Road,

If you are referring to my post above, I wonder why you think I am attacking Rain. I responded here, searching this thread out after reading her response to me on her original thread because she responded favorably to what I had to say there. This post is nothing more than a reiteration of what I already said to her and to which she responded favorably.

Rain, if you read this, I don't have any wish to smack you around, make personal attacks or call you names. I will however make you uncomfortable in choosing an affair over your marriage. I haven't even posted to your husband as of yet because I posted to you first. I know I am treading on thin ice in trying to reason with you, since it is one of the primary things we tell a betrayed spouse when they get here that logic and reasoning are fruitless when discussing an affair with some one who is actively wayward in their thinking. And I know this from my own experience as well.

If you want me to leave you alone entirely, I will respect that wish and simply go away. But please respond to me or to JL and don't just throw away your marriage without at least giving Marriage Builders methods of creating a better marriage a chance. There is so much at stake here that deciding on pure emotions that have been ramped up by the newness and excitement of it all is not worth the regret it will lead to in the future.

Seldom does a person decide to end their marriage and then meet and fall in love with someone else. It is usually the other way around. They fall in love and then decide the marriage is bad enough to dissolve. You yourself recognize this and that is why I keep coming back to it.

You might also be questioning why you would fall into an affair again after having done it before and deciding to recover the marriage that time around. You might see it as a hopeless situation or as proof that you and your husband are not meant to be together. But the reality is that it happened again because you and your husband allowed it to happen again. The root of the problem lies in that unless you are taking extraordinary precautions to prevent an affair from happening, it is all the more likely to happen.

Your past recovery probably went like ours did the first time around. That is, you wanted to "move forward" and he was willing to drop the subject and not deal with it simply because he was grateful that you had returned to him. But the problem with that method is that nothing changes that prevents an affair from being a viable solution to whatever is lacking at any given time. And suffice it to say that there is always something missing. No marriage is ever perfect all the time and it is when it is less than perfect that we become vulnerable to an affair because there is something this new person gives us that we long for.

But the way to prevent an affair from happening is to have a plan to avoid one from beginning. That isn't about magic and all that stuff you see in the movies, it is about taking precautions to not allow others to meet our emotional needs, especially when they are not being fully met by our spouse. If your ENs are not being met, it is up to you to tell your husband what you need so that he stands a chance of meeting them. Because his needs are not the same as yours and though he can instinctively do things for you that HE needs from the marriage, unless he knows what you need, he will not be able to do what you want from him.

During those times when we are most vulnerable, we must take extreme precautions to not allow anyone else to meet our ENs because letting them meet our ENs, even something as innocent as conversation, makes deposits into our love bank and without wanting it to happen, we begin to have feelings of love toward that person.

My guess is that one of your top ENs is in fact conversation and that is how this all began. As OM began to meet that need for you, you began to desire it all the more. Your husband might have missed it or was just too busy to give you the time you needed and so you felt it was OK to innocently allow this OM to fill that need. But the more you desired to talk to him, the more you began to avoid talking to your husband, in part because you were already feeling guilty at least a little. But instead of making it easy to escape and just shutting the relationship down at that point, you kept it going and nurtured it and attempted to justify it because it was just talking or you were just friends or because there was no sexual component to the relationship from your side as of yet.

But that is when you ended up on the road you are on now and it is all down hill with really poor breaks.

You see, once you have dug yourself into a hole, you can't dig yourself out of it. Digging deeper only makes the hole deeper and harder to get out of. The only way to get out of a hole is to climb out of it. You go back to where you started and where it all began and make a different decision than you did the first time around, and that is, to not dig at all. You can't go forward until you go back and fill in the hole that you dug and fell into.

Mark

maybe it would be better for you to keep your opinion about where BS's post to yourself. And by the way...I think you meant to say FWW's here. The last thing this woman needs is another WW to mentor her.
Rain very early on attacked people trying to help her. She brought the response on herself. A WS is either accepted or not based upon their attitude. No one here sees a WS and automatically thinks ...attack.

Fact is, this is much ado about what will most certainly amount to yet another board troll.

Dear Rain,

After reading your husband's thread I found your locked thread and read what I could.

One thing that really slammed home to me was your statement about the resiliance of children of divorce.

My children - all of them - are STILL in the processes of dealing with abandonment issues that arose because of my husband's adultry. While he never left and we did not divorce, the Wookie and I, no matter if we had or hadn't THOSE ISSUES WOULD STILL BE THERE BECAUSE OF HIS ACTIONS.

I must tell you that EVERY Betrayed on hear has heard such justifications and every one of us sees it as a poor excuse for poor choices.

Likewise your arguement regarding suicide vs. infidelity has hit a raw nerve.

I've lived through the suicide of a parent...I've lived through my husband's infidelity.

The infidelity hurts worse, even now.

Please listen to the wise words of KiwiJ. and my dearest AussiesWife. They are sweet, and kind, and no-nonsense. They are a hand up from your mess, and they are caring shoulders.

Also, if you need and ear or a betrayed's opinion, I humbly offer mine.

I will tell you the truth as I see it, not mince words, and I promise a modicum of tact.

- Kimmy

And there are people here who can see that many times the Wayward's attitude is caused by confusion, pain, fear....and they are able to post to them without attacking them.


I would rather be "duped" by a troll for a few posts than withhold aid from a foggy wayward (or a foggy betrayed).

I consider posting to trolls to be good practice at following the TOS when it might be difficult to do so....and I think it helps prepare the board to respond better when foggy waywards and betrayeds find their way here.

I also believe that trolls are in their own pain and fear....who am I to add to that by attacking them?


rainisgone....again, I wish you well in your recovery. Choosing recovery was one of the best decisions I have made in my lifetime. Take care

well, good. I don't take such a liberal attitude towards trolls. I think they are here for amusement and not out of pain...and a swift kick in the teeth is usually called for.

As for the terms of service...as has recently been pointed out to me by a moderator(actually two mods in the past few months)...sarcasm is not a violation of the terms of service...most of what was posted to this woman yesterday was sarcastic responses to her attacking others.

Hopefully, moving forward that is no longer an issue.

JL,

Thank you for your concern. I know he is running out of gas. You think I do not REALLY know what I have done. For all the ones betrayed here there is the one that did the betraying. For some of those, it was intentional. For others, not really so. You think I do not feel pain, guilt, or shamefull for what I have done? It hurts like he77 everyday of my life to think that I have destroyed someone's life. Look, I have read the posts and I know what I said yesterday and I regret none of it. I was attacked and scorned. Some of it I deserved. Nothing anyone can say on this message board is anywhere as damaging as a person's own thoughts and guilt that they have to live with every single minute of everyday. So while I do have feelings for the one's on here that have been betrayed, I too hurt.

No...I did not need a program. After you can't move out of your parent's house and after seeing what it was doing to my H that was enough for me. No more.

you started attacking people from the get go. They responded. You don't regret it...that says a lot about you as a person.

Hopefully, for your sake and the sake of your abused husband and child, that changes. There is much help to be had here. I think you would be wise to avail yourself of it.


Very wise words posted to you yesterday by ILMH

What was the definition of "insane" again? (Think I saw it here somewhere)....

To do the same thing over and over and expect a different result?

My H is wonderful. I do not doubt it. Right now, I doubt our entire marriage and THAT has nothing to do with the OM. He is not an A$$ and has asked me to make a decision because he no longer wants to share. He will not sleep with me while I am married and has made that a FACT. No, I am under no time limit but he pulls himself away because he wants me to make the decision. He says it is best that we do not contact each other and I agreed.

I know you do.

I watched my husband go through what you are.

There is a way out of this....all it takes is work and commitment.

"He will not sleep with me while I am married "


Wow....how noble of him.

Thanks and good luck with your recovery.

well, after all, he is a good man.

There are many here who know exactly what you're talking about....from both sides of the infidelity equation.

I have to go but I sure do hope that you stay and connect with those who can and will help you navigate a course for recovery. If you read around the board, you can get an idea of who you would want to accept in your recovery network....you're not obligated to let everyone in. Take care rainisgone.

Sorry if my last post seemed a little harsh, Rain...but, the fact of the matter is that any man who is hooking up with a married woman (sex or not) is a POS...the sooner you see that the better.

You know, when I first read everyone's comments this morning, I cried. Then, I come back to this stuff. For those of you who posted with the god intentions...thank you. But for introvert and Medc....thanks for nothing.

Im out.

So, you stop in...read some nice posts (and my apology, I would assume)...then you see a negative comment about OM...take it personally...then leave? I won't insult you any more, but your OM is a POS. Why does that insult you? If that comment about OM is that insulting to you, then you may as well leave, because I'm guessing there is no member in here that will say any different about an OP.....unless the member is an OP.

You CAN ignore them.

It is a tool of this board. You can click on their names and hit ignore - then you won't see any of their posts.

Please don't give up.

rain:

First off, I'm very sorry you've gotten yourself in2 a si2ation that brings you here.

2nd, I'm really sorry you're here.

There are many sites and resources for people 2 go 2 - BS and WS alike - 2 help recover from infidelity. Some sites are better than others.

This site used 2 be a lot more helpful than it is now. The Harley methods are still first-rate. The boards are... something other than first-rate. You can still get good support here, but you're going 2 have 2 hunker down, expect the attacks 2 continue, and find a way 2 respond rather than react (medc used the wrong term above) 2 what you read, so that a net positive change can begin in your M.

3rd off: While the OM may not be an analpore, he is behaving like one. He may even think that he means well when he says he won't sleep with you while you are married, but the simple fact is that he crossed the inappropriate intimacy line a long time ago. And the only way out is 2 stay out of your life for the rest of your life.

Simple, but not easy. A lot of what the methods here are all about.

-ol' 2long