And she has since the initial shock of d-day wore off for her.

Part of me knows this is a good thing. For some reason, however, part of me cringes when she makes a comment like, "Brad and Angelina disgust me!" or "McCain makes me sick!"

Talk about mixed emotions. Part of me feels kinda proud of her for acknowledging how awful and despicable adultery is, and the other part feels like shouting at her for not feeling this way sooner.

Maybe it's just a trigger to hear her address adultery in any way. Maybe deep down I wonder if she's sincere, or if it's an elaborate hoax.

Maybe I'm just being a whiner, and I should thank my lucky stars that she has seen the light. I dunno.

Krazy, look at this way. We all become grownups at different times and in different degrees. Adultery is NOT a grownup thing to do by any measure. But it is something that people do who should be adults. There goes that "Should be" again.

Anyway, by what she says and how she reacts, you can now say your wife is a real grownup on the subject of adultery. That is a good thing. But holding McCain accountable for something he did when HE wasn't a grownup is a reflection upon herself and she needs to think about it.

Now how she GOT there at your expense is what you are complaining about, as well you should. Hate how she got there, but appreciate the results. Some of the things that happen to us and around us as we grow are part of us. Hate it or not, they are how we got to be us and how they got to be them.

Larry

My H is the SAME WAY, Krazy!!

Weird..I'm always biting my tongue...LOL

Have you been around RECOVERED SMOKERS????

It's the SAME...

Not to get into a political debate, as I'm pretty sure most high-profile politicians have adultery skeletons in their closet, but I don't understand how, after spending 5 years of hell in a POW camp, McCain could still have had any growing up to do. I also don't understand how he could have a lack of appreciation for his wife. You'd think after such an experience, he'd embrace her and never let go.

I'll never be in his shoes, but I wonder if being a "war hero" inflated his ego after the fact, and left him with a sense of entitlement due to all of his suffering.

Maybe it's not so much that they hate adultery, smoking, etc., but that they hate who they were.

EXACTLY...that's a HUGE part of it...

That experience could have messed up his head BIG time. My WH's grandfather was in vietnam and when he came back he wasn't even the same person. He was this cold, unemotional shell of a person. Things like that are extremely weird on the psyche and can make people act in ways that are totally unlike them.

Ummmmmmmm...McCain is STILL doing it!!! He remains in an adulterous marriage today...

As far as someone who has committed adultery hating it, I am a prime example of such...And here's the thing, I HATED it BEFORE I did it...I KNEW it was wrong...I did not fully grasp how wrong it was, nor all of the ramifications of it for all involved, but I did know it was wrong...Now I know more...Now I hate it with a passion...Now I have changed PROFOUNDLY...Now I value marriage deeply...Now I understand marriage in a way that I didn't before...I HATE how I came to that understanding and wish so much that I could have come to it another way...

People can and do change for the better...There are people that once believed in abortion, that now vehemently oppose it...People that were once raging alcoholics, who today celebrate their sobriety...Once obese people that changed their diet and excercise programs to go on to become health nuts...All of those are GOOD things...WONDERFUL THINGS...

Krazy, when will you decide that you and your wife are now a team? Almost daily you talk about her adversarily...And then in your next breath you tell stories that make her sound like she is quite willing to be on your team...When will you begin to understand that that hurts you too? Are you in counseling? Taking ADs? What is your PLAN to help yourself?

Mrs. W

Well, I was going to reply to this, but I think I'll make it easy on myself and just second everything Mrs. W just said.

Mrs. W, can you elaborate for me on this?

Thanks, Queenie

Ditto this. I guess i don't understand this response.

As a FWW I'm the same way as your wife. I'm in the same boat as Mrs W too. Before my A I always made comments about how I hated cheater and they were scum but my haterd for them became worse after my A. I dispised every form of cheaters, internet, "just friends", etc... I think it all boils down to I hated myself for what I had done and couldn't stand any other person who did the same. My H is that same way with wondering how I could hate them so much when I myself where one.

EXACTAMUNDO. I feel the same revulsion for alcholics, particularly MYSELF in my own dark days. That is normally a sign of recovery.

Hey Krazy,

I would guess that after experiencing all the ramifications of her acts she has reached the realization of how destructive affairs are. I believe its a good thing to hear your FWS make comments of this nature, because it helps the recovery process.

I do understand your mixed emotions though, and I think that its normal. In my sitch, my SO used to make comments about how cheating was stupid and that she didn't understand why people would do that sort of thing instead of just leaving the R --and these comments were made about a year before she had her A. At the time, I remember thinking how lucky I was and that it was something I would not have to worry about. Talk about being naive!!

The part of you that questions the if she is sincere, is a defensive and protective mechanism, that wants to keep you from being thrown under the bus again and experiencing another trauma. I know that for me, I will never be able to be so blindly trusting of my FWW again.

Wow, a tall order for a post...I hope I can do it justice...I'm not sure I can articulate well how different things are now, but I'll try...

First, for me, I was a person that always lived a "waiting for the other shoe to drop" kind of life (a mindset that comes from growing up in a home with a father with a dual diagnosis of Bipolar disorder and Alcoholism)...That mindset lent itself to lots of insecurities regarding our marriage for me...When things were good in my life, I never believed that they would be for long...I believed that Mr. W had just "settled" for me and that once he really knew me that he'd be out the door...MY insecurity issues were big intimacy blockers...

We both were very adversarial with each other...We did NOT view marriage as a TEAM effort...We did not see our marriage as something to be PROTECTED, CELEBRATED and ADORED...It was very much still about "YOU" and "ME"...Not "US"...We both practiced TONS of independent behaviors...Kept each other at a distance...

You know, we both bought into a societal view of marriage...A sitcom view...Men vs. Women...Husbands vs. Wives...What is so sickening for us is that we did NOT have to do that...We had the BOOK with the correct way to do it all along...The Bible...It's all in there...the right way...and we ignored it...In early recovery we went back and read from our workbooks from a Family Life Marriage Conference that we had attended early in our marriage (A wedding gift from friends of ours! ) We were STUNNED to see that we had so much of the stuff that Dr. Harley teaches right there!!! We had sat through the classes, taken the notes, and STILL ignored it...ARGH!!!!!!!

All I can tell you is that now things are worlds away from what they were...We share EVERYTHING-no topic is off limits...No matter how small it may seem...fears, joys, frustrations, finances, decisions...We view each other as ONE now...HUGE mind shift for both of us...We even practice that with our daughter...explaining that any disrespect shown towards one of us is disrespecting both of us...There is a new security in our relationship...A KNOWING...(not just a wishing, hoping, or guessing) that no matter what we are in this together until death...For us, that is new...

I wish I could convey properly in words the diffence between then and now, I'm afraid I have failed to give you a full picture. This flows better conversationally...we talk about different aspects of it often in fact...To be honest though, some of it is deeply personal for us and can't be shared without sacrificing intimacy...Suffice it to say that it is a "Brave New World" for us, with God at the helm...

Mrs. W

It sounds as though she's exhibit one of the psychological defense mechanisms, I think its called displacement. Seeing other acts of infidelity reminds her of what she did, and brings up feelings of guilt and shame she doesn't want to deal with, hence her agression to the others.

You did a WONDERFUL job, Mrs. WONDERING...

You describe the MARRIAGE that WE have, too..

To GOD be the Glory..

AMEN...

His mercy and grace brings me to my knees...

Mrs. W

Or perhaps she realizes the HORROR of it...the DIGUSTINGNESS of what she did and she has LEARNED and CHANGED...She understands the SEARING OF HER OWN SOUL that her choice to commit adultery caused and would not wish it on anyone EVER...Perhaps she IS dealing with it by acknowledging it...Do you think that FWSs are BLIND to how bad what they did is? That somehow they should continue to rationalize and justify that behavior in others? That would NOT be a sign of recovery and a BS would be foolish to stay in a marriage with a FWS that didn't see adultery as a TERRIBLE thing...

Krazy, I wonder if you don't somehow still think that your wife got away with something "wonderful" and "fun"...That she had a "great time" and didn't have to "pay" for it...I can tell you that for me, and I believe other repentent FWS, that is NOT true...It is NOT something that you celebrate in yourself...It is NOT something that brings on great memories...It is HORRIBLE...It HURTS you too...It DAMAGES you too...It is NOT a "walk in the park"...It is NOT a memory that you "wax nostalgic" about...It is a reminder of the WORST in you...Of how dark and bad you were capable of being...It is a terrible scar for the FWS too...

Mrs. W

Well, I think there must be a HUGE amount of stuff regarding his ex-wife and his affair that is unknown to the public. I see how much his ex wife supports him now...and I wonder if that would be the case if he acted as people suspect. I also know that JM had a lot of mitigating circumstances that would make any person act crazy for a period of time. Being held in a North Vietnamese prison during the war had to be life altering. I would really like to learn more about what happened regarding his divorce. I will say that no matter JM's shortcomings...at the very least he is willing to support ending the deaths of over 1 million unborn children each year. I certainly hope that any Christian(or person that values life) would weigh that issue very carefully since a vote for Hilary or Barack is a vote to continue the senseless killing of children. I guess when I look at that isse, I don't really give a flying hoot about JM's affair....or his affairage.