This is my first time posting here although I have been here reading for a while. My husband and I are both 27. November will be 10 years of marriage. We have 3 kids, 2 daughters 9 and 6, 1 son 11 months. My WH actually came on and posted last night after I asked him to.

Here is the Link

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...e=0#Post3412788

This all started in august 2006 when i was pregnant with my son. I got very sick and had to be hospitalized because I hadn't been able to keep anything down for a week. The first night I was in the hospital, my husband and my "bestfriend" started talking online, . Emailing and then instant messaging. One of them ended up calling the other and then she eneded up coming over to our house. My husband was uspest that I was in the hopspital and sick. because it was my idea to get pregnant in the first place even thought he wasn't really happy about the idea. He ended up decidind to try with me and it was a mutual decision. Although, not he and I have different memories about how that really went down. He says he felt forced. I remember him coming to me and saying that we would give it 6 months and if it's want God wants then it will happen. Anyway, she came over and they exchanged sob stories. She was married once before , for about 2 months. This was maybe 3 or 4 years ago. She was telling him all about her marital problems and he was telling her all about ours. After she left, she called him again and they eneded up having phone sex. I knew none of this. I came home from the hospital and I notinced right away that he was distant. Butt he would never say anything. Then he started going for walks at night for an hour or so. I didn't like the idea but he said he just needed time away to himself. After a few more months , probably in October , he started getting up early for work and instead of going to work , he actually went over to her house instead. This was when her parents were aout of town. (BTW- she lives with them and her dad was the pastor of our church where she My husband, ex bf , and I were members) This is when it became physical. I stil l knew nothing except that things were not right. I started to complain about his behavior and it just pushed him farther away. I demeanded to know what was going on. Dec 12 2006 he told me that he didn't love me the same way anymore and he was moving out for a while. He would moved in with a friend/coworker. This is when the affair really hit its's peak. I was completely devastated and at this time 6 months pregnant. I got deepley depressed and couldn't eat. My "bestfriend" took me to the doctor and i got I got put on ADs. I lost 20 pounds. My At this point my baby was at risk. I also started having preterm labor and contractions and was put on meds for that too. My husband gave me every typical wayward-fog babble line in the book: I don't love you, I need more time to sort out my feelings, I don't know what want...ect. I tried and tried to no avail. New years eve he was supposed to have an answer for me .Well that day came and he said he had no answer. So he went back to his apartment. I showed up there the next morning around 6 am. I saw my "bfs" car parked around the corner in an obsurcure place. I called her, asked her where she was and she lied. I immediately began beating the door down. After several minutes and some scuffling around insfde he finally let me in. They both vehemetly denied that anything at all happend. I was so angry and I was yelling every word in the book at her. She was telling my husband to just go home with me. And i was telling her to just get out. My husband - then told me that he loved me and he was sorry. He wanted to come home. I said no. I demanded the truth. They continued to deny it. I went to talk to my mom and when i came home he was here. He convinced me that nothing at all had happend and that she had gone over there to talk about me. They ened up having some drinks and he told her to go sleep upstairs (which i never happend.) . I believed it all , stupid me. Meanwhile she went and told her own twisted story to her patrents, because obviously this was going to be a huge issue as we were all church members and her father was the pastor. Her father then drew up an "agreement" which I signed that said iI believed nothning of a sexual nature happened between them. I did this because my husband was very upset and told me he didn't want anything coming out. I just wanted him back. I was very clueless. So his first night back I told him that he needed to tell me if anything happend , not only for my health, but the health of my unborn child. I told him that I wanted to make an informed desicion whether i I would allow him to be intimate with me again. He once again vehemetly denied everything. Everythng was ok for about 2 or more days. Then the fog babble started all over again. He told me again that he was not in love with me. So i was very depressed again. He was still talking to her. He went out of town a couple weeks later and she went up there to meed him and sleep with him. Which I later found out. While he was out of town, I went back into the hopspital with preterm labor and faced losing my son. The day he came back i had just got home and found out that he went behind my back to get his haircut buy none other than my wonderful "bestfriend" I was livid. Did they have no concern as to how that would make me feel. I was panicing and having my pregnancy at ristk I decided enouph was enough. I called her. Said I was going to tell everyone aoubt bout her and what she was doing and to stay away from my husband and my family. I called my mom over and his parents over. They all showed up here right after he did. He got pissed and took off . He didn't come back until after they left. He told me he was done. So he moved out out again that weekednd. I wasn't speaking to bf anymore at this point. and I had my doubts but all in all i couldn't let myself believe that my bestfriend and husband would do this to me. I heard a few rumors and started TMing my husband saying that I knew what he was doing and I wansn't going to settle for his easy little divorce when he was boinking my bestfriend. He vehemetly denied once again that anything was going on, but at that point i was so fed up I told him to just shove it. I also had his parents over at my house telling me I needed to be a better wife so my husband would come home. they pushed their way in and said they were going to "clean this place up" so that he would comd come back. "Hello!? I have been barfing for 7 months and now I'm on bedrest for preterm labor!! My husband got very angry at them for treating me that way. The next day he came home. Everything seemed ok for a while. He showed some sadness (I know it was withdrawl) but not as much as when he came back the first time. Things went on as usual and very quitet. A few days before I had my son my "bf" started contacting me again. She appoplogized and said she wanted to be back in my life. Stupid me!! I let her. I foolishly believed that nothing happended.

Right after the birth of my son things took a turn for the worst. My husband would get very angry out of the blue and straight up cuss me out for no apparent reason. He was verbally and even physically abusive to a small degree. He literaly slapped me with divorce papers right on top of my head. I was scared and I turned to a friend for help. This was a fellow church member. Her and her husband went to the pastor and told him everything (without my knowledge). The pastor then told them that I was bi-polar, what!!?? They asked him how he knew that and he sad because "OW" , (my "br", his daughter) told him. I flipped , I knew then and there that something was VERY wrong. Apparently he then went straight to his daughter and told her the whole story. Then she went straight to my husband and told him . She told him I was trying to get him sent to prison. He lost it on me. It made him treat me even worse verbally but he was afraid to touch me at that point. I gave up. I completely detached emotionally. Things grew quiet again. Then he was the one asking me what was going on. Why was I so distant and not myself. Well DUR! He didn't like it. I started moving away from him and was making plans to go do stuff on my own. Here I was 2 weeks atfter baby, not pregnant anymore and going out on my own looking good again. He was shaking in his boots. He then told me he loved me and wanted to be with me. I said ok. Over the next few months he had completlely broken off contact with her (behind my back) he would still see her because she once again insuinuated herself into my life. she had me believing that the other people lied to me about her and her father saying I was pi-polar. So our friendship was on again. To the point were she was suffocating me. She was over at my house constantly. Things started to seem fishy to me again. i went and got tested and guess what? I had an STD. Well my H is the only man I have ever slept with . so I confronted him and he admitted it all. He was crying and scared out of his mind that I would leave him. I confronted my former bf. Her attitude was ugly and she just kept saying that he came on to to her and that she had been a good friend to me. I punched her in the face. (wrong I know, ) then left. I exposed to everyone. How the very pastor himself was helping to cover this up and lie. It came out that she had been sleeping with 3 church members, one my husband, the other the former husband of her former bestfriend ( they divorced over this) , and the other a single man at the same time as my husband. Several other church members who I thought were my friends had known that she was seeing my husband behind my back and were covering for them. I felt so humiliated. I was the last to know. She was there with me always. Helping me pick furniture, deocorate the nursery , taking my kids places. She was also the youth choir director that my kids were in. Well the pastor was removed from his office for his behavior and continued lies. She contined to lie as well . He left the church, and she left. The church split. They all went to another sister church. I lost many people who I thought were friends. They broke off their freindship with me to be friends with her. All of my husbands family and all of her family are intertwined and have been friends all their lives. The ripple effect has been tremendous as to who all has been hurt by this. There has been no persoanal contact between her and I or her and my husband. But, there is no way to rid her from our lives. She is involved with everyone around us. Our whole social network. We contstantly hear about her. She is now bestfriends with the wife of my husbands boss ,who used to be a good friend of mine and now wont even speak to me. She's everywhere I't makes me sick. It has been 8 months since D-day. I am willing to work things out. I don 't really feel like we have started any real recovery. I stil l have alot of drepression. The nightmares are awful too. Every night.

sorry about the multiple typos, i was copying and pasting from a key logger because it took so long to type out that the forum timmed out and I didn't want to retype the novel again.

Welcome TW, it is wonderful that your H is also posting here.

I can see why you are having a hard time healing when she has permeated the very air you breathe. Have you considered moving somewhere else? Dr. Harley even recommends moving out of state for the protection of the marriage.

After so many months, it is definitely time for you to enter a real recovery. Dragging on like this will just increase your pain, and ultimately your resentment.

Are there changes you can make in your life, switching churches, moving in different circles, anything that will minimize her impact in your life for now? And I still strongly recommend moving as a goal to begin working toward.

You have made amazing progress though! The affair is busted up, the lying, conniving, enabling pastor has been removed, and everyone knows the truth about your OW, and your H seems to want to save your M. That is huge!!!! In your continued pain, don't lose sight of how far you've already come.

Relax and settle in; you've come to a good place.

Thank you for your response. I know we have made alot of progress. I am thankful for that. I don't think moving is possible at all. I have asked H about it, but it's just not feasible. The housing market has dropped and our house is not even worth what we payed. He really needs to keep his job which really sucks since boss and wife are buddy-buddy with OW. We haven't been back to church at all since this. The former pastor moved to one sister church and she went to another. Their friends a family who attend the various other churches are angry at me for the way I exposed everything. I would like to go back to church but I don't see how to do that and be able to overcome the huge trigger that that place is for me. I think it may be possible in time because 99% of those people don't go to our church anymore, but H is very hesitant to go back at all. Right now the main issue is me being able to express my pain and ask him questions without him getting very upset. He wants me to recognize that he has feelings too. I do realize that. I know he hurts but I also know he has NO idea yet how much pain he has caused.

I agree, move if you can or "remove" yourself from anyone who has contact with her. Above all MOVE out of that church! This is not what God would want and that pastor is putting his own self above what God wants. Also to have parishners knowing about the affair and condoning it just blows my mind. I am sure you can find a new church and start your healing there.

Wow, Tigerswife. I just want you to know that people are reading your post. I'm here with you, and I understand. Our situations are extremely similar, and my husband and I are recovered. I know it looks bleak, but my FWH and I are proof that God does heal marriages wrecked by infidelity.

Keep posting and getting advice...I'll hand it over to the VETS. Keep your chin up.

God will honor you for your faithfulness. It's a promise.

Welcome TW

Sorry you are going through such pain. But you've come to the right place. As Neak suggested, is there any way to move to a different location? Having the OW "around" will make recovery that much harder.


Has your WH done the basics steps for intital recovery?

Obviously the exposure has been done and I say GOOD JOB!!!!

So what about transparency? What about an NC letter? Do you feel he is open and honest about what's going on now? And is he truly remorseful? Is he willing to do anything to help you recover?

I have read his posts and I have my own thoughts of where HE is. So where are you? What do you need from him to recover? What is he not doing now?

I could probably guess.

What's crazy is I don't think it's possible to remove myself from all those people. My husband actually grew up with her. His parents were in her parents wedding and vise versa. I hear about her through them all the time. I mean, don't get me wrong. His parents fall just short of absolute hate for her and her father for what they did, but everyone is just so involved with everyone and it seems impossible to not hear through the grapevine something or other at times. H's father doesn't help much either. He thinks all I need is a good dose of scripture and to attend church and all will be fine. He actually told me to just get over it and not cry in front of H. To just get my cryin out before he comes home or I'll drive him crazy. His parents are extremely old fashioned and don't even believe in cousiling or "recovery". You just need God is all they say.

TW,

First of all, I am sorry for all the pain you have been through. You have suffered multiple betrayals...your husband, your best friend, your minister, fellow sister/brothers in Christ. You blows you have been taken are monumental and all while you were fighting for your baby's life or trying to recover from birth.

So, take a long breath.

There is a road to healing. God is incredibly faithful, even when it seems there is no end to the pain.

I read through your husband's post, and I plan to ask my very remorseful FWH (tst) to post to your husband. Our stories are journaled here on MB. My husband had an incredible turnaround and committed to do anything and everything that I needed to heal.

I suggest you focus your efforts first on your own healing. It is time for your WS to take the lead in recovering your marriage; and if he continues to post, he will learn how to do that.

You need to make sure you are eating and sleeping as best you can. Do you stay at home with the children? Do you nurse?

Your husband is going to need to do a few things right up front to help establish is willingness to help you heal. I am sure he will be instructed about this things, but I'll tell you a little about how my FWH proved to me his repentence and desire to be my husband were sincere.

First, he committed to no contact and sent a no contact letter to OW that I read, approved, and mailed.

Second, he eliminated the avenues that she could contact him. He changed his cell number and his email. He gave me all passwords to all accounts. He closed his personal checking account and only uses our joint one. We have a private home number. He took his business email off his website, and listed his office manager as the only contact person. He informed his receptionist that no calls from OW are to get through to him.

He provides me his daily schedule. He contacts me throughout the day. ANY time he varies from his schedule, he calls me.

The actions above were the FIRST steps to beginning our recovery.

He has confronted his family members and friends that enabled his affair and told them they were wrong and should have been supporting me and our children instead.

My FWH apologized to me, our children, my family, and our close friends for his lies and betrayal. He has humbled himself in everyway, and realizes that he has caused me more suffering than facing his death.

I believe that you and your husband are going to seriously have to consider moving. You have been betrayed by so many around you, and it sounds like your lives are intermingled so much so that you will have triggers everywhere.

Your husband needs to answer every question you have about the affair and your history honestly and completely.

If your husband is willing to do the basics described above, then I suggest the both of you read Dr. Harley's information about emotional needs and fill out his questionnaire. Follow that with the Love Busters information and questionnaire.

You need to start spending 15+ hours a week together meeting each other's emotional needs (ENs).

If your husband is willing to do the above, there is hope for your marriage to recover. But HE must take the lead at this point, because you have battled a long war and you are weary.

He did a no contact letter back right when everything had come out. Even though he had already broken it off with her. He started to hear the double talk and realized what she was doing. She would lie to him about me and lie to me about him. She did NOT want to end the affair so she used me under the false pretense of being my bestfriend to worm her way back in and get to him. He is being very transparent and makes sure I always know where he is. He keeps his phone on at all times. I had no way of knowing before if he was calling her because his phone is through work. So no phone records. Now he has copies of them sent from the office for me to read over. What I need from him is to try and better understand where I'm coming from and to realize that his pain isn't even on the same plane as mine. I need less anger on his part to. He has NO right to be angry right now. He says that he is just angry at himself but I am the one that gets yelled at and cursed at when we talk about it. I don't know if I am going about things the wrong way but whenever I try to talk or ask questions, he seems to end up getting VERY angry and then eventually crying or being so depressed he just wants to lay on the floor and do nothing. I dunno. I just feel like I'm kinda stuck in this depression right now and I wonder if I am just being selfish. I think I am very confused and afraid to trust anyone around me.

Oh, BTW, GOOD JOB on exposure. How sick a church to cover such sin and leave the victim on the ground bleeding! What's really sad is that it happens so often.

You really have done A LOT to fight for your marriage and your family. I hope that your WH realizes the gift he is being given.

I know forgiveness and grace from God and from the BS is a really difficult thing for a truly repentant FWS to handle. It OVERWHELMS them...rocks them to the core of their soul.

Yep, could have guessed that.

You have every right to ask the questions you need to ask, just do it calmly and not as punishment. He sees it as punishment. I suggest you set a certain time when you discuss the A. Maybe limit the number of questions per session. And make sure those questions are ones you really want answers to.

When he answers them truthfully they're gonna hurt. Don't react to them. Thank him for his honesty. Make it safe for him to be honest with you. If you rant and scream hearing the answers, he will clam up. He won't want to keep having those discussions, understandably. Keep calm and in control.

Make this a rule for both of you. If things break down, end the session and revisit it the next session. Eventually you will get the answers you need.

sexymamabear, I am a stay at home mom. I am not nursing. I am however going through the process of getting a job. I think it will help me because my mind is so unoccupied sitting around at home all day. At this point I don't know if he or I have been doing the right things. I do know that he has convinced me of his desire to do whatever he can. I know there is no way she would contact him. If she did we would expose her right away. She tried a while back under a made up name on myspace and it was obvious. He posted the email on his page in a public blog for everyone to see that she was trying to contact him. Needless to say, she hasn't tried since. The emails from her were actually warning and getting on to him for letting everyone know all the nastly little secrets she and her father were keeping.

TW

Your WH is playing the victim. The fallout from his A has caused him pain, but he has not claimed the blame. He hasn't owned the consequences and he blames you for them. None of the pain he is feeling can be traced back to you. Make sure that you completely understand that. His A, his consequences.

Is this part of his personality? Is this his pattern?

If he is truly sorry for his A and all the suffering that you have gone through he will stuff his victim status and man up to help you recover.

Think it's time to go post to him.

He says he realizes that none of this is my fault at all and that he doesn't blame me. He says that he has a tendecy to take out the anger he feels at himself on me. I have noticed this pattern in the past. He has struggled with pornography for years and I hated it. when we first got married it floored me. He would promise to not do it and then over and over again for years he would go back to it and lie to me. Then when i finally had no trust for him and started to talk separation when he wouldn't stop, he got very angry and told me I didn't handle it right. That is why he says he thought he fell out of love with me and fell in love with her. So my heart was pretty bruised and battered before the affair.

Tigerswife,
I am impressed by the way you handled all this. You seem to have done alot of things right, according to this website, without having read here prior to exposure. The one place I would suggest you read up on though is accountability. I think you have been very forgiving, without necessarily setting good boundaries. For instance, the above bolded line is a fallacy. I read your WH's post in "Just Found Out", its no wonder that you aren't in a real recovery yet. Maybe he says he feels differently, but actions speak louder than words. Yelling at you and calling you names is not "doing everything he can". Lying on the floor and not moving is not "doing everything he can". Those are the actions of a petulant boy, not a man seeking your forgiveness. Just look at the reaction of people to his post. It absolutely stinks of anger, entitlement, and resentment. I don't know the man, just the post, and I did not see any contrition or humility there.

If you want a different reaction from him, you need to change how you act towards him. By that, I don't mean you are doing anything wrong. I mean that if you are guilty of angry outbursts and other lovebusters, you need to work to eliminate those and create a safe environment for him to open up to you. If you already HAVE done that, and he continues to react defensively and hostilely, then it may be time to lay some clear boundaries for him.

i.e. "I am doing everything I can to meet your needs and I am committed to recovering our marriage. But to restore my ability to trust you and be vulnerable with you, I need total honesty and transparency without hostility and that includes a willingness to answer all of my questions without reservation. If you cannot meet that need, I am not interested in putting myself through the pain of a prolonged, false recovery."

Sometimes people need a cold, bucket of water in the face to shock them out of their apathy, self-pity, selishness, etc...
Sometimes if you want more, you have to demand more.

Classic blameshifting. Its not his inability to keep a promise to you, its your inability to handle his vices in the correct way. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

If your husband acted like this before his affair and continues to act like this 8-9 months after his affair ended, I think you are a looking at a personality flaw. I would make individual and marital counselling a requirement to reconciliation.

Joseph's Letter:

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"To Whomever,

"I know you are feeling the pain of guilt and confusion. I understand that you wish all this never happened and that you wish it would just go away. I can even believe that you truly love me and that your indiscretion hurts you emotionally much the same way it hurts me. I understand your apprehension to me discovering little by little, everything that led up to your indiscretion, everything that happened that night, and everything that happened afterwards. I understand. No one wants to have a mistake or misjudgment thrown in his or her face repeatedly. No one wants to be forced to "look" at the thing that caused all their pain over and over again. I can actually see, that through your eyes, you are viewing this whole thing as something that just needs to go away, something that is over, that he/she doesn't mean anything to you, so why is it such a big issue? I can understand you wondering why I torture myself with this continuously, and thinking, doesn't he/she know by now that I love him/her? I can see how you can feel this way and how frustrating it must be. But for the remainder of this letter I'm going to ask you to view my reality through my eyes.

"You were there. There is no detail left out from your point of view. Like a puzzle, you have all the pieces and you are able to reconstruct them and be able to understand the whole picture, the whole message, or the whole meaning. You know exactly what that picture is and what it means to you and if it can effect your life and whether or not it continues to stir your feelings. You have the pieces, the tools, and the knowledge. You can move through your life with 100% of the picture you compiled. If you have any doubts, then at least you're carrying all the information in your mind and you can use it to derive conclusions or answers to your doubts or question. You carry all the "STUFF" to figure out OUR reality. There isn't really any information, or pieces to the puzzle that you don't have.

"Now let's enter my reality. Let's both agree that this affects our lives equally. The outcome no matter what it is well affect us both. Our future and our present circumstances are every bit as important to me as it is to you. So, why then is it okay for me to be left in the dark? Do I not deserve to know as much about the night that nearly destroyed our relationship as you do? Just like you, I am also able to discern the meaning of certain particulars and innuendoes of that night and just like you, I deserve to be given the opportunity to understand what nearly brought our relationship down. To assume that I can move forward and accept everything at face value is unrealistic and unless we stop thinking unrealistically I doubt our lives well ever "feel" complete. You have given me a puzzle. It is a 1000 piece puzzle and 400 random pieces are missing. You expect me to assemble the puzzle without the benefit of looking at the picture on the box. You expect me to be able to discern what I am looking at and to appreciate it in the same context as you. You want me to be as comfortable with what I see in the picture as you are. When I ask if there was a tree in such and such area of the picture you tell me don't worry about it, it's not important. When I ask whether there were any animals in my puzzle you say don't worry about it, it's not important. When I ask if there was a lake in that big empty spot in my puzzle you say, what's the difference, it's not important. Then later when I'm expected to "understand" the picture in my puzzle you fail to understand my disorientation and confusion. You expect me to feel the same way about the picture as you do but deny me the same view as you. When I express this problem you feel compelled to admonish me for not understanding it, for not seeing it the way you see it. You wonder why I can't just accept whatever you chose to describe to me about the picture and then be able to feel the same way you feel about it.

"So, you want me to be okay with everything. You think you deserve to know and I deserve to wonder. You may honestly feel that the whole picture, everything that happened is insignificant because in your heart you know it was a mistake and wish it never happened. But how can I know that? Faith? Because you told me so? Would you have faith if the tables were turned? Don't you understand that I want to believe you completely? But how can I? I can never know what is truly in your mind and heart. I can only observe you actions, and what information I have acquired and slowly, over time rebuild my faith in your feelings. I truly wish it were easier.

"So, there it is, as best as I can put it. That is why I ask questions. That is where my need to know is derived from. And that is why it is unfair for you to think that we can effectively move forward and unfair for you to accuse me of dwelling on the past. My need to know stems from my desire to hold our world together. It doesn't come from jealousy, it doesn't come from spitefulness, and it doesn't come from a desire to make you suffer. It comes from the fact that I love you. Why else would I put myself through this? Wouldn't it be easier for me to walk away? Wouldn't it be easier to consider our relationship a bad mistake in my life and to move on to better horizons? Of course it would, but I can't and the reason I can't is because I love you and that reason in itself makes all the difference in the world."

(end of Joseph's Letter)

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Very nice Andrew3. Well spoken.

You SHOULD be afraid to trust anyone around you. They have ALL proven themselves UNTRUSTWORTHY. You would be insane TO trust any of the people involved in this betrayal or the enabling or covering up of it. Get that straight right now.

Your husband getting angry at you when you need to talk about the affair is his way of trying to get out of talking about it. He should be angry with himself. BUT if he truly IS remorseful, then he would not blow up at you.

When my FWH and I talk about the affair, the conversations do take their toll on him. But his anger about his actions is not and should not be targeted at me.

Do not tolerate your husband's attempts to make you feel guilty for needing to know the details of your marriage, which include the details of this betrayal.