Thanks Rocky and mopey!

And sorry to all for the slight T/J!

MEDC...we cross-posted and I just saw your reply...thank you very much...he IS a member of our family. This house will be very strange and empty without him here...

I posted on a couple of infidelity boards before finding MB. They were of the vent and support variety - but nothing with a PLAN for saving my marriage.

My bout with infidelity was very confusing for me. At first, I wasn't even sure what my DH was doing WAS infidelity. I was feeling so betrayed, so scared, so unsure of how to even breathe much less hold my marriage together.

I read everything I could get my hands on. I called 4 local licensed family therapists who advertised as being "pro-marriage" or Christian. The first appointment I could get with any one of them was two weeks away! I was dying inside and couldn't find anyone to talk to, to ask advice of.

Then I searched using the terms marriage, save, infidelity and found MB. It saved my sanity. The members here helped me undertsand that what I was feeling was real, it wasn't all in my head. The articles, the books and the forum participants gave me a plan to save my marriage. I was no longer powerless!

So thank you. All of you.

LaLa,

I in NO WAY question the wisdom of the MB methods. I have actually said many times that the beauty of their plans are that they ARE counter-intitive. Also, I hope that there is NO misunderstanding that what I also said is that without MB I am CERTAIN that I would now be divorced. I believe indeed that MB is Divinely Inspired.

My comments were directed only to the fact that I believe there are some POSTERS who are very insistent that if you end up in a bad way that it must be because you didn't follow the plans correctly. As I said before, I believe this is a subtle undercurrent. I do not believe it has ANYTHING to do with the wisdom of the principles. I am not complaining. I read these boards daily and have for almost a year. I finally started posting in January. I am merely commenting.

And I will tell you that my situation regarding some of this IS a little different. My husband's issues and his A did NOT occur because he his ENs were not being met. He says this also. In his own words, he was selfish and entitled(I am condensing this). In fact, I did Plan A during the A without realizing it. When I found the MB books(right after D-Day) I knew I had found the Holy Grail of Marriage Advice. But what a struggle. Yes, I KNOW it's a struggle. BUT, this was different in mighty ways. And I knew it was different because of what I read on these boards. Without that SINGLE piece of information I don't think I would have been able to make it. I needed to see what was working for others to see what was NOT working for us.

My H is Controlling and Verbally Abusive. He was this way before the A and continued after. Before the A I felt I could handle it. After the A, not so much. No matter what I said, how I approached it, what I did, what tone of voice, what facial expression, EVERYTHING I asked was a Selfish Demand, EVERY different opinion was a Disrespectful Judgement, EVERY word an Angry Outburst. All my life I have been a person who ASSUMES that if I am misunderstood, that it is MY fault because I have not said something properly. I have absolutely NO problem with rephrasing or apologizing if I have inadvertently offended, etc. But NONE of this was good enough for my H. he felt that he did not have to answer to me for ANYTHING. He did not believe in PORH and POJA was a joke. If he did not get HIS way, he told me that I was love-busting and that he did not believe he should have to negotiate. I can NOT exaggerate this. It was THAT bad. And this was POST-A, not just before.

So, I found that while I could work the principles, my H was NOT going to. He was not interested in figuring out his ENs or in meeting mine and he felt that any problem with Love Busters was mine and mine alone. And even though it was great that I was improving, the ultimate goal was the salvation of our marriage. I was confused and frustrated and ready to throw in the towel. I am well aware that the MB road is narrow and my H was totally unwilling to walk it with me. The MC we did see told me flat out that my H was not able to change. That his life experiences(of which there are many) had left him so damaged that change was not possible. THAT was the last time we saw her.

My H was unwilling to talk to the Harley's and I was fearful that it would be waste because my H made it clear that he was not going to do anything they suggested anyway. And something in my gut told me there was more going on here. My H did not want to throw away the marriage and KNEW there was something bizarre about his responses to me but just could not seem to help it or control it.

I stared searching for my more info about my H's personality and struck gold AGAIN when I found the Patricia Evans books. She described my H absolutely to a T and explained EVERY problem that we have had in our M. Over the last few months, we have been slowly working our way through her books. He recognized himself almost immediately. After I caught him in a huge lie(not A related) I told him I was through unless he agreed to talk to the Harleys or to Patricia Evans. He agreed to Patricia. He talked to her 3 weeks ago and I can honestly say that there has been change since then. Maybe it will last, maybe not. But NOW, he SEES the wisdom of MB. And even if it is difficult to get it started he is WILLING to give it a try. Again, I am condensing, but for the first time in many, many, many months I have a deep. genuine hope. I have hope that we can have a real MB marriage.

My point in this ridiculously long defense of myself is that SOMETIMES there ARE other issues that must be addressed. Not always, maybe not often, but sometimes there really ARE. Sometimes there are FOO issues that can NOT be ignored in order for a marriage to work today. I was unwilling to throw away a marriage to a man I love with all my heart and who I believe loves me despite his behaviors WITHOUT looking at all the issues. AS A RULE, I do not believe in dragging all this cr** up from childhood etc.,but there was no choice here if WE were going to survive.

I am sorry if there was any misunderstanding. I completely understand the wisdom of MB.

Blessings,
WH2LE

WK

Can I ask you something? You say that your H had entitlement issues, truth telling issues and than a PA. SOunds like he was tough to live with.

After youre DD, and a bit of time to process the hideousness, did you still LOVE him? Did you want to still be MARRIED to him? And if so, WHY? What was it about him or your marriage that made you want to stay? I mean, he sounded TOUGH BEFORE the A. Why didn't the A seal his fate?

Thank you for any insight. I really appreciate it.

Wow, you've had a rough ride from the beginning. I absolutely agree with you. If there are other serious issues at play beforehand and THEN an affair is piled on top of that, recovery is going to be 1/2 assed at best unless those original issues are dealt with, especially abuse. I think Dr. Harley even says if there are addictions and so forth, that MB will not usually be successful.

Perhaps your husband's unwillingness to work on recovery was the catalyst that you needed. Enough was enough. I'm so glad you found the resources that you need and I pray that your husband recovers completely from his issues so that your marriage can begin anew the way it was intended to be.

Hugs to you.

Now to answer the original question, what brought me to MB?

We were in recovery but it was a lonesome path. I thought I was going CRAZY because I was consistently "triggered" and would feel like I was bursting at the seams to SPEAK MY TRUTH. Yikes! I learned that speaking my truth (in the WAY I was doing it) was LBing all over the place. I was actually HARMING our recovery.

I not only learned that the ups and downs were normal but I learned how to implement ways to give us a healthier marriage.

My FWH has commented several times that he would like to post but it seems like time is never there for him with school and work, maybe someday.

MB was a God-send for me and our marriage. I'm no longer the psycho BS who just couldn't let go of the past. LOL

Now it's a place where I hopefully can offer a tidbit or two to others to help lessen their pain.

Sorry WH2LE...I was not trying to put you into "defensive" mode at ALL! I just thought your post has legitimate questions about MB, and I didn't mean to insinuate that you didn't understand them...

And actually, my BH put up with much of the same crap from me as you did from your WH. It took a LOT to turn me around...a series of events, actually, that led up to the night the vets gave me a <ahem> LESSON IN HUMILITY...lol. He said the same thing- (he knew my anger came from my father) that he could dismiss my AOs and DJs before the A, because he did not internalize it...knew what "box" to put it in, so to speak! But, after the A, he was having NO MO' of my sh!tty attitude! So, when he threatened a D, and I knew he was serious, I realized I had better either straighten up and fly right (as my mama always said) or get my butt kicked to the curb and have my boys' lives torn apart!

So, once again...sorry if you felt I was offensive in some way...it wasn't intentional at all.

Oh Lala,

No problem at all!!!!! MB has just meant SOOOOOO much to me that I did not want ANYONE to think that I was not 100% on board with the principles. I tend to worry when I put things in print because it is so easy to misinterpret without facial expression or tone of voice.

LaLa, your posts in particular have meant a great deal to me and have given me hope. I thank you for your courage. It has blessed me.

Thank you especially for this:
"He said the same thing- (he knew my anger came from my father)that he could dismiss my AOs and DJs before the A, because he did not internalize it...knew what "box" to put it in, so to speak!"

That is EXACTLY it!!!! Although I can't say it didn't bother me.

Gabagool, I want to answer your question but think I may start a new thread so as not to TJ this one. It's a complicated story(just like ALL of them,lol).

I have been reluctant to start a thread because I don't have too much time to post, CAN'T type and am a little afraid. But sometimes I would like advice. So...

Blessings to all,
WH2LE

What brought me to Marriage Builders? A marriage counselor at our church. I was somewhat SHOCKED at what he told me about MB and I just had to come here and check it for myself. I LAUGHED OUT LOUD when he listed "sexual fulfillment" as an emotional need. I had never heard a man actually ADMIT such shallowness. I think I actually GAGGED!

When I arrived, I found it all very, very confusing. A very patient lady named Zorweb cleared up much for me. She was a straight talker and that is what I needed most.

I have to admit that my radical feminist upbringing did not prepare me to hear many things at first. Eventually, I thought things through and they started making sense. And what an AMAZING difference they made in my marriage when I put those things into practice!

My cute and handsome DH and I have been married EIGHT YEARS today and we adore each other 10X more today than we did when we married. We are SOUL MATES.

Happy anniversary to Mr. and Mrs. Lane!

Ditto, TOTALLY!

I found MB through a search on "children from affairs". MB was the ONLY site that actually had advice on the subject. I'd been to a couple of other sites by then, and all they consisted of was BW and OW yammering at one another...essentially, they were WMM b**** fests from both sides.

I posted on the PG forum exclusively at first as I was scared to death to come to this board and "spill". I was so afraid that everyone would tell me to just leave the hairy ape and be well done with him.

Yes, some did tell me to leave, but EVERYONE told me to make a plan.

Idiot me thought our situation was "different" because of the OCs.

(snort)

Once I realized the only special-ness of this situation was the short-bus kind of specialness that my dearest was carrying on with, I got my bootay in gear.

It was still a long row to hoe, so to speak, but REALLY and truly, the turnabout came when I stopped being so fraking stubborn and FOLLOWED a plan!

Never, ever, underestimate the power of a good plan.

(please excuse any typos, my keyboard seems to be dropping letters)

Hey, I've heard that this~~~> *Click Here* is what they call what you posted in Texas!

You musta meant "SOLE MATES"!

Happy Anniversary Mel!

Mrs. W

Good to see you Mel! Happy Anniversary to you and Mr. Lane. Hope y'all have a special evening lined up!

Happy Anniversary to that Tenacious Texan and her hubby! Hope you have the happiest year ever!!! When you go out tonight, make sure you have a big glass of COKE and a SMILE...and then a vegetarian dinner (with NO FAT), of course...

you shaddup, MrsW!

**snort**

thankee, Kimmy, keepitreal and faithfulfollower!

Melody lane in the house.

shaddup, LALA!!

But thanks for the well wishes. We are saving our anniversary celebration for a June trip back up to the city where we met. A ROMANTIC trip!

My man, MEDC!

Welcome back friend. Happy anniversary too!

Thanks, MEDC, good to see y'all!

My WS, (user ILMK above), found this place, started posting, and suggested I join her here.