Oh, I am quite sure he did it because he could. He also felt very entitled. He also had major anger issues and was angry at me for a few things. In his own words "I look out for number 1, and I don't care who gets hurt in the process. I do what makes ME happy regardless." His form of a pity party. "no one cares if they hurt me, no one cares what I want or think" and crap like that.
Because he was angry at me for certain things he got "revenge" by cheating more times than I can count.

I certainly tried to climb that mountain of recovery. I tried for 3 years. Then when I threw him out because of all of his lies and his cheating, he got mad at me for making leave! wtf!

I always said to my ex that he was a coward. I told him if he had any balls he would have just left and divorced me. He took the easy way out and stayed under this roof and did whatever he wanted. When I asked him why he said "because it is cheaper to keep her". ahh.. .so refreshing.

I agree with Krazy: [censored]!

mlhb

I think I will close out my participation in this thread with the following zygotes (as in, last words):

Josieweaverpussycatjones, hi! I’d say you probably did well re the stock. I can’t specifically comment on stock performance since I am considered an insider and married to an insider. I know squat, but I did sign a piece of paper that made it sound rather painful if I violate it.

Speaking of saints, I had the privilege of meeting the Dali Lama when he was in town a couple of weeks ago. Interesting dude. Very humble and very funny, too. I feel bad for his country, though. But I believe his peaceful approach will ultimately succeed to everyone’s benefit. There was a downside. DS’s religion teacher found out DS was there too and he had to write an extra credit report about him.

Going on even more about saints, I watched a video of Mother Theresa a few days ago in which she kept repeating over and over: We must always forgive and forget. Forgive and forget. Forget. Forget. Forget…We can’t forgive if we don’t forget. Yeah, right. If Mother Theresa irks me I certainly need to watch my back.

I can’t forget. I just can’t. My brain won’t let me. Which is why I just plain moved on (but not out). My life, for those who cannot seem to understand what I keep trying to describe is, oh, two orders of magnitude better now than it was during wife’s 10 year VLTA. I didn’t know what was going on then and I do know what was going on now. Yet I am still so much happier now. After the initial two-year crash and burn, that is.

I took control of my happiness. The results have nothing whatsoever to do with SF! The results have nothing to do with admiration. Or any ENs. Or FWW's participation or her non-particpation. And the results have nothing to do with romantic love. I feel sad, actually, for BS who cannot seem to understand this. It’s probably my inability to communicate. But it’s true.

Romantic love, pshaw. Romantic love is just hot chemicals to teabag your brain in. It always cools down, goes away and leaves stains. I like much better love as a verb – it is actions and keeping one’s promises. Matters little how I feel, matters everything what I do. I promised my wife and my unborn DS way back when I would never stop acting with love, care and consideration. Promised God too. So I won't stop.

Life will still go up and down. But I am going to enjoy my life. Don’t believe me? Watch me.

The door will always be open for FWW to come along.

With prayers,

PS: The lunch was good. Expensive (there were seven of us) but fun.

PPS: Resonance, re our cage match – some more advantages of low testosterone: one lives longer and is less likely to go bald.

Hey W2S !

Thank you for taking the time to write me. I really appreciate it !

Your use of my own words against me is cheating ! But You're right of course. Wallowing is rubbish, I know that yet I still do it. What nonsense ! Thanks !



No I can't.

I cannot overlook Squid's betrayal and concentrate instead on the pie she just baked me. The pie is great. But its just a pie.

"apart from that, Mrs Lincoln, how was the play ?"



Great testament to the strength of that boy and thats a whole other league of hurt that I can't even imagine. However as you made it an analogy, I'd comment that , he isn't still married to the bomber who hurt him so very badly, and raising kids with her and never mentioning what she did because Dr Harley says so.

BTW I am grateful and happy to be alive. I was about 14 inches to the right away from NOT being alive a couple of years ago. My life is better than I ever dreamed it would be again a few years ago, as I wrote earlier. I think I'm doing great, considering everything : its everybody else keeps saying I can completely get over this and I shouldn't settle !.


What tactic can I do differently in this charge W2S ? I have come to realise that my reverence for lifelong monogamy from my spouse was and is unhealthy and unrealistic, but it is real. You know how we can't help our ENs even if they make us appear shallow ? Well having an unpolluted marriage bed was and is very VERY important to me.
I tolerated a lot of stuff from Squid because she was the virgin wife of my youth. Now she is just another woman with sexual baggage most everybody else and I feel naive and gauche and stupid for being so hurt by it, but that hurt is absolutely as real and feral as frostbite.

And that, ya see mate, is NOT in the past. A switch flipped forever when she took OM in a love embrace. And that switch is unhealthily important to me.

I don't see how any amount of pie baking, SF and admiration can change how I feel about that.

So what else can I do to make this new charge up the hill more successful than my dozens of previous ones matey ?

BLESS YOU for investing your time in me. I truly appreciate it.

BobPure, I don't know you at all, and I don't think I have ever posted to you. I have to be more honest that I haven't read your threads, but I have read your postings over the past year and have looked forward to reading what you write.

The wisdom and guidance you show many on here is remarkable.

I have watched this thread the last few days, and I hear your pain. I hear the turmoil inside. I don't know how to help or offer advice because you are in a place that I can only dream to come to one day, that is at least working on recovery with my spouse.

BUT

What I do know is that you have helped SO MANY people on here, have given SO MUCH of your time, energy and wisdom that it's only G-d given back to you when you are walking through a hard time in your life. I can't imagine there are many more people on here who deserve the loyalty, time and support that you do.

I hope one day to be a support for you and help you in someway because of all you have given to those on here.

Birchat Ha'Bayit
Be'zeh ha'shaar lo ya'voh tzaar
Be'zot ha'deerah lo ta'voh tzarrah
Be'zot ha'delet lo ta'voh ba'halah
Be'zot ha'machlaka lo tavoh machloket
Be'zeh ha'makom te'hee bracha
v'shalom

Thank you Queenie.

There's not a single BS here that doesn't completely understand where you're coming from Bob, I think most of us feel the same way in varying degrees. And perhaps it is the degree of feeling that makes the difference.

I don't think there's any way I will ever feel the same way about my W as I did pre-A. I can't. Doing so would be denying reality. No matter what happens, it will be different than what COULD HAVE BEEN. But, fighting against that is a waste of time too, because fighting for could have beens is not operating in reality either.

Anyhow, I'm just rambling, just wanted to say that I hear ya man, I understand completely and share your feelings to a great extent! Keep working at it, if you can figure this out, then there's hope for the rest of us too eh?!

Mr. Bob Pure...


LMAO, Bob...do you know I say this almost daily? W2S cracked up when he saw it! Only I say "Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?" My mom always said that!

ANYWAY...

I am so sorry you are still hurting this way. I know we are just newbie schmucks, but we still care about you. We still want you to be happy. We still want to help if we can. We both think you are a great person.


Actually, the fire began in a small bar with way too many people in it and only a couple small exits...the band that was playing had pyrotechnics and after they went off, well...it is an awful story...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Station_nightclub_fire

So, there was no bomber, just stupid people making careless decisions, and who obviously didn't get that it was no place for a pyro show!! And soooo many paid with their lives (100). The ones who lived are forever scarred. The guy who made the decision to light the pyro cried and said he was sorry...he was convicted and sent to jail...

But, I do understand what you are saying- ALL of it. Especially the part about living with the "perp" and then not talking about it "because Dr. Harley says so." That may sound weird coming from my side of the fence, and I do agree with Harley's approach, but I can see how it would leave you bitter, unsettled, and unvindicated. W2S was trying to say that he struggles with the same things. Granted, you are much farther down this road than we are, but if you aren't happy with where you are now- only you can change it. How? Well, isn't that the million dollar question!

I don't believe most people could ever be completely over this. The question is whether or not you love Squid enough to stay. That's really all it is...or let me put it the way my DH puts it. He says that his "blind faith" is gone. He says that he could never love anyone the way he loves me, and that if he left, it wouldn't matter who he fell in love with or whatever, that this scar will always be there. In other words- leaving me wouldn't solve his problem...it would still be there.

So, he chooses to stay because he believes in us as a couple, as a team, and knows it is the best decision for our family. His stance back in December was more about my treatment of him...and that he would not settle for a loveless M.

Now it is a matter of putting time between us and the nightmare I made of our lives for over a year. Surely time will do the trick...time heals all wounds, right? Hopefully by then, the good stuff will out-weigh the bad stuff to the point where it will all be just a distant memory. Right?

Lala,

Time wounds all heels too - just nowhere near fast enough.

I can understand perfectly what your H says LaLa.

I HAD to end my marriage because there was more than one infidelity and other issues to boot. However, the part about "the scar is there and always will be" "and the blind faith being gone".. My innocence and immediate trust of a man is gone forever. If I could not trust the man who was supposed to love me no matter what til death do us part, how in the h*ll am I supposed to trust another man right at the get go? I don't. It will take a lot of time of getting to know someone. I will never just blindly trust someone again. And the scar, it's there. That scar has given me new boundaries that I will not tolerate being crossed. I am sad that the innocence I once had is gone. I now move forth from a whole different perspective.

mlhb

ok krazy... can see from some other threads today something has you in a negative mood...

what's up?

mlhb

LaLa,


All of that may be true, but it's really not the reason why I stay. I stay because you understand me better than anyone else ever could. I stay because if ever there were a couple with a love strong enough to survive this it is ours. I stay because seeing you smile or making you laugh always brightens my day. I stay because when I look into your eyes I can see how deeply you love for me. I stay because when I hold you in my arms there is no place in this world that I would rather be. I stay because whenever you say "I love you" it instantly melts my heart. I stay because you are an amazing, beautiful, smart, caring, sexy woman that I could never replace. I stay because you are the love of my life. I stay because choosing to give up all these things would be like choosing not to breathe.


I truly believe that time does heal all wounds. It is healing ours, little by little one day at a time just as I knew it would. It may be a slow process, but in the end I believe it will have been worth everything it took to get there. It will be worth it because the good stuff ALREADY out-weighs the bad. Every great moment of my life has been shared with you, from the birth of our boys to our own successes and accomplishments. None of those events or the things I have done in my life would have been nearly as satisfying or real if I would not have been able to share them with you. I am thankful to have you still be a part of my life. I am thankful that through it all we have kept our family together. I am thankful for all you are doing to help us heal and I feel blessed to have this chance to rebuild our marriage together. It may not be the same as it was before, but it will be better, stronger, and deeper because we have a better understanding of what one another needs. I was thinking the other day just how ironic life can be sometimes. Isn't it funny that after all these years through the ups and downs, the trials and tribulations, the joys and heartaches we are still doing things just the way we started out. We are doing them "Our Way" which has always worked best for us.

Forever & Always,
Want2Stay


P.S. Sorry for the TJ everyone, but that needed to be said.

Now where did I put my vomit bucket???

Mrs. W

I love you with all of my heart, baby...*crying*

That meant the world to me!



PS--Mrs. W...You just had to get in there before I did, didn't ya! Now I'm gonna hafta open up a can of the butt-whoop on yer hillbilly [censored]!

OMG Get a room already.

Now I have to wipe this off my screen.

Sheesh

SHADDUP BIG KANGAROONA, YA SILLY WOMBAT!!!!

Doan be callin' Miz Dubya no hillbilly! She's a flatlander after all!

Hi Lala


No we're not. You've volunteered to face what you did and help W2S with getting past it. Squid hasn't. And, sadly, that is something a FWS must volunteer for. Its the willing, penitent heart that works healing magic , not robotic execution of a script. You two are MILES further down the road than we are. MILES because your heart wants to heal W2S more than you want to avoid feeling bad about what you did. THAT THERE is the healing pixie dust IME.


See above


I do love her enough to stay, clearly. I agree every single other word of W2S' that you quote here. Despite the unsatisfactory nature of our recovery for me, Squid is still the wife of my youth. Divorcing wouldn't undo my betrayal, it would just deliver a gesture of punishment to Squid. Unless that miraculously healed me I doubt I'd be happier, especially as my kids would be devastated.


Once again I agree with those sentiments completely. "love" however is subject to interpretation. Romance ? Duty of care ? Consideration ? The feelings in a marriage change between these over time IME.


I don't think time heals anything, it gives opportunity for healing behaviours to be applied and to work. In your case I have no doubt that time will heal because you are both more concerned about the others healing than your own.


This is where I am not so sure. My opinion in this area has been agreed with by some and incensed others but I do believe that a person has to value the products of recovery enough for it to mitigate the lingering consequences of betrayal in the "now". Some have said I am inferring that I think I have lost more than others, and received this as a DJ. Yet others that when I am having all my ENs met, the A will just be a distant memory.

To me I think that everyone starts from a different place. I am not defending my attitude to lifelong monogamy : I have come to believe that I place a rather unhealthily high value on this, but I do not choose to do this. It is as much a part of my value system as my unique EN priorities and LB priorities.

But I must say if Squid ever overcame her shame and fear volunteered to talk to me about how I felt about her affair, that may well start to adjust my priorities. As I said earlier though this must be a voluntary action. Its the penitent heart that is required not the words.

Thanks for your investment in me lala. When I write stuff to you two that appears like I am being negative, I just want SO MUCH for you to not be surprised when the down-curves on the rollercoaster hit you. You two promise a wonderful recovery and I have seen others derailed by not seeing backsteps in context.

I suspect you'll do very well.

(((((((((((((((Bob))))))))))))))))

You are good peeps!! And we have had a few pretty rocky spots already, so we do understand what you are saying. Don't you worry about your posts to us being too negative!

Don't know if I ever told you this, but...W2S came to MB and read for some months before we started posting. In my foggy mess of a mind, I called this the "boo-hoo baby" site (SORRY EVERYONE!!!). I rarely came to read, but when I did, I looked up your posts. I have read about you and Squid for almost a year now. I just always thought your story/posts were so interesting and intelligent...they got through my fog more than once. W2S and I actually had some pretty decent conversations back then discussing your threads.

So, this sunshine enema is coming your way now to thank you for sharing your story and for helping us out even before you "knew" us here.

W2S says he has not forgotten you...his mind is "brewing" his response and he will post in the morning! LOL!

And bitbucket...dat southern belle needs a good [censored]-whoopin from time to time...and I'm her Hucklebury!

PS--poor Krazy's thread is now officially a love fest!!

AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW.......

I hope a man feels that way about me some day...

mlhb

MEDC

Thanks MLHB. You will find it when you least expect it. What can I say, I'm a die hard romantic.

Want2Stay