I did some searching on the internet and after paying 5 bucks to reverse search his number I came up with a name that's not his and not his address (don't know the exact address just knew it was in the wrong city).

I texted the OM (he won't talk to me on the phone) and told him that it's not only hurting me but hurting her, her family and friends, my family and friends and i'm sure it would hurt his mom if she knew.

He texted back saying all the stuff I've heard before. That when it started he thought it was an open relationship (W told him that). That he was going to end it last time I confronted him but I changed my mind ( my W got upset and accused me of controlling her relationships and in a moment of weakness I told him to disregard what I said.) He's willing to talk about it though.

So I texted him again saying that I thought I could be ok with it but I realize now that I was wrong and he needs to end all contact with her. If he cares about her then he needs to give us a chance to work things through and if our marriage can't last then he could possibly be with her after our diviorce but if he's just in it for sex then he needs to find someone else because it's destroying any chance we have.

I realize that I can't trust any commitments he makes to me but I feel better knowing that I've done something and for the first time since this started I feel like I'm going to come out of this alright no matter what happens

Just expose it to their work and his family and I guarantee that it will stop.

No matter what she's done to me I just don't think I have it in me to do that to her. Exposing it to her work that is. I don't have any problem exposing it to his family if I knew how to get a hold of them

Do that to her? What is wrong with you? You told her to dump OM and she didn't. Exposure is the consequence. What about what she is doing to you? Why do you have to play Mr. Nice Guy while she screws around on you? She screws around on you because you let her. It's time to put your foot down.

My advice would be to hire the meanest Divorce Attorney in your area and make sure he understands that you will accept nothing less than getting back full physical custody of your testicles in the divorce settlement.

Nice. I know I'm a doormat. I just can't stand hurting her. Which is probably where a lot of our current problems lie

Then why are you here??? Just hump up and take it, like you have been.

MyRev - probably for sympathy. It's definitely not for advice to implement in his marriage. None of us knows anything about marriage or what it takes to have a sucessful one, let alone how to recovery from adultery, right?.

It's also why I no longer have much to say to a lot of the folks who are new to MB. I leave the "MB only" advice to those who want to stay with addressing only that part of it and I try to help others who are believers and want to try to address the faith aspect of recovery also.

This guy thinks an "open marriage" IS a marriage, and he doesn't have the spine to FIGHT. But he can "fight" with me because I advocate and stand for "traditional marriage." Interesting, don't you think? I just don't think it's worth the time investment or the effort to try to help someone who apparently really doesn't want any substantive help.

I wish him well in his endeavors, but I'm not really very hopeful for his marriage without significant and real change.

I'm here because I want to save my marriage. It's just really hard for me to hurt her. I went ahead and called the DM like I said in my other thread but they can't do anything because they're not in the same department so it's not a violation.

I'm now ignoring ForeverHers but I still want to say to him that his advice is not constructive or helpful. He almost sent me over the edge earlier. I came here for help not to be told what a crappy person I am and that I don't understand marriage.

You are not doing yourself any favors by talking poorly about FH because a good portion of posters here agree with him. I have been helping you, but I personally have a problem with your attitude about him. He is trying to help you, but you don't want to hear it because his view of marriage doesn't agree with yours. It is your view of marriage that got you into this mess. If you don't view marriage a little differently (like FH does), then you marriage is doomed for failure. Ask yourself, why did your marriage come to this? It is because your views and practices about your marriage. Anyone that thinks it may be okay to have their wife have sex with someone else (even if it is another woman) is asking for trouble. What are you going to do differently this time to protect your marriage. This forum is for people who believe and practice marriage builder principles. If you don't, this is not the place for you. Do not insult or attack posters like FH who have helped HUNDREDS of people through this exact situation. If you do not want to practice marriage builder philosophies, then I would suggest going somewhere else, but I warn you, your marriage will be more prone to failure.

Your idea of marriage is what got you here in the first place. You need to changes your ideas if you want your marriage to last. You cannot use marriage builder principles if you don't believe in them. You cannot say it's okay to sleep with someone else as long as I agree with it. You must say that it is unacceptable to share alone time with members of the opposite sex, and that you and you alone need to meet each others emotional needs. No outsider should be allowed to do so. Otherwise you will be back here. We are just trying to show you where you went wrong in the first place. If you don't like it - tough.

The problem i had is that nothing he said was constructive. He just told me that I don't know what marriage is, not how to fix it. I've gotten some good advice already, alot of it from you. I don't need to be beaten down, I need to be lifted up. I have serious depression issues, that I am trying to work through and FH's post made me put the knife to my wrist.

I want help, I want to save my marriage. It seems to me though that FH didn't read my whole post. I never said I was ok with an open marriage. I don't want her to sleep with anyone else. What I said was I can accept that her sexual preference might be with women and if that's the case I'd rather get it out of the way now than years down the road.

Yessireebob…"mistakes" like CHOOSING ON PURPOSE to commit adultery. Was that anything like, "oops, I got naked and jumped into bed with you because I thought you were my husband!" This is no "mistake, benc. This is a willful sin. But since you don't believe in the Ten Commandments, which means you also don't believe in the seventh commandment, "You shall not commit adultery," you resort to calling it a "mistake" instead of what it really is. I DO know about your feelings for her because you stated them. Her feelings for you are obvious to all who have had to deal with a Wayward Spouse.

"Where I get off, benc, is that I don't see any value in "coddling" someone who is operating from a poor perspective, as you are concerning what marriage is and what it should be. You are completely wrapped up in "feelings," and if you stick around here long enough you will learn a lot about how feelings don't have a lot to do with LOVE. But we'll see over time just how serious you are.




Nice try, benc, but I read your post and those around here who know my posting style, I rarely "kick someone's butt" unless the proverbial MB "2x4" is warranted by their crooked thinking.

In the quote above you are reverting to "rewriting history" and playing the "Clintonesque" game of obfuscation and denial of FACTS. So in the interest of showing you I DID read your post and you DID say you were "okay" with something other than a completely exclusive marriage with your wife (which is the same thing as saying "open marriage," all you are doing is trying to limit who ELSE is allowed in your marriage).

Here is what you said:


Oopps, reality intruded and you all of a sudden found out that your "okay-ness" with sharing your wife with someone else really might NOT be "okay" with you.

Oh, I forgot, it's just other GUYS you are not "open" about now.



Yep…more evidence of being okay with an "open marriage," just so long as your wife sleeps around with MANY other men and not just the same Other Man. What a piece of work. And you want to save your marriage for WHAT reason? What "marriage" is it that you want to save?

One with exclusivity to each other? One where she can have a homosexual lover and it's okay because the Other Woman doesn’t have your equipment, or maybe you'd like to make it a threesome WITH you? Or maybe just an open marriage where your wife can screw other men just so long as she maintains a smorgasbord of then and not a repeat stud.



Sorry, benc, but I'm way past the stage where you can blame me for YOUR CHOICES. You want to put a knife to your wrist, I'll feel sorry for you, but it's YOUR CHOICE no matter what I or anyone else says or does. Not getting away with "blameshifting" benc.

"Nothing constructive?" Give me something constructive to work with other than "gee, I've been as selfish schmuck hooked on my gaming and neglecting my wife, but I've recently started doing the dishes and my laundry." Give me something other than "you want your marriage." Why would you want the marriage you had? Besides, you have yet to give me one reason to believe you understand the first thing about what marriage is and what a commitment to marriage means. BOTH you and your wife are fixated on "what you want and desire" and you seem to have little understanding of Standards and Boundaries.

Those who know me here know that I rarely get involved with trying to help someone recover their marriage without committing to a fairly substantial time commitment and to trying to understand what they are feeling and what stage of recovery they are in. Those who know me here also know that MY faith is very important to me and I also don't try to force my faith on someone, especially if they have made it clear that they don't want any "faith talk."

Simply because you are a child of God, even though you choose to deny Him, I was willing to see if a "kick in the pants" might get your attention. It did, but you also made it clear that you don't want any real changes in yourself that would help both you and your marriage. So I CHOOSE to let others who might think that they can help you in some way do so.

But a word to the wise, as my last bit of advice; not one single member of MB is "obligated" to help you or any other person. They CHOOSE to do so to try to help, BUT it is YOUR marriage and just as you can reject Christ, who gave His life for you, you can reject any and all advice that "you don't like" because it might mean that you have to change yourself, your morals, your self-centeredness, etc. CHANGE in both the Betrayed Spouse and the Wayward Spouse is not just a "suggestion," it's mandatory if you are to have a successful recovery. But I also heard you loud and clear, you don't believe in or accept "commandments." "They are not for you."

Good luck young man, you are going to need it.

The point that FH is trying to make is that your FIRST need to change your perspective of what marriage is and should be BEFORE you try and save your marriage. Because if you do not change your thinking on marriage, you may get her to end it with OM now, but you will continue to have problems in this marriage in the future. FH is trying to get you to see the errors of your thinking. He's not putting you down. He's trying to be constructive. He's just telling you something that you don't want to hear right now.

Have you read all the Marriage Builder concepts and articles on this site?

Do you agree with them?

Do you understand that allowing people outside the marriage to meet your WW's emotional needs is what got you in this mess?

Do you understand that going forward (once OM is out of the picture) that you and you alone are responsible for meeting your WW's emotional needs while avoiding lovebusters, and others should not be allowed in closely to protect your marriage from this happening again?

Do you understand that without God in your lives and your marriage there is no one to hold you and your wife accountable for your behavior? Who cares about cheating because everyone is doing it? Why should I stay married when I'm not happy right now if it isn't morally wrong to get a divorce?

I know that you are going through a lot right now, but it is time to really sit back and reflect about what marriage really is. It's not what you thought it was up to this point. Only a complete change in thinking and practice will save yours. Are you ready to do that?

benc,

You're not going to like me any more than FH, but for completely different reasons. FH is very faith based ... I am a non-believer. We rarely see eye to eye on things, but I've been around here long enough to respect his committment to his beliefs, and in this case we're sending you a one, two punch that you can either listen to and take action, or you can keep your head buried squarely up your a$$.

1st ... FH and the others are correct that you MUST change your attitude about Marriage or get out of the institution all together. You claim to want to be married, but you IGNORE all of the rules ... so now your marital conflict has brought you to a turning point ... do you stay married and put proper boundaries in place or do you bail out for the "open" lifestyle?

Honestly, I don't care which ... its your choice, but you have to choose one path, period!!!

2nd ... "IF" you choose to stay married, then you better grow a pair real quick and get over this ... "It's just really hard for me to hurt her." BS. She doesn't care about hurting YOU, so (decision time again) ... either stand up for yourself or bail out to avoid the conflict, but do something.

Personally, I'm done with you until you make the above choices and commit to SOMETHING.

Here's some wisdom directly from the "School of HARD Knocks" ... you are very young and immature. In that state, you get a few opportunities to learn from those who are much wiser than you in the ways of the world. You can follow their lead and compensate for your inexperience or you can remain "foolish" and think that you still know everything.

Every young man at some point in their early lives have to come to the realization that you "DON'T KNOW [censored]". Those that learn that early and seek to avoid making the same mistakes again, will prosper ... those that continue to "KNOW EVERYTHING" waste much of their youth repeating the same mistakes.

Benc,

Hate to be part of the told you so club, but MyRev and FH are spot on with their assessments of your situation. It would behoove you to listen to what MyRev is telling you. You have a lot to learn.

<TJ>
MyRev,

Great to see you posting again! MB is kind of like "The Godfather" isn't it? Everytime I think I'm going to get out, it pulls me back in......GRRR!
</TJ>

Ben, you don't want a marriage, you want some surefire during a dry spell.

Seems your "wife" is having better luck than you are.

W2S,

I don't know ... it seems like I have some type of love/hate relationship with this place. Overall, I simply HATE the pain and sorrow of this place ... although I feel a certain empathy for some of the BH's here (and admittedly a disgust for a few others). When I am doing good on the roller-coaster I stay away from here, and it helps, but when the "anger" comes back, I come here to vent, rather than LB FogFree, as there seems to be a never ending supply of benc's out there who could use a 2x4 upside the head.

Yea, and we post, not just for the benc's who don't get it, but for all those anon types who need the same 2X4's and don't post.

BENC, grow a pair. I got nothing else to say.

Larry

benc,

I'm not quite ready to give up on you yet. If you really want to do something to save your marriage, here's my take on it. If you want your wife back you need to get her respect, and you can't do that without showing some spine. I say this as a woman, and I think this is something you really need to hear from a woman. Women don't respect men who are too passive. You HAVE to get over that.

You also need to set clear boundaries. You made a mistake in thinking it might be okay if she fooled around with a woman and then compounded that mistake by not making it crystal clear that you did not want her to be with another man. For your marriage to work it has to have some boundaries to protect it from adultery. That means you have to make it crystal clear to your wife what you expect of and need from her.

You say you don't want to expose your wife's affair at her job because you don't want to hurt her. But I think the real reason is that you are afraid of confrontation. You've already said you have social anxiety - I think this is the real reason you are not doing what you need to do. But suppose the confrontation does not go well? What is the most likely scenario if things don't go well? Well, she could yell at you, tell you that you humiliated her and ruined all chances of working things out. But chances are, that wouldn't be true. It won't ruin your chance of working things out - and it's the only chance you have that things might work out. But hey, what's a few minutes or even an hour of being yelled at really in the grand scheme of things? What is that compared to getting a divorce and watching her ride off into the sunset with some other guy? You can tolerate a little confrontation with your wife. It will not kill you - your head will not explode. I promise!

The fact is that this affair IS hurting her by hurting the marriage. Don't you believe she is better off with YOU than with this other guy? A married person having an affair is their own worst enemy. Although you're not morally obligated to save her from herself, I think if your goal is to pick the option that causes her the least pain (and you in the long run) then you'll do anything you can to stop the affair - even at the risk that she might have an angry outburst with you. Once the marriage is recovered, she will be grateful not angry. Just remind yourself that you are doing what is best for both of you in the long run - you are NOT hurting her. She is hurting herself and you. The brain chemicals that tend to be in overdrive during an infatuation are ruling her head so she isn't herself and doesn't know what is best for her right now. You are trying to save her from herself and recover a marriage in spite of the fact that she was the one who finally broke it. You need to tell yourself that by standing up for yourself and doing what is right for BOTH of you - that you are the HERO in this story, not the villain. (But you can only be the hero if you actually DO what you need to do, not just talk about it.)

If you need medication, then get medication, get therapy - do what you need to do. What you need to do is expose the affair and let her know in no uncertain terms that continuing the affair is completely unacceptable. Find your inner courage and be a hero, not a doormat. And do it right away - don't wait another 24 hours.

Umm..forgot to add thread to Watched Topics list. Doing so now.