Telling someone what they can and cannot do will usually result in defiance.
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We are talking about marriage here...
How do you feel about adultery?

If your wife said, "I forbid you to get a lap dance because it = adultery to me"..... would you defy her?

If my wife said that to me, I would not go because the lap dance is of no importance to me, and it's clearly important to her.

Turn it around. Suppose I said to my wife, "You cannot have a conversation with X, because to me, conversation with X = adultery." Should she relent because I forbade it, or am I just being a selfish jerk? In other words, do I OWN her behavior? It's an open question, not rhetorical.

Keep in mind, I am not trying to compare a conversation with a man to a lap dance, but I am talking about the act of forbidding someone to do something. I see that as the end of negotiation. Of course *I* believe that at some point, negotiation has to end, and either there is a mutually agreeable solution, or the two part ways.

Is this the time for the end of negoatiation? I have no idea.

In Marriage Builders you never make demands but you do express that you are uncomfortable with XYZ situation. Since your spouse must care for your feelings, he will not do it. It is not in Joint Mutual Enthusiastic Agreement.

If you express how you are hurt and how you fear and feel infidelity that is very good for your relationship with your spouse. Otherwise you are in a Giver situation and that is no good. Your spouse must not do it if it hurts you.

So do you think that one must cede to all requests from a spouse? Or just those that he/she feels strongly about? Is it possible that a request/demand is too much to ask?

Are we talking about just refraining from behavior?

Greatly depends upon whom 'X' is as to what label might be attached to conversation with 'X'.

To a certain extent a spouses behavior is 'owned' by the other. Anyone not willing to relinquish 'ownership' in this sense, shouldn't get married.

In marriage, two become one. You can no longer act independently, you are now a couple.

You must take your spouse's feelings into account in everything and your spouse's yours.

Saying that you are uncomfortable should be enough.

Let me see ?? My answer is 'YES', it is possible. Was I correct?

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Actually, in Marriage Builders, it is the policy of Joint Enthusiastic Mutual Agreement that takes precedence on every thing, small and large, and not just behavior but also goals and friendships, jobs, and careers, family and X girl friends etc. It is not a question of ceding but of reaching an agreement or to do nothing until one is reached.

I’ve seen that but I don’t really think something should be too much to ask. Remember, the idea is to both be in love with one another.

For example asking to stop seeing a mother in law that is disrespectfull. That is not too much.

Like what then?

I can't disagree, that should be the way it works.

I suppose I got hung up on the word forbid. It seems like an approach doomed to failure.

I can't imagine telling my wife that I forbid her. But she doesn't cross any of my boundaries.

I think purpose of this thread has been forgotten.

Extremely unusual.

********EDIT*********

I suppose I got hung up on the word forbid. It seems like an approach doomed to failure.

I can't imagine telling my wife that I forbid her. But she doesn't cross any of my boundaries.
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I can understand that the word forbid would rub you he wrong way.
It doesn't have a place in a good marriage because neither partner wants to do anything that would harmful to the relationship.


But suppose your wife wanted stay out all night and party w/ other men?...
and then dismissed your concerns and complaints and told you that it was entertainment for her and she deserved it even if you find it offensive.

Maybe you would be ok with that, I can't be sure by your responses....but, your analogy about talking to other men and lap dances doesn't make much sense to me.....You continually try to take the SEX part out when you are discussing women........ romance vs. porn, talking vs.lap dance.....I think you might be doing yourself a disservice by thinking your wife as a just a romantic being but not a sexual one.

Sigh. I do seem to have trouble expressing myself. I just had a red flag with the word forbid. Perhaps if you ignored everything else I said, it would make more sense.

Sigh. I do seem to have trouble expressing myself. I just had a red flag with the word forbid. Perhaps if you ignored everything else I said, it would make more sense.
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gotcha.
I have a problem w/t he word lapdance, I think I understand where you are coming from.

********EDIT*********

ItCouldHappen, you will cease personal attacks on this board.

Thank you very much Cat for your advice. We have had numerous conversations about this subject lately and everyday it seems he has a better understanding of how strong i feel about this and he feels bad. He actually said he was going to counseling, that he wants to better himself, and i can go with him if i wanted. I of course am going to go but there is still this lingering feeling of deception, dissapointment, anger, etc. that i am feeling. I can forgive him but i know i will never forget and i'm afraid we will never be the way we were.

What you have said is good news. Tell him there are people here who are cheering for him. Nudge him gently but firmly until he has followed though with what he has said he'd do.

He is a fortunate man to have both your love and your willingness to forgive him. If your love is strong enough it will overcome the fear you have of not being the same as once your were. In a very real sense you will be better than before in that you have survived a hurricane together. God bless you and I sincerely hope the progress is abundant and the setbacks few and far between if there are to be any. One day at a time. And make every minute count.

Thank you very much for you well wishes. I told him i am scared and he said if i didn't see a change in him like he promised, i should then decide whether or not to stay with him. I really feel deep down in my heart that he is sincere and wants to grow a greater relationship with God and be a better husband. I told him i was afraid our marriage would never be as great as it was and like you, he said if anything it is only going to be better and stronger. I have faith that it will. Thanks again to you and everyone else who helped me through this huge bump in my marriage. I am very glad i found this marraige website and will continue to learn from it and all who communicate here.

Is this the first time in that 5 yrs that he has done this?..Yes it matters..


This is the part that sticks out in my mind..He told you he would not visit the establishments, he does again (once in 5 yrs)BUT he did in fact lie about it. When asked he should have been honest.