board with any "program" to help us identify our problem areas or anything. He digs his heels in everytime. We've started counseling 3 times, most recently just a few months ago, but after a few sessions, he bails. Tired of hearing how wrong he is? IDK. This last counselor told him in no uncertain terms that he was at the least in an EA based on what he himself had told her. So, identifying his needs, other than maybe FS, has been hard. No matter what I do, he finds something to complain about. I say maybe FS because I think it's just an excuse. He's been so far gone for so long that I think he wanted me to get a FT job to avoid alimony, that he never intended for us to get our marriage back on track. He was just trying to make it look good and buy more time and try to get me working. That's why he didn't care that it meant less money in the long run. He also tried to get me to stop breastfeeding and was quite adamant about sabotaging my efforts to keep it up. He developed a sudden interest in putting the baby to bed, which I was happy about, but AS SOON as I mentioned that he was starting to prefer bottles at bedtime he smiled and never put him to bed again until one time a few weeks ago when I was sick as a dog.

I will admit, though, that he put on a good act the last few months. So many little things had improved a LOT. We we laughing together again. SF (more my need than his) had improved. Because he had been staying home w/Michael the days I was working, their relationship had blossomed and I loved watching them together, even though I was back "on the clock" as soon as I got home. I worked 9 hours and WORKED those 9 hours. He works a 24 hour shift, but might WORK an average of an hour per shift. Yet, I got no breaks.

I don't know if I even want a plan at this point. I've tried plan A in the past, but without any feedback from him I felt like I was hitting a brick wall. Nothing seemed to work, and Harley himself says you can't do all 10.

I'm more inclined to believe that if I was gaslighted, that it was to keep me from looking behind me instead of further around the corner. There may be still someone else, and the former neighbor was just a smokescreen. I don't know. I just know I'm to the point of wanting out myself now. I don't want to feel that way, partly because I still look at this baby of ours and feel that we've failed him. It took two years of infertility treatments and eventual surgery for me before he was finally conceived. And for what? So he could become a statistic? You really think there is a PA going on?

I am definitely very angry right now. I know I'm inclined to act out at this time, which is what brought me back to MB and why I didn't send much more than one liners to him before I came here.

One friend of mine thinks he's doing this simply because I asked for his attorney's information and he's running scared again. She's always been very optimistic about it, though, even though she's going through a very similar divorce herself.

Had to take a break and get the baby in the tub, and now I've completely lost my train of thought.

Thanks for your advice thus far, and please, keep it coming! Ideally, yes, I'd like to save my marriage. He's a class A jerk, but I know he (and WE) has potential. If he treated me as well as he does his friends, we'd be just fine!

Looking forward to a LONG night ahead. Not just my distress about tomorrow, but also because Michael has been sleeping so poorly the last week. Two nights ago I put his daddy's pillowcase in his crib, and he slept better the last two nights. May be coincidence, but I'm leaving it in there! The night before that he was up screaming for 3 hours. The anxiety has affected his digestion as well. It's not been a fun ride, but I'm persevering!

Oh, that is funny about the cops, isn't it? She files the report and then SHE'S the one in their spotlight. HA HA Cracks me up. Speaking of her and the law, when/if a divorce is filed, I live in a state that allows alienation of affection suits, and I'll be pursuing that.

^ for findingme

Thanks, Miss M.

Time for more background information. When our baby was a week old, we filed for bankruptcy. H had lost his job at Northwest Airlines and refused to admit we couldn't afford all the luxuries anymore on only his fire department income. The court ruled that our boat had to be turned over, and he refused resulting in our bankruptcy being dismissed. We were supposed to have it reinstated, but he decided to leave me with a house in foreclosure instead. I had even convinced the trustee's attorney to allow us to keep the boat! My truck, which was current at the time of filing, is now over $3000 behind. We had it hidden until we could get the bankruptcy reinstated.

Today was BAD. Last night our Tahoe (that I paid cash for out of a settlement I received years ago) wouldn't start, so when H got here this morning I told him. He got it jumped and I went to check the carseat in his truck. NO WAY. There is NO WAY I'm letting my baby get in a seat as ridiculously NOT installed as that one was. He insisted it was fine, so I called the police at that point. With the PD on the phone he finally said he would take the Tahoe instead and get the tags renewed and then go see if it was the battery or the alternator that needed replaced and take care of it. My first thought was great way for a 15 month old to spend the day with his father, but I let him go, saying to bring the Tahoe back when that was done, and then we'd go from there.

Well, he left, and did NOT go where he said he was going. Two and a half hours later he was back with MY truck instead of the Tahoe, knowing full well if it sat in this driveway it would be gone within 12 hours. No warning whatsoever. I've been looking into getting it refinanced, but had hoped that we would have the bankruptcy reinstated as part of the terms of the divorce. He claims his lawyer told him my truck is not his problem, to bring it back. If his lawyer said such a thing, he obviously isn't getting the full picture from H. He certainly doesn't know it was ME who bought the Tahoe to begin with. And any lawyer worth his beans would know I'm going to wind up getting the Tahoe if that's the only vehicle, right? Especially after the way he left us! UGH

So, instead of spending his time with his father standing in line and going to AutoZone, Michael spent the whole 2 1/2 hours in his carseat. The truck was an hour away.

After talking it over with a few close friends and family members, I've decided I'm filing on Wednesday if I can get the money to do so from my parents. They want him out of my life badly enough, I think. I've got to do something to protect myself and my baby. He's been clingy as ever since he got back and won't let me out of his sight for a second. Poor baby. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Amanda, I'm sorry things have deteriorated to this point. I've often wondered if things got better for y'all, as you seem to have had a rocky marriage from the beginning.

Have you done a good Plan A or tried Plan B?

Things had gotten better, until that woman moved in next door. Well, even then things were better for a while, until the middle of last summer. We spent 2 years dealing with infertility, until my eventual surgery finally led to a baby, and we dealt with that fairly well. We still had problems, of course, but we were happy. We even went on a 2nd honeymoon last June, and he came home saying he had never been happier than we were at that moment. Then things fell apart fast.

I tried Plan A as best I could with no feedback from him. Things did seem better for a long time, so maybe it worked?

I have not yet officially tried a Plan B, letter and all, but I have basically been doing that. I don't contact him at all unless it deals with the baby. Can you help me draft a Plan B letter to him, or will filing be about the same thing? I don't know that it would help at this point. Not sure I even want it to anymore, but I'm willing to try it for Michael's sake.