Hi

I've asked this question in another thread but never really received an answer.

I don't think my wife is cheating on me, but if she WAS, her behavior would make a bit more sense. So I began to snoop. So far:

1. Google desktop on upstairs computer. Spector on downstairs.
2. Periodic search of purse, work bag, bedroom (under mattress,
clothing, pockets, drawers)
3. No calls and hangups.
4. No mysterious time AWAY from the home. She is home EVERYNIGHT,
right on time.
5. No change in appearance, new interests, etc.(She IS a bit more
concerned about wrinkles, weight (she weighs in at 103, for God
sake)
6. Search car for clues, nada.

So, ask you can see, I think the chances are pretty slim, but, something keeps gnawing away at me, probably paranoia.

MY QUESTION:
One poster suggested a voice activated recorder. SOunds good to me. But I was wondering if ANYONE here has had experience with this piece of equipment and could point me in the right direction as to WHERE to buy one, which is the best model, where to put in car, HOW to put it in the car, risks involved, etc. Also is there any advice on any other method of gathering info?

Thanks, I appreciate it.

Gaba,

""4. No mysterious time AWAY from the home. She is home EVERYNIGHT, right on time.""

During the day, does she work?

While I was at work, they would meet at the notell motel.

They go through batteries pretty fast. Look for long recording times. Circuit City has several models ranging from $30 - $125.

Practice with it first. They pick up conversations pretty well.

Make sure it has a headphone jack for when you listen to it.

Check that all alarms are disabled. It may have a low battery alarm that must be shut down.

It may be (probably is) illegal to record in her car.

Be very, very careful. They work great but you do not want to get caught.

Good luck, but be warned, hearing this stuff hurts bad. Reading their emails is one kind of hurt, but actually hearing their voice spewing venom and lies out loud is really tough. It's a Plan A killer.

Yep. She works as a middle school teacher. Why does that always strike me as a career that involves affairs alot? You?

Thanks for the info.
You know, the one thing that doesn't worry me in the least is if its against the law. I could give a rats [censored] if its against any law. This is MY wife, and MY life. As long as I'm morally at ease with something, thats all I need. Shoot, even if some worm in a black robe decides my wife isn't my wife any more....Yeah, ok. She will ALWAYS be my wife. Society, anybody else who doesn't think so, good for them. My marriage and everything involved with it was between ME, my wife and God.

And thanks for the "hurt" advice. Oh yeah, thats a big worry for me. I know my heart will stop beating if I ever hear those words. If youve gone through them, Im so so sorry. I really am.

I hope NOT! My W has been a 5th grade teacher for 12 years. She has very few (and occassionally no) male coworkers.

I'm just curious...if there are no apparent outward signs that cause you to mistrust your wife, why do you?
What is she doing that causes you concern? Why are you here at MB? Something made you come here...something is making you wonder.

Oh goodness, what this man has been through. Check out his EN thread. Gabagool, how is the counseling going? Did you ever call the IC about the friend?

Fiori

Yeah, theres a big long whiney thread in EN section. I realize that a big part of my mistrust can be attributed to insecurity. But, in all honesty, it just would make all this unhappiness and melodrama in my marriage make a lot more sense.

I'm crazy about my wife. I mean school boy crazy. This hurts a whole bunch.

Hey Soolee!

Hows it going!! Everything is good with you, right? I hope so.

Yep, I have a scheduled meeting with him after the next weekend. Your suggestion of bringing up her friend is FIRST AND FOREMOST on my list of things to discuss.

But she has been going every week. I sure hope SOMETHING is being accomplished here. I don't ask.

GG,
Ok, our internet is on the fritz with email so I had a bit of time to read. Whoa! Now I get it. Sorry for not reading up prior to asking.
Italian huh? My family too. Is W Italian? The only reason I ask is because it's sort of a 'culture' and 'way of life' rather than simply a nationality. I see alot of stuff that you just say is the way it is...final! Perhaps a little more open mindedness... I know, that sounds trite, just a thought.

I tell you a brief story...Several years ago we met a couple at a class we both took. This couple got along very well with us and we formed a nice friendship. As we were both pregnant at the same time and both roughly the same age, it worked out well. The woman and I began spending lots of time together once the babies were born -- long walks, lunch, play dates. I noticed her hubby was always home. Concerned they were some type of drug dealers (huuuuuuggggee house and not stress) I questioned them as to how they managed to make ends meet. Long story, short...he came from a very wealthy family and they lived off interest. Anyway, the point is this; each time I spent days with her, I came home ANGRY with my H. No reason...just angry. It took me months to realize that I was jealous. And, their lifestyle made me mad that it was not mine. I scaled back that relationship, became thankful for the lovely one I had and the negativity faded. Perhaps this 'friend' of your wife is cheering her on to 'dis' you. Perhaps she's unahppy and is seeing to it that you are too! My H got involved with an EA at work and the entire time he was wooing her, I was an awful person. Now that her influence is gone, we laugh again. I told him a long time ago that whether or not it was a man or woman, if there was a toxic force destroying 'us' then it would have to go--and that went for me too! If I had a friend who was that toxic to our well being, I'd have to choose H.

Fiori

Yep. First generation Italian. My wife is Polish. Cant get much different in the way of culture. And that was fine while my wife liked me. Now that she can't stand me, she thinks my heritage ridiculous. The food, the loud discussions, the spoiling of the offspring, all worth sheet. In contrast, I have a great deal of admiration for HER culture. But I DID NOT at first.


As far as her friend is concerned. Oh yeah. Its a toxic one for sure. But if I even try to DISCUSS it with her, I toast. Her friend is FAR more important to her, at this point in time, than I am. And perhaps it will always be. Now, I know, and ANYONE with a sane brain knows that this is WRONG. Case closed WRONG. But, it is just a waste of time tell her this. Her friend HATES her husband and admires my wife a great deal. Therefore if she can have a friend that she admires HATE her husband and marriage too, well, life is good. And her husband is a decent guy to guys, just a real cruddy husband.

As far as envy, your story says a lot about you. It took great personal integrity to do what you did. First of all to admit it and second of all to distance yourself. I think that yeah, my wife could be souring on me because of envy. She would NEVER admit it (shes REALLY REALLY CATHOLIC, envy is bad enough, but envying MONEY is ridiculous. And I wholeheartedly agree. Money mean NOTHING to me) We live in a upscale community and the amount of money people have is ridiculous. It seems sometimes, I can never make enough to make up for early times. Just a few days ago she was ragging that "SHE" doesn't have that much to retire on. BUT, SHE wanted to send my son to boarding school. She didn't want to take out a loan, so THAT cost us about 125,000 dollars for TWO years!!! ANd she wanted to stay at home for the first 15 years of marriage. Well, this ALL feeds into not having enough!~!!!! But, she made it sound (I know her) that this was another shortcoming in ME. And I PERFECTLY noticed that she said SHE, not WE. It just sucks having a conversation with her. She is just so full of hate and venom. I may have done things wrong but............

Nice to meet a fellow EYE TALIAN!!!

Ok GG...
I thought about you a few times this past weekend. Here's what I've come up with (for what it's worth).

1. Can you have a chat with the toxic friend? Perhaps there's some value in speaking with her and getting her read on what has deteriorated your marriage. I realize it's a long shot, but I'm finding that when put in this position you are challenged to do things that otherwise seem odd.

2. Sit down and make a list of all the reasons you love your wife. Really be honest....because I fear that you may be in love with the 'idea' of your wife rather than the actual person. I'm not clear on how someone who is obviously so full of vengence could look appealing to you. But, who gets to understand love??!!

Maybe this will help...maybe not. But, I was thinking of you which is probably helpful. I hope your day today is better than any last week.

Her girlfriend reminds me of the girl's roomate (Sarah Silverman played her) in School for Scoundrels.

Fiori

Man, youre right on in both. In my long thread, I even suggested that I am in love with the woman my wife WAS more than the woman she is now. I admire a lot of what she is now, but its tough to be in love with someone who lacks respect for you, who ignores you, who basically treats you like a nuisance. Its tough to love someone who is trying, really, to create a seperate life from you.
BUt, she is my wife, I married her. That will NEVER CHANGE. Regardless of anything she does, she will always be my wife. This is a decision she made 22 years ago, a decision that she CANNOT change, no matter WHAT society tells her. And the same goes with me. No matter what she does and no matter HOW MUCH I hate it, I will be here husband forever. I took a gamble, a calculated risk, and at this point, it looks like I am losing. But, I can't ask for my money back. I will just keep plugging along, trying to get this back.

Right now, I am trying to "grow my life" ASIDE from her, this way if and when she decides I am no long worthy of her, I will have something to fall back on. As Cat suggested, I am applying TODAY, this afternoon, acutally to graduate school. I am in the gym 5-6 days a week, trying to make myself less ugly, and am EVEN considering EXPANDING my businesses. All these things, I am doing WITHOUT my wifes yes or no. She wanted this route, so thats the route I am going down.

Just bought a new car. A nice car, stick, peppy and great on gas. I gave it to her and took the old wagon. She accepted it. I am glad I can do something once in a while to make her happy.

Oh yeah. The conversation.

I HAVE thought about talking to her. But somehow, I would have to make her PROMISE not to tell my W. I don't know if this is possible.

Like I posted in my thread, I introduced her to my wife because her husband worked for me as a manager. WHile my marriage was decent, I loved the fact that my W and her were getting to be friends. She was a cool person. Big time attractive, hardworking and smart. SHe was a little wild, my wife a little conservative, so together they found something they lacked in themselves. I was proud that I could have had a hand in forming a nice friendship.

She's always hated her husband, for good reason, so I believe that had a big part in a few instances of "attention" to me. A couple times, well a bit more than a couple times, there was a DEFINATE moment or two of attraction on her part towards me. A touch that remained in contact a bit longer than a coincidence, a look. Its hard to explain, but when it happens to you, you know it, always. So thats on my mind also. The danger that lies there, IF its still there.

In shame, I must admit that when I'm really angry I fantasize about going forward with this possiblity. To show my wife the REAL face of this person who she loves so much, and well, she hates me anyways, so why not. I feel bad when I think this way, but sometimes I hurt soooo bad, I just want to hurt back. Luckily these feelings are fleeting. But, they bug me enough I had to get it out and admit it. Its not good to feel this way and I regret it all the time.

So, there are the problems with talking to her. Soolee suggested that I mention her to the counselor that is counseling my wife, to have him bring her up in counseling. When I was seeing him, I told him all about her, so he is familiar with her.

Yep, your wife has a toxic friend.

She's miserable and she has convinced your wife that you are all of her problems!

My own wifey has a toxic friend that helped her destroy our marriage, she was cheating on her husband and cheerleaded my wife while she was cheating on me.

Misery loves company.

Many of the recordings I have of my wife's affair is her bragging to her toxic friend and laughing about how clueless I was.

Whatever the toxic friend tells your wife will be gospel and anything you try will go instantly to the toxic friend for HER advice. Which wil be contradictory to the welfare to your family.

Alright GG, you gave me alot to digest on that one! Perhaps, under the circumstances a private chat would not be your best plan. But, why not in a public place...where there are witnesses? Do you think it's possible that your wife already is aware of the toxic friends fascination with you? Perhaps this is why she is so angry. Frankly, we women sometimes do strange stuff when we are faced with the possibility of losing a friend. Yes, stop jumping...I know you're supposed to be her best friend. But, there's no logic sometimes to that girlfriend bond. We need our girls and perhaps your wife needs her more than you imagined. Obviously they are both getting some need met by each other. There must be some way to find out exactly what it is that toxic lady is giving your W.
Well, for what it's worth, here's my advice. Start writing!! Write your wife love letters. Write her your thoughts for the day. Leave them for her in her car in the morning or at night so she gets them right in the morning. You will be able to communicate many things to her on paper that she rebuffs face to face right now. Be prepared, she may laugh or joke with the toxic buddy at first, but if under all her hostility and her anger she truely loves you, you should be able to win her love back. Really, she would not be with you still if she truely hated you. And, as for your comment on being ugly...please -- be nicer to yourself. Unless you came out of a pod with four eyes and an extra nose, I'm sure you are much more appealing than you give yourself credit for. But, be careful with your car buying and sprucing up -- I smell mid life crisis!! You don't want to be accused of that too!! Heavens, there's enough on your plate already. Anyway, along with a letter or two or 100, make her a heart shaped pizza. I wish someone would tell my H this...but ROMANCE HER!!!!! Don't just be angry...be the best ever!

Yeah, I was considered whiny, jealous, and insecure...until I caught her on my couch with a naked man. I was completely blindsided.

You seem intelligent. Listen to your gut.

Pariah

Man, youre story really friggin sucks. Big time. The hurt, embarassment, frustration and sense of betrayal would have KILLED me. You got some Guts. I wish I had just a bit of yours.

I wish my gut was a bit more positive. I think that maybe, in all honesty, I feel that if she IS having an affair, this shifts the blame of all this on to her and I can say to myself, "See, this isn't about me being a bad guy, this is about her sleeping around".
I don't know, I just don't know

But, I am looking into that recorder you loved. Where did you get yours??

Fiori

Yeah, love letters make sense. BUt, not with MY wife. I used to scribble little stupid love notes on little pad I kept in my pocket. If something happened during the day that was mushy or reminded how important love is, I would write it and then after I got 3 or 4 I would put them all over the house. Tape to a mirror, in the sugar bowl, in her purse, on the cieling above the bed...anywhere where I thought she would least expect them.... As she started to hate me more and more, she told me to stop with the letters and the "sappy Guinea stuff" She hates it. She HATES love songs and laughs at me because I can't watch stupid chick flicks because the tender scenes get my face watering. I can't help it. I've ALWAYS been emotional.

See my wife sees love letters, love songs, etc ONLY real IF I don't do anything else wrong. I see them as saying "Hey, you know I know I acted like a baffoon, but deep down I am crazy about you, please forgive me." She just doesn't want me in her life anymore. I'm starting to understand this. ANd I HAVE TO guard against it. It is imperative that I begin building a life ASIDE from hers, or else when the poop FINALLY hits the fan, I will be ROYALLY SCREWED. I don't know if I will be able to handle it, either.

I LOVE LOVE LETTERS. SHE DOESN'T.