I'm not sure what happened to me. Or my life as I knew it. My H had an EA (maybe PA? He says no, I'm not sure I believe him) for about 2 months. That I know and have proof of. Maybe more. Again I don't know. We've been in varying degrees of recovery since 3/07, but he still hasn't disclosed much to me. Most of what I know I found out on my own. I discovered the A through phone records and confronted him. I asked who the number belonged to & got the response "a friend". That email is burned in my brain. How long did I sit at the computer and just stare at that? I called the number. The voicemail was a woman's name. But it was a company he worked with, so maybe he's just pushing my buttons because we had been fighting recently. There could be a legitimate reason he had placed so many calls to that number. I looked at the phone bill again. There were even more calls to another number I didn't know. I called that one. Same name. But this was a cell phone. Harder to explain to myself, but it could be that she works from home just as he does sometimes. We set that up when we were expecting baby 3, so he could be with us more. 3 was just over a year old. I called him at work. Not knowing MB or how this worked other than on TV, I expected that he was either going to give me a simple, logical explanation or he was going to rush home and beg my forgiveness. Even though I thought all I'd be asked to forgive would be too many friendly conversations. Didn't happen. He started what I now know to be typical WS fogbabble, but had never heard of or imagined would ever be spoken to me by this person who was my love and my life. She was just a friend. He could be friends with whomever he decided and I had no say. Our marriage was over. He'd already decided It had nothing to do with her. She was a good person. She listened and understood him like I never had. She cared. That was the beginning of my train wreck. The start of the crazy talk in my head. I hung up the phone and just sat. What the H just happened? Not even 3 hours earlier, he kissed me good bye and said he loved me. I changed the baby, loaded the dishwasher, gave the kids breakfast and sat down to pay the bills. Why did I ask him about that bill? I just wanted to know if it was a work related expense. That's why I asked. That's all I wanted to know. I'm home alone with 3 young children and my H, who I thought still loved me as much as always. Whom I still loved even more deeply than at the start of our marriage informed me by phone that he was just simply "done with me and our marriage". Where did that speeding train come from? I didn't see it. I didn't hear it. I didn't feel the rumble. We ate dinner the night before, put the kids to bed together, he loved me 3 hours ago. I went through the motions of the morning, I'm not sure how many hours, waiting for him still to walk through the door. Waiting for him to say he's sorry. He lost it. Didn't mean any of it. She really is just a business assoc. and he was trying to get a rise out of me. The door didn't open. After lunch I called him again. Maybe he cooled off. Maybe he can explain. Maybe I can find out how my life as I knew it ceased to exist in 3 words. "Just a friend". He wouldn't talk to me. Said I was being irrational. He'd be working late. Huh? This can't be real. My world just got blown apart. He did it. And he won't tell me why. What happened? What next?
I started calling family members. His, not mine. I can't hold it together in front of my kids. The man I knew that morning was gone and in his place a stranger who was he!!bent on destroying everything I knew and loved. I called his because my step father was in the end stages of cancer. End stage like maybe not even still living by the time I called. I couldn't ask my mom for help. I couldn't burden them with my problem. My dad and I aren't close. He would still be there if I asked, but he was recovering from heart surgery, so it probably wasn't a good idea to call him. Hmm H never asked how the surgery went. Should I have read something into that? My husband doesn't love me. How could I miss this. There had to be signs. Think. No. One big fight, less than 2 weeks earlier. That was after the phone calls started.Think. What did I miss? No. Valentine's day was before that fight. It was nice. He had to miss work because of the snow. I made one of his favorite dinners. Had a birthday party for our daughter's stuffed lion. Rubbed his shoulders when he came in from shoveling snow. I know now. It meant nothing. While I was so appreciative of him for doing that, watching from the window because I was worried he'd overdo it. He was doing it so he didn't have to be near me. Ouch. Even the fight. I called a friend from church during that. I could not understand why he was reacting so strongly. She asked, "Could there be someone else?" "No, my H would never do that!"
H's relatives didn't return calls. I didn't want them to take sides. I just wanted them to take the kids, so I could crumple on the outside, just like I was crushed inside. I can't face him. Not in this state. Not with the kids here. I just can't hold it together if I have to see him. I called H again. "Please don't come home. I'll drop clothes off for you. I'll leave them in the driveway. Go buy new, but don't come home. I can't see you" Of course as the entitled WS, it's his house and I can't keep him out. I called everyone I thought may be able to get through to him to ask him to give me this one night to process what just happened. He wouldn't talk to them and it probably wouldn't have done any good.
Then the even crazier talk. Who is the OW? What does she know? Does she know he's married with 3 kids? Maybe not. Maybe if I call. If I tell her I love my husband. My kids love their father. We have a history. We're married. She knew. I heard from her that H didn't love me. Never had. Only stayed as long as he had for the kids. he didn't want to be with me. She loved him and wasn't backing off. I called H's cell phone. He'd be on his way home. I really can not deal with him. "DO NOT COME HOME" I called my sister. I cried. i think I scared her almost to death. I just sobbed. And I don't cry. "Please help. Just come over for 10 minutes so I can self destruct."
But H got there first. With a police escort. I didn't see H's car. Oh My G! Has he been in an accident? He was so upset. Why did I call his cell while he was driving? And here I didn't think I could feel more out of control. No, he's ok. He's afraid of me. As dark as that moment was, now I laugh. My H is 6'8" and well over 200 lbs. I'm 5' and less than 100 lbs soaking wet. The police escort was probably only 5'5" and maybe 150 lbs. Besides, what was I going to do? I told the officer he could let H in, but I didn't want to be around him. I went to the baby's bedroom with him while the 2 older visited the policeman. They're young enough to just think it's cool. Before he left H came in to kiss the baby good bye. Then he walked out. How could he see me like that and turn his back? How could he hold our baby and be so cold to me? The baby climbed on my lap and hugged me. My sister and her afmily came. My brother in law offered to hunt H down, smack some sense into him and drag him back to his wife and kids where H belonged. I declined. BIL went out to shovel my walk. Why do men shovel to avoid?
Bed time. "Daddy's having a sleepover at Grandma's. I'm sort of mad because I don't like one of his friends and we don't want to talk about it until we calm down. You can call him at work in the morning" What isn't said- Your father is a lying, cheating piece of dirt who doesn't care what happens to us. I really don't know where he's sleeping or with whom. I don't know if he'll be at work or if he'll take our calls.
My bed time. More sobbing. Tossing and turning. I'm exhausted. I've felt like I was going to just drop all day and now I can't turn off. Maybe if I sleep, it will go away. It's a bad dream. I stretched my hand across the bed just like every night. There's no one there. He was there last night. Less than 24 hours. I was a wife and mother. Who am I now? Where is he? Why doesn't he love me? Why won't he fix this? Why isn't that door opening? All he has to do is tell me it's ok. It was a mistake.
I get up and wander the house. Will this be my house much longer? Will my H ever share this house with me again? How do I keep things normal for the kids? What will happen to all of us? Will another woman be putting her hand across the bed to touch H? Will she hold my babies? I want the life I had yesterday.

It's a year later. There's been a lot more on the rollercoaster. I've got posts all over MB, trying to find the right fit. All the stories are so similar, but we're all different too. H & I are mostly good on the day to day, but the A still holds way too much power. We have to put time and work into this and sometimes it's just too hard, but we're trying. Thanks for listening.

Powerful writing. Brings me back to my own pre d-day pain and confusion. The things WSs say are very hard to get over, aren't they? Many of the things my WW did then are seared into my brain, and I don't think those scars will ever completely heal.

Its something I've always wondered about. I can understand an A. I don't agree with it, but I can get my head around it. What I struggle with is the wayward behavior that comes with it, the emotional abuse inflicted upon the BS.

I mean, ok, so you want to be with someone else? What does that have to do with ME? Why does that translate into the WS having to seemingly go out of thier way to inflict damage on the BS? I mean, I get it, the whole self justification thing, the history rewrite, all that.

But the things WSs do, they're above and beyond what would be necessary to conduct an A. They treat BS worse than I have ever treated anyone. I mean, where does that even come from? To know that they are even capable of treating someone with such utter disrespect, for whatever reason.

And now here she is, WW becomes FWW, and she loves me (again? . . . still?). We're trying to make it better, probably is better in many ways, but its also worse, for me anyhow, and there's really only 2 options, keep trying, or quit. Quitting is always tempting, but it isn't REALLY an option, at least not for me.

Anyhow, I hear you loud and clear Turksmom, I bet many others do as well.

Yeah, I can certainly identify with you, Turksmom.

I was completely blindsided. As it says in my signature, I walked in and caught them in the act. Due to the nature of their "relationship", or lack thereof, I had absolutely no evidence prior to opening that front door.

I'm not the same person anymore. I look about the same, and I sound the same. I can fake it well enough to fool my own family, including my FWW.

Only I know that I'm a completely different person now. The person I used to be was instantly destroyed on d-day, which was nearly 2 years ago.

I feel like I've put on an act every day since then. Like someone else is occupying my body, and I'm little more than a spectator to what's going on around me.

Turk,
I cried for you when I read your story. Actually, I might have cried for me too....it's eerily similar. But, mine never left. He was about to until I laid a few things on the line for him. I told him "just remember when you crawl into bed at night with OW, I'll be alone...when you go to the mall and hold her hand I'll be holding the hand of one of your children...when you sit back refreshed after a nice afternoon of God knows what, I'll be cutting the lawn, cleaning the house, driving the kids to activities and doing laundry. Just remember what you leave behind when you walk out that door." This brought him to his knees in fits of tears. He says that was his moment of clarity when he realized how MUCH I meant to him. While he was totally enthralled with OW I represented what he referred to as 'Big Love'. I was 'it' for him and he now realized the error of his ways blah, blah, blah...It would be four months from that fateful date until true NC occurred -- to my knowledge. My heart aches every day to this very day when I replay those horrible words he said to me...'I think I'm supposed to be with her". I, too, was blindsided except that I met OW and saw it coming from her side. I just did not believe my H was dumb enought to squander 17 years of marriage for that dumpy little gross human. Sorry...that always feels better. You know, it sounds odd, but I'm a much nicer person than she is so I just don't always get it. This was a big pill for me to swallow...always a great wife & mother...where did I go wrong?
Anyway, you are in the right spot. There are many who have suffered the betrayal of a PA, and I am glad to not know that pain. However, the more I read the more I realize how similar they are. We will all be here for you and will be the folks who pull you up when you don't feel able to do so. I really have no one I can talk to in person as I hate to burdon people with my own troubles. My own family rarely asks how I'm doing as their problems seem to make mine seem small. I fear that my OW lurks and reads every thing I say but then I wonder how she'd know. It's a feeling I think I'll live with forever. I have a file on her that is hidden..my H says I know more about her than he does. This seems to be true. I run checks, I've done research. The only think I have not done is drive by her home. I'm always afraid he'll be there, even if I physically see him at our home. Your irrational thoughts will very often cloud what should be your reality. Be careful with this, as the slippery slope is very hard to recover from. I'll pray extra hard for you today. Thanks for sharing your story. You'll find that no matter how bad it seems, someone is here to help.

Turksmom,

This is a lonely journey. But putting the bulk of your attention on your kids will help you rise above the pain and keep you going for them.

Your H will crash someday and see the big mistake he made over this insanity. Kids are not ok with divorce and waywards convince themselves that they will be. They are too short sighted and selfish to see any different.

Don't punish yourself at all or blame yourself. Real life is tough. Real life can be tedious. Real life is what makes marriage wonderful to those who truly value it.

Keep your chin up and focus on you in your recovery. Improving yourself means improving things for your kids.

Take care and keep coming back for more help and support.

I think maybe there should be a warning on this thread. I seem to be throwing people back to some really dark days. I still feel the need to revisit. Like an accident scene. I need to process it and grieve for what I lost.
Believe me, confusion is still very high on my list of daily emotions. I'm going to try to share a little bit that I've figured out from these posts, SAA and my own situation that may help you understand the WS's cruelty. Understanding alone won't make you feel better. It still happened. It's part of your memory. Knowing more of why WS would and could do this and WS being fully aware of and remorseful for those things has helped me.
First know those awful things that were said about you weren't true. Even if it started with a tiny morsel of truth by the time WS was at the point of justifying an A to her/himself, you made Satan look like a better mate. All in WS's head.
WS does this for some of the following reasons. They were wronged. Real or imagined, that you did this is in their head. Somehow my H got from me complaining about him not taking out the garbage to me being a horrible, cruel, demanding, controlling shrew of a wife who never loved him. If he couldn't make me worse in his mind, he couldn't be blameless for the A or problems in the M
To alleviate WS's guilt. The worse we are, the more they deserve to look elsewhere for their happiness. They are behaving like monsters. It's easier for them if we created the monster and then deserve to have our creation unleashed on us, than if they "just aren't happy" We did this to them.Our problem is somewhere in that monster we see the person we love. We haven't devoted the time to rewriting our image of WS completely
They are presenting their perfect image to OP. OP does not see the bad. WS begins to think of themselves only as they let OP see them. We see all and love them anyway, but may try to hold them accountable for less than perfect behavior. OP sees no fault and they would rather believe that assessment. Therefore we're "never happy, overly critical".
We don't love them. If we did, we wouldn't wrong them in all the ways they perceive. If we don't love them, we can't be hurt by the A. If we throw a wrench in the plans and still do love them, they say these awful things so we'll stop. Then they can say they were right all along and they don't have to feel bad about their behavior.

When my H finally confessed his A to his BF, his BF said he thought I was a "nutjob" because H was presenting me from his fogged perspective. Now that he's heard the unfogged version, it seems I'm just a typical, sometimes mad wife. The WS spends so many hours nurturing this image that it becomes reality. Then you have OP who never has anything positive to say about the BS and the clouded opinions of friends who only know half the story all supporting this warped version of you. We can't imagine how they could do this because even though we fall into the "crazies" sometimes, we don't take up residence as they did.
My biggest question of how doesn't come from those cruel babblings. My how is the opposite. How could H behave lovingly toward me? Especially the above and beyond? I can understand peacekeeping efforts like taking out the garbage, but why spend extra time with me? Why hold my hand? Bring me coffee? Things that weren't typical, that I wouldn't have missed if he hadn't done them. That seems more cruel, that he loved someone else and made me believe he still loved me. Then yanked it away without warning.
Keep hanging in. There are so many good people on this site who will offer support, it really helps with the bad days

Thanks so much for your support. I'm afraid I only had time to post the beginning of my story in detail. I'll add more as I can. H reluctantly agreed to see MC and end A about a week after dday. It was several more weeks before the fog lifted. We're about a year past that now. When I have dark days, when I have doubts about whether H and I can get through this, I look at my kids and know that I can't walk away unless I have tried everything first. Good things aren't always painless.

He needs to understand how important it is for you to know everything in order to truly heal. Do a search for "Trueheart's Letter" (I believe that's the spelling) which does a wonderful job of explaining the need to know to a WS.

That's a hole in your heart which won't heal until you have full disclosure.

Keeping things hidden only prolongs the pain.

Fiori,
Thanks for visiting and your continued encouragement. Talk with H last night didn't reveal as much info as I hoped, but I feel like for the first time he "gets it". The advice from BF was basically that it's time for H to "man up", get over his issues with this and do whatever I need because what I need is what we need to stay in this M. H talked without excusing.
Very amused by your OW comment. Don't think I can post the names I use. H is feeling guilt over similar issue. He can't believe he was ready to throw away "REAL" for something with no substance. I could totally identify with what you told your H as well. At one point before he decided her or me I considered mailing his dirty laundry to her. (I also did background checks to get as much info as I could. Gave my sister the file to hold for me)Let's see how badly she wants him when she knows how his socks really smell! Also would have loved to see her explain that package to her H.
As far as irrational, I've wondered if OW knows about this site as well. It isn't you, is it? (LOL) Sometimes the crazies do creep up, but I try not to slide.
Let me know how you are doing. Do you have your own thread?

Turk,
I used to have a thread entitled "Can I survive HIS emotional affiar" but it no longer exists. I think there's a statute of limitations on things that no longer get posts on them. I believe most people who've been here know my story but let me know if you think I should post it again. I always feel like I'm 'bothering' people if I start something new.

How are you today? How are the kids? I'll think of you today.

Thanks, Fiori,
Today's a good day. Sad, but full of promise. I know the sad will fade. H is finally talking and understanding what I need from that and even a bit of how I feel and why when I hear these things. It seems like it's the silly stuff that bothers me most. He finally admitted to calling her because he loved hearing how right he was and that it just made him feel good instead of the previous, "Well, I called her because you upset me" He understands now that choosing to call her as opposed to any other action he could have taken was based on his own selfish desires. But that part didn't bother me. I figured that long before he did. He told her about a fight he and I had before we M. Talk about holding on to things! It was a stupid fight even then. Not overly personal, but we were the only two people in the world who knew about it. It was our history. Now she's part of it. I feel like the seagulls in "Finding Nemo". I just want to yell, " Mine, mine, mine". There were also things he talked about with her that he never told me. He said it was because I was there, so he didn't have to tell me about it and also he was using it to impress her. On the plus side, he knew I wouldn't be impressed because I'm not that shallow and he sees me as strong and accomplished( I'll believe that again someday. Right now I see myself more as Jell-o), I don't need to hang on his experiences. She shouldn't know any more about him than I do. No matter how insignificant. So, I'll be mad, I'll be sad, I'll be over it and ready for the next.
We did have nice couple and family time also. Walked to our polling place with the kids. Can you guess my state? (ha,ha) I know there has to be fun too for this to work.
I understand how you feel about not starting new posts. That's one of the reasons it took me a year. I think everyone's stories are helpful, both in feeling we aren't alone and identifying places for hope and potential pit falls, so I don't know that anyone is bothered by it. Maybe just that reluctance to burden. Besides, they don't have to read them. If you decide you want to, let me know where to find you. You're welcome to piggyback here. Thank you for the kind words and thoughts.

So, can you sum up where things have been in recovery?

What H and you have done so far..... Counseling, books, MB reading, etc.

Wow, it was hard to get through that. Triggers abound. (((Turksmom)))

Is your H willing to post or read here? I think my FWH and other FWS here would be willing to post to him about the importance of being radically honest if he would be open to that...

This was something my FWH didn't want to do for a while. I told him I wanted to move forward...no more setbacks with additional d-days...and in order to do that I needed to know the truth about everything. Our MC basically told him we really wouldn't be able to rebuild our M if he didn't come clean. Once he finally did, he said it was a huge relief.

Also wanted to mention to you that it was recommended to me here to get "His Needs Her Needs." (We got the audio book...H listened to it on his commute to work). I can't recommend this book enough. IMHO probably the next best thing to counseling with the Harleys directly...

Hope this helps!

Turk,
Jello?? That's a good thing to be! You can throw it and it keeps it's shape...you can sink fruit in it and it still stays together...you can put a fork in it and the fork stands upright. Ok, sure, it's pliable...but jello does NOT deconstruct..no matter what!

You can be lime..a little tart but with a sweet aftertaste.

By the way...
HTM is in distress and needs reinforcements.

Yes, tell your H you MUST have all the answers to everything you need to know.... Radical Honesty!





HIS pace will get you nowhere. It is time to tell him what your needs are. Don't make him guess.

I understand his guilt, However (BIG HOWEVER), it doesn't remove his responsibility to give you honest answers to ALL of your questions.

You will re-live mini D-Day's over and over until you have all the questions answered. Why are you waiting??

You know, I had to go to the polls yesterday too...I did not realize I had another east coaster here.

Read this again


Radical Honesty Link

Thanks for the notice about HTM! She's definitely hug-worthy!

TST,
To answer your earlier post as well. We do have MC and he has IC. Lots of his stuff is from long before me and he does realize that has to be worked out to prevent him from sliding back. We have HNHN for parents-that's how I discovered MB. Not until about 3 mos. post Dday, but better late than never. We have SAA, a book/video series by Charles Swindoll, some great marriage mentors, accountability people, he reads MB and has promised his own login by week's end. We've done all of the worksheets that go with the MB principles, although we should reevaluate, so I'm glad you reminded me.Also the posts I printed went to work with him to read on his break.Since he used to call OW then, I'm very pleased that he now devotes that time to us.
Daily we've been doing really well. He practices enthusiastic agreement, lets me know where he is and what he's doing, helps more around the house, more family time and we've really been trying to keep our 15 hours. We had some major crises, not about M or the A, but they would have been difficult for a couple not in recovery and we've stood strong together. There have been some slips on both sides, but nothing earth shattering.
The only thing is he won't talk!!! I'll bet SMB gave you a whole list of reasons why she had to know and I'm sure I've repeated the same to H over and over and over. We have talked the last 2 nights. His talk with his BF was a real turning point. It's still going a little slow for me, but when he does it, he's getting it right. I'm no longer getting the summary of the general misdeed followed by, but..., so I am hopeful this time. But also a little afraid to be hopeful.
I'm so grateful for the support and advice I find here. I'm sure I'll need it as things finally come to light.
Blessings to you and your beloved.